| [ Total Views: 266285 | Total Replies: 705 | Thread Id: 77027 ] |
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 Joel
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| posted on April 1st, 2011 at 11:52 AM |
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Cheers for the offer Rob,
I did think about mount the turbo at the timing belt end, just a little bit harder in a bug and Im worried about heat issues being so close the timing
belt and covers.
If I can sort out the Kafer bar issue it'll work out well in the stock position.
I've been talking with Dave he's given me a few ideas to chew over.
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Joel
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| posted on April 4th, 2011 at 06:29 PM |
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Geez all these Subaru related posts at the top of topic activity must be giving all the purists nosebleeds 
Speaking of, yesterday a good example of another reason why I love my conversion.
All the purists who like VWs cos they are so mechanically simple ( the kind of people who know what a spanner is but not sure what it actually does)
can't understand why I would take that setup out and add one of them new fangdangle computer controlled engine with elebenty million wires and
sensors.
I've put abit over 300kms on it since the motor went back in and so far has all been running well.
Yesterday was one of our club cruises, backing out of the driveway it cut out on me, I didnt think anything of it as it restarted and drove fine, till
I got about 5 km out of town and it did it again.
Didn't die completely but it did cut out for maybe 1-1.5 secs and started doing that on a regular basis.
I was sure it was electrical, it was too consistant to be a mechanical or fuel problem, it was like the spark was stopping or the injectors werent
opening for a split second.
I had no check engine light and everything seem to be plugged in, After going through everything in my head trying to work out what I did wrong I
plugged in the computer when I got home and it told me straight away.
Cam position sensor.
A quick check showed when i put the engine back in the other week I had plugged it in but hadn't clicked it in place so it was reading fine but
periodically losing contact.
Nothing like a nice easy fix, it told me what the problem was and I wasn't chasing my tail fucking around with carbs, looking for ignition problems
etc.
maybe just a sign I'm just getting older that I'm becoming the lazy mechanic.
Since I was old enough to hold a spanner I've loved a mechanical challenge, take a car (or anything mechanical for that matter) not running right,
track down what it was and getting it running/working sweet.
It started with the lawnmowers, by the time I was 10 I owned 11 of them, back 20 years ago you could scavange anything from the tip, then the VWs
started.....The old running joke, same thing just no blades  .
Now I just wanna enjoy driving the bug and not work on it all the time.
Has this happened to anyone else or am I just speshul?
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1303Steve
A.k.a.: Steve Carter
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| posted on April 7th, 2011 at 04:33 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by seagull
| Quote: | Originally
posted by 1303Steve
Hi Joel
Good news, may the boost be with you.
I was talking the local subi guy the other day, not keen on 2.5 at all, we talked about one day building a 2.2
Steve
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Taken from a wrx forum
Here's an interesting piece of information regarding bearing clearances as list by Subaru having WAY too much of a tolerance range & why this is
not so good for #2 & #3 con rod bigends (generally the two that fail hard) specificly in the EJ engine family.
"For example, according to the Subaru Manual, the acceptable range for the connecting rod oil clearance is 0.0007-0.0018 inches. While a tolerance of
0.0011 inches might not seem significant, it actually allows an oil volume difference of 264 percent.
In other words, the larger clearance of 0.0018 inches allows 2.6 times more oil to pass through the bearing and thereby accomplish one of its primary
functions: removing heat. This is a dramatic increase in terms of bearing heat-load management. At the lower end of the Subaru production engine
clearance scale, 0.0007 is woefully inadequate for providing effective heat removal in a performance/ high boost engine."
Whilst this ^^ is interesting from an engineering point of view and quazzi standard practice for most mass produced engines - 11 thou is a huge range
for a 'standard' bearing clearance, the following spells out why this is bad particularly to any EJ.......
Unlike the bigends for cyls 1 & 4 - which are fed from separate, individual main journals - the bigends of cyls 2 & 3 are fed oil from the
same single point on the crankshaft (#3 main journal)
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Hi Neil
My local Subi guy told me that the issues that they have are the bore being too large, cast pistons and a bad rod ratio.
He often builds up 2.2 (stroked 2.00) in place of 2.5s.
Steve
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surfbeetle
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| posted on April 8th, 2011 at 04:27 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Joel...Now I just wanna enjoy driving the bug and not work on it all the time.
Has this happened to anyone else or am I just speshul?
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That's the reason I'm doing my conversion. I had kadron dual carbs and later 48IDAs. I got sick of the valve adjustments, syncing the carb linkage
every time the weather changed. Cant wait to drive my suby VW.
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Jak Rizzo
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| posted on April 9th, 2011 at 08:00 AM |
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I agree totally with everything u are saying Joel, but, I have gotten to the point over the last 6+ years that I go into the garage looking for things
to do on the car. Sad but true.
I was wrapped last weekend to have to replace the Autometor oil pressure sender. After 6 years it had sprung a leak. Only problem was it only took
about 4 minutes to do. Now what?
Luckily for me CT lets me work on his car so I can get my vintage vw fix, then I get in my fuel injected turbo charged bug for the drive home
Jak
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 matberry
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| posted on April 9th, 2011 at 09:48 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Jak Rizzo
I agree totally with everything u are saying Joel, but, I have gotten to the point over the last 6+ years that I go into the garage looking for things
to do on the car. Sad but true.
I was wrapped last weekend to have to replace the Autometor oil pressure sender. After 6 years it had sprung a leak. Only problem was it only took
about 4 minutes to do. Now what?
Luckily for me CT lets me work on his car so I can get my vintage vw fix, then I get in my fuel injected turbo charged bug for the drive home
Jak
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yawn ; yawn
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
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Joel
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| posted on April 9th, 2011 at 01:03 PM |
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I know what you mean Jak, I guess my downfalling is I take on way too big projects instead of doing smaller jobs
Anyway, may sound cliche but I've got a real bond with my bug, after 12 years the literally 100s of modifications I've done to the engines,
suspension, brakes, electrics etc all have the potential to fail but that bug just never lets me down and always does it's darnedest to get me home
when it's farhkenbroken.
The only one time *touch wood* that it ever left me stranded was when the wheel bearing seized and that was my fault for mixing and matching bearings
with the wrong outer race.
One of my old 1600s crapped out both right side exhaust valve seats when I was out west and got me from Broken hill back to home (over 1000kms) on 2
and abit cylinders, my old turbo motor got me home when the rings fell to bits and it lost nearly all compression, my supercharged motor got me home
when the crank pulley bolt fell out but the crank pulley and fanbelt magically stayed in position, and the first subaru engine got me home when the
headgaskets let go despite the water temp geting to 120c.
Had yet another example of this yesterday.
Sitting in stop go peak hour traffic through the main street of Alstonville which is the main highway between Lismore and Ballina with no where to
pull off it waited till I got through town and turned into an empty side street before it did last weekends trick of cutting out for a few seconds
before catching again.
Only this time a few seconds later it cut out completely and wouldnt restart.
It was cranking over like there was no spark, naturally first thing I checked was that cam position sensor plug, it was still plugged in but I gave it
a nudge and the car started up.
Soon as I touched the plug it cut out again.
No matter how hard I pushed it would not click into place so I wedged it in there with a piece of twig and babied it back home.
Guess the computer doesnt know what to do when it can't tell the cam positions, it wouldn't know when to fire the plugs or pulse the injectors.
Had it have done it about 1 minute prior I would have caused peak hour chaos.
GOod thing I kept the sensors off the first motor.
And there it is.....
The 1mm X 5mm piece of missing plastic that nearly did my head in.
The simplest things can seem so dramatic.
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ElusiveStranger
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| posted on April 10th, 2011 at 10:01 AM |
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Oooh, not the bit of placky that meant you couldn't remove the plug, Joel? Feel for ya bud. Use a pin (what seamstresses use)
Jak - come to the UK, daily hacks rot faster than Subies give up :'(
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Joel
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| posted on August 14th, 2011 at 09:20 AM |
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Just a little teaser for now as to why my bug's been off the road for a while.
As promised baby's been boosted, but,
not in the force fed way everyone was expecting.....
A boost in capacity 
A warm welcome for Subaru engine number 3.
It's an EJ254 from a 2005 Outback and for those who know their Subarus that are wondering how the hell I got a late model fly by wire and AVCS (V-tec
YO!) engine to fit my bug all will be revealed soon, I've just got a few photos and shit to sort through and a messy shed to get cleaned up.
I'm facing the firing squad if I don't get some of the oil stains and scattered parts from my shenanigans cleaned up.
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SebastienPeek
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| posted on August 14th, 2011 at 09:54 AM |
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JOEL!
I feel as though this is a worthy upgrade of your bug!
I can't wait to hear this one, you need to put up a video on YouTube kind sir.
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STIDUB
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Over it.
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| posted on August 14th, 2011 at 05:50 PM |
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i guess this means ill see you at oxenford in 2 weeks 
Volkswagen Drivers Club of Queensland - member 
STIDUB - yep its still a work in progress
Vwdcq club car racing/ and crashing while my bug isn't finished.
The above are personal views, no more, no less |
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Joel
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| posted on October 9th, 2011 at 02:01 PM |
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OK that's enough suspense.
A few people suspected I was just playing a prank, but no EJ25 is alive and well.
I've only just replaced my video camera so my youtube channel is back in action and it does make an appearance in my latest vid but I will make some
more detailed vids about it once things slow down for me abit more work wise.
Anyway people are probably wondering what possessed me to fit a whole new engine when I'd only just redone the top end of my current EJ22.
It's been a very long drawn out process, it all started way back in May, I was in town and a hail storm came over so I raced the over to the subi
joint as it was nearest, stuck the bug undercover then stood at the front videoing the engine bay of the bosses WRX race car filling up with hail
while it passed.
It was only a minor storm but they can quickly turn nasty around here, I didn't want the bug to match my little paddock basher farmcar, it already
looks like a golf ball with wheels.
While I was there I started having a piss and moan about how hard the turbo project was ending up.
I didn't want to do any more body work or give up my parcel tray but I also wanted something that wasn't so cramped into the engine bay that it
takes a contorsionist to change the plugs which was how it was going to end up.
Why don't you just go bigger N/A then? the boss says to me.....
We're about to do an engine swap on that outback sitting in the workshop, you can have the old EJ25 out of it if you want.
A Fuel injected, 2.5L, 16 valve, twin cam engine in a bug....
I'm sure he could see the gears ticking over in my head.
It was not going to be a nice straight forward swap though.
The outback was a 2005 Gen 4 and has a lot of features that don't play out well with conversions.
First one was it had fly by wire electronic throttle and the manifold is very different so I couldn't just fit my EJ22 one on like you can with early
gen1 EJ25s.
Next problem was even though its a single overhead cam engine like my 22 it has AVCS which is Subarus version of V-tec.
The computer controls the cam timing, so it can have agressive valve timing when granny gets on the noise pedal to get the first seat at bingo, but
drive like Birch does and you get a nice smooth engine and good fuel economy.
To make all that work though firstly I would need all the wiring loom and ECU from the donor car to control it which is a whole heap of bullshit I
didn't want to go through again and setting up fly by wire throttle... I don't even....
Secondly as you can see the AVCS heads are alot more chunky than my current EJ22s heads and the plug access ports would be hard up against the
bodywork.
To get these to fit in the bug is alot work, they stick through the bumper mounts almost the same amount as the quad cam motors only they dont need
the gearbox moved forward to stay under the guards and apron.
A guy in the US I've chatted with has one in his bug and you can see he had to do some mods to fit it.
The side engine bay tray would also need chopping out to allow access to the plugs.
Now the beauty of EJ suby engines is they are exactly like type1 VW engines - Lego motors.
You can mix and match parts to build one out of .
So what we did was put my two new reco heads from the 22 on the 25 bottom end.
Overall It's just like the old EJ22 but with longer stroke and bigger bore
This made it a nice easy plug and play fit and it's still a non-interference engine (all quad cam EJs and twin cam EJs after 96 are interference)
The engine had just ticked over 155,000kms and was running fine but while it was half torn down I couldn't see the point in being half assed about
things so the boss pulled it right down and gave it a full freshen up in his free time which hasn't been very often while he worked on his hill climb
car hence the slow progress.
Its been in for bit over 2 months and 2000kms now, the main issue I've had is a rebuilt EJ25 with EJ22 heads has a lot of compression and even the
brand new German semi-auto starter motor turns it abit slow once it's warmed up so a cranky kit is on the horizon.
It's not a bad little power increase (about 35-40hp) over the EJ22 but it's the torque of that longer stroke thats most impressive.
The stock EJ22 is good for 190nm, the EJ254 in stock for with AVCS is 229nm but even without that my engine would be around 220nm same a non-variable
SOHC EJ25.
So in a light weight bug it's no wonder it pulls up steep hills in topgear like a tractor.
I was worried this thing was gonna be thirsty, but to my surprise it's been no worse on fuel than the EJ22.
Boss wants to plug the laptop into it with the wideband and go for a spin so we can make sure it's not leaning out under load otherwise it may need
some bigger injectors but plugs so far show no sign of it.
My average tanks so far have all been between 8.8 and 9.0L/100km.
I've done 2 runs up the gold coast, i had to drive it hard the first time to bed the rings in but it still got 8.2L/100 and the second time got 7.6L
and that was even with the a/c on (it was 27c and hot)
So in a nutshell, it was a lot of rooting around but very pleased with the results.
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Smiley
A.k.a.: Daniel Stephens
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| posted on October 9th, 2011 at 07:20 PM |
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Great work as usual Mr Joel. Good to see that you took the time to think things through and do the job properly 
Smiley
If you said I was a Volkswagen man, you'd be right.
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JVLRacing
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| posted on October 11th, 2011 at 11:31 AM |
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luv the purist comment but great round up of proceedings
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Joel
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| posted on October 11th, 2011 at 11:48 AM |
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Cheers guys, wasn't sure if anyone was still following this thread.
I've changed a few other things with the cooling system and a new exhaust system but didn't bother updating.
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SebastienPeek
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| posted on October 11th, 2011 at 03:44 PM |
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Definitely want to hear about this and see this exhaust and cooling upgrade as well Joel!
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kaiisons
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| posted on October 11th, 2011 at 04:38 PM |
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This is one of the best documented conversions on the web. I keep reading over and over. Great work!
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cam070
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| posted on October 11th, 2011 at 07:46 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Joel
Cheers guys, wasn't sure if anyone was still following this
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Shame on you Joel. I bet there are loads of us following this thread and plenty that come back looking for tips. Details, details, we love 'em. Keep
them coming we are listening!
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JVLRacing
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| posted on October 12th, 2011 at 08:08 AM |
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haha love the topic joel....move ur ass give more pics,
maybe ad wat $expenses$
it takes to do these improvements!
Even i am impressed Seagull would be too
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ElusiveStranger
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| posted on October 13th, 2011 at 06:25 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Joel
Cheers guys, wasn't sure if anyone was still following this thread.
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Well I still get about 6 notifications for every new post on it.
Good work fella
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surfbeetle
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| posted on October 13th, 2011 at 06:33 AM |
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I usually get 4 notification emails... by the way, Joel, did you happen to post how you did the air conditioning? I am planning on installing air
conditioning in mine but need a diagram of what is needed and how it should be plumbed. Any tips are greatly appreciated.
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Joel
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| posted on October 13th, 2011 at 04:18 PM |
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Half your luck, I get 7 of the bloody things each reply so i've just come back to a chockers inbox.
I did a write up of the A/C in my readers rides thread, its on page 8
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=68443&page=8
I didn't mention what I spent on this last little endevour as it's not really an accurate representation of what this sort of work typically
costs.
Its cost me $1800 for what is a full rebuild but most of that is parts, I specified that everything had to be genuine Subaru.
He was going to fit some low KM STi pistons which had some sort of special coating in but this thing wont see boost now and it would only complicated
things further getting the CR right
It was a good running engine but I couldnt see the point in strapping fresh heads to a 155k old bottom end so the block had to be honed, new rings,
bearings, etc etc but i consider it good value still for a 170hp engine that I can beat the crap out of and it's still gonna last 300,000kms if i
keep the maintaince up to it and get good fuel mileage.
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lou0060
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| posted on October 13th, 2011 at 09:22 PM |
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hi Joel, good to see the 2.5 is up and running. didn't see you at Warwick but we'll catch up somewhere I'm sure. I sorted out my relay issue on
the air flow sensor so thanks for the info on the Saturday.
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising 
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust 
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief 
1960 beetle - old school low & slow  |
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Joel
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| posted on October 13th, 2011 at 10:08 PM |
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No worries mate, glad you got it sorted.
Didn't end up getting up to warwick unfortunately, just been flat out working.
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surfbeetle
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| posted on October 14th, 2011 at 03:37 AM |
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Thanks for the AC info. So far I have found the entire thread fascinating. It's very cool to see the evolution of your car.
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sx200
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| posted on January 29th, 2012 at 06:37 PM |
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thanks great post
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sx200
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| posted on January 29th, 2012 at 06:38 PM |
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thanks for info on ac
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sx200
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| posted on January 29th, 2012 at 06:41 PM |
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great post
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KoenvdW
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| posted on January 31st, 2012 at 03:55 AM |
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Joel,
I'm new here on this forum, but I used you're topic as a guideline for my subaru powered beetle. Which i'm currently building. I'm from the
Netherlands, and i'm building a EJ20 into my vw Bug. I got a couple of questions about the electronics, and i was wondering if you could help me
perhaps...
In the picture below, there's a part of the engine wiring diagram. There are 6 wire's coming from the main fuse box, but when i looked at your photo
of the completed wiring loom, i don't see a fuse box.. I assume you don't use them(Main and fuse&relay)?
Were did you get the 3 wires(Main power, Ignito power and Fuel pump) from. And don't you use a mass connection?
I hope you're willing to help me, and sorry about possible language faults and the number of questions
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Joel
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| posted on January 31st, 2012 at 09:25 AM |
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Howdy,
I didn't use the standard Subaru fuse box, all that has been chopped out of my loom and I run inline fuses.
Al that converted my loom to fit recommended a 30amp circuit breaker rather than a fuse on the main power so it just comes off the Battery through the
breaker to the main power wire of the ECU.
The ignition I've got a 15 or 20 amp inline fuse for, it just comes from the ignition switch via the bugs main fuse box and the fuel pump gets its
power from inside the ECU from the main power wire, so I have another inline fuse on that where it comes out of the ECU.
My wiring is a total jumble under the backseat, another of those "oneday" gonna tidy up things.
Hope that helps anyway.
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