Black_math 路
The 2nd in my seris of questions about rotarys in volkswagens, has anybody every seen a rotary in a beetle or heard anything about how well they would perform? 馃檪 just curious/ thinking bout it:P
Aussieveedubbers 路 Non-VW Engine Conversions
Rotary in a beetle
https://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/threads/15573/rotary-in-a-beetle
RSI 路
check out davids 66 baja showcar , he's also got some photo's
Craig Torrens 路
My brother inlaw owns RX engineering in Newcastle, he had a stock 13b turbo in a Superbug, Steering was very light when boost came on 馃榾 馃榾
Stanley 路
NOT AGAIN
Doug Sweetman 路
yes again, get used to it - its a logical conversion (once again, if you want a conversion that is. If its air cooled for you, then thats your right !)
There is a gentleman in Perth with a 13B turbo in a late 60's beetle (pearl white, a fairly old conversion, maybe someone on this forum knows the guy) that apparently does low 13's (which would make it the quickest street legal bug in WA)
They are a small light engine, with a great ability to make power. The turbos (12A and 13B) I think would be too hard to get registered. Dont believe people who tell you they require heaps of maintenance or are unreliable - thats just hangovers from the early rotaries in the 70's - technology has come a ways since then.
They are thirsty though.
There is a bloke on this forum who has had a number of Rotary Mazda's - he should be able to give you some better info.
There is a gentleman in Perth with a 13B turbo in a late 60's beetle (pearl white, a fairly old conversion, maybe someone on this forum knows the guy) that apparently does low 13's (which would make it the quickest street legal bug in WA)
They are a small light engine, with a great ability to make power. The turbos (12A and 13B) I think would be too hard to get registered. Dont believe people who tell you they require heaps of maintenance or are unreliable - thats just hangovers from the early rotaries in the 70's - technology has come a ways since then.
They are thirsty though.
There is a bloke on this forum who has had a number of Rotary Mazda's - he should be able to give you some better info.
wacked1 路
Hey dude at the Boris picnic day at Sydney there was a sweet bug with a rotary motor in it the guy was selling it for about $10,000 it was engineered and apparently went really good. It was green in colour and had fushes on it.
:jesus
:jesus
Baja Wes 路
go to the links/archive post at the top of this subforum. Then go to rotary, and click on the link to Zenjoe's site. He was what you are looking at doing.
Basically if your in QLD which I think you are, you will not get a turbo rotary legally approved in a beetle. Therefore you are stuck with 12A or 13B naturally aspirated.
You would need a heavy superbug or something more than 870kg to get the 13B approved.
You would still need a heavy later standard beetle of about 800+kg to get the 12A approved.
There was a 13B turbo manx buggy at the FF&R Jamboree this year, it ran 12's but was illegally modified for sure.
Basically if your in QLD which I think you are, you will not get a turbo rotary legally approved in a beetle. Therefore you are stuck with 12A or 13B naturally aspirated.
You would need a heavy superbug or something more than 870kg to get the 13B approved.
You would still need a heavy later standard beetle of about 800+kg to get the 12A approved.
There was a 13B turbo manx buggy at the FF&R Jamboree this year, it ran 12's but was illegally modified for sure.
veedubman 路
hey guys
i was just wondering
how much do you reckon the whole conversion would cost
ive been searching for days
and cant seem to find anything
either im a complete dropkick
or there arent any sites that have pricesall help will be greatly appreciated
馃憤
i was just wondering
how much do you reckon the whole conversion would cost
ive been searching for days
and cant seem to find anything
either im a complete dropkick
or there arent any sites that have pricesall help will be greatly appreciated
馃憤
Mick058 路
'Bugzla' had his rotary 68 bug up for sale - good price too! Check that out.
IT doesn't cost much to do the conversion - just time and trial and error. I had heating issues, they run hot - need to get the right radiator and oil cooler in the right spots in the right size with the right thermostat
IT doesn't cost much to do the conversion - just time and trial and error. I had heating issues, they run hot - need to get the right radiator and oil cooler in the right spots in the right size with the right thermostat
Euro_67 路
This might help explain what is required for the conversion.
http://www.geocities.com/zenjoe/vw.html
It is a US site, so check local regulations for legalities.
http://www.geocities.com/zenjoe/vw.html
It is a US site, so check local regulations for legalities.
Mick058 路
Price wise i reacken 2-3k
ttriebler 路
I've had quite a number of Rotaries in my time (in Mazda Bodies) and I say it all depends on what you want to do with it and how much power you would like to make.
Given today's technology, a fuel injected modern rotary engine is an excellent motor, very smooth power delivery and all the revs you could want. The fuel injection takes care of easy starting, not running out of fuel at the top end, and smooth power. There is basically zero maintenance on them except to change the oil regularly and make sure you run an oil cooler. The new generation of Apex seals fitted to rotary engines have a lot of longevity.
The best transplant IMHO would be an EFI 13b Turbo, followed by a 12a EFI Turbo (would need aftermarket EFI computer) as these make nice torque, as much power as you could want and run very quiet as the turbos take a lot of energy out of the exhaust.
However, given the power/weight restrictions of the ADR/RTA Nazis, it's unlikely that you could do this conversion legally.
So the next best thing is to do a 13b Extend port EFI motor. This will still idle well, give good fuel economy and make around 150kw which should be plenty in a beetle. Using 2 decent mufflers will keep the noise to an acceptable level. I would stay away from bridge ports and peripheral ports as they are more like having a BIG cam and an OBSCENE cam in a normal engine - poor idle, loss of low down torque, and then a massive hit at the top end of the rev range.
If you wanted a bit more and could get it through the authorities, have a look into fitting a triple rotor 20B with an extend port and EFI. Thos things have plenty of mumbo and of course lots of useable torque low in the rev range.
All of this takes time and money to do properly though, so make sure you set aside funds for uprated gearbox, efi pumps and filters, lift pump, EFI hoses and return hoses, and a good exhaust system.
Given today's technology, a fuel injected modern rotary engine is an excellent motor, very smooth power delivery and all the revs you could want. The fuel injection takes care of easy starting, not running out of fuel at the top end, and smooth power. There is basically zero maintenance on them except to change the oil regularly and make sure you run an oil cooler. The new generation of Apex seals fitted to rotary engines have a lot of longevity.
The best transplant IMHO would be an EFI 13b Turbo, followed by a 12a EFI Turbo (would need aftermarket EFI computer) as these make nice torque, as much power as you could want and run very quiet as the turbos take a lot of energy out of the exhaust.
However, given the power/weight restrictions of the ADR/RTA Nazis, it's unlikely that you could do this conversion legally.
So the next best thing is to do a 13b Extend port EFI motor. This will still idle well, give good fuel economy and make around 150kw which should be plenty in a beetle. Using 2 decent mufflers will keep the noise to an acceptable level. I would stay away from bridge ports and peripheral ports as they are more like having a BIG cam and an OBSCENE cam in a normal engine - poor idle, loss of low down torque, and then a massive hit at the top end of the rev range.
If you wanted a bit more and could get it through the authorities, have a look into fitting a triple rotor 20B with an extend port and EFI. Thos things have plenty of mumbo and of course lots of useable torque low in the rev range.
All of this takes time and money to do properly though, so make sure you set aside funds for uprated gearbox, efi pumps and filters, lift pump, EFI hoses and return hoses, and a good exhaust system.
pete wood 路
and keep counting. anything brought in from OS is routinely rebuilt by the decent rotary workshops these days. and a decent rebuild is not cheap from what I hear. then you need to put a good gearbox behind it... 馃ゲ I'd suggest about the cost of a WRX conversion plus the cost of the motor rebuild.Mick058 wrote:Price wise i reacken 2-3k
if you were really serious about putting one in a dub, I'd buy a late type 3 (cheap and legal) and put a 13b turbo in it. the fella in QLD with the 20b kombi has one for his missus apparently. I reckon you'd be nuts to use one without the turbo. the turbo makes a rotary far more usable.
Mick058 路
ha, like anything PEte, depends how fast and how well. I did it under 2k, i was 17 and poor. IT worked, wasn't the best, but it did work.
Did all the work myself and bought second stuff, got it rebuilt, re-cord etc.
Did all the work myself and bought second stuff, got it rebuilt, re-cord etc.
13BVW 路
I have a 13bt in my car (the one Wes is talking about earlier) it was built OS and was a personal import that is how it is registered, its been on the road with a rotary for 20 years this year and with me behind the wheel for the last 12.
As for reliability mine has had a hard life it is now 23 years old and still going strong.
As for fuel economy with general cruising mine gets better econ then my old 1835(EFI helps) but it does like a drink when the pedal is to the floor.
They are such a compact engine that they fit beautifully and very smooth and revvy.
I have another rotary powered car and it cost 3k to get the engine rebuilt with new parts (seals, oil control rings rotors etc)
The gearbox is worst bit(they break with abuse) but you will get that even with a subaru or vw motor putting out the same power.
Do it, I hated rotary's initially due to hearing of all the myths but am now glad I took the plunge 馃槀
As for reliability mine has had a hard life it is now 23 years old and still going strong.
As for fuel economy with general cruising mine gets better econ then my old 1835(EFI helps) but it does like a drink when the pedal is to the floor.
They are such a compact engine that they fit beautifully and very smooth and revvy.
I have another rotary powered car and it cost 3k to get the engine rebuilt with new parts (seals, oil control rings rotors etc)
The gearbox is worst bit(they break with abuse) but you will get that even with a subaru or vw motor putting out the same power.
Do it, I hated rotary's initially due to hearing of all the myths but am now glad I took the plunge 馃槀
Boozo 路
woot, yay for 2 rats in a tin can. love the noise. non turbo would be more than enough for a street car. ive been thinking about doing this when and if i ever kill my 1916.
i was thinking 13b injected, but in light of the RTA restrictions the 12a might be an easier and most painfree option here in QLD.
Ive seen the mentioned yellow max at jambos for years, love it, its so quiet smooth and fast, beautiful 馃檪
i was thinking 13b injected, but in light of the RTA restrictions the 12a might be an easier and most painfree option here in QLD.
Ive seen the mentioned yellow max at jambos for years, love it, its so quiet smooth and fast, beautiful 馃檪
veedubman 路
mmm yea i was thinking either the 12a or the 13b
but i was also thinking maybe an EJ20
but id need a new gearbox to aye
but i was also thinking maybe an EJ20
but id need a new gearbox to aye
pete wood 路
a stock lbug box will cope with a non turbo EJ20. I'd have thought it would also be ok behind a 12a or 13b atmo motor. it's the torque of the turbo engines that kills them.
newghia 路
Just do it !!!
Built my first car, a beetle, for a rotary in the late 80's / early 90's
louvered the bonnet in prep for the radiator etc,
sanded the body by hand for too many weekends,
sadly never got there (with the engine )........still regret selling & not finishing that car馃檨
Built my first car, a beetle, for a rotary in the late 80's / early 90's
louvered the bonnet in prep for the radiator etc,
sanded the body by hand for too many weekends,
sadly never got there (with the engine )........still regret selling & not finishing that car馃檨
VWCOOL 路
wow veedubman, you say you been searching for days... this thread is from 2003
Joel 路
my black bug had a stock DC type3 box that was fine for years with a 13B
no offense to the wankel lovers but i couldnt wait to get that engine out and an EJ in
unless ur a die hard rota fan EJs are a far more logical choice
no offense to the wankel lovers but i couldnt wait to get that engine out and an EJ in
unless ur a die hard rota fan EJs are a far more logical choice
Euro_67 路
Joel,
what was it about the rotary you disliked ? The EJ engines appear to be far more work to fit into a beetle than rotary due to size.
what was it about the rotary you disliked ? The EJ engines appear to be far more work to fit into a beetle than rotary due to size.
Joel 路
depends which EJ
NA sohc engines fit in with minimal effort and cutting
i agree with u that rotarys are a nice little compact engine
the only cutting to mine was the valance for the old fan hub clearance
but maybe ive never been exposed to a good rota but to me they are rediculously thirsty, not a smooth engine and noisy as no matter what u do to them
but my main dislike is the way they disrupt the handling
i love pushing cars hard thro corners and ive found and many other too that as soon as u chuck in anything other than a horizontally opposed banger u upset the center of gravity with a bug
got me buggerd how these guys running twin cam VW and toyota motors can still corner without stopping to grab 1st gear
NA sohc engines fit in with minimal effort and cutting
i agree with u that rotarys are a nice little compact engine
the only cutting to mine was the valance for the old fan hub clearance
but maybe ive never been exposed to a good rota but to me they are rediculously thirsty, not a smooth engine and noisy as no matter what u do to them
but my main dislike is the way they disrupt the handling
i love pushing cars hard thro corners and ive found and many other too that as soon as u chuck in anything other than a horizontally opposed banger u upset the center of gravity with a bug
got me buggerd how these guys running twin cam VW and toyota motors can still corner without stopping to grab 1st gear
Joel 路
i should also add that electrical wise i guess rotas are nice and simple to espeically if carb'd
that was the biggest hold up with my conversion was the amount of electrical bullshit involved with EJs
but to my way of thinking subis are a modern more refined engine smooth as, economical and cheap to get parts for
be that as it may my Lbug will always stay vw powered as its never been rusted, welded or in a prang so i dont have the heart to cut it up
that was the biggest hold up with my conversion was the amount of electrical bullshit involved with EJs
but to my way of thinking subis are a modern more refined engine smooth as, economical and cheap to get parts for
be that as it may my Lbug will always stay vw powered as its never been rusted, welded or in a prang so i dont have the heart to cut it up
ian.mezz 路
you wuss , you need to go to the dark side, the Subaru turbo is so much fun , the acceleration over 100Ks is scaryJoel wrote:i should also add that electrical wise i guess rotas are nice and simple to espeically if carb'd
that was the biggest hold up with my conversion was the amount of electrical bullshit involved with EJs
but to my way of thinking subis are a modern more refined engine smooth as, economical and cheap to get parts for
be that as it may my Lbug will always stay vw powered as its never been rusted, welded or in a prang so i dont have the heart to cut it up
Euro_67 路
Funny ones recollection of things.
My first car was a Honey Brown Superbug. It leaked almost more oil than I could top it up with, and was just plain awful. Thankfully this didnt turn me of VWs completely, but it came close. It did lead me to work part time at a local VW workshop, after the engine finally died.
My mate's firs car was a very tidy RX4 coupe, complete with factory 13B and 5 Speed. I went for a drive, and couldnt believe how smooth the engine was, and how quickly it revved.
I have never driven a rotary engined beetle, so cant comment on the potential to change the handling characteristics.
A properly sorted rotary conversion offers a good power gain, with minimal body mods and plenty of room to spare. I think the handling could be an issue, regardless of engine choice (Rotary or EJ) and would need sorting out to suit the final weight / distribution.
I remember the first Rotary engined Beetle I saw (the Penrose one I think, with suicide doors) driving into an indoor VW show at the old Enfield motor auctions, and the noise and scene it caused (13b Bridge Port) with the purists and modders alike turning their noses up in disgust.
My first car was a Honey Brown Superbug. It leaked almost more oil than I could top it up with, and was just plain awful. Thankfully this didnt turn me of VWs completely, but it came close. It did lead me to work part time at a local VW workshop, after the engine finally died.
My mate's firs car was a very tidy RX4 coupe, complete with factory 13B and 5 Speed. I went for a drive, and couldnt believe how smooth the engine was, and how quickly it revved.
I have never driven a rotary engined beetle, so cant comment on the potential to change the handling characteristics.
A properly sorted rotary conversion offers a good power gain, with minimal body mods and plenty of room to spare. I think the handling could be an issue, regardless of engine choice (Rotary or EJ) and would need sorting out to suit the final weight / distribution.
I remember the first Rotary engined Beetle I saw (the Penrose one I think, with suicide doors) driving into an indoor VW show at the old Enfield motor auctions, and the noise and scene it caused (13b Bridge Port) with the purists and modders alike turning their noses up in disgust.
froger 路
I have a complete 12a motor , adaptor plate , flywheel , exhaust , motor doesn't turn, was supposed to have been running a couple of years ago but old mate lost interest in the project and let it sit in the car and never turned it over , $500.00 If interested PM me
bugzla 路
as mick said its all about placement of the radiator and oil cooler ducting and so on my car is still up for grabs just if your interested look in members cars for some pics let me know if there are any more questions ............
steve
steve
68AutoBug 路
The Wankel engines use too much fuel....Euro_67 wrote:what was it about the rotary you disliked ? The EJ engines appear to be far more work to fit into a beetle than rotary due to size.
that was the main problem with them....
along with seals...
I don't know if they ever really fixed the seal problems...
the subaru engines are a modern technolegy engine
thats why they are used so much...
even with all the hassles...
ttriebler 路
Of course they did, they are selling the RX8 aren't they?68AutoBug wrote:The Wankel engines use too much fuel....Euro_67 wrote:what was it about the rotary you disliked ? The EJ engines appear to be far more work to fit into a beetle than rotary due to size.
that was the main problem with them....
along with seals...
I don't know if they ever really fixed the seal problems...
the subaru engines are a modern technolegy engine
thats why they are used so much...
even with all the hassles...
And note the Rehayem's (Pac Racing) are turning out 1000+hp methanol turbo motors - I reckon they might have the seal thing worked out.
I know drag racing is only for 7 secs.
South Coast Rotary make a very good aftermarket seal that apparently gets revs to around 13,000rpm and has some awesome longevity - so the seals really aren't an issue anymore.
bugzla 路
all it comes down to at the end is this........... want to make big hp for low cost stick with what u know if you want to save fuel stay standard no 48 ida for u on ya boxer, as for the old ej20t another great motor how ever it takes a shit load more money to rebuild it if something brakes if i spend 10,000 on a vw motor uld want it to be 200hp+ spend the same on a rotor and your in a car with one hell of a ride with 400+ id rather replace a couple of seals then replace a stroker crank big pistons and barrels those expencive ported and polished heads and maybe even a conrod threw the case can get quite expensive for my next i will use the old vw t1 boxer cause going fast is not what i want or the big fuel bill like to hear from u ...馃お
kb_ara 路
gas research do a lpg conversion for rotary's and how cool would a stainless gas tank look under the bonet might help with weight distribution aswell....lpg is about 40c a litre and is pretty clean and yes rotaries dont really have any problems these days.. no more than any other engine... its the old story the harder you drive anything the quicker it breaks, I had a 12a turbo cosmo recently and i couldnt break it.
it was good for 210kph before the limiter kicked in.
it was good for 210kph before the limiter kicked in.
kb_ara 路
just FYI 210kph on the dyno Mr plod...................
kb_ara 路
HONEST......
colonel mustard 路
Ahh. I hate and LOVE this topic.
It would be a simple conversion, really, appart from the cooling.
the adapter kit, fuel system (fuel pump, fuel pressure reg and carbie/manifold) would be easy.
Cooling/ eningine mounts are the hard part. i personaly really dislike holes in bonnets for cooling. oil cooling is also a huge part, and that is also quite hard.
the positive is that rota's rev a crap load. and sound sick. but can you get out of it for less than what you would spend on a comparitve air cooled engine. I could build a decent 1916 with carbies for under $5000.... but i couldnt get a carbie -N/A rota in for for that.
Its a sweet idea.... but you've gotta really love them. I hope to do it one day, if i have $10 000 to throw at an engine and transmission, id do it.
馃檪
It would be a simple conversion, really, appart from the cooling.
the adapter kit, fuel system (fuel pump, fuel pressure reg and carbie/manifold) would be easy.
Cooling/ eningine mounts are the hard part. i personaly really dislike holes in bonnets for cooling. oil cooling is also a huge part, and that is also quite hard.
the positive is that rota's rev a crap load. and sound sick. but can you get out of it for less than what you would spend on a comparitve air cooled engine. I could build a decent 1916 with carbies for under $5000.... but i couldnt get a carbie -N/A rota in for for that.
Its a sweet idea.... but you've gotta really love them. I hope to do it one day, if i have $10 000 to throw at an engine and transmission, id do it.
馃檪
bugzla 路
i stil run the same 1500 swing axle transmision from when the the conversion was done maybe 4 years ago and never a problem as for oil cooling its all about hit and miss mine runs fine if you live in sydney melbourne brisbane cooling is nothing its all about sealing and ducting as for cornering perfect big sway bars front and back its like anything you have to want to do it ........... as for the 1916 thing ill eat it for lunch for a min amount .......... $2500 verse $9000 i like it like that save the money people are just scared of hybrid things such as this......... if you need to know any tips let me know
p.s mine is up for sale
p.s mine is up for sale
bugzla 路
my beast
13BVW 路
Mt rotary cost me $800 fits just as well as the orig air cooled motor and has 3 times the power and better economy (as long as its not getting floored) than my old 1835. The gearbox breakages suck but thats probably the wheelstands,( I broke two boxes with the 1835 aswell).
colonel mustard 路
See, I love your car, except i cant stand that the front has holes cut out.... But thats the only thing... A rotary would make a MEGA sweet sleeper, heck, i guess any large bore boxer would.. but rotarys just rev like anything. the renisis will just pull to 9500rpm in each gear... the rx8 has shown us that.bugzla wrote:my beast
How is your oil cooled ... is there a cooler at the front? I like the idea that 'westi' has on his car, where the gearbox is cooled with an oil cooler, do you think this would be possible to do with a radiator or two. I have seen bugs with the radiator where the backseat goes.
pete wood 路
you don't have to cut holes in the front apron. you can scoop air into the bottom of the spare wheel well while leaving the front in tact.
MickH 路
Haha...thats funny!! My 1916 absolutely toasted my mated 13B injected engine....bugzla wrote:........... as for the 1916 thing ill eat it for lunch for a min amount .......... $2500 verse $9000 i like it like that save the money people are just scared of hybrid things such as this......... if you need to know any tips let me know
p.s mine is up for sale
Both were in Manx buggies as well..same tyres etc etc...
matberry 路
馃槀馃槀 Go you good thingMickH wrote:Haha...thats funny!! My 1916 absolutely toasted my mated 13B injected engine....bugzla wrote:........... as for the 1916 thing ill eat it for lunch for a min amount .......... $2500 verse $9000 i like it like that save the money people are just scared of hybrid things such as this......... if you need to know any tips let me know
p.s mine is up for sale
Both were in Manx buggies as well..same tyres etc etc...
bugzla 路
from memory that 1916 was also running nos i think you said bit of a unfair comparison mick 馃お
plus did he launch hard and use all of the 7000 rpm from standard right through all gears,
i find if i launch hard its all good how ever if its a normal take off it aint so good as wat has been said before not to much torque down low with the rota but look at the money again ....................................馃槉
plus did he launch hard and use all of the 7000 rpm from standard right through all gears,
i find if i launch hard its all good how ever if its a normal take off it aint so good as wat has been said before not to much torque down low with the rota but look at the money again ....................................馃槉
20bkombi 路
Hi all, Just my 2 cents worth, I would use a 12A turbo
in a beetle because they are quite powerfull and getting very cheep. I etimate the hole conversion to be around $3500 including 12a rebuild, thats DIY.
in a beetle because they are quite powerfull and getting very cheep. I etimate the hole conversion to be around $3500 including 12a rebuild, thats DIY.
matberry 路
And the lurker shows his hand.....knew this thread would bring you out of the closet A. Welcome
1303Steve 路
Hi
Wow we have learner dubber on here now, welcome along Aaron. Your forum a virgin but a 1/4 mile @#$$&^$%^, please insert your own definition, or otherwise known as a 1/4 mile person of loose morals.
Steve
Wow we have learner dubber on here now, welcome along Aaron. Your forum a virgin but a 1/4 mile @#$$&^$%^, please insert your own definition, or otherwise known as a 1/4 mile person of loose morals.
Steve
MickH 路
NOS was only on the 1500....bugzla wrote:from memory that 1916 was also running nos i think you said bit of a unfair comparison mick 馃お
plus did he launch hard and use all of the 7000 rpm from standard right through all gears,
i find if i launch hard its all good how ever if its a normal take off it aint so good as wat has been said before not to much torque down low with the rota but look at the money again ....................................馃槉
The 1916 was 102HP at the wheels, little down in the EJ engine I have now.....didn't Marks "bathtub" kick yer arse with the EJ LOL馃槀馃槀 In all fairness he wizzed past me after I got to 130Kmh.....in 2nd gear i might add....screaming it's titz off...馃 Damn Wankels...
20bkombi 路
Thanks for the welcome.
What are you doing in this dark little corner of the forum???
Looking for ideas for Warwick are we馃樀
What are you doing in this dark little corner of the forum???
Looking for ideas for Warwick are we馃樀
bugzla 路
at that stage it was with no linkage bars and was flopping around like crazy so i couldnt give it a good hit he would had still beat me power to weight,
mine was still cheaper for a little less power ........... it was the best set out buggies ive seen great bar work and strengthing awsome what can i say ................... yours is great to thou mick ..........馃槝 but u do have more ks on the clock too both are a great conversion very tidy and perpose built.
Howdy 20bkombi seen ur car a couple of times love it
mine was still cheaper for a little less power ........... it was the best set out buggies ive seen great bar work and strengthing awsome what can i say ................... yours is great to thou mick ..........馃槝 but u do have more ks on the clock too both are a great conversion very tidy and perpose built.
Howdy 20bkombi seen ur car a couple of times love it
MickH 路
Mines a little different now.....hehe...
Camo 路
Firstly, I am not against a water cooled beetle. But can you guys tell me the best simplest place to run the water pipes. So that the average bloke could do them and not a metal fabricator. And be has to pass engineer.
Also, I personally dont like the vents/grill cut into the bonnet. I know others have put radiators up front without doing this, do you have any details photos. This may also help others make the decision to go water cooled.
Thanks for your help, Kevin
Also, I personally dont like the vents/grill cut into the bonnet. I know others have put radiators up front without doing this, do you have any details photos. This may also help others make the decision to go water cooled.
Thanks for your help, Kevin
bugzla 路
camo you want need to cut vents in the bonnet if you in sydney mine was fine u just need to create a scope behind the bumper seal the radiator in and thats it make sure the radiator is flush with the petrol tank and sealed as well its all about sealing the radiator so that the air goes only throght the radiator not around it .............. pics i dont have sorry
20bkombi 路
Yeah I know not a beetle, but you can do somthing similar.
These pics were when i was striping the car for paint, i think 2003, so i didn't have the top fan cover on.
The fans blow the hot air under the fuel tank, witch has a thick insulation foam with aluminum on the out side.
As for the water pipes i use 38mm x 1.6 thick under the pan straight along either side of the tunnel and use hoses for the bends.
I will try to take some pics of then soon.
The cut outs under the bumper are enough for the twin turbo rotary wich puts out 198 rear wheel hp on 7 psi, no intercooler.
So i think a 12 turbo or 13b 6port would keep just as cool in a beetle.
Like mentioned earler sealing is the key
These pics were when i was striping the car for paint, i think 2003, so i didn't have the top fan cover on.
The fans blow the hot air under the fuel tank, witch has a thick insulation foam with aluminum on the out side.
As for the water pipes i use 38mm x 1.6 thick under the pan straight along either side of the tunnel and use hoses for the bends.
I will try to take some pics of then soon.
The cut outs under the bumper are enough for the twin turbo rotary wich puts out 198 rear wheel hp on 7 psi, no intercooler.
So i think a 12 turbo or 13b 6port would keep just as cool in a beetle.
Like mentioned earler sealing is the key
20bkombi 路
2003
bugzla 路
pending on the car the oil cooler placement is critical try and find a place with constant air flow and u should be right ............................ 馃槀
colonel mustard 路
This subject always grabs my interest.
Is it possible to run the oil cooler to the front of the car, or the oil lines far too long for this. I cant imagine most people would want to have to buy 10 litres of oil just for a change. 馃檪
as for cooling pipes can they run any lower than the pan, or must they be above the lowest part of the pan... ie inside the tunnel, or similar.
Is it possible to run the oil cooler to the front of the car, or the oil lines far too long for this. I cant imagine most people would want to have to buy 10 litres of oil just for a change. 馃檪
as for cooling pipes can they run any lower than the pan, or must they be above the lowest part of the pan... ie inside the tunnel, or similar.
Joel 路
Kev, you dont get much more simple than my old rotary bug had for water linesCamo wrote:Firstly, I am not against a water cooled beetle. But can you guys tell me the best simplest place to run the water pipes. So that the average bloke could do them and not a metal fabricator. And be has to pass engineer.
Also, I personally dont like the vents/grill cut into the bonnet. I know others have put radiators up front without doing this, do you have any details photos. This may also help others make the decision to go water cooled.
Thanks for your help, Kevin
just 2 lengths of zorst pipe with hose clamps around them every 500mm or so that were tucked under those funky square washers along each sill that hold the heater channels to the floor pans
crude but it worked from the late 80s up till i bought it in 2001
i agree tho, vents in the hood spoil the look and also give the game away
my bug just had holes in the valance i put mesh in them but after i painted it .
with the mesh painted black and a bumper on you wouldnt even notice
with my Lbug conversion i plan on getting a US front valance which has the factory A/C grille under the bumper
Zako 路
I'd go with a 13b 6port in my 71 superbeetle. I had a 6 port in my 77 808 wagon, and that thing was absolutely mental! I had a Microtech MT-4 running the mapping, and it hauled some serious ass. I can only imagine how much it would haul in a beetle, which would be lighter!
As everyone has said, oil cooler placement and radiator is critical. the oil cooler from a Series 3 rx7 will do! Nice and big (Just gotta fit it somewhere). The radiator, well we can do many things there. Water injection could also help lower the temperature. I've thought about locating a custom fuel cell/tank under the rear seats and using the space under the front to place a shroud to a radiator, and even have twin thermos working as well, however I don't want to cut into the bonnet. Still nutting that one out...dun wanna spoil the look I'm after.
I quoted up a kit to get a rota engine in the beetle, getting a conversion kit from a bloke in QLD, and if my memory serves me well, it was under $900. My concern (as it was in the 808 as well) is braking power!
That beetle above has used the front apron very well!
I'd be happy to give some advice on rotary engines....used to be an absolute fanatic! Yes they can be thirsty, yes they have quirks, but once those rotas get up into the rev range, it's a rush I cannot explain!
Kind Regards
Zako
As everyone has said, oil cooler placement and radiator is critical. the oil cooler from a Series 3 rx7 will do! Nice and big (Just gotta fit it somewhere). The radiator, well we can do many things there. Water injection could also help lower the temperature. I've thought about locating a custom fuel cell/tank under the rear seats and using the space under the front to place a shroud to a radiator, and even have twin thermos working as well, however I don't want to cut into the bonnet. Still nutting that one out...dun wanna spoil the look I'm after.
I quoted up a kit to get a rota engine in the beetle, getting a conversion kit from a bloke in QLD, and if my memory serves me well, it was under $900. My concern (as it was in the 808 as well) is braking power!
That beetle above has used the front apron very well!
I'd be happy to give some advice on rotary engines....used to be an absolute fanatic! Yes they can be thirsty, yes they have quirks, but once those rotas get up into the rev range, it's a rush I cannot explain!
Kind Regards
Zako
themadpostie 路
I'm looking at this whole rotary idea in a racecar shortly.... but I'm still hesitant on making a decision to use a VW transaxle, simply because of the horror stories I'm hearing about breaking trannies..... I'm leaning towards a Renault UN-1 transmission now.
There's alot of talk about the motors and how powerful they are, but little in regards to getting it reliably to the ground....
Anyone care to comment?
There's alot of talk about the motors and how powerful they are, but little in regards to getting it reliably to the ground....
Anyone care to comment?
13BVW 路
Most of the comments on rotaries being unreliable stem from when they were first used in the 60's. The rotary in mine has been a hell of a lot more reliable than the VW motors it replaced.
The guys from Marrineli's automotive/mechanical in Ipswich run a circuit anglia with a rotary and when I asked them about theirs they said they get it freshened once a year.
The guys from Marrineli's automotive/mechanical in Ipswich run a circuit anglia with a rotary and when I asked them about theirs they said they get it freshened once a year.
RAZ34 路
I notice Aaron is doing a fair bit of work on VW autos and probably rotors.
Anyone persisting with rotary conversions ? Interested to hear any tales.
Anyone persisting with rotary conversions ? Interested to hear any tales.