Just wondering what everyone thought about these specs on a 1916 longblock. What sort of power? Rev limit?
Fuel Economy? What carbs/exhaust would you use? Etc....
Please comment.
engle 100
043 heads 40x35.5 valves
single springs
56cc around 8.3:1 cr
chromoly counter weighted crankshaft
vw54 ·
65 to 70 RWHP
20 to 23 MPG depending on how you drive
twin dells or webbers if you can find them or evn the twin Solexs stays away from Kadrons
get an electronic ignition set up one less thing to go wrong
or Buy Mick058 engine for $6500 and save some funds and headaches
trickysimon ·
Whats wrong with kadrons?
vw54 ·
ask anyone who has them c r a p
Joel ·
x2!!
had them, never again, webers or dells, buy once cry once
vw54 ·
or spend a few K more say 4 - 5 and go fuel injection
depending on the putor u buy
sander288 ·
I agree with dave, if you can afford FI do it, far better power spread and drivability, should be a fairly torquey motor, tell me if i'm wrong anyone?
colonel mustard ·
For what reason were the kadrons crap? No responce? Something broke? Not good for such a large capacity? (my mate runs them on his 1776 and thinks they are mega sweet - and he is a qualified mech...) - saying they are generally crap isn't hugely helpful. Im buying a set next week for $900, to go onto a motor im building i the nearish future...
colonel mustard ·
Also, when you say electronic igniton, would you say a 009 with a compufire good, or is there something better on the market for about the same price?
Old Hutcho ·
Trickysimon
I got one. Identical spec except I got a 110 cam.
I just turned out 76 hp on the recent dyno day. I produce 121 + ft/lb of torque.
I am not sure where these guys are getting their info on Kads, but I am using a set and I now get close to 30mpg and I turn out most of my torque at 3320rpm or 100 kph. I tried an expensive set of Dellortos and had enormous problems with them. The Kadrons are by comparison, crude, but simplicity has its advantages. The recent dyno day we had at our club helped me to jet the things properly and I havent looked back since.
This configuration is a VERY GOOD cruise/street engine setup. I can cruise at 100kph all day and keep up with anybody on the road, its torquey and a bit loud on the intake side. I can run to the rev limiter at 5400 in any gear except top (I honestly think I am breaking a speed limit somewhere at those revs)
Dave Becker (The Guru) drove my car to Wollongong recently and asked me three times what carbs I had on the car.
So go figure.
Old Hutcho😂
colonel mustard ·
What disi do you run old Hutcho? Also, you say its a street engine, how agressive is your cam, what are the specs of your cam, if i can ask 🙂
trickysimon ·
Thanks Old Hutcho, good to hear from someone who has pretty much the same combo.
What exhaust are you running?
What CR?
0-100 time? 🤘
Old Hutcho ·
Colonel mustard.
I run a 009, cause I cant figure out how to get a vacuum signal to a canister svda distributor. They are no doubt the best but the 009 is a good compromise for my setup. I use a Pertronix breakerless ignition from George at Classic VW with a stock coil. Its cheap enough to do and it is reliable and works well. I have had this system in the car for 2 years without a problem.
I cant give you the specs of an Engle 110 but someone on here will have it.
The cam is not super aggressive as driveability was the aim for me and I have achieved that. I think I may have just overcammed the engine by one size, and perhaps I should have stayed with a 100. I dont wanna race anyone from point A to point B, I just wanna go cruising. If you need to go real fast, spec the engine differently and put up with the different characteristics. (Boy is that opening a can of worms)
There is no doubt that fuel injection is the way to go, but I dont have the money and I am real happy with what I got.
Old Hutcho.
Old Hutcho ·
Trickysimon
I am running an original set of 1.5" Genie extractors (circa 1969??) which I found brand new. Theyre tuned and have a beautifully designed and built collector. I had a shop build me a custom tuckaway glasspack muffler. Its quiet and but it has the tendency to run out of puff at the top end if I take the rev limiter off it.
At 5400rpm the serious guys may laugh at me, but I can get a speeding ticket on pretty much any road in Australia with the way its set up, AND the Highway Patrol blokes cant hear me.
0 - 100? Havent got a clue. It wouldn't be a track burner, but nobody leaves me out of the frame when I am on the road.
Old Hutcho
Joel ·
kadrons are ok as a base product twin carb setup
they wouldnt have what i call the best progression circuit, stock linkage setup is beyond a joke
ive never seen such poor engineering and they wear in the throttle shaft bushings which sucks air
they can be made to work with a better linkage and drilled for vacuum so they run a vac advance dissy but once you experience webers (good italian ones) or dells u never wanna go back to kadrons
colonel mustard, i hope for $900 its a brand new pair your getting
i sold my pair to a mate for $250
i almost felt guilty till i saw them going for $300-350 on ebay
Joel ·
hutcho, sorry not the clearest but theres the specs
colonel mustard ·
Naw, second hand. New set is $1400 now. my mechanic loves them, and he has worked on VW's his whole life (did his apprenticeship with them). So I trust him when he says they will be good for the setup Im going for (still not sure if i will go 1776 - 1835 or 1916). Not saying i dont trust people here, but if he thinks he can set them up to be awesome on a motor he builds - I will take his word for it. At the moment the aim is for streetable power - if i get serious it will be off to webers, and away from an L-bug and into a 1970 1500 or 1300 beetle. 😀
So far i have lined up the kadrons, a german 69mm crank that has been machined and balanced (just need to have it machined to 8 dowel), 8 dowel lightened flywheel, german rods (need to be balanced/machined and new bushes, swivel foot rockers. I have (sitting in a box) a set of extractors with a single glasspack muffler, if you can call it that (mechanic also raves about this exhaust). and one of those mini extended sumps. '
Im certainly a long way off building this engine as im studying youthwork this year, but maybe warwick 2010 you might see my car.
vassy66T1 ·
Having had webers for half that price and brand new dellortos for only $300 more (45's) it seems really steep. If you are happy that is cool but Webers and Dellortos aren't some exotic and difficult carb setup. I jetted my own on my 1776 after reading some articles and they ran like a dream.
My 2c anyhow.
colonel mustard ·
I guess I'm just comfortable to let him put his knowledge into my car, and if he screws it up, i can blame him. I know i will never be happy with the power i get, but iv driven my mates 70 beetle with the 1776 running kadrons out the back of upper brookfield, and i was more than pleased. i really dont intend to race it (only on the streets off the lights racing skylines) hahaha. not much ET work.
hellbugged ·
engle 100......
Excellent low-end cam. Used with 1300-1700cc, one 2-barrel, 2 single barrel such as Solex Kadrons, dual 42 DCNF Webers, or equivalent with little or no headwork. Good low and mid range to about 5000 RPM. The more headwork the stronger, smoother and higher RPM it produces. 276 duration, 0.374" lift at cam.
for that money i would put it into some dells or webbers run some small vents till you do some headwork and then up the vents and jets and enjoy your $$
matberry ·
Kadrons are great for a low comp small engine, but at $900 and 1915, I would be putting on some 40mm IDF's or 40 Dells. The linkages on Kaddies certainly leave a bit to be desired, but I have set up plenty, and on a 16-1700cc engine, they are an economical alternative. You should get a better price or for that money and heads, I'd probably go, 1915, 043's, W110 cam with 40mm dual twin barrels. Comp depends on what car it's going in and use.
Joel ·
colonel mustard wrote:Naw, second hand. New set is $1400 now.
your shitting me.... who the hell is selling them for that? 🤪
they were no where near that last time i priced them which was all that long ago
you would be mad to spend 1.4k and only end up with brazillian made single throat carbs that are nothing more than stock kombi carbs on small dose of roids
theres a couple of sets of good italian webers for twin ports on ebay at the moment both currently under $350
and a IDF linkage/manifold/aircleaner kit for cheap to
Old Hutcho ·
Joel
Thanks for the specs Joel. They are a little hard to read but it may be my screen. I knew someone would come through with the info.
Hellbugged
I am inclined to think that you are right. I could have perhaps gone to a 100 instead of a 110 but mine runs so well its hard for me to judge one against the other. I certainly would not discount the 100 cam, as I reckon its probably a very good cam for cruise stuff. I have some slightly bigger heads and I am not complaining.
I forgot to tell everybody that I run about 8:1 comp or a touch over.
The biggest factor I took into consideration when I built my 2 engines were
1: advice from Dave Becker.
2: some more advice from Dave Becker.
3: the fact that the Americans have poured about 40 years of development into VW street engines and the two sizes that crop up time and time again in the literature is 1776 and 1916. So I built one of each. Not sorry on either score.
Old Hutcho
Craig Torrens ·
trickysimon wrote:engle 100
043 heads 40x35.5 valves
single springs
56cc around 7.9:1 cr
chromoly counter weighted crankshaft
Cam is to mild (close to stock) and the compression is also to low.
With that combo you wont need a counterweighted crank as it wont rev that high................stock cranks, in motors built right, will rev all day to 6500rpm.
Dont use 043 heads as you will not be able to machine enough out of the heads to increase the compression.
Also pointless having the valves that size with the 100 cam
Regards
CraigT
colonel mustard ·
Sorry to change the subject back to carbs, but when dell's are mentioned, can you show me exactly which dellorto's you are refering to?? Where can i get manifolds/air cleaners/linkage from. A bit more of a solid price would be great, if someone can link me up 🙂
Bizarre ·
DRLA are the equivelent of IDF Webers
They will both use the same manifold, linkage and filters
Thanks Craig. I'm guessing that the motor was just built for long life regarding the cw crank?
Craig Torrens ·
with that combo a standard or counterweighted crank will last the same................in fact a standard vw crank in a lot of cases is better than an aftermarket crank, as the quality of the forging of a vw crank is 1st class.
with regards to "long life" it all depends on how it was built..........has it been balanced? Pointless using cw crank if the motor hasn't been balanced. 👍
trickysimon ·
Does anyone know if 1.4:1 rockers are compatible with Engle 110 or are they limted to 1.25:1 or 1.3:1?
Also would 1 5/8 sidewinder and 40mm IDFs be fine with this combo?
BiX ·
1 5/8 is really for a hev rev/ larger motor. I have one ona 2L but it revs to over 7k.
The W series of cams are made for std rockers, you cna get away with 1.25s (possibly) but the K series are made for the larger ratio.
40mm Carbs will be fine, they will even run on 1776's and hipo 1600's.
cram ·
I've got a set of 40 mm webers - rebuilt with cb performance kit - has type 4 linkage and manifolds though -
see parts for sale section!
trickysimon ·
Thanks BiX. Just hoping that I can get 1.5 inch sidewinder than.
Cram they would be good except I have no use for type 4 manifolds or linkages 😉
colonel mustard ·
Then sell the manifolds/linkage on here and make some money, then buy some decent type 1 manifolds / linkage / air cleaners. still going to be cheaper than new webers... I wish I hadn't put a deposit on kadrons... or I wish I had a 1915. one day... when I actually have money, I will. 🙂
trickysimon ·
Does anyone know what size venturi's I should use in my 40 DCN's for this engine?
They currently have 24's in them but I'm thinking they might be a bit on the small size 😂
trickysimon ·
Online calculator says 32 vents. Does this sound right? If so anyone got 32 vents for DCNs?
NuZo ·
lots of great info in here!
i would like to see the outcome of ur engine simon! once u get it going in ur car you gota get some dynos up for us !!!
trickysimon ·
😂 I doubt it will be a dyno queen with the Engle w100 but will be interesting none the less 😁
NuZo ·
im not talking about dyno for high HP figures, just for an idea of whats happening.
Mate TBH id rather a daily drive, then something that only works on weekends (if that)
dangerous ·
Leave the 24 vents in there being you have the baby W100 cam.
trickysimon ·
Really? I heard they were even too small for 1600's 🤪
NuZo ·
simon, does ur car have a doghouse cooler on it?
if not is it the same as mine, where its in teh fan shroud?
will my oilcooler be enough for an engine like yours? or even a bit more wild? or do the doghouse coolers get alot more cooling done then the standard ones?
Cheers 😀
trickysimon ·
I dunno I'm still learning 😂
Smaller vents restrict the top end if I'm right. I dont want all the power to be over by 3000, although I understand it wont go much over 4500.
Pretty much looking for the most all round vents for my engine.
trickysimon ·
You talk in riddles Daimo 😂
hellbugged ·
just build the long block and run it.........external changes can be made according to how it goes and you like to drive it.