Hi All I recently purchased this 61 which will look familiar to some of you, with the intention of giving it a new paint job, learning a bit about them and using it as semi daily drive.
After a rough trailer trip from Brisbane to Newcastle I noticed a crack in the passenger side sill. From there my game plan changed and I am leaning a lot very quickly.
I decided on a full body off restoration an the body is now off.
It needs a lot of rust repairs and so be it, my dillema is whether to repair the mods (guards&intakes) which was a look that attracted me to it in the first place or attempt to go back to original body?
My thought is that if I take it back to original it will cost me a fortune in panel replacement.So may be a better option to find another body that just needs rust repairs.
I change my mind daily on this at the moment but am thinking of working with what I have, reducing the front flares, leaving the rear flares and altering the shape of the air intakes to give it a bit of a 911 GT flavour whilst keeping it as tastefull as possible.
Any ides or opinions are appreciated.
L469 ·
looks like what a few of us suspected that looks like just a big bog job on the body i hope you didnt pay alot for it paint hides alot of horrors is that paper stuffed in the rust with bog on top?disgusting thats my opinion anyway try find another shell that looks like scrap
vw54 ·
I decided on a full body off restoration an the body is now off.
I would be chemically dipping this shell doors bonnet n engine lid and seeing what you have left
From the looks of it IT wont be much
After it comes out of the schemical strip u can decide what to do with theremains
its the only way to get ride of all the R U S T
L469 ·
why waste all that money on dipping that shell is too far gone you can see even on a couple of photos besides the paper mashe and bog and rust maybe you can save the swinging panels ? whats left of the shell maybe the roof if your lucky
karmann54 ·
In my eye the ghia body is pretty perfect the way it left the factory, but the world would be pretty boring if we were all the same.
It's pretty obvious it's going to take a lot of work to repair this shell. I would say it's not worth it if you were trying to go back to original, but if the flared/scoop look is what you like it's better to do it to this one than an unmodified one. That would still take a lot of work and it's one less on the road.
Did you brace the body before you took it off the pan, it doesn't look like it would have much torsional rigidity.
Whichever way you go it will keep you busy!
HappyDaze ·
vw54 wrote:
I decided on a full body off restoration an the body is now off.
I would be chemically dipping this shell doors bonnet n engine lid and seeing what you have left
From the looks of it IT wont be much
After it comes out of the schemical strip u can decide what to do with theremains
its the only way to get ride of all the R U S T
How long is it since you've had a 'dip' done, Dave?
With all that bog & rust, I woulld say it would cost over $3,000.🤪
L469 ·
dip it and make some tea with it vw tea expensive tea that cars a tea bag
vw54 ·
yeah it will be x pensive but better off starting with NO rust as to say
grumble ·
it is quite a while since I saw the old paper sills,promax bread in the plastic bags,old cardigans,sox,plastic bags with bog mixed on them etc forming sill panels,I thought those days were over unfortunately i was wwwwwrong!.i am sorry that you have to endure this just by buying a vehicle that you obviously wanted.I hope you can find a better body and continue.Good luck Les.
ashbaxter ·
So it's body hunting i'll be doing then.
Sides ·
Hmm, bummer... is it just the passenger side that's in this state, or driver's side as well ??? What's the rest of the body like ???
Finding another KG body that's in better condition could be difficult... you may actually be better of fixing this one, especially if you're keen on the flares and scoops.
Just a suggestion...
ashbaxter ·
Both sides are the same and there is rust all around. The roof is good 😵 so are the doors and boot.
ashbaxter ·
some more from the rust monster
L469 ·
i feel your pain got a dog like that years ago not a vw just an old ford but same toilet roll stuffed sills chicken wire cement and bog hope it didnt cost you an arm and a leg maybe you could get a good body from someone importing from the states maybe the aussie dollar will be in your favour you have a dash and bits to convert to rhd😵💫
chickenfillet ·
Hi Ash,
It looks like a bit of a mess but all these things are repairable and all the replacement panels are available so I would pick up the grinder and start cutting back until you get a nice solid metal. Then at least you will be able to work out if the repairs are within your budget and skills.
As for stripping, I have heard great things about the portable soda blasting machines. They are available for around the $200-250 mark and will rip off that old paint and bog in no time.
If you ever find yourself down in Sydney, you are more than welcome to come and have a look over my 68 to see how the factory put them together.
Good luck,
Kevin
AyeBee ·
Best of luck there Ash, certainly got some work ahead of you. I've had a similar experience (an old 63 XL Falcon), and I learnt a lot from that car despite turning out to be a dog. Whilst I'm guessing it's cost you a lot of money, I hope you learn from it what you're looking for.
ashbaxter ·
I agree, anything can be fixed but the labour cost may kill me.
Anyone know of people importing from the States?
L469 ·
dont remember the people possibly a member of the penrose family you say you are in newcastle?
ashbaxter ·
Yes in Newcastle
L469 ·
someone on central coast was bringing them in and converting them anyone out there on the forum got more info just dont remember enough to say who it was hope fully this post may jog someones memory
ashbaxter ·
cool, looks like Vics Bahn brings them in.
Has anyone dealt with them?
L469 ·
yes nice fellow good for a chat on anything vw his name also escaped me yes good thinking🙂
so sad to see so much damage. finding a dry ghia body at a bargain price will be hard. As others have said a US import may be the best option but then you have 2 ghias........ which makes your purchase a bit of a waste of money. I hope you didn't pay too much for it and that whoever sold it to you has trouble sleeping at night, unless of course they told you it was full of rust.
In the end it is still a ghia and modified or original they are a beautiful car, I've had mine for 24 yrs. Dave, (VW54) and Kevin are on the right track. I would at least invest another few hundred and get it soda blasted and then assess what panels you will need and work out the cost of this compared to buying a second ghia.
How handy are you with a mig? or do you have a good friend who can weld? If it has to go to a body shop then maybe buying a second ghia is the better option. So, in summary, get the paint and bog off and then do some comparison costing.
good luck with it. Lou
ashbaxter ·
Thanks all for the encouragement I will keep going with it and see what comes along
ashbaxter ·
No I don't weld there lies part of the problem
matberry ·
Yeah, pretty safe to say all ghia's have rust or have been repaired at some stage, it's thier poor design of the sills and guards. there are plenty of repair panels available. Not saying it's a easy job, but it can be done, and done well..IF..time or money or both permits.
vwsteve ·
nearly all unrestored ghias need new sills, spare wheel wells, headlight buckets and lower rear quarters/floors etc ash, i can honestly tell you ive fixed a lot of these ghias and a lot worse than this, if you buy another one you may end up in the same situation as like i said nearly all are like this unless you buy 1 for 20 - 30 thou, put new sills back on it and keep going, at least you know it will be done right.
matberry ·
vwsteve wrote:nearly all unrestored ghias need new sills, spare wheel wells, headlight buckets and lower rear quarters/floors etc ash, i can honestly tell you ive fixed a lot of these ghias and a lot worse than this, if you buy another one you may end up in the same situation as like i said nearly all are like this unless you buy 1 for 20 - 30 thou, put new sills back on it and keep going, at least you know it will be done right.
x2
Joel ·
I remember looking over this thing last year at dubs by the pub thinking it's probably like that underneath.
but I wouldnt give up on it though, replacement panels are easy to get hold of you just need to find a good welder.
I've seen alot worse than this brought back from the dead.
KGs especially early ones aint exactly falling off trees.
ashbaxter ·
I started this post for some advice and opinions and so far it confirms what I was thinking, keep going and finish what I have started.
The replies are much appreciated although some a bit off topic in regards to my purchase which was not my intent.
Would you agree that rust repairs aside, staying with the flares and scoops is the way to go as trying to remove them would result in replacing just about every panel anyway.
Obviously not one for the purists out there but it would be unique wouldn't it? I haven't seen another like it.
vwsteve ·
yes ash, stay with the flares and scoops otherwise you will have a huge job on your hands in my opinion and you would have been better off buying an original then, some hate the flares,some love them, at the end of the day its what you want not others,if you keep it small and put new sills in then with a bit of labour you can have it back on the road a lot sooner,just my opinion.
lou0060 ·
agree with ya Steve, not many custom ghias out there and done right they look great as they have excellent lines to start with. Ash, you said you bought the Ghia for its modified looks so stay with what your gut tells you, nice flares, scoop that leads somewhere, (not just a hole in the side) and some sick wheels and you'll stand out from the crowd.... go for it I say.
Wannavee ·
Stick with what you want mate.
If ya bought it for the flares,great. Its not my cup of tea,but thats just my opinion.
My custom Ghia thats for sale now appeals to those who are'nt that hung up on OG Ghia's.It looks standard,but is missing some minor chrome trim bits etc
Thats cool,each to their own
What I will say,is that you have a big job ahead,and bodywork can cost a mint to get right.
I doubt it will be a cheap and easy fix too
twoguns ·
mate... rough to see this. there are many vw enthusiasts on the central coast and i am sure you will find support, info and assistance. good luck with it. there are many of us that have had this kind of experience at some stage too.
always amazed that there are so many experienced dubbers in this world, with many cars, or past cars and knowledge and first hand dealings, but still some claim they can not see the underlying condition of some cars.
tintin ·
Poor ash - you got ripped there mate - buy another karman ghia and use it as a sacrifical car - you best learn how to weld - it isnt that hard you could learn it in 2 - 3 hours - tack welding and grinding and patience will see a lengthy result here.
VW Steve - - best laid plans of BOG and paper WTF ?????? edited by barls to remove inappropriate language
vwsteve ·
tin tin, the bodywork was not done by me, i bought the car as it was years ago and drove it for a few years as is, the previous owner organised the bodywork so if someone wants to bag them then go for it but most panel shops will only do what someone instructs them to do, from memory the name of the panel shop was in amongst all the reciepts supplied with the car so please keep the smart remarks to yourself if you dont know the story, i pointed out there was fibreglass in the spare wheel well so i was honest with the condition of the car before sale, i did not put a grinder into it so who was to know what someone did to the sills beforehand.This is just typical for a kg, nearly all of the kgs on the road would have bog in them, it all depends on what someone has done to it previously, these cars are not new anymore and are prone to rust.Good luck finding a kg in mint condition for a low price.
its people who dont know anything about these cars like l469 which make this situation worse than it is, its a typical sill replacement on a kg job, plain and fairly simple if someone knows how to weld, otherwise pay a restorer to weld them in and ash may be able to finnish it off himself after that, i personally have restored a few of these and a lot wosre than this, i once restored 1 which was in 3 separate pieces after i put a grinder on to it.
I hope none of you are planning on buying a 356 porsche 1 day as that is a whole new kettle of fish again!
If restoring a karmann ghia is too much for people then stick to a new commodore or falcon.
L469 ·
who doesnt no about these cars ? i have been in the trade 23 years around vw s all my life 😂
tintin ·
Hey vw steve - obviously you are coping some heat here - there is plenty of cliches apply here - buyer beware - hind sight. (it is fun for every one else but) Chin up bro it will soon pass.
Thanks burls for ur editing except I am not sure what u edited mate as it was the exact post - Hey but whatever gets you thru, right?
Ash - there is always someone or some situation worse than yours - watch the you tube clip and follow this guy he is funny as - especially the clown scenes and it should help you out enormously - armed with know how everything is easy.
iWelding is simple as - get one of these t will do everything and will set u back about 1k. it is 15amp but grind the earth pin to fit into a normal 10amp electrical female plug and the low amp setting say 80 - 100 amps you will need will never blow a fuse wire at this low setting.
Good luck mate - Steve is right - sill repairs are very simple and fun as is all of the body work
Regards Gavin
Lucky Phil ·
Hey Ash - I would stick with the flares and scoops. That's what attracted you to the car in the first place I'll bet.
If the body is too big a hill to climb right now just put it to one side. There's still plenty to do. Pan, suspension, brakes, gearbox etc.
A decent MIG welder isn't that dear these days. Using it isn't all that hard.
Iv'e always let a project take on a life of it's own. Let the car tell you what it wants.
If you get stuck, do what you want to do rather than what you think you should do. It's all about having fun after all.
ashbaxter ·
Thanks guys for the positive advice project underway and looking forward to creating something a little original
vlad01 ·
going back to the chemical dipping, Minus Paint in SA is apparently the best place in Australia and i read on a review of them which was written 10 years ago the price is about 750 - 1000 for most cars. Don't know how
much it would cost how.
My real concern is who offers E-coating (aka EDP or Electrophoretic Deposition painting)
its basically how they treat and primer cars these days which coats them inside out in every nook and cranny with rust and chemical resistant paint
Making them virtually rust proof.
volma1 ·
Can anyone say what a good body is worth, I mean completely rust free as I have an almost complete 61 car that I may sell. Has only one issue that is prev owner put type3 gearbox incl longer axles and shafts, therefore the tyres scrub. volma1
volma1 ·
Forgot to say the body was restored and painted approx 15 years ago and is still as good apart from some shed scratches(no dents) as I bought it 13 years back. volma1
Will try to get some pics in the next few weeks but have some rear shots in the shed that are oversize that I can email to any interested persons.
Newt ·
Go do an evening course at your local tafe / high school to learn how to weld.
Theres other things to do while you learn about welding.
Newt
ashbaxter ·
Wasn't sure whether to start a new post or continue on, but I will continue on.
Firstly a progress update, body is off the pan and the new floor pans will be welded in soon and that part is going along well.
Now for the body. The body has been 90% blasted, it aint pretty and based on estimates from a shop to do the work and my lack of welding ability and lack of time to learn to weld I am on the hunt for another body.
If anyone has anything available I am more than interested to check it out.
bajachris88 ·
You can do it ash!
I bought a $550 gasless mig 4 years ago and taught myself to weld. I had to replace my whole a pillar and couldn't afford a new body or someone else to repair it. If u do a mistake you can always grind it out again. It worked for me, and the cars solid as a rock.
Just have to make sure you weld braces to sections before you cut out rotten panels to make sure things align properly and take note of positioning etc. etc.
lou0060 ·
hi Ash,
noted the car is up for sale. At least the new owner knows what he is getting. Have you found a new body?
Wannavee ·
Shame to see it mate
Hope it doesnt discourage you from moving forward with a VW in the future
ashbaxter ·
If I can come out of this without too much of a loss I will get something with the body repairs already done,even if i have to paint it the colour I want.
Not turned off though I now know exactly what I,m looking at.
I see one for sale in toowoomba (yet another yellow one) does anyone know this car?
ashbaxter ·
Sorry not on carsales it's on eBay
volma1 ·
Am going to post this 61 ghia soon for sale. volma1
volma1 ·
another pic volma1
vlad01 ·
shit that's nice👍
scot70wagon ·
so Ash did you buy this one ?
ashbaxter ·
Yes I did, it's even the colour I wanted. Just need to get it home and get started.
vlad01 ·
ashbaxter wrote:cool, looks like Vics Bahn brings them in.
Has anyone dealt with them?
yes, Vinko is awesome, i got heaps of NOS type 3 parts from him and he tells me he has very few part in the type 3 area.
So that is just saying he has plenty of KG parts. 😂 NOS as well.