The other day i had a heated debate with my sister in law (shes a legal secretary) saying my car is breaking the law cos i have no seatbelts in the rear
My car was never fitted with seatbelts in the rear so im right and legal + the car is a 66 model which is b4 ADR 1969 (is this right)
She then asked her boss a solicitor and mocked me by saying that if i was right then a guy can register his horse and cart:cussing
Anyways just want some links so i can prove im right cos its really got me pissed off (especially her boss)
My car is a 1966 beetle with seatbelts in the front but none in the rear
:beer
jonno-t3 ·
i am pretty damn certain that if a car never came out with seatbelts from factory then it is legal now...however most peeps get them installed for safety reasons....i know my dads valiant ap5....1965 model...never had seatbelts and was registered without them...none in the back either.
Legal if they have never been fitted and the car hasn't been modified.
If you have gone to a post August 70 (I think it was then) engine then the car has to be updated to then which would mean belts in the back.
Canni. ·
yep...definately legal if they were never fitted originally...
Che Castro ·
Yep they are legal I actually phoned up the local police station and asked the highway patrol guy. If they werent fitted originally then they wont need to be unless car is modified. the rule is to "use all available seatbelts"
buzzbug ·
your right costa
i never had any rear seatbelts in my hk monaro (1968).
had rego and everything.
no laws broken.
Secoh ·
yep. if it was never fitted then it's legal. ADR's and compliance plates came out in late '71 early '72. www.rta.nsw.gov.au has some ADR info in their tech documents somewhere.
XXX-1.8T ·
cool ok so can someone give me some legal proof or links that i can stick in their faces?
:vader
jonno-t3 ·
lol XXX...u just want to rub it in their face's just so u can prove to them ur right...lol...i like that😀
jonno
pyr0 ·
hey im pretty sure i saw youre car today 🙂 XXX-1.8t i was the dude sittin on the ute tray that had a stack of old skool splitty parts on it and infront of it. :duh
jenz58 ·
Legal tell her!!!
Bel won't have any.... it can make some people nervous about sitting in d back seat though
Goodness legal jargon beats around d bush a lot ... it refers you on to another law which I can't find ....but no you don't have 2...and really you don't have to have belts in the front of very early veicles...just people tend to put them in 4 safety....
I was going to just have lap belts but went for 3 point in the front....and I rarely have back seat passengers these days....
XXX-1.8T ·
pyr0 wrote:hey im pretty sure i saw youre car today 🙂 XXX-1.8t i was the dude sittin on the ute tray that had a stack of old skool splitty parts on it and infront of it. :duh
hey pyro i remember u too cheers
Costa.....
thanx for thhe advice guys:beer
1303Steve ·
Hi Costa
Are legal secretaries like doctors secretaries? Thing they know everything that a solicitor or doctor knows and are experts on all aspects of law or medicine.
Steve
XXX-1.8T ·
yeah tell me about it:repuke
So is there anywhere wher it states any car b4 1970 doesnt need seat belts if werent fitted as standard?
Cmon Steve i know u have something 🙂
VDUBXTC ·
Seat belts
In NSW:
The driver of a car is responsible for ensuring that where restraints are available, children who are passengers use them at all times.
Except when no Seat Belt is fitted to a vehicle (only very old cars), all occupants 16 years and older must wear Seat Belts.
Babies under 12 months must be in an approved Child Restraint.
Children between 1 and 15 years must wear a Child Restraint or a Seat Belt if one is available. There is nothing as good as an approved Child Safety Seat for children weighing between about 9kg and about 18kg. Children should continue to use one for as long as possible.
If no restraint is available, children under 16 must travel on the back seat.
VDUBXTC ·
Here you go
the legislation came out in 1971
Meaning you are correct if you are driving a pre 1971 vehicle
Restraints Facts
Legislative background
In 1971, legislation was introduced requiring seat belts to be fitted to motor cars for all seats. Further legislation made wearing seat belts compulsory for drivers and passengers. In 1995, new seat belt regulations were enacted requiring all children, regardless of age, to be correctly restrained. The Western Australian Road Traffic Code 2000 makes drivers responsible for ensuring that all passengers under the age of 16 are seated in a position that is fitted with a seat belt and that the restraint is properly adjusted and securely fastened.
This is Australian design regulation
for the full bla bla bla the link is down the bottom.
3.2.1 Seat Belts
The first seat belt arrangement was patented by a Frenchman in 1903 (8). However it was in 1954 that researchers at the Cornell Aeronautical Laboratories in the US identified the danger of ejection from motor vehicles, and in September 1960 a Select Committee of the Commonwealth Parliament recommended that
“The motor trade should install seat belts of an approved standard in all motor vehicles. Road safety authorities should give publicity to the advantages of wearing seat belts” (8).
In the early 1960s the Standards Association of Australia began to develop standards for seat belts and anchorages, and these were eventually incorporated in Australian Design Rules 4 and 5 and approved in 1967 as two of the first five Australian Design Rules. They came into effect on 1 January 1969.
Seat belts had been on sale and available for fitting in cars from the 1950s (8), but there was little understanding of the need for restraint and almost all fitting in cars was voluntary and after market. In many cases it was government and private fleets that took the lead and fitted belts to their vehicles. One of the earliest and certainly the best known example is the Snowy Mountains Authority, which not only fitted belts in heavy machinery as well as road vehicles, but required its staff to wear them and provided educational and publicity material to encourage them to do so. A report on this experience and a study based on police reports of 40,000 casualty crashes in Victoria in 1963 provided the first hard Australian evidence of the benefits of seat belt wearing. These two studies provided a strong foundation for policy and legislative action.
Even if fitted, belts must be worn to be effective. Milne reports that in 1964 the South Australian Road Traffic Board reported a 64% wearing rate for drivers, where belts were fitted, and in the same year in Victoria 64% of drivers of passenger cars and derivatives involved in casualty crashes were wearing belts, where fitted. Oddly, the wearing rate declined over the rest of the decade to as low as 27% in South Australia in 1970.
That year was the watershed. It will be recalled that 1970 was Australia’s worst year for road deaths. Following recommendations of a Parliamentary Committee, Victoria made seat belt wearing compulsory from the beginning of 1971. Similar legislation in New South Wales came into effect in October of that year. Other States followed and by 1972 compulsory wearing followed throughout Australia.
There was an immediate effect. Milne reports that the reduction in occupant fatalities from the expected trend was of the order of 15-20%; Heiman (9) reports a reduction in Victoria of 18% over the expected trend by the end of 1971 and 26% by 1975. Milne mentions a flow-on in belt wearing rates in Sydney and South Australia following Victoria’s compulsory wearing legislation.
Further improvements followed. Compulsory fitting of belts in back seats came in 1971, but mandatory locking retractors, although required in front seats from 1976 (but fitted in many vehicles before that) were not required in rear seats before 1984 (although again, some manufacturers were fitting them from the late 1970s). Child restraint anchorages in the rear seats were mandatory from 1976.
Recent improvements have included seat belt pretensioners and webbing clamps to further improve restraint effectiveness in a crash. A logical development, these devices overcome one deficiency of the locking retractor belt: the propensity of this belt to allow ‘spool out’ and some forward movement before the retractor locks, and hence some head or upper body impact with the front of the passenger compartment.
Heiman reports seat belt wearing rates up to 90% by the mid 1980s. Makeham (10) reported rates of 95% and up to 98% in some regions of Australia in the front seat, and up to 80% in the rear. These rates are now as high as anywhere in the world. If ever there were a ‘silver bullet’ in road safety, seat belts would have to be one of them.
This chronology of events related to the development and use of motor vehicle seat belts may provide some perspective for those unfamiliar with these topics.
1930's Several U.S. physicians equip their own cars with lap belts and begin urging manufacturers to provide them in all new cars
1953
Colorado State Medical Society publishes policy supporting installation of lap belts in all automobiles
1954
Sports Car Club of America requires competing drivers to wear lap belts
American Medical Association House of Delegates votes to support installation of lap belts in all automobiles
1955
California Vehicle Code is amended to require State approval of seat belts before their sale or use
National Safety Council, American College of Surgeons, International Association of Chiefs of Police vote to support installation of lap belts in all automobiles
Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) appoints Motor Vehicle Seat Belt Committee
1956
Volvo markets 2-point cross-chest diagonal belt as accessory
For and Chrysler offer lap belts in front as option on some models
Ford begins 2-year ad campaign based on safety, focusing heavily on belts
1957
Volvo provides anchors for 2-point diagonal belts in front
Special Subcommittee on Traffic Safety, U.S. House of Representatives, opens hearings on effectiveness of seat belts in automobiles
1958
Nils Bohlin, a design engineer with Volvo in Sweden, patents the "Basics of Proper Restraint Systems for Car Occupants," better known as a three-point safey belt. The device comprises two straps, a lap strap and shoulder strap. **
Volvo provides anchors for 2-point diagonal belts in rear
1959
Volvo introduces 3-point belt in front as standard, in Sweden. New York considers and rejects bill to require seat belts in new cars sold in State
1960
New York again considers and again rejects seat belt bill
1961
SAE issues standard for U.S. seat belts (J4)
New York requires seat belt anchors at front outboard seat positions (effective January 1, 1962)
Wisconsin requires seat belts in front outboard seat positions
Standards Association of Australia issues standard for "safety belts and harness assemblies"
1962
Association for Aid to Crippled Children and Consumers Union sponsor landmark conference on "Passenger Car Design and Highway Safety" with occupant protection the sole theme
Six U.S. States require front outboard seat belt anchors
U.S. manufacturers provide seat belt anchors in front outboard as standard
1963
Volvo introduces 3-point belt in front as standard, in USA
Some U.S. manufacturers provide lap belts in front outboard positions (23 States have laws to requires belts in front, most effective 1/64)
SAE issues revised standard (J4a)
U.S. Congress passes P.L. 88-201 to allow Commerce Department to issue mandatory standards for seat belts sold in interstate commerce
1964
About half the U.S. States require seat belt anchorages at front outboard
Most U.S. manufactures provide lap belts at front outboard seat positions
Victoria and South Australia require seat belt anchorages at front outboard positions in new cars (either 2- or 3-point permitted)
1965
U.S. Commerce Dept. issues first seat belt standard (adopted SAE standard)
SAE issues revised standard (J4c)
All U.S. manufacturers providing lap belts in front outboard positions by this time
Some U.S. manufacturers provide automatic locking retractors (ALRs) in front seat belts
1966
Swedish regulations prohibit 2-point cross-chest diagonal belt at seats next to a door, and Y-type of 3-point belt altogether
U.S. Commerce Dept. issues revised seat belt standard (SAE j4c)
U.S. Congress passes P.L. 89-593, establishing National Highway Safety Bureau (now NHTSA)
Sports Car Club of America requires competing drivers to wear a shoulder harness as well as a lap belt (perhaps 1967, according to ref. 131)
1967
Society of Automotive Engineers study at UCLA leads to calls for two-point seat belts, highback seats and other occupant protection strategies for school buses.
U.S. manufacturers provide lap belts at rear outboard positions (MY 1967)
NHSB issues initial Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards 208, 209, setting standards for lap and shoulder belts in front outboard positions, lap belts in all other positions (to take effect 1/1/68 and 3/67, respectively)
Volvo introduces 3-point belt in rear as standard, certain markets
Great Britain requires 3-points in front outboard positions
Australian standard for belt anchorages issued
South Australia requires seat belts (lap belts OK) at front outboard positions
1968
Volvo provides emergency locking retractors (ELRs) as standard in front, in Sweden
Great Britain requires retrofit of 3-point belts in front in MY 65 and newer cars
Many U.S. cars this MY provide ALRs.
1969
Sweden requires 3-point belts of approved type in front
Volvo provides 3-point belt in rear as standard, all markets
Mercedes-Benz adds 3-point belt in rear outboard seats as standard, all markets
Japan requires seat belts, front and rear
Australia requires 3-point belts, front outboard seats, all cars registered since 1965
1970
Sweden requires belts in rear (diagonal and static allowed; lap-only not approved)
Victoria, Australia requires 3-point belts, front and rear and mandates use, front and rear
1971
Volvo provides ELRs as standard in rear, all markets
NHTSA amends FMVSS 208 to require passive restraints in front, to be effective 1973
New South Wales requires use of seat belts
1972
NHTSA begins rulemaking leading to Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard 222: Occupant Seating Protection in School Buses
Volvo introduces adjustable B-post anchor point (not standard) to permit better fitting of shoulder portion of front lap/shoulder belts
Last Australian state law requiring belt use, front and rear, goes into effect 1/1
New Zealand requires belt use, front and rear
W. Germany requires 3-point belts, front and rear
NHTSA requires anchorages for (detachable) shoulder straps for rear outboard (FMVSS 210)
VW displays 3-point belt system with webbing pre-tensioner (Transport 72, Washington, D.C.)
[Edited on 19-9-2004 by vw0064]
XXX-1.8T ·
thanx for the help guys i won:P
and gee did it feel good:thumb
MickH ·
It is also legal to register a horse and cart.How could you not win!!????Just remind her that she is the secretary:vader