'Horace' the speedway 1600 sedan returns to Nowra Speedway Saturday 5th January at 6pm , with Ben Ford at the wheel .
'Horace' has undergone a major rebuild for the 2013 season with details to follow soon......
matberry 路
Good stuff Wayne. You guy's never stop. 馃憤馃憤
Good luck on the 5th
mactaylor 路
great use for the torana guards! good stuff wayne.
hypo-vw 路
Horace has been sitting idle at WPVW for nearly 2 years whilst we have concentrated on drag racing , hill-climbs and super-sprints ......
The engine in Horace has been stripped down for a full rebuild in the attempt to gain more power from the 1641 NA engine . Last dyno session it produced 93hp @ the wheels , and I am now looking for 100+hp .
The Scat crankshaft is linished and a new set of alloy Pauter Pro-series conrods are to be used .
hypo-vw 路
the rods are fitted to the crank and crank gears are installed .
the bottom-end is assembled and the new forged pistons are weighed and balanced
hypo-vw 路
2 years ago Ben Ford was at the wheel of Horace when an inlet valve broke while the engine was turning 7000rpm ...... the damage was fairly substantial with a valve going through the piston , massive damage to the combustion chamber & valve seats , and the valve stem came back up the inlet port ( punching a hole through the inlet manifold )
the cause of the broken valve was due to an inlet valve guide coming loose in the head and as it shuffled up & down it wore the hole in the head (where it is located) so badly that the valve was coming down crooked into the seat , which in turn stressed the valve and snapped the head off .......
hypo-vw 路
the bottom end is assembled and a piston is fitted to 1 conrod to check the deckheight .....
the new Pauter conrods look half the size of the piston that is attached to them , I dont think the conrods will be the weak link in this little engine
the cylinder head is welded , machined & new valve seats installed along with new valve guide
porting then starts around the chamber & in the ports
hypo-vw 路
the ports are all cleaned up , the chamber is refaced and the head is ready for final seat cutting
note the spacers used in the chambers.... these heads with 42mm inlet & 38mm exhaust valves were previously used on a speedway midget which was bored for 94mm barrels . I had to have spigot sleeves made to locate the 87mm barrels into the heads for the 1641ml engine
coletrickle 路
Nice work guys!
Craig Torrens 路
Compression must be bloody high with combustion chambers like that !!
Good work 馃憤
Doug Sweetman 路
Nice rods Wayne 馃檪
Also very nice repair work to the head... I would have thought it cactus but looks like you have the technology !
Craig Torrens 路
Doug Sweetman wrote:Nice rods rod 馃檪
Who is Rod ?
hypo-vw 路
Doug Sweetman wrote:Nice rods rod 馃檪
WTF .... who is rod, Doug ??
hypo-vw 路
Craig Torrens wrote:Compression must be bloody high with combustion chambers like that !!
yep Craig ..... when we made 93hp@ the wheels the compression was 11.4 , now I have set it to 12.5 馃憤馃憤 that should make great power with the right tune .....
reub 路
Crazy con rods...
May I ask expected redline?
Super1302 路
crikey, thats fat............馃憤
Doug Sweetman 路
Bah... Sorry Wayne, brain fart. Apologies.
Nice engine build thread anyway.
colin 路
Geez Wayne, Horace has a great looking set of legs.馃槈
Cheers Col
hypo-vw 路
reub wrote:Crazy con rods...
May I ask expected redline?
sure reub , you guys should know that I have very few secrets and love to share info with you ( thats why I always seem to get myself in the shit ).......
Horace is geared so that when Ben comes out of a corner the engine is turning 5800rpm and at the end of the short straight approx. 7800rpm 馃お馃お
hypo-vw 路
colin wrote:Geez Wayne, Horace has a great looking set of legs.馃槈
Cheers Col
just wait till you see his new boots then Col 馃槀馃槀
More rubber under Horace than I would have expected too.... Big boots
hypo-vw 路
the spark plug hole is re-drilled and the seats are refaced in the heads . I then lap each valve into its seat and check the valve face & seat face with bearing blue to ensure a perfect sealing surface
hypo-vw 路
I then gap all of the piston rings , installing them into the barrels to check the end gap .
the total seal piston rings are then fitted to the pistons
hypo-vw 路
all of the ring gaps are staggered , the pistons are clamped in the ring compressor and then all of the pistons are installed into the barrels , ready for assembly
hypo-vw 路
the valves are lapped into the other head and seat sealing is also checked prior to assembly
hypo-vw 路
valve spring shims are installed , a new set of Bugpak dual springs with chromoly retainers and hardened keepers is used , then the heads are assembled ...... ready for installation and checking piston to valve clearances
hypo-vw 路
after calculating the compression ratio at 12.9:1 , I have decided to install a set of .020" barrel shims to bring the c/r down to 12.5 .
the pistons and barrels are installed with Berg circlips and hi-temp silicon sealant at the base of the barrels
hypo-vw 路
windage pushrod tubes are used to limit the amount of oil that surges to the rocker covers when cornering and sliding sideways . the under-barrel air deflector plates are also installed
whathaveidone 路
cant belive with all the technology available,lapping valves is still done with a stick and a suction cap between 2 hands!!!!!!!!!!!
Nice work guys馃憤馃憤馃憤馃憤
hypo-vw 路
whathaveidone wrote:cant belive with all the technology available,lapping valves is still done with a stick and a suction cap between 2 hands!!!!!!!!!!!
Nice work guys馃憤馃憤馃憤馃憤
my local engine reconditioner has spent 150K on a machine that cuts valve seats in the heads and it does an awesome job , but being a bit 'old school' I still like to lap the valves in and check the seat sealing , especially after I have been playing in there with a die-grinder ...... 馃槑
hypo-vw 路
we are using an additional 4 new rims with new Hoosier race tyres on Horace for his come-back to speedway
hypo-vw 路
a new CSP oil pump relief cover and aeroflow oil fittings have been fitted to the engine .
Berg swivel feet adjusters will be used also this time to take a bit of load off the valve guides . I soak the swivel feet in auto trans oil prior to assembly to ensure that I get lubrication into the ball of the swivel
hypo-vw 路
new scat race race pushrod set is cut to the length I need and the tips are installed .
After installing the rockers and adjusting tappets I find that the 42mm inlet valves are striking the pistons .... so heads back off and pistons out to have the valve notches enlarged .
hypo-vw 路
while I work on the engine , Cindy helps Ben with the assembly of a new battery isolation switch and replacement of all electrical terminals .
with the valve notches re-machined the engine is assembled and new inlet manifold gaskets are cut to match the ports . The inlet manifold has also been welded and requires minor porting
hypo-vw 路
a new Scat welded & balanced cooling fan is used , the engine is assembled , carbs cleaned , exhaust fitted and the engine is back in Horace
hypo-vw 路
aeroflow oil fittings are fitted to the oil lines , breather box is cleaned and connected , and a new tacho is installed
hypo-vw 路
the fuel system has been fully cleaned and filters replaced , the race harness belt is removed and will be replaced .
Horace has his own personalised trimmed seat ..... complete with shit stain !! lol
hypo-vw 路
the engine has been run , basic tune set and it is off to the dyno this morning at 10am for tuning .
If all goes well at the dyno , Ben Ford will be racing Horace at Nowra speedway tonight ......
coletrickle 路
Waiting for news!
hypo-vw 路
well, extremely happy with the dyno results from the 1641ml engine in Horace .
We went to the dyno at 10am , first run made 95.7hp @ the wheels and with some minor tweaking we ended up with 105.8hp @ the wheels and 757lbs of tractive effort (which is almost as much as my blue sports sedan) and by 11.15am we are back at WPVW .....
This gives us 1.05hp per cubic inch of capacity @ the wheels .
looking forward to watching Ben give those water-pumpers a thrashing tonight , and playing pit-crew for him .
Doug Sweetman 路
Top stuff - good luck
Craig Torrens 路
Great result Wayne.
Did you do any 4th gear runs ?
vassy66T1 路
Well done!!
Would be cool to see it run 馃憤
coletrickle 路
Exellent fellas!Got me all motivated to pull my finger out and get my old 1585 back together.Do your thing tonite Ben!Shame I can't be there tonite!Is there an event around the Sydney event in feb?Ill come early or stay late to see Horace Do his stuff!
airkool_little_bastard 路
Just got home from watching Horace's breif return to the track
Poor Horace 馃檨
Super1302 路
what happened? 馃檨
hypo-vw 路
Super1302 wrote:what happened? 馃檨
It was disappointing to say the least to see Horace perform so crap after such good preparation results , we haven't looked into it too deep as yet to determin what the smoke is caused from , but the drematic loss of power was a result of 2 broken rocker arms on no.3 cylinder . Unfortunately I didnt have any spare rocker arms with me to replace them .
These are the same rocker arms that I have always used on this engine and they are stock VW arms on solid rocker shaft assemblies .
I have changed the valve springs , added swivel feet adjusters and new pushrods . My thoughts at this early stage is that the increased rocker angle with the swivel feet adjusters may be just too much load for the stock rocker arms with the new heavier bugpack dual springs .
We also have 1 plug showing very lean and 1 plug very oily .
We will get horace back to WPVW , remove the heads and barrels for inspection and report from there ......
thanks for posting the vid .... great footage..... I will check the 2 incar vids and get them posted also
whathaveidone 路
Dam馃槩
hypo-vw 路
Craig Torrens wrote:Great result Wayne.
Did you do any 4th gear runs ?
no Craig , we did all the tuning in 3rd gear only ..... and then the power runs in 2nd gear as this is the only gear we use on the track during a race . It gives us an accurate comparison between Horace and other speedway cars that we have built engines for and tuned .
Horace made 105.8hp @ the wheels , in comparison we built the engine for the orange datsun 1600 (car 18) , tuned it on the dyno in 2nd gear also as this is the gear he runs in and it made 92.8hp @ the wheels . Another datsun 1200 coupe I assisted with and tuned on the dyno made 113hp @ the wheels ......
coletrickle 路
Bummer,did you have to clearance the rockers for the swivel feet?
hypo-vw 路
coletrickle wrote:Bummer,did you have to clearance the rockers for the swivel feet?
no Col , the rockers dont have to be clearanced for the Berg swivel feet adjusters , as the rocker assemblies are spaced away from the valves with 0.090" shims and pushrods are then cut to the correct length
tayloredvw 路
Hey wayne, bad luck about the engine trouble.
Just wondering what type of sealant do you use to seal the oil lines into the case?
Doug Sweetman 路
Unlucky mate, sorry to hear. I'm ire ome investigation into geometry and loading will clear it up for you. Sounded brilliant on the YouTube vid !
2442supercharged 路
pics of broken rockers
dangerous 路
I used that same rocker set up on all my engines until I stepped up to the Pauter heads and it worked well.
Even with 460lb chevy valve springs and on my AF heads when I ran my nines.
VW rockers are forged steel, so perhaps something bottomed out.
Adjuster looks to be out a bit far, but that is not really relevant in your issue.
Great engine combination and power!
hellbugged 路
Wayne
Noticed the spring shimms in the heads and was intent on asking simply out of interest before the failure........Do you tighten up the springs to max rates from bind or happy to run just them to stop chaffing on the head?
Nice little engine
hypo-vw 路
hellbugged wrote:Wayne
Noticed the spring shimms in the heads and was intent on asking simply out of interest before the failure........Do you tighten up the springs to max rates from bind or happy to run just them to stop chaffing on the head?
Nice little engine
I like to measure the installed height of the retainer , collets and valve on all 8 valves , then I shim the springs so that they have even spring tension and leave minimum 0.060" from coil bind .
hypo-vw 路
dangerous wrote:VW rockers are forged steel, so perhaps something bottomed out.
Ben Ford came up with a reasonable theory taday Dave , 2 years ago Horace broke an inlet valve and badly bent the exhaust valve on no.2 cylinder , perhaps the rocker assembly was on the other side of the engine back then and the rocker arms had been stressed ?? maybe ....
We will pull the heads and barrels from Horace tomorrow and get it sorted so that Ben can run Horace at Parramatta Speedway this saturday night in the street stock class .
The promoter of the class ( which is mainly Holden commodores and Ford falcons) approached us last saturday night and asked if we would be interested in bringing Horace to PCR and running at the rear of the field , mainly as a crowd pleaser !!
We gladly accepted , so Horace goes to PCR this saturday night !!
matberry 路
hypo-vw wrote:We gladly accepted , so Horace goes to PCR this saturday night !!
That's awesome Wayne, get it back together and run that field down 馃槀馃お馃槏馃槉馃ゲ馃馃槑
Doug Sweetman 路
He might start at rear of field.... Doubt he will finish there !
I'm learning lots from this thread too by the way...
Craig Torrens 路
Great news re Parramatta.馃樀
hypo-vw 路
a short vid of Horace on the dyno at South Coast Rotary.....
hypo-vw 路
another vid of Horace racing last saturday night at Nowra Speedway ...........
TOPCAT69 路
Give me more!
Enjoying this thead 馃榾馃榾
Great work WPVW team.
cheers tc
hypo-vw 路
TOPCAT69 wrote:Give me more!
Enjoying this thead 馃榾馃榾
Great work WPVW team.
cheers tc
thanks for your positive comments TC ..... here is some more for you !!
Horace is ready for Parramatta Speedway on saturday night 12th January .....
after a full engine strip on wednesday to inspect all of the internals ( as I didnt want to risk any internal engine damage ) , the 1641ml engine has been reassembled today , installed and test driven .
At 7-30am I arrived at WPVW , made a coffee and proceeded to wash and inspect all of the internal engine parts . Shortly after 9am Ben Ford and my son Dean arrived to assist me in cleaning parts for the reassembly . By 1pm we had the engine reassembled and tappets adjusted , Ben Ford then fitted the cooling tin and accessories , exhaust and webers while Dean and I went to lunch with my partner Louise .
When we returned to WPVW an 1hr 15mins later the engine was in Horace , everything connected and ready to start .
The engine was running by 3pm and tuned , a thorough check-over and then Ben Ford took Horace for a test flight up and down the street , revving very quick and smoothly to 7500rpm .
Back into the workshop for a quick check-over again and all good !!
We spent the next hour adding more stickers to Horace for better advertising at the track ........ and tomorrow morning just a bath for Horace before he goes to play in the mud !!
Doug Sweetman 路
Nice action vid - that corolla was asking for it, he was all over the shop and I reckon Ben might hav had him next lap if th rockers hadn't given up the ghost.
Good luck tomorrow !
Craig Torrens 路
did you find out why it broke the rockers ?
hypo-vw 路
Craig Torrens wrote:did you find out why it broke the rockers ?
nothing obvious in the engine strip Craig , however Ben Ford has been banned from doing 1st gear rolling start take-offs after turning the 1641ml engine to valve bounce & 9000rpm .
As the field approached the green flag Horace was already turning 6000rpm on light throttle and then Ben planted his foot into it . The engine immediately turned 9000rpm and the valve springs are not designed to cope with those revs .
We still think that the rockers had been previously stressed ......
Craig Torrens 路
How did it go at Parra ?
whathaveidone 路
Come on Wayne!!!!!!!! You cant just leave us hanging馃槵
hypo-vw 路
Horace looked very impressive amongst all of those Holdens & Fords .
I didnt get to go and watch / help after all of that work I put into it due to a prior dinner engagement with Louise and a bunch of friends , but I really wanted Ben to go and have a great time in Horace .
Horace was very fast and passed many cars ( sometimes 2 at a time ) however this was short lived due to a fuel starving problem . Ben would run strong for 4-5 laps then Horace would loose all power . Ben looked for the problem between races but was unable to find it ..... He went back out for 2nd heat and same story , ran strong for 4-5 laps then no fuel !! and again in the feature race ...... we think we may have a dry bush in the Holley fuel pump and as the pump gets hot it grabs the shaft to slow the pump , hence low delivery rate .
The reason why I suspect this is due to my son Dean having his beetle stop on the road just before going to Warwick last year ..... when his bug stopped he noticed that the fuel pump was not running and it had been getting a little noisy . Dean managed to hit the fuel pump and get it to run long enough to get his bug back to my shop .
He removed the holley pump which was mounted at the rear of the front suspension beam and I stripped it for inspection ..... I found that water had been getting into the top of the pump and had washed all of the lubricant from the upper bush , so the shaft was running dry . I cleaned the bush and the shaft , lubed it and it has been running very quietly ever since .
With Horace sitting in the weather for the past 2 years and the pump getting hosed off every time we wash the mud from inside Horace , I am confident that I will find the same has happened to this holley pump .
I will check it this week as Ben will race Horace again at the end of next week at Moruya Speedway with the 1600 sedans again .
Ben got some great footage of Horace racing last saturday night at PCR , with 4 cameras mounted in Horace at different angles and Cindy also videoing from the crowd . I will edit and make a short movie over the next couple of nights , then post it for you all to see
hellbugged 路
Yes yes Wayne ..... Same probs here with those pesky Holley pumps 馃槵
hypo-vw 路
after many hours of searching through what seemed like endless footage from 5 cameras , I have edited it down to a 16min movie of the highlites of Horace racing at Parramatta Speedway on saturday night ........
Hope you enjoy !!
hellbugged 路
Sweet as!
PAZZAN 路
馃憤馃憤
IWL_86 路
Awesome effort !!!! Hear that mouse motor rev!!!! 馃槑
HappyDaze 路
Why didn't they sweep all that dirt and mud off the track......how are you supposed to drive on that stuff?馃槀
Great effort all 'round.馃憤
hypo-vw 路
last night the entire fuel system on Horace was removed for inspection .
The tank was found to be clean & fuel flowing very fast from the outlet fitting , the fuel filter checked & was clean , the fuel pump stripped right down to find the bushes dry but no water corrosion (reassembled pump & lubricated the bushes) , the fuel tap checked & found to be clean , the fuel pressure regulator stripped and water damage found !! water has entered the top of the Holley regulator via the vent gallery for the diaphram and totally corroded/rusted the diaphram plate & spring . This has caused the spring to loose tension and the diaphram to become very stiff with the rust build up between the bottom of the plate and the rubber diaphram surface . The fuel supplied by the pump is stopped entering the regulator by a check ball , this check ball needs to be depressed off its seat by the diaphram to allow the fuel past , but the very stiff diaphram & rusted spring would not allow this . the fuel pressure regulator has been replaced with the same type & the adjustment screw is now much higher than the old regulator with the same fuel pressure . Both carburettor tops removed & the needle valves removed for inspection . Carb float levels checked again & found to be OK .
The entire fuel system has been re-installed with all new larger diameter fuel hose & the pump has been relocated to the front of Horace next to the bottom of the tank .
Ben is off to Moruya Speedway next sat night 26th January 2013 .
airkool_little_bastard 路
Any plans to take Horace out for a spin this summer?