There has been alot of 1916 / carb talk on the forum this week, And as these are things that Im currently researching and planning, I'd really love your opinion on this.
So, I will be building an engine late this year/early next year (2010) and the budget is quite limited but id love to know what specs I would get a decent decent performance out of. The aim is to be daily driven, but with a fair bit of punch. I'm really not interested in it be stupidly powerful, but id like to get the most out of the setup 馃檪
I am being serious here, and I'm not interersted in fuel injection or turbo's (as cool as that is). I want it to be simple, and drivable.
What i have so far:
- 8 dowel lightened flywheel
- German 69mm Crank
- 69mm Rods
- Swivel foot rockers (standard - 1:1 [is that correct..?])
- standard clutch kit to mate to the L-bug IRS gearbox.
- Single glass pack extractors
I want to keep the standard Fuel setup if I can, Im not really up for electronic fuel pumps.
I'd love some suggestions in this form, roughly:
- heads
- cam
- Intake
- P/B
- Distributer
- what ever else I've missed!!
I'm also looking for links, so if you suggest something, a link would be awesome also!!!
Cheers 馃檪
cnfabo 路
i think maybe get your stock 040 heads port and polished, engle 110 cam, dell or webber 40's or kads with match ported manfolds, quite pack muffler, 94 mahle p&b's,and maybe that compufire 60 000 volt system. will be a nice daily with some torque and wont brake the bank. thats my 2 cents. keep saving, but dont rush it, if you think that it might take a few extra months saving to build it that much better, do it.
good luck mr mustard, ha......
Bizarre 路
what is the cut on your crank??
How many times has it been ground
If it is much more than 20 thou under i would consider replacing it
Same with your case
Has it been line bored??
Has the thrust bearing been cut??
These are the backbones that need to be sound to start with
If it is a true daily consider running a stock 34 Pict for reliability and ease
Otherwise what Chis said above is as good a "base" 1916 as you can get
With your muffler if you have a fulkly merged header in a 4 3 2 1 firing order it is heaps better than the standard 4 2 3 1 extractor set up
Have a look at what you have - it will make sense when you see it
colonel mustard 路
I will be getting a new case. And no, i dont know what type that will be.
Im not sure how many times the crank has been ground either. probably some things i should find out hey.
I hate 34PICT, no offence. but i really cant stand it. I was going down the kadron track, but after what every body said in a thread a few days ago, I'm definatly concidering dellortos.
I will have a look at the headers. Its not nully merged, it has j pipes. its similar to this http://www.classicveedub.com.au/images/SpareParts/muffler_exhaust/3310.jpg
Bizarre 路
ok - anti clock wise from top left no 3
3 - 1 - 4 - 2
I have a few questions, Does anyone know what sort of rev's a standard German crank will hold up to? Also, does anyone have experiance with swivel foot rockers??
My exhaust pattern isnt like that sadly, but for me looks>>>>(over) performance, to a certain extent. especially externally. I have a similar exhaust on my 1600 currently, and i HATE that it sticks out. Im happy with the exhaust iv got for the new engine, it just needs a bit of sanding and painting, and it will be wicked.
Im mainly concerned now at what im really getting out of stock parts in a performance motor. the guy who is building it generally uses stock parts in the engines he builds. what do you think?
Joel 路
with a non c/w crank if ur revin it over 5k all the time you will soon pound out the bearing seats
colonel mustard 路
What about standard rods Joel? Will they deal with plus 5k revs? Im not sure that i will generally rev past that... Its not a rotary... haha! I don't shift at 9500rpm all the time!
RodPenrose 路
Colonel , Here are the spec's on an engine I have just sold to Tricky Simon .
Used as 41 case line bored .020
cro-moly counterweighted crank .010 mains , .020 rods
new 5.4'' I beam cro-moly conrods
engle 100 cam and bevel gear
scat lifters
AA 94mm piston kit
New 043 heads 40 x 35.5 stainless valves , single springs and 54cc chambers , cleaned up and not ported
std pushrods
solid shimmed rockers with swivel feet adj.
26mm oil pump
std weight 8 dowelled flywheel
new bearing kit
This engine was all new except for the case that I was using in my personal car and after 8,000 km's was totally rebuilt with different heads . This engine has 8.3 comp. and runs Kadron carbs and is to be used on std unleaded fuel . This is not an engine that will see more than 5000 rpm , however is built to do 80,000 + km's . The total cost on this engine sealed from front pulley to flywheel and valve cover to valve cover was $ 3000 . This engine runs and idles like a std engine , has the power to overtake at 100 km/h , and has enough torque to climb hills without changing gears on a freeway . Good luck with your engine and remember to built what you need and not what you think you need , ROD.
trickysimon 路
So is the compression 7.9 or 8.3 Rod? 馃槀
colonel mustard 路
OK.... this gives me some good idea's
-8 dowel lightened flywheel
- German 69mm Crank (balanced and machined for 8 dowel)
- 69mm Rods
- Swivel foot rockers (standard - 1:1 [is that correct..?])
- standard clutch kit to mate to the L-bug IRS gearbox.
- Single glass pack extractors
- 94mm heads - 40mm x 35.5mm valves
- engle 110 cam (not sure what exact grind)
- 94mm piston kit
- Bosch 009 with electronic (compufire)
- DRLA Dellorto's (not sure what size...) or maybe Kadrons still (going to try and get out of that today)
- Oil pump... No idea
- Lifters.... No idea
- Push rods.... No idea
- would DRLA 40's be big enough?
- Rod,
What brand are the heads that you used on that engine? also,
This might be a dumb question, but what is the difference between a AA and B piston kit? And what brand of pistons are most commonly used/or what are the best - life wise?
hellbugged 路
colonel mustard wrote:OK.... this gives me some good idea's
-8 dowel lightened flywheel
- German 69mm Crank (balanced and machined for 8 dowel)
- 69mm Rods
- Swivel foot rockers (standard - 1:1 [is that correct..?])
- standard clutch kit to mate to the L-bug IRS gearbox.
- Single glass pack extractors
- 94mm heads - 40mm x 35.5mm valves
- engle 110 cam (not sure what exact grind)
- 94mm piston kit
- Bosch 009 with electronic (compufire)
- DRLA Dellorto's (not sure what size...) or maybe Kadrons still (going to try and get out of that today)
- Oil pump... No idea
- Lifters.... No idea
- Push rods.... No idea
- would DRLA 40's be big enough?
- Rod,
What brand are the heads that you used on that engine? also,
This might be a dumb question, but what is the difference between a AA and B piston kit? And what brand of pistons are most commonly used/or what are the best - life wise?
rods woill be a bit longer than 69mm 馃槀.......but yes standard do the job up to 76mm stroke
Rod would have all those parts you need at excellent $$$
rockers would be 1.1/1
you need new lifters of good quality with new cams
oil pump will be good with 26mm providing plenty
you only need standard pushrods
engle 100 would work well if you are not porting the heads and sticking to the kaddies...........up to 5000 rpm
might make use of 110 with dells and cleaning the heads up a tad
40mm dells would be plenty (venturis will need attention and jets from there of which there are plenty available) kads would work
A and B piston relates to pin height in the piston with B type being for stroker cranks........mahle brand work fine
Joel 路
stock rods balanced are almost bullet proof
colonel mustard 路
Piston and Cylinder Set 94MM X 69 Stroke FORGED.
CB 044 Heads 40x35.5 valves 94 bore
ENGLE Hi-performance Cam W110
HIGH PERFORMANCE PUSH RODS Made from the highest quality heat-treated 5/16" tubing. Fits 1300-1600cc.
STAINLESS STEEL PUSH ROD TUBES 40hp 1600cc
Valve Covers
just some ideas there.......
Do any vw shops do engine kits??
Craig Torrens 路
Joel wrote:with a non c/w crank if ur revin it over 5k all the time you will soon pound out the bearing seats
Not true, if its all balanced and the machining is done properly they will rev to 6200 all day long for years.
And yes stock rods are bullet proof !
Joel 路
yeh its the ones that arent balanced tho iwas refering to
colonel mustard 路
But then a counterwighted crank is better than a standard balanced crank.... But is it worth it for the price???
Craig Torrens 路
depends on your budget and combo !
hellbugged 路
colonel mustard wrote:But then a counterwighted crank is better than a standard balanced crank.... But is it worth it for the price???
NO........ but YES 馃お
start thinking of your engine as a combination of ALL it's components.........and exactly what you want to do with it
eg.......
no point having cam that runs in the 5500- 8000rpm range if you have non ported standard valve sized heads and a non counter-weighted crank...........
BUT a non counter weighted crank with a nice gentle cam designed for tourque 1200-4900 rpm would work great with the exact same heads
there are things you wont need and things that once you add one "design up grade", you will need several more to get the best performance AND ALSO just as importantly ENGINE LIFE
make sense?
matberry 路
One thing, definately dont use those stainless pushrod tubes, I fitted em to an offroader thinking I would save the effort of painting and should last forever on the beach...they actually are too tough or too long or both and hold the heads from exerting the correct clamp force on the barrel.
Lots of good advice above. So no need for me to repeat.
Nothing wrong with stock rods, I reved them to 9000rpm in the chop top engine in the 90's, but always had sets that were definately German and never previously resized.
Kadrons are ok but I'd prefer Webers personally.
pat Malone 路
A counterweighted crank adds torque right through the rev range................... if its made correctly
from idle all the way as far as the cam/heads combo will take it 馃槒
ie not just crappy flame cut counterweights welded on down the back of the shop
Bizarre 路
Another point
A lightened flywheel will rev up faster but will loose momentum quicker
whatnow 路
i'm no expert but i think that with 42mm intake valves you will want 44 webers/45 dellortos
colonel mustard 路
Interesting. I will research that. thanks 馃檪
colin 路
Pretty much backup what Daimo said,
Its not the parts that count but more the combo and how they work together.
Seek plenty of advice from people liike Rod Penrose.
Cheers Col
colonel mustard 路
Rod seems to be the man..
colonel mustard 路
What do you think of this combo (anyone - rod in particular)
case???
cro-moly counterweighted crank .010 mains , .020 rods
new 5.4'' I beam cro-moly conrods
engle 110 cam and bevel gear
scat lifters
AA 94mm piston kit
New 044 heads w/ stainless valves , single springs and 54cc chambers
Aluminium pushrods
Windage push rod tubes
roller rockers
26mm oil pump
lightened 8 dowelled flywheel
colonel mustard wrote:But then a counterwighted crank is better than a standard balanced crank.... But is it worth it for the price???
and you'd still have to get the c/w crank balanced and the c/w helps stop the crank from twisting, which at high rev will break the crank and there goes your engine. if you were going to scrot the poor thing everyday then I'd say yes but then the stock case becomes the weak point and you have to go with a wasserboxer.
get the case shuffle pinned and this will help stop the case moving at high revs. Otherwise a balanced crank, rods and pistons. This should all be matched so that the weight of the crank, rod and piston on each journal is within a gram of each other. if you assemble any rod to any piston then you can end up with one set weighing more than the others then it should.
port the heads, you could do a reasonable job yourself, and 3 angle the vlave seats plus back cut the valves. This will help maximise flow for the lift your cam gives. Also, match port the inlet manifold to the heads and carbs.
The kads will give you a nice smooth drive and be more fuel efficient than the dells or webers but either would work.
The 110 will work well with the head mods. Use scat lifters, the ones with the small oil hole in the contact pad. helps cam lobe lubrication.
trickysimon 路
I don't know why ure so obsessed with coming up with all these combos even though you said you wont be doing it for ages.. 馃檮
colonel mustard 路
Because..... im not really, but id love to know what people run. Its like getting blood out of a rock around here.... and trying it isnt a good answer when you cant pull money off tree's.
13bwagon 路
i can tell you why
forum post counter
quote
Nice one. Im over 400 and I haven't even been on here 3 months... hahah
