Has anyone thought about getting reverse cams made so the motor would run backwards and then a Subaru gearbox could be used in the rear of a bug. This was done with Corvairs in the past.
Steve
Baja Wes ·
no...
It would require some ECU work to programme it backwards, but that shouldn't be too hard.
The cams are belt driven so you don't have to worry about thrust from cam gears.
The water pump wouldn't work backwards, so you would need a Davies Craig water pump.
The oil pump would have similar issues, but I don't know what the suby pump looks like and how you could get past that problem.
If the internals have the drawn out oiling holes in the spinning shafts (when the oil hole comes through the journal but it elongated in the direction of rotation just at the surface) then it wouldn't lubricate as well. Don't know how much of an effect this would have.
Don't know what you'd do with the starter. The one way clutch would eliminate the possibility of wiring it backwards.
Then there's the gearbox. The internal lubrication in the gearbox might not like going backwards, certainly not in an auto. Manuals would possibly still have some problems. I don't know if the thrust faces on the gears are equal on both sides, but I guess they should be.
MikeM ·
Can't the R&P be turned over in the subi box? I'm sorry if this has been answered somewhere else.
1303Steve ·
Hi Mike
The R&P cant be flipped in the Subi box. The above idea was thought of in drunken haze on Saturday night.
Steve
Jeza ·
I'll add to that drunken haze idea...
How about using a Honda motor... one of the ones that already rotates "backwards" (compared to everone else), and then using the Subi gearbox...
I guess you would then have to deal with the length of the inline 4.
I have no idea motor options Honda offered that spun "backwards", any thoughts?
The interesting thing is that the Subis 5th gear (from the 2wd boxes anyway) in not much higher than the type 3 ratio 4th gear. The gear ratios are just a bit more squashed together. The graph is done by a freind of mine who has a mid engined sports "buggy" (for want of a better description), and was considering the subaru box.nn[ Edited on 4-7-2005 by Jeza nn[ Edited on 5-7-2005 by Jeza ]
rubyred ·
it would cost WAY more than a built box stronger than a suby box and the adapter plate combined....i honestly do not see the point.
1303Steve ·
Hi
Have you priced strong gearboxes latley? I just sold a type 1 box which in todays money would cost about $6,000 to build and still be 4 speed, limo & Albins gears. Im now going for a Porsche box.
Steve
jakjones ·
WRX Boxes break when driven hard, guys in our club with subies are often wrecking boxes.
jvl054 ·
Hi Steve,is that a 5 speed Porsche Box? any reason why you didnt use the Type 1 box?JVLRacing
1303Steve ·
jvl054 wrote:Hi Steve,is that a 5 speed Porsche Box? any reason why you didnt use the Type 1 box?JVLRacing
I will break it.
Doug Sweetman ·
Suby boxes break because WRX's have 4WD traction. VW's dont - I'd be suprised if you busted one quickly with only 2wd.
On the honda idea, they made a 2.7L v6 for the Legend that would be an interesting motor I'm sure.... or a VTEC 4 or something like that.... would definetely be different.
71superbug ·
yeah subie boxes seem to be the weakest link in wrx's,
Anthony
RENNWAGEN ·
If Hondas spin the opposite way, then a Honda gearbox in a bug ( backwards ) will spin the correct way. How strong are the honda boxes?
Doug Sweetman ·
handa boxes are unfortunately mostly east west configuration - the suby's are still a transaxle type of box. You could make the honda box work, but it wouldnt be pretty.
Baja Wes ·
I'm pretty sure all the V6 honda's spun the right way, and now all the 4cyl's spin the right way too.
A 2wd suby box is only a front wheel drive, so probably not an overly strong box. I think using it in a RWD VW set-up would put alot more traction and strain on it.
1303Steve ·
Hi
If my idea was used I think a WRX box would be the best one to use, I agree with Wes the 2wd boxes would not be overly strong.
Steve
jvl054 ·
1303Steve wrote:
jvl054 wrote:Hi Steve,is that a 5 speed Porsche Box? any reason why you didnt use the Type 1 box?JVLRacing
I will break it.
I Thought you might say that.The Lbox that i have and its got all the gear iam not sure it will cope with the ponies i have.JVLRacing.
Jeza ·
Baja Wes wrote:I'm pretty sure all the V6 honda's spun the right way, and now all the 4cyl's spin the right way too.
Thats what I though....
pete wood ·
jakjones wrote:WRX Boxes break when driven hard, guys in our club with subies are often wrecking boxes.
Subie boxes break because they are trying to drive all 4 wheels in a 1450kg car. The clutches go first for the same reason. Same problems turn up in all turbo 4wds. 2wd is much more forgiving. Besides you can get dog gears and lsds more easily for the WRX boxes than for VW boxes.
As for the fwd boxes, Pete has one in his speedster and it's producing significant horsepower. He hasn't broken it yet. And he's not very mechanically sympathetic with it.
speedster356 ·
The test will come, I just picked up another FWD box for $100, I'm going to lock the diff and see how long it lasts......
jakjones ·
oooo locked diff in a rear engine high powered car would be very Dangerous !
speedster356 ·
Mid engined, but yeah it will be interesting.
1303Steve ·
Hi
Some Porsche LSDs lock 25% on acceleration and 100% on back-off.
Steve
jakjones ·
I have seen what can happen if u brake an axle or CV while on the gas with a locked diff, thats why Porche or any other sports car Manufacturers don't run lockers.
hey but each to there own .
Craig Torrens ·
jvl054 wrote:
1303Steve wrote:
jvl054 wrote:Hi Steve,is that a 5 speed Porsche Box? any reason why you didnt use the Type 1 box?JVLRacing
I will break it.
I Thought you might say that.The Lbox that i have and its got all the gear iam not sure it will cope with the ponies i have.JVLRacing.
You're an ex supertourer guru.....................you should know all about this?:jesus
jvl054 ·
Craig Torrens wrote:
jvl054 wrote:
1303Steve wrote:
jvl054 wrote:Hi Steve,is that a 5 speed Porsche Box? any reason why you didnt use the Type 1 box?JVLRacing
I will break it.
I Thought you might say that.The Lbox that i have and its got all the gear iam not sure it will cope with the ponies i have.JVLRacing.
You're an ex supertourer guru.....................you should know all about this?:jesus
:thumbThanks Craig:kiss Supertourers use sequentials DHnn[ Edited on 13/7/2005 by jvl054 ]
1303Steve ·
Hi John
Im sure your box will cope with what you want to do, just treat it nice off the line. Im building my chassis around the gearbox, so I bit the bullet and bought a G50, I didnt want to have to change the car around in the future to fit a G50 at a later date.
Steve
jvl054 ·
Hi Steve, I have been told the Gbox will not handle the motor.Still unsure which way to go.Ill just use it and see what will happen.Have you done anyhome work on a reno at all,are they good for 500hp all not?JVLRacing
1303Steve ·
Hi John
I tried every contact I could find to get a reno box, none around. All the off road guys have used them up. I did see one 4sale on an Aussie off road site but he wanted big money it.
Steve
boof2332 ·
When I pick up the pickup the 914, Ill see how that is done...mid mount a bug????High back seat!