2.7L

Hello all,

Well, i'm procrastinating extremely hard from Uni study at the moment and have been pondering my 'dream' engine. Yes, 2.7L is the desired displacement - why?

because it is way more than enough, because I want 2.7L, because lots of people say I shouldn't and lots of people say it's hard and expensive. Which of course I have no doubt is totally correct. But, my point is - let me dream, let us all dream (procrastinate) and see if we can do it. I'm sure there will be a few, "2276's go well in a beetle - all you need". I'm sure they do go well and hey, probs will end up building on of them instead one day. But I dare to go a biit further in my procrastination. Yes there are problems with rego etc etc - but these can be over come one way or another.

Ok so a few things:

engine in the back of a beetle
type 4 engine / (brings me to my first question)
naturally aspirated
lets say on the 1/4 mile - as close to 10s as possible... (11's sweet as, you know... i'm not too fussed as long as its suprisingly fast)
Limited use on the road - but driveable on the road, mainly a weekend fun car / scare the crap out of people occasionaly (sleeper) / powercrusier?

Lets say i'm happy to buy expensive bits atm and money is no problem. (which it is, but this is dreaming remember)

Q1) Case? Used type 4 case rebuilt? (guessing nah?)
Scat? (can you use type 4 style bits in these?)
Pauter? (you have to buy pauter heads then right?)

I'm guessing, and answering my own question here to a degree, but better off with an engine of this size etc to buy a brand new case?

Lets just leave it at that for the moment! Enjoy dreaming! Please just tell yourself 'this kid is crazy it will never work' then type something that is remotely helpfull if possible?? haha 🙂

I'm looking to learn alot here, feel free to critisize I guess, its your right, but I like positive people...... and... I should really stop procrastination and go do some study!!!

So thanks in advance, have a bit of fun with this, happy to asnwer anymore q's that would help the dreaming continue!

p.s I'm drawing some inspiration from these guys

http://www.boxergasse.com/html/slalom.html - check out the slalom section!

check this

annnnd this http://www.boxergasse.com/html/street_race.html (google translate is your friend)

hope some people find this interesting 🙂

Cheers

Josh

I've been going to start a Procrastinators Club for years. Maybe next year?

Just remember............Never put off until tomorrow, what you can put off until the day after!😉

give richard at vforce a ring. they raced a 2.7 at the nationals and are also building a scary fi turbo version.

I like that quote happy daze!

Barls. Was that the lime green one? If so I think I've seen it on you tube. Epic

thats their green one on youtube
its the motor out of the lime green one thats in the yellow one that they are racing atm. the green one has undergone a complete reincarnation into a complete track machine. 2.7L fi turbo last time i looked and will be truly something to see on the track when its finished.

x2 with the richard call. Call him He loves talking about where the type 4 can lead.

rod penrose has a 2.8ltr type 4 injected sitting on his workshop floor 🙂

Will you be build the engine your self, if you are competent you will save a lot of money, the only limiting factor with things like this is your wallet.

I've seen a street bug with a 3.1L type4 in it, that would scare alot of people.

What model bug is this going in?
would be worth sussing out the ADRs
I know with mine that fits into the 73 onwards ADRs I can go 3L N/A or 2.2 turbo.
beyond that it starts needing crap like ABS and TCS etc
Dunno how much different QLD is but it wouldn't be too far off NSW.

A tranny to handle that much power will be your big problem.

my friend has a 2.7 t4...150 whp,low comp and only 44 idfs.....put some 48's or so and bump the comp up.....ooh yeah.....very tough engine.........home ported heads, non welded...

10-11 sec 1/4's ,good luck.....you need more then just a donk to get those times also a lot of $$$$$$$..... but dreaming is always good too....

good luck....

Thanks for the replies everyone. Loving it. Keep em coming. Yes would like to build the core myself. And Joel haven't considered what model. But not really fussy. 1303s would be nice. But whatever i can get away with Yes tranny is another expense I'd have to take into account. I'm guessing around say 10g for tranny?

My engine would be efi too...

Joel wrote:I've seen a street bug with a 3.1L type4 in it, that would scare alot of people.

What model bug is this going in?
would be worth sussing out the ADRs
I know with mine that fits into the 73 onwards ADRs I can go 3L N/A or 2.2 turbo.
beyond that it starts needing crap like ABS and TCS etc
Dunno how much different QLD is but it wouldn't be too far off NSW.

A tranny to handle that much power will be your big problem.

are you talking about Jake's blubonic plague? or was that 3.0L?

yes that car is scary as 🤪

Air cooled 2.7 ltr? this one fits in a bug.

Hi Carter,

Plenty of information here: http://www.aircooledtechnology.com.

hey Zayus, i'm a member of that forum.. have had brief searches and what not but not really come across to much info that i'm after - i'm sure I will if I look harder.

I know there are alot of experts on this forum too and I value thier inputs!

Cheers again!

vlad01 wrote:

Joel wrote:I've seen a street bug with a 3.1L type4 in it, that would scare alot of people.

What model bug is this going in?
would be worth sussing out the ADRs
I know with mine that fits into the 73 onwards ADRs I can go 3L N/A or 2.2 turbo.
beyond that it starts needing crap like ABS and TCS etc
Dunno how much different QLD is but it wouldn't be too far off NSW.

A tranny to handle that much power will be your big problem.

are you talking about Jake's blubonic plague? or was that 3.0L?

yes that car is scary as 🤪

This was about 15 years ago, I don't think it was anything to do with Jake, was definatley 3.1L though

VolksVair wrote:Air cooled 2.7 ltr? this one fits in a bug.

You ever seen a Bug corvair conversion? it's more like making the bug fit the engine.
Alot of bodywork needed to fit it and cover it up.
or just let it all hang out 😂

Epic pics Joel. Could have bought a covair engine a few months ago but had no money! Well I bought a 2nd hand 1800 instead for cheap.

Brings me back though, what do you all think would a type 4 case obviously tidied up. Line bored etc everything that needs being done be ok?? There are such Dutch dudes running a 2666 on what looks like a type 4 case but with a lot of oil filter and cooler adapters which would be a must obviously...

Carter wrote:Epic pics Joel. Could have bought a covair engine a few months ago but had no money! Well I bought a 2nd hand 1800 instead for cheap.

Brings me back though, what do you all think would a type 4 case obviously tidied up. Line bored etc everything that needs being done be ok?? There are such Dutch dudes running a 2666 on what looks like a type 4 case but with a lot of oil filter and cooler adapters which would be a must obviously...

DUTCH DUDES! You should reed some of the replies made.
Mitchell

Huh? Haha...

Hey Carter Dude,I had a dream and ended up with a 2733 fuel injected Type 4 in my Oval Bug.

I like it man 2733 what bore and stroke is that? Fuel injected and large! Love it.

Talking of dreaming.........2980 EFI.......


I bought an ex off road race motor, definately a way to save some bucks.

Hey, they dont stick out that much, have a look at mates bug, oh and if there is something strange lookin about the body, well, he cut 8 inches out of the centre of the bug http://i901.photobucket.com/albums/ac219/fishermanfrank5/trike032.jpg

Mr Remmele seems to know a few things about Type IV monsters....

This is all very exciting. Matt 2980 far out. Any hp or kw figures? Im sure it was more torquey than anything for offload?

Yes remmelle does make some incredible engines and cars!! So sexy!

Ok next q all. Do pauter heads only fit pauter case?

And do remmelle heads fit stock type 4 cases?

Do engine plus heads fit stock type 4 cases?

Please feel free to dish out any knowlede about these heads and your advice!!

There are sone new heads in development from NZ for the type 4. terra head I think it's called??

Anyways let me know what you all think the best head is out there (limit dirty jokes)

matberry wrote:Talking of dreaming.........2980 EFI.......


I bought an ex off road race motor, definately a way to save some bucks.

my dream is/was 2.9L efi, dfi, nickies, twin plug and roller cam.

Looks like Raby is doing to discontinue all but one size, 2270!

his plans are not final yet but if most likely will have efi, dfi, nickies and roller cam anyway on this 2270, it will just have to be mild turbo to reach my target torque and power😢

awwh, I really liked the idea of a NA 2.9L making over 250ft-lb of torque at 4000rpm and 284hp at 6000rpm.

Doesn't hurt to dream! 🙂

My Brother runs a 2.5L EFI type IV in his Baja. Great fun both on and off the road. It has been in the car now for years and has not missed a beat.

He has just started collecting parts for a similar motor to put into his Bay window Kombi. He hasn't finalised the details yet, however we have ordered the ECU so I know it will be EFI'ed!

R 🙂

There is a 2.7 ltr flat 6 subaru engine for sale on ebay atm. was going to be used for a vw. Apparently in good working order. 👍

Nah vw only. Too easy to do an engine conversion

Slash vw has the shock factor that gains cred. Any suby engine can go fast but a big vw is a bit harder

bajachris88 wrote:There is a 2.7 ltr flat 6 subaru engine for sale on ebay atm. was going to be used for a vw. Apparently in good working order. 👍

You wouldn't bother putting an ER27 in a bug, they're a big clunky heavy engine that makes less power and torque than an EJ25 and need a crapload of body work to fit unlike an EJ25

Parts might be an issue as they weren't sold here although they really are just an EA82 with 2 extra cylinders tacked on, same as the EG33 is just an EJ22 with 2 extra cylinders.

Nah vw only for me! See previous post for reasoning.


So any ideas on heads? Refer to first page

Carter wrote:Nah vw only. Too easy to do an engine conversion

👍 👍

Like the way your thinking.

My engine uses big valve 914 heads and as you said it's more torque than hp. As for numbers, we'll have to wait until saturday, Dynomania.

People are right regarding tranny issues. Minimum on the street IMO would be an albins equipped 091 bus trans....$$$$

Carter wrote:This is all very exciting. Matt 2980 far out. Any hp or kw figures? Im sure it was more torquey than anything for offload?

Yes remmelle does make some incredible engines and cars!! So sexy!

Ok next q all. Do pauter heads only fit pauter case?

And do remmelle heads fit stock type 4 cases?

Do engine plus heads fit stock type 4 cases?

Please feel free to dish out any knowlede about these heads and your advice!!

There are sone new heads in development from NZ for the type 4. terra head I think it's called??

Anyways let me know what you all think the best head is out there (limit dirty jokes)

Wow Matt,
2980 means it must be a tight squeeze in there
with an 86 crank and 105 bore?

Carter,
Pauter heads are available in a few different stud patterns in type 1
and the casting can be machined for the type 4 engine.
Rod Penrose has one in stock I think.

Don Pauter runs them in his street Ghia,
but there are probably better choices if you want cooling and type 4.
Type 4 is going to the most affordable way to get 2700cc,
since you can fit the 105 bores in there pretty easily.(78 stroke)

Type one is going to need aftermarket case
to get the studs out far enough
to make the big bores work.

Another option is the water boxer case,
which has the larger head-stud pattern,
and can fit as big as 103 if you are handy with a milling machine.
(105 if you are sneaky).

I fitted a 90mm crank into a wasser,
but just like the type 4, and the cam lobe being close
to large stroke cranks,
the water boxer,(and all type1's) usually sacrifice some lobe size when a large stroke(86 plus) is crammed in there.

Woohoo dangerous. Your drag engine has been an inspiration. I know I'm not going to come close to that though haha.

Id definitely be going type 4. I've got two cases both are obviously out of heavy kombis. Is that going to present an issue with longevity? It'd be very handy to use the type 4 case. Those Dutch blokes from boxergasse look as though they do... But if it were to be an issue id rather spend more money on a new case bi just don't know what would be best.

What heads would you suggest for 2.7 type 4 going for kw over street drivability yet still being able to be driven on the street but not often. If that makes sense haha. Engine plus??


Another quick question. Who's best for engine case work prefferably in qld... Leons motors do it but um... Yeah. Let's just say I'd take it to them if there weren't any other options. No offense to them haha

Type 4 case is the way to go, Crankshaft Engineering are the guy's to see BUT, having said that, they don't do thier own tunnel boring, and I've had some issues with the local guy's in that area. A recent build, 2840, the case was prepped for 5th head stud and they rooted it. So for a replacement, I went straight to the guy's with probably the most experience in big type 4's on the planet, FAT Performance. I can source for you or go direct. They have been easy to deal with and do excellent work. One major consideration is not all type 4 bearing sizes are available, therefore the final dimensions are aimed at but bearings must be sourced before final machine work carried out.

Those Engine plus heads look the biz, but I haven't used them, although I have a client planning that route.....

Matt much appreciated. FAT hey. Vaguely recall hearing about them. I'll look into that option for sure. Yeah they look pretty decent. I've also been in touch with Jake rabys head guy Len Hoffman. He said forget stock castings with 2.7 and look at engine plus heads. Apparently he's a guru so they must be alright.

Matberry-I have just bought a spare set of .50X.25 bearings from Custom and Speed Parts in Germany and they claim to have all sizes in stock again.They are Mahle Original,and I think they were about $120 delivered.

Gary, won't you have to get your motor running, then wear it out, before you need those ❓

Cheers, Greg

Anyone else have any opinions on heads?

HappyDaze wrote:Gary, won't you have to get your motor running, then wear it out, before you need those ❓

Cheers, Greg

--Good call Greg-actually when I stuffed one of my new bearing shells,I was trying everywhere for a new set,but all the normal places were out of stock.I found a set in the US from a VW collector,and the German crowd were out of stock,and were expecting some soon.So I bought from both,but the German ones only arrived recently.The engine has been together for months- still no smoke-so still no wear on the bearings.