I have been shopping around looking at buggies for the past month or so, and it seems to be standard that the manufacturers put disc brakes on the front and leave drum brakes at the back.
Is there any particular reason why they don't do it? (Any technical or performance reasons?)
I'm looking at getting discs all round (front and rear), but I just was wondering why these other guys don't bother. You would think that you would need them for better braking, especially when you got fat/large rear wheels.
:duh
[Edited on 28/4/2005 by mynameischris88]
MikeM ·
mynameischris88 wrote:I'm looking at getting discs all round (front and rear), but I just was wondering why these other chumps don't bother. :duh
I would help you out with some knowledge I have collected after many years of buggy ownership, but alas I am one of these "chumps" with drum brakes on the rear so you can get stuffed.
You're young and clueless.
bajachris88 ·
Young yes, clueless, (WELL Y THE HELL DO YOU THINK IM ASKING THIS QUESTION).
Whats up your ass. Chump is not an offense.
ie:
"Me and the Chumps and Chumpetes are going down to get a beer"
What is so offensive, it just means mate. Get with the times, geez. You have it all wrong, and im actually offended by the way you barked at me because of your misunderstanding. YOUR CLUELESS. You have no clue about what the hell i was saying when it comes to saying chump. YOU HYPOCRIT.
Anthiron ·
whoa dude. settle down. play nice. where i come from "chump" isnt a term for "mate". it pays not to offend members of this forum who could supply a huge wealth of information to you if u do go ahead with a buggy project.
bajachris88 ·
No one happens to watch 'FUTURAMA' any more. It was a great show, and thats where i picked it up. And it was used for the good.
Its like how gangsters say "Oh yeah, fully sick subwoofer".
By saying sick, they don't mean disgusting, vomitted on, dirty and pukable. Its means its cool. Thats just like chump.
bajachris88 ·
So for those people who don't understand my LOGIC, I have editted the message.
MikeM ·
chump [ chump ] (plural chumps)
noun
unwise person or dupe: somebody who is unwise or easily deceived
And might I suggest you learn how to use the Search feature.
By the way. Hypocrite is spelt with an "e". And what does that mean on your planet?
bajachris88 ·
And sick:
sick1 ( P ) Pronunciation Key (sk)
adj. sick·er, sick·est
1. Suffering from or affected with a physical illness; ailing.
2. Of or for sick persons: sick wards.
3. Nauseated.
Regardless, its slang. The word "Chump" i used was in a slang way. Just because it has some other definition you don't like doesn't mean im here to affend you. YOU SHOULDN'T JUMP TO CONCLUSIONS.
Mate: sex partner,
& mate: companion, buddy etc.
They have 2 definitions, just like how i used the word chump. because i say that a GUY is my mate, doesn't mean that me is my sex partner. And just because i say that a guy is a chump does not mean that the guy is unwise or easily deceived. You got the definition wrong, in my case.
So shut it, and move on. GET OVER IT.
tinsfci ·
My buggy has stock brakes all round (not even type 3 rear drums yet). Could it be that many buggies are not expected to do stoppies from 160 km/h? The cost of adding big brakes all round seems to upwards of 2000 bananas (not using VW bits). On a vehicle costing 5 large upwards that is not great value unless you really plan on getting jiggy wid it in the west side hizzy tryin to impress all your chumps.
Discs do have advantages, less fade, bugger all to adjust, easy pad changes, more stopping power etc, but unless you want to spend big bucks up front and can find exactly what you want then you may be best to buy a basic but solid buggy and build it up exactly how you want it.
Half the fun with these things is the fun per dollar spent.
Wuuuuuurrrrd.
bajachris88 ·
True.
Tinsfci, I am proud of ya. Finally we have a decent person who can answer my question, and has a sense of wit and understanding. Champion job. Your a rollmodel on this forum.
Good on ya mate, heres a :beer
MikeM ·
This dude cracks me up.
bajachris88 ·
Glad i brought happiness to a guy I though was destrought about being accused of jumping to conclusions.
MikeM ·
mynameischris88 wrote:Glad i brought happiness to a guy I though was destrought about being accused of jumping to conclusions.
I'm not laughing with you ya chump, I'm laughing at you.
bajachris88 ·
I too am laughing (but louder than you are). Its a 2-way road. lol. HA HA HA! HA! HE HE!🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂🙂
MickH ·
I have a complete set of front and rear disc brakes that i will be selling in a couple of weeks. They are beetle 4 stud pattern and have less than 500km on them. I think they sell for $1800 new but you can have then half price if you want 'em. U2U me
bajachris88 ·
Thanks for the offer,
I haven't got the money yet, but what i do plan to do is build my dream buggy while im in university. So thats when i will have funds to come in to purchase stuff like that. Sorry, but I haven't go the money at the moment. Thanks though.
Maybe later.
Boozer ·
mynameischris88 wrote:Young yes, clueless, (WELL Y THE HELL DO YOU THINK IM ASKING THIS QUESTION).
Whats up your ass. Chump is not an offense.
ie:
"Me and the Chumps and Chumpetes are going down to get a beer"
What is so offensive, it just means mate. Get with the times, geez. You have it all wrong, and im actually offended by the way you barked at me because of your misunderstanding. YOUR CLUELESS. You have no clue about what the hell i was saying when it comes to saying chump. YOU HYPOCRIT.
I think you're thinking of the word, "chum" not "chump". Correct me if I'm wrong (i'm sure you will) but the word chum was a common term for buddy, mate, friend about 50-70 years ago mostly in England. As far as I know chump has always been a offensive name for someone. I'll give you a hint: people around here will respect you a tad more if you use caps less and spell properly, the only time I don't is on purpose or I'm drunk or semi-dead. Also immeadiately insulting everybody is not a really good way to make friends on the net. Anywho...
Disc brake are awesome but yes are pricy, unless you're lucky. I've got discs on the front at the moment and the difference is quite big. I'm definitely gonna go discs all round for my next one and I know a few guys on here are doing it, MUD BASHING is one. One reason a lot of people have disc fronts and not rears is that the fronts are a lot easier to set up than the rears, and as there's more out there-cheaper.
[Edited on 28-4-2005 by Boozer]
phantom ·
Well I am lucky enough to have drums all round, having them looked over next week in preparation for rego (soon! woohoo).
Probably a bit down the road I will look at front disks at least, maybe the whole hog later....but I can agree with the other posts on here concerning $$. By the time you get a buggy happening and shell out all of the hidden costs, extras, etc.....what you can save in not rebuilding the brake types, you can use for other unnecessary things, like getting seatbelts fitted...or the huge $$ for the engineering certificate itself.
I am sure you know a lot of these costs, as you've been looking apparently...but I got caught with the $$ side. A lot of things suddenly needed doing, and as much as I investigated everything before purchasing the buggy, I still got caught with extras.
For example.....who would have thought that to get a professional to fit a set (2 only) of seatbelts, would cost minimum $700, normally more? Let alone when the engineer, who looks at the car only twice (once when he does the initial assessment, and once when he checks it off for certification), tells you his price will be minimum $650, depending on how many re-visits, etc.
Its a $$ exercise......and if you can keep it down by using your current brakes, then its something you look at....
Kimbo ·
To get back to the point of the original question (and to avoid the mindless bickering that has ensued since), whether you have discs/drums on front or disc/drums on rear is essentially all to do with weight transference under braking, the surface upon which you drive, and how you want the car to respond under braking depending on the surface you're driving on.
Drums and discs apply differing amounts of braking effectiveness, discs being typically more effective than drums. So with discs on the front and drums on the rear, you're applying more braking force to the front of the car than to the rear - switch them around (assuming you could) and you'd reverse that effect.
If you have to mix drums and discs, and typcially drive on sealed roads, then discs should always be on the front as it provides much greater control under braking - look at any major car manufacturer that mix drums and discs, and you'll ALWAYS find the discs on the front and drums on the back.
Racing/offroad/rally applications may reverse that trend but that's because the drivers want the cars to respond differently under non-standard conditions.
Chewy ·
Wouldnt drums be fine on a buggy anyway?
considering they weigh something like half as much as a beetle..
Kimbo ·
Well, I've got a full offroad racing buggy (under rebuild conditions at this point), which probably weighs even less, and I'm going for discs on the rear and drums on the front (and they're bias-adjustable) for a couple of reasons - by applying more force to the rear brakes (as you would in this setup), 1) you prevent the front suspension from diving too much, allowing greater suspension movement and a better ability to ride over bumps; 2) discs are also typically lighter, which reduces the unsprung weight, and therefore allows the shocks to control suspension movement better; and 3) less braking force on the fronts will allow the wheels to continue revolving slightly, which allows better steering control
bajachris88 ·
Yeah, i don't mind the idea of discs allround. Of course, like pointed out, i gotta look at the cost. I plan to build it while im in uni, so i don't have to really suffer the budgeting side and money issues to a great extend (like kids, mortgage etc.). But if i can only afford drums, so be it.
Anyway, with my pricing, for an appropriate rolling chassis for my buggy with the offroad mods i want & disc brakes all round will cost me $6750. I got it all planned and i got a max of 5 or 6 years of pure fund dedication (besides a bit of board and cost of uni text books, which can be pricy but able to be delt with).
I want pure performance, (well thats what i dream), and im not saying the drum brakes are bad, (they are great) but from what i have heard, discs are good when it comes to performance, price, fitting etc. It probably wont have much of an effect because regardless of the brake, the buggy is still light and can stop easily with either. But just for the less price and complication of fitting (from what i heard from disc enthusiasts) i might go with discs.
mattie182 ·
mynameischris88 wrote:what i do plan to do is build my dream buggy
Well another wanna be.............. I m with you MikeM, also laughing At him
mat
bajachris88 ·
Don't u believe in following dreams?
What you have said has fueled me up more to make this buggy to DISPROVE YOU. Then we will see who is laughing!
HA HA HA HA!😀😀😀
bigbaja ·
standard disks on the front and standard type 3 drums on the rear is the way to go .
fitting is factory.
parts availability is factory.
every thing is factory .
i have modified beetle disks on the front .
and modified xf falcon disks on the rear .
the disks do not stop you any better.
if at all possible stay away from the word MODIFY.
MODIFY = MONEY remember this.
terry
Mad Manx ·
Main reason I'm sticking to drums at the mo is (apart from being totally broke) is I love my 5 stud wheels, and 4 stud disc seem to be the cheap and effective way out, the alternative for me would be to run adaptor plates as Terry's Baja has (as seen in Manx Mania #6- im not a stalker!) But in the end mate It all comes down to MONEY. My drums can still lock up so I guess there good enough for now.
bajachris88 ·
True, well many people go fine without discs all over. Just have to see with money.
Might keep you busy for a while and give you some more info
bajachris88 ·
Thanks.
Adam_C ·
..... Building a buggy at uni.....
HA! ever heard the term "Poor uni student" ..... they call us that for a reason!
boersch ·
how old are ya? the earlier you start saving for your car the better.. I had 8k saved up by the end of year 12.. that was from 1 shift a week at safeway. unless you're lucky and go to a uni that's close enough that you can live at home you'll be struggling to survive let alone build a beach buggy.
64vwmark ·
tinsfci wrote:My buggy has stock brakes all round (not even type 3 rear drums yet). Could it be that many buggies are not expected to do stoppies from 160 km/h? The cost of adding big brakes all round seems to upwards of 2000 bananas (not using VW bits). On a vehicle costing 5 large upwards that is not great value unless you really plan on getting jiggy wid it in the west side hizzy tryin to impress all your chumps.
Discs do have advantages, less fade, bugger all to adjust, easy pad changes, more stopping power etc, but unless you want to spend big bucks up front and can find exactly what you want then you may be best to buy a basic but solid buggy and build it up exactly how you want it.
Half the fun with these things is the fun per dollar spent.
I agree with you.
I've got drums all round on mine (type 3 wagon drums on rear, for brake balance) and they work fine, especially when they are adjusted up properly. Sure disc brakes are better, but in terms of bang for your buck, they aren't worth it.
Wuuuuuurrrrd.
mattie182 ·
mynameischris88 wrote:Don't u believe in following dreams?
What you have said has fueled me up more to make this buggy to DISPROVE YOU. Then we will see who is laughing!
Well we will see.......... I do believe in following dreams, but you come on here, bagging out people who dont have discs all round, then by the end of the dicussion, your saying that drums are fine. My point; get the facts first
ancientbugger ·
I have drums all round on my buggy and discs on the back would be the way I was thinking of going as there's so little weight on the front it locks up without trying. But don't discs dry out quicker after going through water which would be the deciding factor for me?
VWCOOL ·
lol.. dreams are just plans you can't afford. Finish uni, save up your money and when you can afford to plan, start asking questions of us that have been there, done that and heard it all before... 😉
bigbaja ·
not all people are poor uni students
my friend has 6 full regoed cars and they are all insured and all going and not shitas either
and thats was through uni
just knows how to spend money and dont buy shit
like i do wish i was as poor as him hehehehehehe
just cause you go to uni doesnt mean you have to be poor
daz67 ·
mattie182 wrote:
mynameischris88 wrote:what i do plan to do is build my dream buggy
Well another wanna be.............. I m with you MikeM, also laughing At him
mat
Come on Guys,
Let him dream, If he posts and you think he is dreaming ?
Don't read it, or at least don't reply!
Simple....
Keep the Buggy dream alive.......:kiss
MUD BASHING ANYONE ?? ·
I'm sure iv'e read this before or maybe its just another biff between the same lads
bajachris88 ·
lol. This thread has been posted for a while. You probably have read it before. Well, the dream is quite probable. It has a high chance of reality, cause ive looked at the budgeting side of things, and it seems very well thought.
There shouldn't really be any probs at all, just patience, constantly saving every cent, and the matter of working hard at byrning spears.
So really, its not much of a dream. Its more a realistic, highly probably future plan.
VWCOOL ·
I built my first Retro-Cal, 1916cc, disc brake, auto-panned IRS Oval when I WAS AT UNI. It cost me almost as much as a New Pulsar 'Reebok', which was another car I considered... so yes it can be done... I did it with two jobs and plenty of discipline and I did most body work myself
bajachris88 ·
nice stuff mate. It will be alot of hard work for me, but hopefully i shall get there.:thumb
WABaja ·
Chris in your situation you're probably better off saving a bit longer and trying to buy a buggy, (If it's a buggy that you really want), that is already registered...
I have seen a really nice buggy get built the way the owner wanted it.... the thing cost him about $75,000.oo...
Oh, and yes, it has 4 wheels disc brakes.....
Buy an old one that's going and registered, and just add to it, fix it, change it as you go, but keep it registered and going....
I bought my Baja as a registered, running, driving, (but not stopping coz it had no brakes) car... I got it cheap and I fixed it and changed it as I went...
What started as a virtually standard beetle that had been turned in to a convertable with a baja kit, has become a pretty tough off roader with all the things I wanted including 4 inch body lift, full roll cage, harness seat belts and a good motor, but it took a long time and really did cost a LOT of money... Money that I could Never have been able to spend all in one hit, but bit by bit over a bunch of years, I was able to build up my toy...
I think the thing is, get an exact idea of what you want, save heaps of pics and get all the info, then find out what the cheapest version of that car is selling for, without all the fancy bits... then take it from there... I have owned my Baja for about 17 YEARS...!!! So don't get too excited about these things happening over night... They rarely do...
Good luck with your what you want to do, and I'm sure when you've totally set your sights on just what it is that you want, there will be plenty of people around to help you see it right...
bajachris88 ·
Thanks mate. Yeah, ur baja looks champ.
What did ur mate get for $75,000? That is surely a huge amount.