| [ Total Views: 3409 | Total Replies: 23 | Thread Id: 40005 ] |
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 Brad
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 09:22 AM |
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Towing with an EJ22 Converted Kombi
Well as some of you may know I have a Dual Cab Kombi with one of the Custom Offroad ( http://www.customoffroad.com.au ) conversions in it using an EJ 22.
Anyway I have never been one to do things by halves and was wondering how well it would tow / carry weight. Here are the results:
Empty - Cruises happily at 110 kmph, uses approx 9L per 100 km and runs very well, good take off and cruise.
620kg in the tray - Cruises as 110 kmph uses approx 10L per 100 km, slower take off but still keeps up with traffic.
Tandem Trailer on, tray empty - Gets up to 100 kmph and hold the speed, slows down a little on hills but still holds 110 with a little more right
foot. Uses approx 11 L per 100 km. Slower than traffic on take off but still drives and feel nicer than my hilux.
Tanden Trailer 2350 kg, 620kg on tray - Up to about 70 kmph drives fine, slow but still feels like it is happy. Cruises happily on around 80 - 90
kmph doesn't have the balls to hold 100 kmph unless you are going down hill. Knocked back to 3rd on a number of hills I was pulling 4th up prior.
Fuel usage TBC.
Ok, over all I am very impressed, the current weight of around 4.3T is to much for it to drive at normal speed. It will pull it but the EJ doesn't
have the balls to do it happily. I kombi on car trailer weighs in at under 2 T so I will say that it happily pulls that empty, but I will trial that
later.
The dual cab is stock 2L gearing and everything else is stock. Engine is an EJ22. Trailer is a tandem 10 x 6' box trailer with load sharing axles,
htdraulic over ride brakes.
I have some pictures of the load but it is basically the following:
- Tandem Trailer - 650kg - trailer
- Kubota 4WD tractor - 900kg - trailer
- Front end loader attachment - 550 kg - trailer
- 3' offset slasher - 250 kg - kombi ute
- 5' grader blade - 250 kg - trailer
- 5' carry all - 120 kg - kombi ute
- misc parts and add ons - 250 kg - kombi ute
- Dual Cab Kombi - 1250 kg
To make sure I am not incorrect in my assesment I will be towing the above load for around 2000 km from Melbourne to Brisbane so if you see a Dual Cab
kombi cruising at 80 kmph and looking like it is earning its keep it will be me. Will probably have a nice line on traffic behind me.
I will let you all know what fuel economy I get, I am guessing around 12 - 13 L per 100 km.
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 kombi_kid
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 09:29 AM |
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u wanna pull in here this time tell me when and ill make sure im around!!
cheers
rhys
it aint just cool its aircool'd
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Brad
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 09:41 AM |
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I am going up the inland .... less hills
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VWCOOL
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 10:04 AM |
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4-plus tonnes... wow! What is the Subaru factory tow rating for a Liberty etc fitted with that engine? Do you have gauges etc for oil temps? I
wouldn't go over that - less due to the extra frontal area of the Kombi... But gee, good work!
Pay your debts, CxxT
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Brad
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 10:19 AM |
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The EJ25 will fit in the kombi no probs at all. In fact it is the same block to the EJ22 so even uses the same mounts, cooling etc etc.
I use the EJ 22 in our kits for two main reasons:
- Cost - the EJ 22 is around 1/2 the price of an EJ 25
- Prefference - I have done a lot of research into the EJ series and came to the conclussion that the EJ 22 is the best value for money and does what
I wanted to achieve with the most reliability. Some may argue but I picked the EJ 22. That being said I am looking at the EJ 33 as a possible for the
Custom Offroad Tow car. SO in short if someone wanted an EJ 25 as compared to an EJ 22 then I can happily do it but it would end up being more like
$10 500 rather than $8800 like the EJ 22. For around the $1100 mark I will be able to do the EJ 33 conversion. It really comes down to what you want
to achieve, really how often to people tow large loads ?? Fuel economy is better value ..
VWCOOL - I have a few temp guages and I map the the temp as it moves through the engine and radiator. I have senders on the outside of engine, in side
of radiator, outside of radiator and in side of engine. I then record the temp readings so I am aware of what the radiator is doing, what the fan does
and what the increased water capacity is doing to the ECU control for fan and also the thermostat. I also have a sump oil temp guage and presure
guage. This is the major test rig for our under body cooling solution and I need to be 100% sure that it works and the ECU can handle the temp latency
created by the new radiator.
Towing capacity of a liberty is bugger all .. I am well over that. In fact some may argue that I am over the kombi tow limit but as it is registered
as a light truck I am within my legal limit.
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Doug Sweetman
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 10:20 AM |
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I had a 91 Liberty wagon with EJ22 (4WD too) and the most I ever towed with that would have only been about 1200kg (fat ugly hire car trailer with my
bug on it sans engine). It didnt mids that sort of load too much - I think I got up to about 100kmh, but it was a long time ago now.
Not sure what the official ratings are, but they certainly arent 2.4T !!!!
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Brad
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 10:24 AM |
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Doug - Most hire trailers are around a tonne on their own. So with a bug on it I would guess it was close to 1800 kg. The rear suspension in a Liberty
is not real good either, the kombi takes the weight much better.
Ratings are done on vehcile not engine. Tow rate of a 1600 kombi is same as 2L kombi.
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VWCOOL
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 12:15 PM |
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| Quote: |
VWCOOL - I have a few temp guages and I map the the temp as it moves through the engine and radiator. I have senders on the outside of engine, in side
of radiator, outside of radiator and in side of engine. I then record the temp readings so I am aware of what the radiator is doing, what the fan does
and what the increased water capacity is doing to the ECU control for fan and also the thermostat. I also have a sump oil temp guage and presure
guage. This is the major test rig for our under body cooling solution and I need to be 100% sure that it works and the ECU can handle the temp latency
created by the new radiator.
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Good work. You don't want boiling oil! Manufacturers' tow ratings take into account all sorts of stuff such as trans temps and brake capacity, too.
I had my car 'wired' with digital temp gauges and oil temp gauges etc when I was playing with my Hoodjax design years ago.
Pay your debts, CxxT
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Brad
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| posted on June 2nd, 2005 at 12:59 PM |
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yeah it is nice to know it isn't going to melt down.
Oh and to date the water temp has stayed constant at all levels apart from the loaded trailer and ute. It runs at 92 - 94 normal and it now at about
96 with load on. These are thermo's off temp help by ECU. If I turn thermo's on I can get it back to around 85 and moving slowly down, BUT will see
what the heat of day does as Victoria isn't what I would call hot ....
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seagull
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| posted on June 3rd, 2005 at 12:41 AM |
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your 50mm tow ball rated to 3800kg Brad ?
Looking for that special lady : PM me for coffee & cake
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Kombicol
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| posted on June 3rd, 2005 at 02:50 PM |
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hey brad,
i will have one of those eg33 conversions for 1100 :P
in fact i will take 2 at that price :P :P
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Brad
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 08:20 PM |
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hehe well I made it back...... In one piece took about 24 hrs all up and was a pretty easy cruise. Slow but no issues.
All up I averaged 15.1L per 100 km .... yep she sure likes to eat fuel when under a load. All up I weighed in at 5.4tonne when I went over the weight
bridge at the dump on the way home ... so the little EJ didn't do to bad.
Engine temp was fine but top end power was no real good. Got to use 2nd gear on a few of the big hills where I couldn't keep speed up. If I kept it
in the sweat zone then it pulled a lot better.
Cruised at 100 kmph most of the time as long as there was no hills.
Over all I would say that if you wanted to tow say 2 tonne ( weight of a kombi and trailer then the EJ 22 would do it no worries. More than that you
need a v6.
I had to reset the rear torsion bars two notches to get some travel back which makes it sit like a baja bus when the trailer was taken off.
It was a valuable test and let me know what the EJ 22 was capable of..
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Brad
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 08:21 PM |
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pics
Here she is in tow trim
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MickH
A.k.a.: Michael Hutchinson
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 08:50 PM |
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You're a nutter....looks good though:o
tssnq.com.au
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koolkarmakombi
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 09:02 PM |
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*****applause*******
brad, you got my vote
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 helbus
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 09:17 PM |
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So we could say from this that the radiator is cooling pretty good on long hauls with large loads? Yeah?
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VWCOOL
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 09:18 PM |
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Jeez! :thumb
Pay your debts, CxxT
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pete wood
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 09:22 PM |
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So I shouldn't worry about towing a little camping trailer behind my buggy?
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Brad
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 09:25 PM |
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cooling is fine, needs a 16" fan though as the 10" don't pull enough when it counts. I am still keen to change the shroud though to a more agresive
one so the thermo isn't needed as much.
In answer to the other questions - Car is registered as a light truck and can legally tow 3500 kg braked. The tow bar is a 3500 kg rated unit with
matching ball, it has been custom made to suit kombi and the rear end is significantly reinforced. So yes it may be a little over but talking to a few
guys they all agreed it wasn't a big issue with 50 % design safety. Future mods will be electric brakes and rear discs for the kombi and maybe .....
a few more cylinders.
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1303Steve
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| posted on June 7th, 2005 at 11:13 PM |
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Hi Brad
Are you using Davies Craig fans? I used to use a 79 Audi 100 fan on my bug, when it came on it blew stuff around on the ground like compressed air,
but the fan motor was huge and had to stick out the back of my shroud, so I fitted a huge Davies Craig unit to suit a V8, it has nowhere near the
amount air force like the Audi unit. If you look at most VW/Audi fan shrouds you will notice rubber flaps, at speed with the fan off they allow
airflow through the radiator to pass through the rubber flaps, when the fans on the get sucked shut making all the air pass through the fan.
Steve
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Brad
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| posted on June 8th, 2005 at 08:30 AM |
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Hi Steve,
Yeah I am using Davies Craig, I will do a few air flow tests on a number of fans I have sitting around and see how I go.
Thanks for the info.
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baybuscamperkid
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| posted on June 8th, 2005 at 01:28 PM |
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wow, well that brings up some interesting questions about my setup, since i have a panelvan, trakka roof conversion (probably 200+kg on its own with
the steel reinforcement), interior cupboards (say 100kg), full water tank (another 80kg, it is a BIG tank), plus luggage (another 50 - 100kg probably)
as well as roofracks, annex (another 100kg easily all up), maybe it is nothing to do with my rad setup when the engine heats up at 100? since my test
area is all hills at 100kph (maroondah highway past lilydale), my engine is much lower powered then yours and i regularly am driving with my foot
basically flat down, maybe i am simply trying to drive beyond the limits of my vehicle? since your not comfortably breaking 100kph with a 1tonne load,
maybe it is quite acceptable for mine to not sit comfortably over 90kph carrying 700kg with my little engine? what do you think?
Reimagined/Recycled/Upcycled Cool
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helbus
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| posted on June 8th, 2005 at 03:08 PM |
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1 tonne load? I think you will find Brad was in total 5.4tonne!
bbck I really do think you need to get a bigger radiator as the hp being produced to keep the bus and weight moving is transferring the heat into the
radiator which is not able to transfer any more of that heat back out through your current radiator.
That is my thoughts anyway.
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Craig Torrens
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| posted on June 8th, 2005 at 03:36 PM |
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time to go V6 !!
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