Bond roll bar group buy

Hi

Richard at V - Force is liaising with Bond Roll bars for a group buy on Bond Roll bars.

These will be in full or 1/2 cage.

To get your name on the list contact Richard direct, 02 9743 1247 or mobile 0408 991 247.

Steve

Have you got any idea as to the approximate cost? Also will they be possible to install without separating the body from the pan?

Good idea👍

Maybe post cost, and pics of designs/configuration etc..........I'm assuming they are bolt in cages ?

Yep...more info would be good

what they said ^^^^ 👍

compliant with any of the specs for adr's cams or andra by any chance?

important info for some, doubt rich wants 100 of the same queries 🙂

What he said. interested, but depends on specs and price.

What he said as well!!

Yeh. I am certainly interested to see what this can give us.

If they have door bars ? will they open for entry to seat . Are they being made to help, to get car blue tag for registered.
You know what I mean .🤪

Spoke to Richard tonight
He is trying to see who is interested first before he can get numbers/costs/design/colour/shoe size
What is wanted - rear seat in / out
Full / half
Post a preference of what you are after and Steve or I will pass on info

If REALLY interested Steve posted the phone number

Im in for one, Full cage, no rear seat

1967 1300 deluxe.

Cheers
Shaun

For me a basic 6 point cage in kit form is best. That way I can add to the cage with a local builder.

Min specs for me would be
no rear seat
6 point
min 1 diag in main hoop
Cams approved
single door bar
weld in

Interested depending on cost and what configuration as already said pics or design would be good or at least of a description of how and where they are to mount.

I'd be looking at 6 point boltin one diag in main hoop and door bars . No rear seat to fit into 69 Cams approved is a must.

6 point bolt ins are usually around $1200 as a guide

I'm interested, not sure on preference, I'd like to see what the choices/prices will be.

$1200 sounds fare........

would a 6 point be too much of a hastle for a daily driver?

or am i better of going hlf cage

Well...for me..

6 point, no back seat, very useable (ie entry at A pillar and window winders can operate), strong, legal; cams and dmt, weld in removeable?, connection type? and for 1200 clams I think it should be installed too.

matberry wrote:and for 1200 clams I think it should be installed too.

I initially thought that sounds like a lot of $ also,
but after talking wth a couple of other guys who had cages done by shops,
that is not so bad.

I keep forgetting that it is now 2010,
and how most specialist shops are charging $100/hr or more.

On another topic,
it would be a real challenge to get a 45mm tube bent to clear both the dash and the window winders!
I think some guys went electric windows for that reason!

$1200......CHEAP
It would be a very basic simple design of a cage!
BUT to save a life worth it😎

If someone can show some schematic/shop drawings of the style we are talking about it would be helpful.
Ta

sheez hasn't anyone but Craig stuck their head in a hillclimb beetle for the last 20 years......99% are bonds roll bars

here's my old "bonds" alloy one......they run very tight with the inside of the car at the B pillar and in the roof areas.........obvouosly as DB pointed out they cant keep them too tight to the A pillar but it cut under the bottom of the dash within mm's and access was fine Matt. seat belt mount holes in B pillar were still useable.....window winders might have some interference. yes i can get it in and out with the body on the chassis still

new ones have correct specs for cams (STEEL, foot plate size, cross bar in hoop, proximity to roof, crush testings etc etc) yes they do side impact bars and i'm not sure, but thought the rear bars were moved to run to the wheel arches as where mine goes under the window has since been deemed not stong enough with the cams specs. so most likely they will run to there..........be an interesting group buy if everyone wants different specs, be like 20 people phoning in for their custom cages at once 😂

we need to get Richard on here to let us know the real details, but i hope this can provide some sort of insight to bondy's work

i might order one tomorrow and save waiting 😘



in steel....






notch has a bonds steel one (with a couple of extra alloy bars).........might get an idea of the locking system here........but hey maybe you want to weld it all up 🥲




i'm sure you all remember that I don't know shit anyways

Dam Daimo. every time you put that pic up makes me want my cage back 😀

Probably the best way is to do 1 or 2 basic cage designs that meet cams specs, ie Early beetle half cage, early beetle 6 point, Superbug 6 point.

decide if they will be weld or bolt in. Otherwise like somebody said its going to become everybody with a custom cage. If people want extra bars, bond can give a price for this per item and a cost for fitting for sydney people. The major cost would be in bending and forming the main front legs, main hoop, and rear bars and roof bar.

Just a thought. I would take one in kit form, weld in for a super. then get a local builder to weld it and add extra bars where I want them.

Bix, I am 100% in agreement.

cams specs is not a problem, its his speciality...


yeah bondy already has the jigs to knock them up at will....guessing the idea is its cheaper to get them out, then set up... and knock out a dozen while he is at it
Win win situation

I personally am more for a custom setup.

In the past, I have used Custom Vee Dub in Bris to bend my main hoops and any extra bits I want, from there I bring it home and fabricate it how I want for the individual car and purpose. Weather I weld it or get it tig'd up back at their shop, I get alot more for my money.

I'm sorry but that single bend A pillar doesn't cut it for me, nor does the bolt in clamp arrangements. My cages become intergrated suspension and driveline support, being for more than your average street car or race setup. That price is way high for a few tubes to start a build with. As Daimo explains above, the real winner I think would be mr bond.

i ment win for them and us

cams regs are not easily met, so for that intent its a good deal

There are a few more bends than it appears in the pics to get those front legs down matt, how ever, im hearing ya!

Bond Roll Bars are making a cage for the 'new' No.8 Beetle. I've gone for the option of having them supply all the bits, and I will fit and weld them.

Roll cages are almost like snow-flakes - no two are the same. Allan and Peter at BRB were very helpful, and were happy to go along with what I wanted in the way of slight changes. They will measure your car if you want, or even do the whole job. Just make sure that you get the right one for YOUR car, and what's best for YOU!

Cheers, Greg

Hi

Richard is the guy to talk to about this. To get a group buy they would need to be a standardised thing with extras fitted at the customers cost. So talk to Richard about your preference so that he can go to Bonds with group buy numbers and configurations.

I think it gave all of us a shock when we saw what happened to Greg Mackies car.

Were looking at putting 1/2 cage in David's bug, we will take the back seat out and have the hoops going to the back luggage area, David and I tall so we cant have a cross brace, we would go with a diagonal to the luggage area.

Steve

I have purchased 2 x 8 point roll cage kits today as they were so cheap . I have a pic of the finished cage and will have to up load it when I get home . These are all bent and are to be assembled by the owner and conform with the class 11 off road specs in the US . I have purchased these after seeing the aftermath of Greg's car and will install one in my own car . I should be able to offer these in kit form for around $ 340 per kit . These are mild steel and I want to install it to make sure it will comply with the Aust. standards , ROD.

Anyone spending money and time fitting a rollcage for ANY motorsport should make sure it complies with CAMS, ANDRA etc...... fitting a non complying rollcage is a waste of money IMO.

use this as a reference:
http://www.camsmanual.com.au/pdf/10_gen_req/GQ11_Schedule_J_Q210.pdf

Craig,

Can you change your avatar?

That is very distracting 🤪

The popular class 11 cage in the states that you speak of Rod is likely to be one of these. Very popular with the baja crowd over there , even as a starting point to then customise and add to. Second one is Empi

are empi cages just for looks....

that cams roll cage regs is a bunch of japanese jiberish. for a home build "1 st time" seems confusing....

whats wrong with the cages posted???? are those regs writen by a lawyer or something...

cnfabo wrote:that cams roll cage regs is a bunch of japanese jiberish. for a home build "1 st time" seems confusing....

whats wrong with the cages posted???? are those regs writen by a lawyer or something...

The rules aren't that complex, so let's break it down.

The first part just tells you which types of racing needs what cage.

The main hoop has to be within 150mm in front or behind the driver's head, but not directly above it.

Also, in general you're supposed to have as few bends as possible and the main hoop should be as close to vertical as possible.

Your full cage needs at least 6 mounting points, which have to be a minimum of 3mm thick steel, must be a certain size and must be welded to the body. If your cage bolts in then you have to weld 3mm steel plates to the back side of the panel, the same size as the foot of the roll cage.

Then it says the minimum material specs and tube size. Cold-drawn seamless or cold-drawn welded, with a minimum of 50mm OD and 2mm wall for the main hoop and 40mm OD and 2mm wall for everything else. This part is usually where imported roll cages fail, as they may not comply with the material standards, or even if they do, you may not be able to get the paperwork to prove that the material is up to spec. Alloy cages are definitely out, as has been mentioned before.

The two cages which Matberry posted up just recently, would fail to meet CAMS specs for all sorts of reasons. Now, this is just my individual opinion, and I'm not an expert, but to me, here's what's wrong with the multi-coloured Class 11 cage:

The biggest problem is in the fine print at the top of the picture, the tubes are too small, although they are chrome-moly so you might be able to get them certified, but it would involve a lot of arguing and paperwork. Also, the picture doesn't show any proper mounting points where it attaches to the body, so you would have to weld those on. Those weird tubes which seem to attach the front beam to the rear suspension should not be part of the cage. The rear stays and front hoop are both terrible, as the front hoop is made up of several random pieces bolted together which is not allowed, and the rear stays seem to be actually formed together out of a loop instead of mounting to the body, which kind of defeats the purpose of them. Also, there is no diagonal cross-brace welded into the main hoop, which is now a minimum requirement.

Next, the other cage which is photographed. This one is nowhere near as bad, but it would still fail. The mounting feet for the main hoop and front hoops are too small, and there is no diagonal cross-brace. Also, the rear stays are a little bit more bendy than CAMS likes them these days, it would be better if they were just straight tubes welded between the main hoop and the rear floor. You might also get into trouble with the weird "knees" which seem to have been bent into the main hoop for no adequate reason. It looks to me like the designers of that cage were trying to preserve rear seat room rather than maximise safety, which is fairly silly. If a car has a rollcage then it should never have rear seat passengers anyway, as they won't be adequately held in without bucket seats or harnesses, and they'll be killed if they hit their head on a roll cage bar without a helmet.

On the other hand, the photos of the black Bond Roll Bars cage shown on page 1 are perfectly fine, and would easily pass CAMS specs.

Matt , the kits that I have purchased are pretty close to the frst image you supplied , but do not have the 2 lower bars that run from the front to the back of the car . I am pretty sure there are steel plates supplied that mount the entire cage to the car , ROD .

cnfabo wrote:that cams roll cage regs is a bunch of japanese jiberish. for a home build "1 st time" seems confusing....

whats wrong with the cages posted???? are those regs writen by a lawyer or something...

Its basic engineering principals...........to stop "1st time" dodgy home build cages from entering a track and potentially doing more harm to the driver than good.

Some people seem to think that welding in a few bars makes the car safer...but this is NOT always the case. As with all safety equipment we are lucky we have CAMS to set the standards.......this makes motor racing safer for all.

For the people who find the rules confusing , then its best to get someone who understands them to sell or build you the cage.

Thanks waveman1500 for your comments, you're spot on.

Now back to the topic of a group buy from "BOND" cages..........not inferior OS products that wont comply.

Craig Torrens wrote:

cnfabo wrote:that cams roll cage regs is a bunch of japanese jiberish. for a home build "1 st time" seems confusing....

whats wrong with the cages posted???? are those regs writen by a lawyer or something...

Its basic engineering principals...........to stop "1st time" dodgy home build cages from entering a track and potentially doing more harm to the driver than good.

Some people seem to think that welding in a few bars makes the car safer...but this is NOT always the case. As with all safety equipment we are lucky we have CAMS to set the standards.......this makes motor racing safer for all.

For the people who find the rules confusing , then its best to get someone who understands them to sell or build you the cage.

Thanks waveman1500 for your comments, you're spot on.

Now back to the topic of a group buy from "BOND" cages..........not inferior OS products that wont comply.

VERY VERY TRUE!😎

there is a cnc mandrel bender down this way if anyone is interested find me a cage to copy and ill get a price! maybe one of rods class11 cages? update to cams specs, should be no probs and cheapish.

I have read this whole post and there seems a recuring theme, price.

Gents how much do you value your life?

Forget price, think quality, you life may depend on it!

Cheers Col

Wise words there, Colin

Greg, i told dad about your unfortunate accident at Wakefield.

He was glad you were okay, then said some wise crack about dak daks, you know what he,s like.

Cheers Col

Tell him I spoke to Warren Weldon last week - he wasn't game to make any wise-cracks, as he up-ended a couple of 'early' Holdens! They used to break their rear axles, with nasty results!

Cheers, Greg

Hi

Richard at V Force has got a group buy price from Bond,

6 point bolt in cage $850
Extras like hip bars seat belt bars $120

Five people are needed to get this price.

1/2 cage prices to follow

Steve

that is very cheap
👍👍👍

Hi

Group buy price from Bond, for bolt in 1/2 cage $635

Five people are needed to get this price, I have 2 people wanting one now, we need 3 more.

Steve

1303 steve, I know that you might not be able to help but can you give us an Idea of the design of the 6 point cage?

and whether it is CAMS approved (i'm assuming yes but assumptions are the mother of all .....)

I'm actually heading out to see Bond tomorrow morning, so hopefully I can compare a quote for a built cage to the group buy

Hi

I'm not sure of the design of the 6 point cage, were only going 1/2 cage, they are CAMS approved.

What we want in the 1/2 cage is a hoop, 2 bars going back to the parcel area and diagonal going from the drivers head back to parcel tray, no cross brace as then you cant get the seat far enough back.

In most forms circuit motorsport if the car has rego it doesn't need cage at all, with ANDRA its needed below a certain ET.

Steve

ps, let us know about the prices

I think you will find the rear legs will go to the wheel arch and not the parcel shelf. In order to be CAMS approved the rear legs must be straight and can not mount to the parcel shelf or have a bend in them like the cages of old. The price quoted for the 6 point cage and side bars is the same price I paid for a 6 point cage for my old bug.

Hi

I meant to say the rear parcel area/wheel arch. The old cages used to go onto the panel below the rear window, you needed to slip the nuts in through the vents below the rear window.

Steve

Ok, so saw Allan today, the price for a full cage was $950, and $137.50 for either side bar or harness bar.

Was pretty happy with the quote, and he told me that his standard cage was a little bit different and couldn't quite work with my car, but for 68 up it would be fine.

To have the cage installed by him it takes 1 day, and $2500 or there abouts. If you want to bolt it in yourself he measures and cuts it all to size and then marks up on the body where to drill, and supplies all the high tensile bolts etc...

So there you go, I think i'm going to go with this quote, as I want the cage soon and can't wait for more people to buy. as well I get what I want and not a compromise,

it is a good point you make about the cage running diagonally behind the seats with moving the seat back, I hadn't thought of that but i'll need the flexibility!

Got in early and now have my (Bond) roll cage, It is a heap of heavy gauge tube at present, as I will be fitting it myself.

Allan and Peter were very helpful, and I am following their advice re. installation, mounting points, etc.

One important thing to factor into your valuations is ------How much do you value your neck❓

Cheers, Greg

has anyone got pic's of there cages from bond.
it is usually easier for people to make up there mind's after seeing the product.

westi wrote:has anyone got pic's of there cages from bond.
it is usually easier for people to make up there mind's after seeing the product.

my post on first page Westi.......all "bond" cages

orange car would be as per current, but can gather whole shape from all the pics i've put there

Sander and HappyDaze any chance you have pics that include your new setups...??? Pls

Awww, don't rush me - I'm still fitting/welding mine in.😂 Besides, while I'm busy working on the 'new' No. 8, I can't learn to do the 'pics' thing🤪

Cheers, Greg