G'day all. just a kick off my daughter bought her husband a 74 bay as a surprise xmas present then she bought her dad a76 bay the son in law's is gong to be a resto but running ej18 it was originally a 1600 they have bought a 1963 caravan to resto to go behind it. It has minimal rust & minor ding's. Mine is a different type of build it has had the rear gaurd's cut & rolled to baja style by previous owner it has been in a shed since rego ran out in 05 so body is pretty good. my plans are for a baja bus but not in usual style. I have sopent many hour's laying under a photo taking to find 4x4 spindles that could possibly fit the front end after a lot of measuring closest is rodeo. The drive train is 3.5 ltr rover v8 behind front seat backed up with a hiace alloy case 5speed same shape as supra but side shift linkage's this is then connected to a 720 Nissan transfer case which is divorced from trans by a short shaft made up of kombi cv joint a drive flange of kombi box & shaft machined to have the hiace gearbox yoke welded to it the diff's are vt v6 auto commodore the rear drive shaft is pretty short so I am using a late model 180b half shaft as a tail shaft as it bolts to transfer case need to modify the rear flange for diff joint but not an issue the front shaft is a combination of commodore wagon & 180b half shaft to allow for slide. the whole drive train will be mounted on to a separate 10cm x 5 cm boxed frame bolted to inner kombi rails. to get clearance for front diff I have moved the centre steering arm to the bottom of the beam instead of thru the middle unlike the factory built mules for testing the syncro running gear. the shifter is hiace remote but using marine style control cables instead of bar type linkages to clear the motor the engineer doing my machining has assured me he can cut & shut the drive shaft's to take kombi outer's for the rear & rodeo front's to commodore shafts with out any worries so that's the biggest expense out of the way. I am tossing up wether to use straight lpg twin carby manifold I have or stay with the injection. pics to follow
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day ian. yes it's called a syncro of which a mate has 3 2 for part's to keep his ej20 turbo on the road which after 4 gearbox's it's sitting in his shed unreg as he is sick of doing his money on trans repairs he is saving up to do a subaru gears conversion we have sorted out mount's etc for it with it you have to spend thousnd's to get a decoupler to drop awd then the same for lockerdiff ho freewheeling hub's available so even with decoupler the front diff still drags the weight of the tailshaft. I had planned to buy the better body but prefer the bay shape
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all sent intermediate shaft between gear box & transfer case to be built using kombi halfshaft machined to have the bolt on flange of the nissan case machined out to a press fit & welded on. On the gearbox side of the cv joint will be done the same to take the toyota input yoke this will give flex & front rear movement between them & gives me an extra 75 mm's in length of everything. I bought a davis craig electric water pump & remote oil cooler filter setup this will give me An extre 100 mm's. Tried to fit extractors but no joy don't want to make the hole for motor any bigger so using p6b manifold nice fit snug to block. piking up the radiator & gear box on monday so should be able to start building the frame to mount everything on it will be set up hopefully so the motor gearbox transfer can be liffted out thru side door in 1 piece. 1 good things is it's all aluminium cased so not much weight in the centre. Can anyone tell me can I fit rear facing seats behind the front seat's as i would like to pu buckets on both sides of the engine box there's enough room. All for now
Ernie.
roverv8bay ·
roverv8bay ·
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. picked up 5 speed today a wash & rattlecan rebuild
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. The ej18 had blue silicone smeared under heads between block took it back got another 1 of the floor when i started stripping & cleaning it found it's an ej22 bonus for $250.00 including complete harness & computer. some pics of stuff for my 4x4 project the LED lights are park & blinker I plan on filling in the front vent & blinker holes & recessing lights into front
Doug Sweetman ·
Neat project - very cool stuff !
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Intermediate shaft also the standard nissan shaft I could havs had it shortened but still tight for space. the kombi drive flange has to have the spline removed to a press fit tolerance for the toyota slip yoke to go into the other end is a kombi axle also press fit into flange of transfer case
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. More of the shaft insitu. I used this similar set up when the lj50 & 80 suzuki 4x4 were getting corolla & 120y motors fitted in the same type of position the companies doing the full fitting kits supplied a solid yoke that bolted to the transfer case & was unfogiving if you didn't have everything lined up spot on I found it allowed movement bach & forth up & down but was compact.
matberry ·
Now that IS S-H-O-R-T
roverv8bay ·
G'day Matt. good to have a quick catch up the other day. that shaft is between the transmission & the transfer case just in case people may confuse it for the rear tail shaft. I spent a little time today just setting front diff up to bay beam to check for axle alignment and clearance on steering arm. I should be able to fit the commodore diff rear mount into area between beams & bend up a 5cm tube xmember to bolt between chassis rails & bolt to top drive shaft flange
helbus ·
Good work, keep at it
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. thanks helbus that's a compliment coming from people that are well VW land by known by their name. Just 2 pics today spent a 1/2 hour today just setting diff into place on a complete beam along with bent axles they are hose just to sort out clearance issues. The front mount will be the original commodore mounted to a gusseted 90deg angle of the lower beam. If you look at the pinion flange you will see the Nissan tailshaft flange it has the same size locator as the commodore so just have to drill 4 holes for the rear Nissan drive shaft to bolt up that made my day I envisaged all sorts of oddball to bolt them together. Note the clearance on the relocated center arm I know the tierods are loose but still plenty of room.t the spindle should be ready on Monday to test fit. more then
Doug Sweetman ·
Mate that's just brilliant ! Would never have thought it possible to graft a diff to a beam front end !
roverv8bay ·
G'day Doug. the JEG is something to look at it's basically copying off but modernised a bit. here are some body & under floor pics pretty tidy note the speedo don't know how many times or any history if anyone recognises it please let me know it was from NSW. the guards were cut & rolled when I bought it. the roof is the worst for brown stuff but only surface the flares are from volks conversions makes the rear look finished
roverv8bay ·
G'day all just fitted spindle bit of a problem so back to engineers he has to move the bottom ball joint hole to get enough adjustment on camber. I will also have to spread the beams by about 5 cm's so I will get new plates watercut out of 13mm plate with the body mount holes set to provide 50mm lift as well. Any thoughts or opinions gratefully received on the plare size as it will replace the pressed metal beam support set ups
ernie
Doug Sweetman ·
Ernie, half inch plate I would think is fine, assuming you are talking about standard structural grade plate (250MPa yield). If you are worried, you could try and find some boiler plate cut offs (430 - 460MPa yield) which will give you a bit more strength.
roverv8bay ·
G'day Doug. Thanks for the information. Went back to shed this arvo and spent time with a tape measure & found that the lower arm is approx. 15mm longer than the bottom. If the bottom torsion bars are the same as the top by using top arms on the bottom I will get the adjustment just have to figure out lower shock mounts for the arms. So tomorrow will be spent stripping the font beams out to check out if it will do what I think.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. picked up Datsun 1600 halfshafts today $20.00 for 2 cheap. compared to custom built tailshaft the rear 1 will be used complete as is & the other will have the fixed uni joint end machined off then inserted into front shaft
Doug Sweetman ·
Love this thread... Real mad scientist stuff !
helbus ·
Awesome work. Thinking outside the mainstream. And then making it happen
nils ·
I was wondering how you where going to make the arm/spindle combo fit together, seeing as the rodeo has quite a different spacing between the joints. Any idea how spreading the beam will effect caster?
Keep up the good work, very egger to see how this turns out
roverv8bay ·
G'day Nils. yes to splitting beam if I don't it puts a load on the balljoint angles. the caster should be the same as kombi stubs as I'm still using top adjuster if I need more I will get another adjuster cone put into bottom joint. here are some pics of intermediate shaft now finished just have to press Toyota gearbox joke into kombi gearbox cv flange then get engineer to weld for me my welding is okay for general mounts & frame work but they will have torque going thru them
roverv8bay ·
Gday all. shaft assembled just have to get it welded
roverv8bay ·
G'day all just picked up freebie seats for rear pajero. Started to locate the rear diff should have the height etc sorted this arvo so can do drawings & form templates for mounting brackets pics
roverv8bay ·
G'day all spoke to Engineer this morning he cant see any problems with the 4x4 in kombi. Ihave a meeting with him on Monday morning to view pics & tell me what he expects me to do & how to do it so fingers crossed. thanks to Matt Berry for your advice spoke to the shaftman & he is going to look at it to see what is best.
ernie
OZ Towdster ·
Ernie the seat to use for the rear if you really wanted a 3 seater is the mitsubishi delica L300 model rear seat as that is what i have mounted in my baja bay and it is a nice comfy seat , plus has a 60 40 rear split which folds over on top of the seat swab which if mounted at the right height becomes a extension of the high floor area in the rear and hence becomes a great bed base .
The other nice feature of the seat is that it also folds foward when folded over which creats a nice storage area under the seat base
matberry ·
👍👍
roverv8bay ·
G'day Andrew & Matt. The seats II have were super cheap the rear seat does the same it has 3 set ups to it. I have been working on the engine mounting for petes bay with the ej 22 I have rotated the inlet moved the alternator over to the side cut down the mounting brackt to clear the manifold & cut a plate to bolt on where the belt idler pully mounted then welded a tube to it this will bolt onto the original 1600 crossmember using the bay rubber mounts
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. off to get adapter flanges made to bolt kombi cv's to commodore diff centre this will save getting the axles cut & joined. going to meet engineer this morning he is at Capalaba for blue tag to see if he will give approval he doesn't seem concerned about the 4x4 aspect so fingers crossed he seemed easy to talk to on the phone. We will see.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spoke to Engineer today he builds trikes rods & other stuff very switched on & a 1st meeting very helpful . because vw built bay 4x4 even though they were mules for the syncro I'm doing the front drive the same & there are pics of it available he suggested I enclose them with the application to QLD transport. f the kombi had a removable chassis he could pass I with out going to transport. He is more than happy with engine location & transmissions I'm using. A mate has just turned up with a spare set of spindles with axles & nearly new cv joints bargain price. now have all the parts for front drive only have to sort out axles.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
Gday all. been sorting out rear diff rear crossmember this is the shape now to decide on mounting method to the chassis rails. The mount in the pics is the original commodore unit mounted upside down. pretty simple mounting application easy to repair or replace. Now to build the front mount for this end again a piece if plate I have drill it of a template I have folded up then take & get it folded at 90 degs x 2 so a bit of searching to get it done. all for now hope to have it sitting in the tilt on Tuesday pics if I do
ernie
TheMiniMan ·
Ah, you`re going through Earl , Lovely Lovely Lovely fella... tell him "Matt The Mini Man" said hello :-)
he`s helping me out with a couple of projects as well :-)
Lookin good Earnie, keep up the good work mate.
roverv8bay ·
G'day miniman. yes Earl's the man his work is to be seen to be believed. the trike he is building is top work probably the best tube frame set up I have ever seen in the flesh. what have you got on the go or is it a secret. with our interest we should get together do you work full time. being retired I have been finishing of an extension on the house plus the 2 bays on the go.
ernie
TheMiniMan ·
work for myself "pretending" to fix morris minis for a living :-)
we`ve had adjustable mini control arms & big disc brake conversions approved by Earl for the minis
& i currently have Earl approving a Monaco Fast-back mini for me-->
& we are doing a trike for the road similar to this (except only one rear wheel of course)
this buggy has Yamaha R1 motor fitted but we will be using all sorts of bike motors like the Suzuki hayabusa & Zx14 etc for the Trikes
2 seaters & single seaters being made :-)
john1960 ·
more photos please ernie.
h ·
cool stuff ernie..
great to read and see all the techy stuff 🙂
TheMiniMan ·
i don`t understand why he won`t approve this turbo charged alloy V8 powered mini for me tho :-)
keep up the good work Earnie & i`ll be talking with Earl at Capalaba very shortl;y so i`ll say hello for you :-)
roverv8bay ·
G'day h & miniman. Miniman is that a minor roof on he Monaco lot rounder the the broadspeed. What transmission on the v8 years ago we cut down a Kimberly & tried 1500 box but time ran out on it so we canned the idea. I spoke to Earl aboyt passing a rover v8 trike I have the basic front frame motor & plan on using an alfa auto trans axle as the diff is at the rear instead of in front of box giving a longer wheel base. he said he had passed a few v8 trikes so next project is in the planning stage after my kombi & the son in laws bay ej22. I started the front mounting setup for the rear diff today the brackets will have the marked hole cut out this will slip over the 5cmx5cm tube
ernie.
roverv8bay ·
the brackets they have to be cut down to length. there are 2 bolted together to drill holes the bottom bolt hole will align with the mounting hole.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. cut brackets this morning this it what mount xmember will look like just have to weld brackets to tube. The brackets are bumper brackets of Nissan patrol.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. picked up kombi cv to commodore diff adapters today. Should have the complete rear assembly fitted up next couple of weeks. Will have get the centre machined out for movement.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. I made up the ply template this morning for the front beam to spread it 8cm's to allow for spindle's difference between the ball joints took 1/2 hour to do this I will get them cut out next week with a bit of luck. once they are finished I can sort out the front diff mounts & decide what type of steering mods to use
ernie
nils ·
Looking forward to seeing progress on this front beam👍
roverv8bay ·
G'day nils. I hope to set up the beams tomorrow with sliding tube welded to the inside & I have to make a second ply template that I will cut thru the center of the holes to form a jig to sit it in to assemble so when I cut the original mounting brackets off it will slide apart but retain the proper position in regards to angles of arms etc for caster. I will pre drill it so it will slide & lock into place. the biggest hassle is getting beam down off the wall rack. all for know
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. I set up the the cv adapters today will need to use a beetle axle on the left side to make up for the diff centre offset. Also picked up the pajero rear disc assemblies now to sort out fitting them up to kombi hub assembly
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. picked up this rack for free something different to the usual tube racks. the beetle axle is to short to use so I'm going to space out hub carriers on both sides by 12mm using steel plate by doing that I can use 2 kombi axles so no cut & shut axles.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all scored a good running rover motor today. It's an 84 model so no cat or other associated parts needed the other motor is a 86 unleaded so needs all the bells & whistles to comply will use it to build a 5litre. for later. I swapped the motor for 2 non runner's that have been in the shed since 1993 so their an unknown. so motor cost me nothing & it's complete with exhaust manifolds & good muffler system which should be easy to modify to fit the kombi looking at the bends & twist in it. also got the steel plate for the hub spacers for rear. can some tell me the amount of float in & out in the axles of a kombi. also scored another roof rack for son in laws project love the associates scrap yard not to be confused with wreckers yard I pay for bit's buy the kilo.
ernie
lou0060 ·
this thread always brings a smile to my face......
keep up the good work, looking forward to the finished unit.
matberry ·
Good on ya Ernie.
Axle length needs to be set at the suspension height where both cv's are level where the axle length is shortest. At this point you need to have some play, similarly at full droop there should also be some play in the axle.
roverv8bay ·
G'day lou0600 & Matt. Thanks for info Matt. I plan on setting up the rear diff next Wednesday. along with the transfer case & gearbox. to sort out how much room I have the measurement's add up. but you never know until things are in place. Thinking about flipping the rear hub carriers so the bottom shock mount doesn't hand up on rock etc just have fiddle with upper mount position & length
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spent some time on mounting diff into place the ugly pipe x member has gone in it's place will be a simple mount bolted to original gearbox mount it 's like it was made to be used for this purpose. placed motor at right height to clear front tailshaft. the length is good just have to shorten front section & put a rear diff flange on onto it next week I will start on the morse cables for the shifter. After lift I will have to run to lengths of tube beside the tailshaft same as syncro set up but bit stronger from front beam to torsion bar tube. All for now
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. picked up a Mitsubishi steering column complete with the angle box along with a deawoo power rack & pinion also the L300 cable shifter to use on transmission just have to chase up a t bar type shifter for the transfer case. picked up a manual flywheel & good range rover pressure plate for $40.00. Ordered the dellow bellhousing today approx. 2 weeks wait. having the kombi brake drums & rear hubs drilled to take 6 stud pattern the hubs have enough in them to cope. building engine frame next week & chassis stiffener's like the syncro they will bolt from the front beam to the rear torsion bar tube. all for now.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all the Dellow bellhousing & McLeod concentric thrust bearing arrived today so next week will be bolt up & manfacture the mounting brackets & final location point of drive train. I have had the floor reinforcing for engine cradle welded up ready to go in next week. the 7.5cm x 5cm angle iron welded to 40cm x 3cm tubes will push into the floor supports between the floor & the chassis rails then bolt thru the floor angle iron ends also sit on the xmember at the front & on top of rear suspension tube the 5cm x 5cm tube frame for the drive train will bolt down on top of the angle iron
pics tomorrow
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spent a couple of hours on ECLECTIC yesterday. fitting up the floor reinforcing & sorting out engine transmission heights they are governed by the transfer case location in the pics you will get an idea of the intrusion into the load area by everything associated with the conversion. the drawing is of the shape of the covers & approx heights. So it won't affect rear seat if & when I fit it there should be enough room for the dicky seats out of the pajero either side of the gear box depending on noise level as to fitting them.
ernie
this is the frame to be fitted into top hats
going into floor
in a bit
all the way home
blue tube will be the engine cradle sides
nils ·
This is what i imagine ernie looks like when working on his van 😂
matberry ·
lol
roverv8bay ·
G'day nils & matt my daughter agreed with pic she thinks the same where do I get so much in my head at anyone time. Shame I wasn't smarter at school might have become something. more pics
ernie
height of transfer case above floor
height of transmission
height of engine before cutting out more floor & trimming down kombi xmember
roverv8bay ·
Back from lunch a quick cut on floor between seats & trim down top of x member to allow motor to sit in it's final resting place so here we go more pics
still to be lifted 25mm
need new manifolds
small mounting bracket to be made up will make some templates to make them at home next week
tarago shifter location 2 to choose from think it will be built up to save reaching down
the tarago shifter cables are spot on length
back home tonight so get into small jobs have a hub carrier at engineer's getting machined to accept the pajero diff housing axle flange to be welded onto carrier & then can bolt on complete backing plate handbrake & caliper mounting bracket's. I will post pics of the process to assemble them when I get them back. all for now. Thanks for following my build
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all picked up 1st carrier hub took a very slight amount of to clean & round of to fit pajero axle flange to slide over it just nave to determine height thenbolt to hub where the chalk marks are will drill & tap into hub plenty of metal to do that.
hub with with tidy up
hub & pajero flange
slide on fit just have sort out location
allway home will use spacers to set depth
pajero caliper bracket & backing plate
roverv8bay ·
G'day all sent the caliper bracket off to be machined 1/2mm to slide over carrier. It looks like I will do away with the axle housing bracket & just bolt the caliper bracket straight onto carrier hub I hope to get it back this afternoon. sorting out the gearbox mount today as well. will post pics tomorrow.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
Gday all picked up the brake set up it's simple as the pajero caliper bracket had to have less than a mm taken out of it the engineer is going to plug the kombi stud holes once everything is sorted. So here are some pics
the pajero caliper bracket
all the bits less the backing plate & hand brake assembly
assemble to measure fit & locate space the bracket the engineer is machining up some locator rings to go between the hub centre & the disc to sit in the taper in the disc
next job to sort out the front diff & power steering mounts so all for now
ernie
OZ Towdster ·
Ernie , i bet your wrecking yards send you a Christmas card
roverv8bay ·
G'day Andrew. actually I get some stuff so cheap I sometimes get excited like $30.00 for the complete disc assemblies. The beauty is I just drop him $50.00 a fortnight so easy to pay for. I haven't been out there this week trying to not come home with more weight to put in ECLECTIC. I'm back down the goldie on Monday arvo so hope to get the engine cradle spot welded then I can sort mounts. I have just been down & bent up a template to build the gearbox mount off the box was mounted off the top so I bent up a strip to go around it with a flat length on the bottom to sit on a mount of some type to be determined.
thanks for looking in on the progress.
ernie
matberry ·
Ahhh we're all looking Ernie. Keep it up mate, going well.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening matt. found a sliding door to start on electrics so next brain snap coming up. I have to go out to scrappies to get the door switch out of a tarago slider they have a 3 point spring loaded contact switch in the door & pillar so that will work for the winder motor. all for now again
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. been playing with rattle reconditioner pack couple of the assembly with backing plate in place.
the caliper sit's in a good position
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. been playing with linear actuator for power window motor instead of normal type motor. they are more than strong enough to move the glass maybe not as fast but not everything has to be fast. I'm looking at using them on the centre windows as well 1 at each end so it doesn't twist in frame will take door apart on Tuesday to see if it works pics if it does.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Spent an 1/2 hour today welding up the engine cradle bit of paint to protect it until the engine brackets era set up I have to get the r/h bracket off 1 of my spare engines out of a sedan as the range rover mount bracket is to big to use sand blasted then paint with por15.
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spent an hour today sorting out the shifter's the middle 1 is original tarago with it's floor mounting bracket the handbrake lever is hi ace the other shifter is L300 Mitsubishi removed from it's housing. no holed had to be drilled. It will have to be reinforced where they mount but at least it' all in 1 piece instead of 3 different bracket's If I can buy a small checker plate tool box I will use that as a console & cover for them. engineer has been flat out so no bit's to play with this week .
ernie
roverv8bay ·
D'day again. Sat engine cradle in to locate & make templates for the engine mounting brackets to weld on will do them tomorrow
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. made the mount brackets today. Bit rough around the holes but won't see it with the motor sitting on them
ernie
TheMiniMan ·
Goin Good Ernie,,, keep up the good work mate
roverv8bay ·
G'day Miniman. Thanks for dropping in. I spent some time today sorting out shifter housing come lockable console. after getting quotes to have one made this was the easiest & cheapest way to go cut the lid to form a separate section for the levers. I will put a false floor over the cables to form a console.
the unit sits neat between seats with room to clear seat belt stalks.I will cut the back out to sit over the front of the motor & seal against the front of the engine cover when its made.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. been measuring the spindle for lift if I place the caster nut at top it gives 7cm lift by placing nut at the bottom I gives 9.5cm lift with out changing the steering arm position by a great deal so will put hub & disc on then take to goldie next week to try it both ways. thinking about using a linear actuator to shift the transfer case save mucking around with cable set up it's a simple straight forward back motion no side movement.
ernie
OZ Towdster ·
roverv8bay wrote:D'day again. Sat engine cradle in to locate & make templates for the engine mounting brackets to weld on will do them tomorrow
ernie
Holy cow , this thing will be quicker than your Dunnydore with those 8 throttle bodies on a 4.4
roverv8bay ·
G'day Andrew. I wish they were throttle bodies just factory ram tubes I have the throttle body & plenum of it to get a new plenum made to take a Holley 4 barrel onto the injection manifold. how's the towd coming on. I hope to get ECLECTIC finished for Valla 14 so have to get going try to get it up to 8 hours a fortnight.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all spent some time with front spindle this morning pics will give the idea of what it should look like when it's assembled
ernie
nils ·
Nice T bar there ernie, for reaching nut around corners perhaps?😁
roverv8bay ·
G'day nils. The tbar is that bent it's been used to undo both beetle & kombi hub nuts to often about 25 years ago I bit the bullet & bought a 3/4 inch sidchrome bar & socket I have that many t bars in kit but it seems to just get used when I need 1. what do you think about setup
ernie
nils ·
There is a lot of promis here Ernie, I look forward to seeing the beam fully set up and moving. seeing as how the tubes have been spread
Will there be longer axles? It seems those ones will limit your travel pretty quick
roverv8bay ·
G'day nils. good to hear from you The beam still has tension on the upper arms & they are separated but not solid to each other hence the angle I don't plan on rock crawling type activities. it may get to Fraser or double island but that's about my limit of off roading. As I have said before this has been in my head for so long I just had to bite the bullet & make a start on the damn thing. before I spoke to earl about it I had planned on it being my final build but after seeing what he builds & the fact that I can build & register a v8 trike that is now to the point of moving the frame & motor into my Pantech bodied work shop to start the sorting out at least its at home in Nambour not down the goldie. I'm going to call it HEAPA it will consist of a Yamaha front frame section rover v8 under tank Alfa Romeo auto transaxle di dion rear suspension all the original Alfa brake full LPG twin carbie set up with the round tank over rear end with a spare wheel cover over it another bastard idea.as far as off road there's a short track between towen mount & the back of Palmwoods that's not to rough but good for testing on. unfortunately I cant fit longer arms unlike the beetle that you can use extenders or move the beam mounting point forward to accommodate longer arms the kombi suspension is pretty well set in place all I can do is lift. I'm not down the goldie now for 3 weeks so this will slow me down as far test fitting spindle so I will work on sorting out & starting the wiring harness for the dash I have a board set up to run it all on. also give me time to start on the ej22 harness for daughters kombi. I should be nice & mental with the Subaru.
all for now
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all went to Warwick meet on Sunday some very quick vw running especially the rat kombi with Porsche up it's but. had a quick conversation with the always helpful Matt Berry about spreading the beam to run the arms parallel he thinks I will get away with not spreading them so going to bolt spindle in to see what happens. the axle is a standard rodeo length you can see why there lift is limited.I have to get axles cut n shut to have commodore on 1 end for the diff & rodeo on the other they will be spigotted & strengthened with tube over weld. Engineer assures me they will be strong enough for the light front weight of the kombi. I scored an aluminium ute roll bar freebie that I hope will fit in the front if not I will mount it in the back for passenger safety you never know. I'm off to the truck wreckers sometime this week to find a throttle cable long enough to use with the tarago pedal assembly. so 1 more hole in floor to cover up now I have eliminated the pedals handbrake gearshift levers the front will look empty with all that bulky handbrake on it's own removed this mornig is planned before it gets hot to finish the deking wires then I have to sort out if I can fit impreza cup holder's into front of the tool box come shifter console this will be a better spot than under the dash. It's 10 to 6 so off to the deck. All for now
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Good score today complete vt v8 radiator with fans for the bargain price of &50.00 just have to sort out how to mount it in engine bay or on the rodeo bull bar I think it will end up on the bull after all its never going to be a show van it will be less noticeable than ordinary kombi bull bars as far as size & it has a winch mount type bar so a far bit covering the front view. all for now
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. well it's back to the drawing board for the rear disc set up I had to change the location of the caliper bracket holes in the bearing carrier. they had to have spacers made anyway so off to the pump house for 2 machined round flanges for irrigation system they will bolt to bearing carrier from the back & thread the plate for brackets to bolt to pics later on today.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. well spent some time on the spindle today looks like the beam can stay in it's position thanks to Matt for his unlimited knowledge of VW's. I ha to relieve some metal to clear the lower ball joint but nothing to radical still plenty of metal left the bottom arm is a bit tight on the caliper where the bump stop rubber hits relieved about 5mm of the side hump for it. I plan on mounting the complete spindle assembly next week. Then I will tie the front diff in to beam to find a sweet spot that will clear steering etc. bought the extractor face flanges today to set up engine pipes I will use pvc pipe & corners to get a shape then mandrel bends then get them welded up at the muffler shop. found a hotrod company that builds fibreglass floor tunnels the man is going to get around to the house to see what needs to be done to get 1 to fit. I will sit the console tool box in as well to check the shifter cable length pics on Friday all for now
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. back in the kombi shed after a month off. sat tool box come console in today have cut 10.5cm's off the back & trim the lid behind & relocate the lock.
the engine mount bracket's a tidy up then weld 5cm x 5cm angle to it then the angle bolt's down on top of the rail
this is the rodeo spindle insitu I think I will have to spread the beams there's a lot of down force on the lower beam I will bolt up the hub assembly tomorrow & see how it looks
more pic tomorrow of spindle set up
good night
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spindle assembly set up
roverv8bay ·
G'da all. spent some time sorting the spindle to beam & have decided to split the beams it's the case of not enough room for balljoints in the bottom so flipping lower arms as well as have ne beam plates cut to suit new width
this is the spindle flipped note the arms almost parallel so final position but still need to split beams but not as much
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Picking up a complete discovery 3.9 litre injected motor tomorrow. it has a stand alone engine harness apparently it only needs power to it everything to run the motor is in 1 piece. I have been working on the beam again set it up in a jig I made to correspond with the plates I need to have cut to suit the increase between them. Whwn VW did the mule it lookslike they spread them & plated in th cut as it has 2 bump stop arms it would be quick to do it that way but will have to check with Engineer what he wants. I have booked for valla 14 bit late to get into valla itself but in another park at least. I may trailer ECLECTIC down if its not running wishful thinking. all for now
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all this is the rear hub spacer to allow for thrust in cv joints due to the width of commodore diff & spacers. they are 12mm thick & by having 6 holes it lets me do 9cm lift with out resetting arms. will be bolting tube between bottom bolt holes & under bottom of inner arm.
all for now
have a Merry Christmas & Happy New Year everyone
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. not much happening at tthe time being I have torn my right rotator cuff could have been the left. changed the seats to a full set of 4 bucket & rear out of kia carnivale.
$30.00. The next project for it is fitting a set of mitsubishi delica overlap wipers they sweep to the very edge of the screen so will set up on a stuffed front panel It's light work not heavy lifting. I'm currently working on the new carport so I can bring ECLECTIC home from the gold coast so I can put some time into IT. been working sorting out the 3 piece tailshaft for the front diff in original position not enough ground clearence about 8" in centre of vehicle so getting 1 made to come around the sump instead of under it pics when i get it sorted. I will have to shorten sump as well but loss of capacity will be tzaken up in the double oilcoolers & remote filter. Once the drive train is in it's final place will be sorting out a oil cooler & pump for both the transmisions lots of fittings & hose. picked up a vt v8 radiator complete with fans relays will mount it to the front bar wont look pretty but will be effeciant. I'm going down to sydney to spend 3 days at Jeff dellows to sort out the adapter plates to suit rover v8 & v6 commodore motors to subarugears boxes for the kombi's. hopefully there will be some market for the v6 it will make good vehicle better.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. well ECLECTIC arrived in Nambour from the goldie today. tomorrow's task is unloading it & setting up the new work area & 7 meter Pantech workshop. then I can get down to business. looking at IY out of the shed I may not need to lift it as the only weight will be the commodore diff centre & fuel tank. I will see how it looks by stacking equivalent weight on top of engine bay. I think I will need extra hard shocks to take the torsion bounce out of it. Any suggestions gratefully considered. If anyone is around Nambour & would like to drop in pm me home most day's.
ernie
Doug Sweetman ·
Ernie - killer stuff mate, keep it up !
roverv8bay ·
G'day Doug. Thanks for dropping in. I had solar fitted to house today no power so I spent a couple of hours setting the rear diff insitu to get an idea of space for the radiator I thought it may have been to wide but plenty of room the cap even comes out under the engine hatch so nice position to fill the expansion bottle will fit onto the side bracket for the fans. have the rear diff in place it will need a beetle axle on the left side to allow for the off set in the pinion. I looks like I won't need the spacers for the rear hub's but may still use them for the lift. I don't know what to do for the airflow out of the old engine bay as far as having the radiator in there. louver's & mesh really make the hatch look shonky so will have to wait & see
all the best
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G;'day all. spent a couple of hours locating the alternator as the only room I have for it is under the side of the sump at dirt & water level so I have decided to run a drive shaft with the alternator pulley fitted to the front of it off the front crank pulley & located by self aligning bearings then bolted to aluminium blocks welded to the rover aluminium valve covers then attached to 100amp subi alternator by a rubber steering couple connector the shaft will run just above the injectors on the right side of the motor the shaft is being machined next week. pics when it's all back together.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. started building a dual battery carrier to mount behind the radiator in the old engine bay. it will slide in on tracks. need to get some weight over the rear axles to substitute for lack of any drive train. the diff weighs about half of the gear box so bugger all. engineer suggested aluminium shaft for the alternator so picked up 20mm x mtr long $20.00 cheap for what it is. was given an aussie desert cooler radiator today freebie so will look at using it instead of the thinner commodore unit. will post some pics next week.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spent some time fitting towbar off rodeo needs slight trim on the brackets to allow it to move up about 40mm. I have to move the tyre mount toward the centre to clear the tail lamp still enough room for engine hatch to open. Also setting up remote rear mounted alternator. I need to make a bracket to mount the front bearing above the timing case the shaft will be 20mm aluminium with a rubber steering coupling between shaft & alternator.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
more pics of the alternator set for making brackets.
ernie
after with tyre moved to centre then rattle can reconditioning
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. forgot to mention the silver object on the floor is a Holden Astra electric power steering pump. I'm thinking about mounting it under the front floor & putting cap up thru the hole left when I pull out the heater tube from floor to dash this will give easy access to fill fluid also put washer bottle filler in beside it & make a cover. The heater is from under the front seat in a 60 series land cruiser nice & compact will fit behind the dash has its own tap so can use the original kombi cable assembly to turn flow on. I plan on removing the complete dash assembly next week to start fitting up the Tarago brake & clutch cylinders along with the L300 steering column. I'm looking at the taillights as far as the reversing light being blocked may French in some LEDS that are shorter thus moving the reversing light up. Making slow progress on the engine side as the Engineer has been on holidays but hope to get the alternator shaft done. the rear tailshaft is finished pick up on Thursday I think it ended up about 20cms long lucky the diff centre is fixed minimal movement between transfer case & diff. All for now
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Thanks to Todd for helping me with some cad drawings the spread beam end plates will be ready to pick up from the water jet cutters in Caloundra next Thursday so I can finally make up the beam mounts for the power steering & the front diff mount. this is the last major bit of sorting & construction now it's the matter of bolting it altogether. put the rear tailshaft in it's a good fit so far just have to get under for a bit longer to check angles on axle shaft out to the hub.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all laying under ECLECTIC after fitting rear tailshaft decided to move the front diff centre over towards left side by 10cm's this will allow me to run the front tailshaft up beside the sump instead of underneath it this will give me an extra 10cm's clearance under the motor so well worth the time involved in setting up mounts for the centre bearing may et away with 2 piece shaft but have enough bit's if it needs to be 3 piece post some pics tomorrow.
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. had a trial run with my new plasma cutter to trim the end plate assemblies off ECLECTICS beam set up have to love the ease of use & lack of flame & heat. sorted out the template for v6 commodore to Subaru 5speed today taking it to Sydney to see about costings to have them made. Then off to nationals on Saturday morning.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all couple of pics to give kombi owners an idea of the Subaru to v6 commodore motor & the beam plates 12mm thick fit was tight had run small grind stone around the internal of the beam holes but will give an idea spread extra 8cm's between tubes.
vlad01 ·
roverv8bay wrote:G'day all couple of pics to give kombi owners an idea of the Subaru to v6 commodore motor & the beam plates 12mm thick fit was tight had run small grind stone around the internal of the beam holes but will give an idea spread extra 8cm's between tubes.
Now we're talking! 👍
roverv8bay ·
G'day vlad01 what are e talking the v6 or the suspension mods if it's the v6 the template is with the manufacturer to check it out found it will need a flywheel also this will be cnc machined out of solid so it will use all the original Subaru clutch assembly & bolt up to the v6 crank.
I have been working on the other side plate today just have to fit all the t/bars the arms & spindles to line up then weld then bolt in so fingers crossed it lifts it like I anticipate it should.
ernie
vlad01 ·
was referring to the V6.
just a heads up on the flywheel, these use a counter weighted flywheel and there are like 6 different sizing in the counterweights and the flywheel is indexed via one slightly offset bolt hole, almost impossible to see unless you look at it for ages at different orientations.
Dellow's conversions have lots of experience with billet flywheels for these engines. I am guessing you are using them to do the flywheel and adapter?
If this combo goes ahead, there is massive potential for this type of conversion coz the engines are so well designed and bullet proof.
I know of a few builders of these engines that will surprise you on what you can get out of them for relative little money. But even in stock form with a good tune on the ECU will pull a 1400kg 0-100 in the 6-7 sec bracket, possibly faster given the diff of the suby box is quite short ratio.
if you need help on the EFI/ECU side of V6 conversions, I can hook you up with the goods and knowledge to do it right.
I'd love to see any updates on the V6 conversion you may have in the future.
roverv8bay ·
G'day vlad01. correct in every respect. I Have know Jeff for 42 years & been looking at this since Todd developed the best thing to happen in our little world of VW ever. having spoken to Todd before sticking my head on a block he was more than happy for me to follow up on it. so here here is what it will require an adapter plate
similar to what Todd has developed to bolt VW motor to subi box flywheel to suit v6 & complete subi clutch then your on your way to reliability in the drive chain shame v6 is heavy it would be nice in type 3's. Off to the shed now to finish setting up ECLECTICS beam plates
ernie
roverv8bay ·
PS vlad will keep you updated plus thankyou for your offer the ecu side can be yours to do with as you wish if I takes off you get the work if you want it for that nightmare.
ernie
vlad01 ·
yes the engine is a bit heavy, but not ridiculously heavy.
I worked out complete engine with unnecessary bits tossed for a vw conversion should be around high 150kg mark.
could drop it further using aftermarket alloy heads and alloy "I" beam rods. Naturally you toss the balance shaft and gears, which drop 3kg or so.
I have thought a lot about dumping one in my notch, fitment is good actually, more compact than the stock engine in length and width, just taller. weight is the issue, higher COG and fair bit more Kg swinging around corners so I am saving my pennies for a much more expensive and complicated suby donk conversion instead. But these are perfect in vw buses as they have better weight distribution already and being heavier the engine has less % change to the total weight and distribution.
the simplicity of them and the engine management system are in my opinion 2nd to none. The flexibility and tuneability of the management system with few minor mods to the ECU and custom code surpasses all the aftermarket ECUs in so many ways. Its one of the many reasons these have been a choice of engine conversion for just about every other car except the VW.
Yeah leave the management stuff to me if you like, piece of cake!
the best thing about the suby box is the VSS. will come so handy for the ECU side of things. The gear ratios are pretty good for the V6 except for the diff. 3.9 is still too short, 3.45-3.27 will be good for hauling weight, 3.08 is ideal.
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. the beam plates fitted now to assemble & fit
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. After looking at the rear bar I not happy with it so going to shorten it up & move the spindle carrying the arm over towards the centre so as not to cover the taillights originally I was going to fit some in the bar but I determined that it would look shitey. so out comes the cut off machine tomorrow & drill some new holes.
the rear disc assemblies are finally sorted out for position & alignment so back to engineers to have them drilled then I can fit them up.
ernie
Subarugears ·
vlad01 wrote:yes the engine is a bit heavy, but not ridiculously heavy.
I worked out complete engine with unnecessary bits tossed for a vw conversion should be around high 150kg mark.
could drop it further using aftermarket alloy heads and alloy "I" beam rods. Naturally you toss the balance shaft and gears, which drop 3kg or so.
I have thought a lot about dumping one in my notch, fitment is good actually, more compact than the stock engine in length and width, just taller. weight is the issue, higher COG and fair bit more Kg swinging around corners so I am saving my pennies for a much more expensive and complicated suby donk conversion instead. But these are perfect in vw buses as they have better weight distribution already and being heavier the engine has less % change to the total weight and distribution.
the simplicity of them and the engine management system are in my opinion 2nd to none. The flexibility and tuneability of the management system with few minor mods to the ECU and custom code surpasses all the aftermarket ECUs in so many ways. Its one of the many reasons these have been a choice of engine conversion for just about every other car except the VW.
Yeah leave the management stuff to me if you like, piece of cake!
the best thing about the suby box is the VSS. will come so handy for the ECU side of things. The gear ratios are pretty good for the V6 except for the diff. 3.9 is still too short, 3.45-3.27 will be good for hauling weight, 3.08 is ideal.
I know you LOVE the V6 Commodore motor but I just can NOT understand why you would want to put one in a VW with a Subie trans when you have a 3.0L or 3.6L flat 6 Subie to use. By your own admission the Commie V6 is heavier and taller and so will be an issue to fit with a flat decklid. Then you have to pay for an adaptor plate and flywheel on top which will run atleast $1000. That certainly makes any 'cheap' Commie motor more expensive than a Subie flat 6 - which are very cheap to acquire anyway. And the drivetrain taller and longer. Makes no sense to me. And a series 1 Commie motor put out 165hp with an EZ36 Subie putting out 260hp. Even the old EZ30 put out 245hp (series 2) and 220hp (series 1).
You also discuss gearing but you are only looking at diff gearing, wanting a 3.08. You need to look at the combination of top gear (5th in the Subie at 0.73) and the diff ratio and then also look at the wheel and tyre size. You might find it is actually very well suited. It's certainly perfectly suited for the Subie motor's torque curve 😎 But anyway this is the beauty of custom cars - you can build whatever you want.
Given I already make an LSX adaptor plate for Subie gearboxes, you may find that this fits the V6 Commie motor as well - it's the turbo bolt pattern so I assume that's what's needed as Commies run TH700's. I also make flywheels for the LSX V8 to suit Subie boxes - I wonder how close they would be to bolting onto your beloved V6 Commie?
vlad01 ·
i'll tell ya why I like those engine.
cheap
bullet proof, suby are too but going nothing on these comparing side by side. You can blow the block apart and still start first go and drive them around lol 😂
simple and way less to go wrong.
economical, more than suby surprisingly.
mods and parts galore that aint ricer or china made.
management system one of the best out there and very well documented, not to mention continuous improvements in code.
massive potential to make more power and torque.
can take boost right out of the box while doubling the output reliably.
and much more!
what one could ask more for a $500 engine?
Don't get me wrong, I would prefer a flat 6 just for the sound and low COG but I don't like the idea of such an obscure engine that little info exists about it and the oil consumption problem that is common for the EZ.
I think the EJ is a better all rounder.
As for the gearing, looked at gears and tyres, gearing is good(almost same as stock T5), tyres are fine but diff way to low range. The engine would be screaming at around 3k @ 100, even more @ 110
The thing is over 90% of the toque is developed at only 1200rpm and peaks at 3600rpm. These engine accelerate faster by lugging them at low rpm range. They pull like tractors on steroids.
If it was me I would only consider putting a v6 in a kombi as they fit nice and weights not an issue. Like I said earlier, they are dimensionally very good.
I never plan on having a kombi...... unless?? 🥷😂
Subarugears ·
cheap - yeah the Series 1's are cheap but have 100hp less than the comparable Subie and once you add the adaptor plate and flywheel they are way way more expensive
bullet proof, suby are too but going nothing on these comparing side by side. Bullshit
You can blow the block apart and still start first go and drive them around lol 😂 And more bullshit
simple and way less to go wrong. Er...it has pistons, a cam, two heads and valves, 6 injectors and 6 spark plugs. Almost exactly the same. SO...no - not way less to go wrong. In fact the bloody thing has followers and pushrods - so maybe it is actually more complicated
economical, more than suby surprisingly. Er...NO....the VT commodore gets 12.0 L/100 in the city in an auto and the EZ36 Outback gets 10.3L/100km in an auto.
mods and parts galore that aint ricer or china made. You would need mods and parts galore seeing as you're 100hp down. Having to do mods and buy parts doesn't make it a cheap motor anymore does it?! And the aftermarket area for Subaru isn't big is it...made by quality Japanese companies like Tomei and Jun...oh and Cosworth.
management system one of the best out there and very well documented, not to mention continuous improvements in code. Big Deal, Subaru runs Denso, the same as pretty much all Japanese manufacturers use. Ultra-reliable, failsafe, self_learning, self-tuning. Open source software available with tons of maps to download free.
massive potential to make more power and torque. Yeah..coz a turbo EZ30 making 1000hp with twin turbos isn't enough....
can take boost right out of the box while doubling the output reliably. It needs to double its power just to match the stock Subie...there goes your $500 budget again...out the window..
and much more! Nothin to see here.
what one could ask more for a $500 engine? Power, fuel economy, smoothness, light weight, packaging for a start.
I can't understand why you would say the Subie 6 is an obscure engine with little info existing about it. Are you kidding me? They make hundreds of thousands of these every year to sell all around the world! Pretty good chance Subaru's 6 cylinder production is more than Commodore's. Total Commodore sales in 2013 were 27,766..and that includes the V8 models. Subaru sold 808,919 cars globally last year including 4 cylinder and 6 cylinder models.
vlad01 ·
haha more suby h6 engines made?
hello?, buick v6 has and still holds the largest number of one engine ever produced. 25+ million! units were made world wide.
they won ward's best 10 engine on a few occasions. They were renown as one of the best of all time engine designs, renown for reliability, low maintenance, efficiency!
We took one to the test. 1080Km on a 68L tank from full to dead empty. That averaged (yes average! not, peak, peak was like 4.5L) 6.2L/100 for a 1.7 ton car with slush box and 235 wide tyres.
Subarugears ·
Wow that's a lot of boat anchors!
1960's Buick V6 front wheel drive is not Commodore is it, so your figures are highly innacurate.
You're talking about $500 Commodore motors, not other stuff you can't get your hands on.
I call B.S. on your fuel figures. Amazing how manufacturers with billions of dollars cannot get those sorts of amazing fuel figures but you backyard blokes can magically achieve the, with a slush box no less. If only you could have got a job at Holden, you might have saved their local production with your skillz :-)
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. seems we have a debate going on. Anyway here's pics of the spread beam just have to fit the other disc assembly. the wheels to set it up in ECLECTIC
the beam tubes rotate with tolerance so I can move the spindles up 7 down to set the angle on the balljoints so they aren't under load. then have to centre the tubes spot weld tues to plates the disassemble & get the tailshaft guys to weld it. I hope to be able to modify the kombi steering arm to use on the rack this let me use 2 kombi adjustable drag links on it
ernie
helbus ·
My opininion is that you are looking way out of the common box and that your ideas are groundbreaking. I hope you are enjoying the ride. Keeping your mind active. I do similar things with car bodies. There are a lot of 'standard custom' ways to modify the body of a car, however there are some different ways that people customise that I give great credit too, and that includes car bodywork, paint work and drivetrain engineering.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening Pete. Thanks for dropping in a lot of this stuff has been rattling around in my head for along time. It's the matter of looking photos of other systems drawing100 different ways to do something the card board plywood templates. you now how it goes with custom body work. how about some photos of you work if you have any besides Vw my next flaw is the hotrod scene not ratrods though nothing nicer than a full fendered deuce roadster or 5 window coupe drool to me I have just bought 10 tickets in the 32 coupe raffle fingers xed
ernie
Subarugears ·
Meh, Vlad and I are just having a bit of fun.
Anyway, back to the topic of AWD Bay Kombis.
How about this one done with an EJ20 turbo and entire driveline transplanted? It's being built in France.
roverv8bay ·
Thanks Todd. that makes mine look 2bob. Nice engineering on front suspension Plus the integration of the struts on rear
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. here's my thought's on adjusters any feed back welcome. The idea being that 1 welded on each tube with a hole thru to a series of tapped holes in the beam plates to let it up or down instead of the usual centre set up.
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Is it just me or can others see the face on top of the rear of the gearbox above the seal housing on output shaft. In the 4th pics from the top in the SC. is it Jesus.
ernie
vlad01 ·
Subarugears wrote:Meh, Vlad and I are just having a bit of fun.
Anyway, back to the topic of AWD Bay Kombis.
How about this one done with an EJ20 turbo and entire driveline transplanted? It's being built in France.
haha thats right!
anyway, that looks like a tight fit there with that engine. Just fits by the looks.
vlad01 ·
Subarugears wrote:Wow that's a lot of boat anchors!
1960's Buick V6 front wheel drive is not Commodore is it, so your figures are highly innacurate.
You're talking about $500 Commodore motors, not other stuff you can't get your hands on.
I call B.S. on your fuel figures. Amazing how manufacturers with billions of dollars cannot get those sorts of amazing fuel figures but you backyard blokes can magically achieve the, with a slush box no less. If only you could have got a job at Holden, you might have saved their local production with your skillz :-)
now can you call bs when you are not that one actually doing it?
they are very efficient, they just got to be in good shape and not neglected, that is the key. They are given a bad wrap coz most people drive them into the ground and half the sensors are dead and fuel system up shit creek. I was achieving average 8L/100 including giving it some in city driving. best I got was 850k out of 63L. not bad for early 90s L27
I get only about 9.5-10L average now after overheating and seizing the engine, still alright for 300,000 motors that been absolutely flogged. My mate still get gets on average 800-900 out of a tank on a 400,000+ car.
I picked up one nice vr that sat around since 96 in Adelaide, drove it here on one tank with a little left, that 700km on a neglected other wise good car, slush box with 63L tank.
there is no magic, that is honestly what they do.
my figures are not inaccurate. the same buick engine been around since the 70s and slowly evolved til ceasing production in 06( supposed to be in 99, but investors went berserk, demanding to extend production) in favor of the current chev HFV6. The same engines were used in may cars around the world. I even by brand new engine parts direct from GM in the states, I just cross reference the engine with the Pontiac FWD models over there. Same engine!
interestingly, been looking at the weights of various suby H6 engines.
some of the earlier H6 were heaver than the cast iron buick lol 😂 boat anchor!
Ok, done with that.
more interestingly.
The current HFV6 3.6L is a real contender to the current H6 basically same weight, more rev range, flatter and fatter torque curve( more like a line) more power! over 300hp NA. heaps of awesome features. only thing is its managed by a bosch PCM 🤪
its also got 6 bolt mains, all alloy, quad cam with dual VVT, forged coated piston, forged bottom end, piston oil jet squirters, ladder bridge girdle across the block valley, dual knock adaptive spark, direct injection, COPs among other features.
one of the plants is in port Melbourne, so its Aussie built, US ones are built in Michigan. best part is a complete crate motor with all accessories and ECU. $5200 😂
hmmm very tempting, except the Bosch PCM is a real turn off. A bastard to hack!
ok, my history lesson is done 😂
oh one other thing, E85 out of the box, without any fuel sensors or added complexity. it does it using the existing O2 sensors, knock and various other standard management sensors. the PCM is cleaver enough to work out which fuel or mixture of its using.
roverv8bay ·
WHAT ABOUT ECLECTIC
vlad01 ·
electric engine?
roverv8bay ·
G'day vlad. NO ECLETIC in this build not much more can be sais in the above debate.
ERNIE
Subarugears ·
Eclectic? Are you posting about Eclectic in our V6 Commodore vs Flat 6 Subie thread Ernie???!!!!
vlad01 ·
I thought that was a spelling mistake.
Had to google that word, never seen it before. Makes sense now.
Todd, had a look at LS1 bell housing pattern. sure is an odd one, never actually seen that pattern before.
the Buick uses GM metric 60º pattern along with some of the other Holden engines.
The HFV6 uses something entirely new. well, something for me to think about anyway.
Subarugears ·
LS1 is LSX is Chevy V8 small block and big block is 308 turbo as well.
Seems the V6 commie and TH700 slushie is something else.
I've got the pattern off the net anyway.
vlad01 ·
TH700 appears to come in various patterns? For a min I was thinking wtf is a TH700? Its been a LONG time since I even batted an eye at an auto.
More familiar with the 4L60E as they can be fully manualized. Autos are boat anchors anyway, literally, damn things weigh shit loads. 120kg.
This what I know very well.
but more importantly would get to get a pattern for the HFV6 as that engine is the best candidate.
very different looking here.
vlad01 ·
Just came across an Aussie mob that do a manifold for these. with a worked engine in combo with the CPR6 manifold they getting close to 500hp NA out of a 3.6!!! WTF! 🤪 how is that possible!!?? talk about a power house. I am very impressed.
helbus ·
The Alfa 159 3.2 V6 is a GM engine with different heads. SAAB use them too.
Subarugears ·
Oh wow, that's interesting for sure and is a whole other setup.
I like it.
Plus E85 outta the box.
1303Steve ·
So what dinkbat put the thermostat down the back of that motor
vlad01 ·
1303Steve wrote:So what dinkbat put the thermostat down the back of that motor
merica! did. guess its to suit the more common fwd setup.
interestingly, i see in/outlet on the front.
but i see here its just got a pipe that goes to the back.
reminds me of the vn days when they first put a LN3 v6 in them that were right out of FWD application. Stat was at the back 😂
you can see the pipe here, pretty small so I gather these don't have much cooling requirements due to the efficiency of them.
Stat at the back, not that bad, more direct route for at least one of the cooling lines.
EDIT:
Holden application LFX engine.
pretty neat! yeah stat certainly art the back, but easy access to the cool side pipe instead of routing it all the way around.
vlad01 ·
Subarugears wrote:Oh wow, that's interesting for sure and is a whole other setup.
I like it.
Plus E85 outta the box.
😂 now were are talking.
Todd do you know a definitive weight figure for a complete EZ36?
I can only find rough figures on early H6 engines, been searching for months on this, can't find shit on EZ series.
vlad01 ·
had a new friend let me take measurements of his SIDI 3.6.
height still the same 570mm as always with the v6. but the crank sits low, about 200 above the sump. So the engine is shorter but made taller again to be the same as the buick by the DOHC heads and big ass manifold.
width is approx 600ish, more like 680 from alternator to far side top rocker cover edge. engine is pretty narrow down low though.
length 😵💫 480mm 👍 that is shorter than a vw engine in complete form, apples for apples. minus exhaust of course.
Pretty compact engines in person. would fit great in a bus or type 3 or similar engine bay. Bugs would be out of the question I would think.
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spent 5 mins with a holesaw to drill holes through the front bar & crush bar the slid in this bar I think it looks ok so it stay's save me fitting fog lights in the holes. It's stailess steel & best part was freebie
ernie
vlad01 ·
nice! so whats your plans for the radiator, rear mount or front?
roverv8bay ·
Good morning Vlad I took a pic of the radiator sitting behind bar but the vover was over it will retake 1 this morning thinking seriously about front just need to look at a nicer way to run the hoses some of the pics I have seen look terrible like an after thought looking at possibility putting of 90 deg
bends on pipes & sown through the top of the bar our through the bottom instead of ugly hoses coming out under & around the bar. If I front mount I will get some nice stainless mess for it.
ernie
I don't like it here back to the engine bay it goes
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. spent some time setting up the rear lift plate on left side to see if they will do what I want. if the lift is to high I will revert back to just using them as spacers to allow the axles slide for movement In the cv's. spent 1/2 hour dropping front end it dropped the stopped DOH the shock tower extensions from the previous owner hung up so have to unbolt the damn things to get it out
ernie
plenty off room for the tyres now have to fit the fronts first to see what will fit then if it's to high in rear will drop it back
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. old beam out spread beam in now to adjust the ride height the spot weld the tubes should have it completed by end of next week. then build the front diff support cage & mount the power steering. Couple of pics.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. Refit the beam today sorted out the end plate measurements. I think it will be restricted to 15'' rims as theses hit the guards. also made this in 20 minutes this morning to take the weight instead of on the stuffed shoulder.
ernie
matberry ·
Amazing Ernie. Seeing those fourby front hubs in there is something else!!! Keep up the good work, this thing is going to be awesome.👍👍👍
roverv8bay ·
Thanks Matt. if everything goes to plan should have it ready to fire in about 3 to 4 months. the rear disc assemblies should be ready to bolt up at the end of next week. waiting for engineer to fit the drilling & tapping in for me Rather pay him than stuff around myself. I like the look of the hubs makes it look the part. had a fiddle with the camber after setting it up looks like it will work ok using the Vw adjusters.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
Gday all. squared the tubes up but under load from control arms & spindles so will have try without the spindles the pics of the front with the mik crate will give & idea of the lift achieved through the longer spindles & spread beam combined.
standard height
with lift.
the tube problem
the amount it needs to moved to the right
thanks to people following the build see you at Valla not with ECELECTIC unfortunately
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. fathers day from son. Now too fit them
ernie
how to fit them
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. started to build the headers for ECLECTIC the only way to get manifolds to fit because of space. this is the left side because of exhaust pulse there's a bit more work in this side due to that right side is pretty straight forward they will run 2 into 1 the again was going to do 4 into 1 but easier Also try to maintain equal length runners
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Been sorting out the speedo drive. have to modify the Toyota unit to fit the Nissan transfer case. 1st job is too machine the Nissan shaft to fit into Toyota drive electronic housing the machine the Nissan housing internal out to take the Toyota housing. This is to allow for the difference in the housings diameter. this will be an easy fix to allow mw to use electronic speedo & vss for motor
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. looking forward to Warwick hope the weather hangs dry would be nice & not to hot. Another mechanical problem solved. The McLeod thrust bearing was the wrong size & shape to use on the Daihatsu P plate after searching the Repco clutch book for a suitable unit I had to do 1 of 2 things use a different unit & get a spacer made to fit it to the carrier or use the expensive original & have a sleeve made to fit over it & suit the p/plate. Here's what I came up with simple solution.
ernie
This is the McLeod unit
this is the profile of the Daihatsu unit note the curve on the face
this is the front face of sleeve
this is the rear side
this is the 2 parts prior to being pressed together the unit next to it is the Daihatsu bearing
as you see ECLECTIC is time consuming in chasing down or modifying stuff to use that will be reliable & strong enough to do the job even though IT'S not heavy in the weight compared to a range rover. all for now.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. Big relief today.I took the front beam & spindle to Engineer today along with the steering rack & bevel box. I received the ok to go ahead with the front conversion so now I really need to get head down into it so Thursday the beam is going in so I can work out the steering location & the diff mount's.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. been a bit slow on ECLECTIC last few weeks due to home reno's. But have been chasing bits last week I scored a freebie a long range range rover alloy tank. plus a rover zf auto to use the bell housing on the rover v8 alfetta auto transaxle I plan to build when ECLECTIC'S finished so all round a good week of hunting & gathering
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. put the front end in now to start locating the diff & rack. I had to cut the mounting lug off the diff cover to allow the diff to move forward
by 8cms. also picked up the modified speedo drive.
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. happy new year to you all. Things have been quite on ECLECTIC I had 3 weeks in Melbourne last month so nothing achieved picked up 2 turbos so going to do some research on roverv8 fitted with them the pro's & con's of fitting them before I go ahead with them. I have the beam in I fitted a set of beetle adjusters to it to set the height once I have it set I will weld the torsion bar holder in the centre in the adjusters are a once off use
ernie
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. I have pulled the front end out for final sorting of the mountings for the diff centre & rack the diff will be offset to allow the tailshaft to run beside the sump instead of under it. The left hand rodeo standard halfshaft will be spot on length wise once I have an adapter made to bolt cv to holden diff the right hand side has to be built I looking through finding another brand cv with the same spline size to try & find a shaft long enough to fit without being cut & shut
roverv8bay ·
Good morning all. It's been a while since last post. I have the left side driveshaft being modified by spigot & press fitting the out put shaft from the commodore diff & the outer cv shaft end off the rodeo I hope to have it back next week. Once it's back I can set the diff in it's final position & get the length for the right hand shaft. it will be made up from small tailsahft tubing with same shafts as the other one. I have to use commodore outer cv. as they have the plunge in them. while I have been waiting for some down time I stated to mock up my future project a v8 trike. Using a rover running on straight lpg through 2 gas carbies bolted to rover manifold. It will be front engine along with a Alfa Romeo auto transaxle adapted to the motor using a $10.00 ring from scrappies that formed part of the analogue tv station. a few pics of it as it sits.
the carbies will be replaced by the LPG carbies & allow the frame to sit down lower. I have been told that it will be registrable
this is the auto set up
this is a manual but showing the suspension arrangement
a couple of pics of the adapter ring not pretty but strong & functional
waltermitty ·
WTF ??
Are you building a Trike now?
More pics of the bike please.
Mitchell
roverv8bay ·
Good evening Walter. I'm still working on the kombi. the trike is for when I have to wait for stuff for the kombi. It's along term project
ernie
lou0060 ·
Ernie, you are a machine! i love this thread. Keep the pics and idea coming.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. The engineer rang me that he couldn't separate the outer cv from the shaft he tried to press it off using a 15ton press to no avail the spring clip locked into the shaft & wouldn't release. So 6 x 100 mm cutting discs later I had cut the cv housing & the splined cup off the shaft so now I have to wait till he gets time to fit it in
vlad01 ·
Looks like rover v8s are popular at your house lol
roverv8bay ·
Good evening vlad01 the rovers are cheap light not real powerhouse but more than sufficient for my purpose. I had a smokey & the bandit type Trans Am 454 with auto offered to me for free. just a bit big for my needs.
vlad01 ·
yeah they are small sized for v8, which makes them good for stuff like this.
LS are good like that too, light and small, but not exactly cheap, but you do get big power from them and plenty of aftermarket parts and tuners out there.
I got a look in on some LS1 one builds and they are like a coat hanger inside and small as externally. hard to believe they are 5.7L
How much do the rover v8 weigh anyway?
roverv8bay ·
G'day Vlad. google tells me approx. weight is 220kg
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. I picked up the left hand drive shaft. it consist of the outer end of the rodeo with a 13mm diameter by 20mm long spigot pressed into the inner drive flange shaft out of the commodore IRS the tailshaft man heated it before welding it so hope it last for at least test drive. It's 10mm longer than the rodeo shaft
OZ Towdster ·
Hopefully it was joined using a morse taper as well as the weld or did he shrink fit them together ,and why didn't he also plug weld it ????
vlad01 ·
roverv8bay wrote:G'day Vlad. google tells me approx. weight is 220kg
wow thats a lot heavier than I expected.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. I have Been busy doing a change on the steering rack. I have replaced the heavy bulky Daewoo unit with an Audi. I have had the tierod arms threaded to take Astra tierod were the original bent end with restrictive bush mount was. The bushes & angles limited the movement. the arm in the photo fitted pvc tube dummy for length
roverv8bay ·
good evening all. I have the spindles back from being modified for the tierod ends off the Daewoo steering arms. the rodeo hole tapers where to big & upside down. I can now assemble the front end & get it back on 4 wheels to set up the rack into place & star sorting out the steering column & bevelbox back to the rack
the kombi hole out of the centre arm machined to fit into spindle hole
the modified arm prior to fitting new hole these will be drilled between the new & old hole 1/8th at 180 degs to take roll pins to stop them turning with the tierods
fitted in to place
the spindle in front is the modified 1 note the difference in the length of the top section & location of the new hole to bring the camber into place
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. the waterpump blank plate with thermostat housing fitted. The thermostat will mount in the bottom hose near the electric waterpump
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. this the makings of the taillights for ECLECTIC. 1cm thick aluminium with LED lights. The plate will be shaped to the kombi lens the tapped in the back to take studs to secure to the body.
roverv8bay ·
Good afternoon all. I did a bit on the trike today. waiting for Engineer to come back to work to redo the front driveshaft. here's what the transaxle looks like behind the rover it has increased the wheelbase by about 3 inches
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. I have chosen the colour for ECLECTIT. It was easy to choose as it was a freebie. pure yellow tinter with pure white tinter above the waist line.
I slipped the Di Dion tube under the trike to see where it would sit. I will have to trim the bellhousing ring to sit it up under
there no problem with torque convertor clearance.
roverv8bay ·
Good afternoon all. I started stripping the dash steering column handbrake assembly heater controls accelerator pedal & linkage setup next job is to drop the pedals out & steering box out. I'm happy with the condition behind the dash. I have to build the support braces for the E30 BMW manual pedal assemblies. The curved steel square tubing cost me $2.00 each they will be secured to the inner panels with rivnuts.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. After driving a bay I forgot how well set up the pedals are so I have drop the idea of swing pedals. I did some final sorting out of clearances on the front CV joints I had to lower the bottom hole into the spindle to give me room for the CV rubber on the control arm. the best thing about the way I had the Engineer doing my machining modify The rodeo spindles. I had to remove the steering stop off the arm to clear the boot on right lock
roverv8bay ·
Good afternoon all. I have found that the front shocks interfere with the driveshafts. I have move the bottom of the shock 5cm forward to clear. Using a piece of 5cm x 5cm tube the stud for the shock is to short to get a nut on. After looking on google & trying suppliers there was nothing over the counter. After some thought I could only find a way around it was to make my own. Using a cyclone rod nut & 12mm x 1.05 tap I recut the thread it was a simple tidy up if the existing thread. I then screwed a bolt into the nut & locked a nut onto it then into the drill press & using a 10mm grinder I ground it down to suit the hole in the spacer then I file finished & emery paper it in the drill the cut the end of with a hack saw this is the finished product
This is mk1 1st one I made to rough so made the 2nd one a lot better finish.
The spacer a prototype of what I need
the 1st attempt to rough to use. this is the cyclone nut I'm using
2nd attempt better happy with this
roverv8bay ·
good evening all. fitting up the front diff. the front mount is a simple piece of 5 cm x7 cm tube with 1 7cm side cut out to let it sit down over the tube. the rear cross member for it will be simple job to build. The tailshaft will be a 2piece unit out of the commodore. There is plenty of ground clearance on the diff centre. Note the under hang below the beam tube the rear diff is the same clearance
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. I spent an hour today building the front diff rear mount. So simple a piece of 5cm x 5m tube with round tube with suspension bushes in them. The brackets for chassis mounts are of a canvas rollout awning. More than strong enough.
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. I have been doing a bit on ECLECTIC, I tried to find a shop to curve & fold some ally for the tunnel. No joy so had ago using a strap rubber mallet trailer frame circular saw & a big tyre. also a cover for the front of the engine box to fill the spot between the front walk through seat walls. this was the hardest to do with it tapering into the top & had to be made to clear the seat belt stalks.
The small piece had to on the back edge be curved on the front & straight on the back edge. it will be welded were the 2 join then the screw holes welded up. It will be sprayed with ute liner paint to help with vibration the top will be done with insulation & boat carpet
This is the start of bending & rolling the front cover between the seat
getting the curve to fit around the seat backs was the task
this section will be sealed to the walls with rubber striping & to the engine box with rivnuts
roverv8bay ·
This is the new home for the ECU relays & engine fuse box. it was a 240v fuse box. It's ventilated around the sides.
sitting in approx location. Now to shorten the harness to suit
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. A little bit more done to the engine area. set up the ECU engine fuse box in their box & the air filter box on the side of the engine box.
the fresh air box will house the AFM & pod filter
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. started on the harness pretty simple compared to Subi.
roverv8bay ·
good evening all. bit of an update. I had another Engineer check out ECLECTIC to see if there was anything I needed to change anything for the rego tag process. The only thing he would like me to change is the transfercase mount to incorporate the original Nissan brackets off the chassis. I took the fuel tank in today to have it welded up after fitting a new inlet outlet for the fuel pickup & return lines along with a swirl pot.
This is the shape of the tank with section reversed to allow it to slide into the original tank shelf. This will give me more room in the former engine bay for the radiator & batteries
A bit off topic I started sorting out the Watts linkage for the trike to get heights for the frame & mounting brackets. Now to make some templates to get the shapes.
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. I spent some time setting up the original Nissan chassis to transfercase brackets. simple task now to tack weld them & the engine mounting brackets to cradle. The cradle will then be welded by the tailshaft bloke. the Intermediate shaft will be short at 14cms. I have to chase up a OZ Toyota corona tailshaft yoke to bring the shafts size down to Nissan size. This is a Hi Ace yoke
teck screws to hold insitu
with the Nissan transfercase it drops the rear shaft under the torsion tube to line up with the diff where as most others come straight out of the case inline with the tube
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. did some tack welding on the brackets to get the transfercase sitting in position. I have to make 3 gussets to mount onto the top of bracket to the cradle tube. OFF TOPIC. I have been doing a 4wheel disc brake conversion on a 56 Cadillac for a mate. I'm using jeep front discs on front & rear with home made front caliper brackets with VT commodore calipers & XE rear calipers & brackets onto the original caddy diff for now the future is a 9inch. also fitting a 454bigblock chev & turbo400. I wanted to run a powerglide box but the owner wants a 400 so he wins
the Caddie set up pretty simple even uses the original nuts & bolts to hold the caliper bracket to the stub axle
ideal location for the calipers swapped sides as the commodores mount to the rear
roverv8bay ·
good evening all. A change in suspension set on the front dual to sag I will be setting up a set of front coilovers off the front on a current model Ford Ranger. the torsion springs will rotate with the centre locator. a simple tube with plate on top to bolt the top of the shock to it then bolted to the beam end plates
roverv8bay ·
Good afternoon all. been doing the strut conversion for the front suspension> I had 6mm folded to shape. When its finished it will bolt to the front beam plate the chassis rail. I have to cut out the gussets to strengthen the upper fold.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. A bit more progress today. cut the commodore tailshaft down by 28cms & put the diff flange on it to give me a Bolt on flange for the front diff & transfercase. The centre bearing required a formed support bracket I bent 1 up to suit. the odd shape is to clear the gearbox. because of the lift on the front beam I can now centre the diff for better length 1/2 shafts. I will build a sump guard from The beam to transfercase consisting of 5x5cm tube & 6mm alloy sheet.
roverv8bay ·
Good afternoon all. After a couple of VW blokes questioned the use of the lower shock stud & if it would be strong enough I devised this mount to place the shock on top of the arm stud instead of straight on the stud.
paper mock up fro shape & size
How it will sit on the arm
partly assembled
I still have to devise a clamp type to secure it to arm but allow removal if needed
how the shock will sit on arm
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. I have started to modify the rear suspension inner arms to help strengthen the drop plates. Using a 2nd arm bolted to the plate this will be cut shortened & the end curve rotated to join to the upper arm creating a parallel set. the sketch will give an idea of finished shape.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. did the mods to the right hand side arm. this is the end product.
This seems to be the way a lot of people are doing there reinforcing
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all. these are the drop plates for the rear suspension lift. Compare them in the pics above with them before & after I cut ground & linished them
roverv8bay ·
G'day all. Dash started. it will be painted in black crinkle finish & recessed into the dah 25 mm & a perpex cover.
roverv8bay ·
Good evening all it has been awhile. heres where I'm up to
