I'm working through the list of jobs on 'Sonny' and now have several partially completed while I await the arrival of parts. So I did the next best thing and moved onto the next job, fit new distributor.
I went with a Bosch style distributor with vacuum advance, replacing one without the vacuum advance. Carefully following the 'How To Keep Your VW Alive" and Bentley guides I did the alignments; pulley TDC with crankcase split, rotor with cylinder and also did the 'pencil' test to be sure. I then removed the old distributor. I also checked the slot in the distributor drive all was as it should be.
In fitting the new dizzy I could only get it seated properly with the rotor at about the '2 o'clock' mark. Have I stuffed something up? I'm not willing to try and fire it up until I at least get a second opinion!!
Seeing as I was stuck on that job I did the usual thing ... and moved onto the next job. Oil pressure light and reversing light, who would have though they would be linked. Previous owner had cut both of them, go figure. Successfully traced the oils pressure light wiring and have that reconnected and working, still struggling with the reversing lights. So ... on to the next job.
Indicators work on hazard light, do not work as indicators. I'm figuring its a switch issue, not a relay? So ... on to the next job.
Tail lights work on low beam and go off on hight beam. No idea, where do I start?
There's not a lot of room under a Beetle for a big bloke, need to install a hoist 馃槈
cb john 路
1.If TDC is correctly set, whereever the rotor points, there is your No.1 cylinder, just change HT cables..
2.Reverse switch is on the nosecone of the gearbox.It should have no relationship with the oil pressure warning light,
check the wiring and the fuse.
3.if the hazard indicators work and indicators do not, check, if the wire termination on the light switch is correct.
NewBug 路
I think you have the wrong cylinder at TDC. Ensure Cylinder 1 is at TDC, sounds to me the number 2 cylinder is at TDC.
zocstar 路
And it is on compression stroke.
pod 路
i,m with CB john on no.1,and reverse lights usually power up from the coil,well they do in my bus and i dont think VW would have changed it that much in a bug
68AutoBug 路
If You used a pencil to find the TDC on number one then that is where it is..
just put the HT lead for number one there.. 1432..
that rotor looks extremely large or is it just the camera..???
if its all correct then Your engine should fire...
if its not right.. then no go or misfire...
if You have reverse lights then the switch should be on the nose of the gearbox...
if it came with reverse lights..
fuse was in the engine bay I believe..??
seems your blinker switch isn't working correctly or a wire is disconnected...
all the blinker wires go to the hazard light switch...
so, they all connected there ok...
Lee
Joel 路
NewBug wrote:I think you have the wrong cylinder at TDC. Ensure Cylinder 1 is at TDC, sounds to me the number 2 cylinder is at TDC.
Won't be #2 as the TDC wont line up on the pulley, only 1 and 3 do.
It all depends how the person who installed the distributor drive positioned it.
The earlier bugs are at 12:00 or 90degrees to the case joint at #1 TDC (small segment to pulley if I remember rightly) but later twin port engines need to be more about 2:00 so the condenser cleared the fuel pump.
But where ever it ends up as long as the #1 is at TDC and the rotor will line up with #1 notch in the dissy you need to static time it at 7.5btdc from there.
Uber Kafer 路
as for general wiring issues on vee dubs, if you are having problems that are intermittent / weird / doing your head in, I strongly recommend several steps.
Get a decent crimping tool for insulated crimp lugs, they are the ones colour coded red for small wires ( most of the 12 volt vee dub wires ), blue for mid sized wires ( most of the 6 volt vee dub wires ), and yellow for battery, alternator, generator sized wire. Dont get the crimp tool that pierces or penetrates the insulated lug, get the one that compresses it into a hex shape or rounded shape. Disconnect the battery and check EVERY wire, and re-lug if the original lug is looking loose, corroded or skanky in any way.
Next step, check the fuse box to see if the spring loaded tabs at each end of the fuse have lost their mojo and arent doing the spring-tension-thing to hold the fuse in. Replace any fuses that look like the tab has worn a massive groove in the ends. Check the fuse size against the correct wiring diagram.
Next, check every earth/chassis connection, unscrew it, clean it and re-tighten. That includes the large strap between the gearbox nose and the left gearbox horn.
Hopefully that work will fix some or all of your electrical problems.
psimitar 路
To triple check #1 is at TDC you can take the rocker cover off and check that both valves for #1 are shut.
As for wiring the reverse light is powered for the coil positive. As for connectors buy the proper brass uninsulated and learn to crimp them properly. As an electrical engineer I can tell you that the insulated ones are pretty gay as the ali connector doesn't indent in the middle so they never properly grip the wire. Once you've used a proper uninsulted connector you'll see what I mean.
TorxKiwi 路
Thanks for the advice all. I now have a suitable excuse to go tool shopping ....... Again 馃槈
psimitar wrote:To triple check #1 is at TDC you can take the rocker cover off and check that both valves for #1 are shut.
As for wiring the reverse light is powered for the coil positive. As for connectors buy the proper brass uninsulated and learn to crimp them properly. As an electrical engineer I can tell you that the insulated ones are pretty gay as the ali connector doesn't indent in the middle so they never properly grip the wire. Once you've used a proper uninsulted connector you'll see what I mean.
As an electrical engineer can you please explain why if insulated crimps are so 'gay' why does all of industry specify them for ALL electrical connections up to 6mm wire size? Yes, the brass uninsulated lugs are a direct replacement but insulated crimps with the correct crimper are an option that is accessible to most people, and very reliable.
psimitar 路
Uber Kafer wrote:
psimitar wrote:To triple check #1 is at TDC you can take the rocker cover off and check that both valves for #1 are shut.
As for wiring the reverse light is powered for the coil positive. As for connectors buy the proper brass uninsulated and learn to crimp them properly. As an electrical engineer I can tell you that the insulated ones are pretty gay as the ali connector doesn't indent in the middle so they never properly grip the wire. Once you've used a proper uninsulted connector you'll see what I mean.
As an electrical engineer can you please explain why if insulated crimps are so 'gay' why does all of industry specify them for ALL electrical connections up to 6mm wire size? Yes, the brass uninsulated lugs are a direct replacement but insulated crimps with the correct crimper are an option that is accessible to most people, and very reliable.
Hmm, without a pic it;s hard to explain but with either connector you have a gap at which the terminal wraps around the wire and is shown as a split in the connector. Now with an uninsulated connector this split gets folded inwards and causes the connector to grip the wire in a much better mechanical fashion than the insulated connector as this just crushes on the circumference of the connector. Now with a true 6 point crimper this will correctly compress the connector around the wire but your cheap 2 jaw crimper will only compressor on the top and bottom and beleive me that over time this is a poor joint. These can fail within months if used frequently as the wire is not clamped at a sufficient pressure to ensure longeviety.
Uninsulated connectors require the installer to crimp the connector into the wire and hence gives a far greater clamping pressure. I have tried insulated, even with central compression, and they are far inferior to a properly seated uninsulated connector.
For most they seem fine bt believe me, over time they are crap compared to uninsulated. A 50 yr old uninsulated crimp connection can still hold up a decent fight compared to a 3month old insulated crimp.
These modern connections are designed for lazy people and a quick fix. Schol connectors were popular in the 90 for lazy people as you could break into a wire without cutting it yet now these are banned as a function connection in the UK and most other European countries.
Oh and don't forget that a majority of standards are passed by politicians and other technically twatish people with no actual engineering capability whatsoever. Ease over writes correctness.
Uber Kafer 路
Lengthy answer....impressive... but still doesnt answer my question.
If insulated crimp lugs, crimped with the proper ratcheting crimper, are so 'gay' why are they specified by everyone in industry?
Are you telling me that everyone I have worked for in the onshore and offshore Oil & Gas Industry, Power/Energy Generation and Transmission industry, etc, for the last 30 years, in Australia and overseas, has got it wrong ??
I never mentioned standards, but I am talking about client/project specifications based on 'best practice' and reliability. Surely Chevron, Shell, Woodside, et al, havent got it horribly wrong with the manner in which they install and maintain there complex Process Control Systems, Emergency Shut Down systems, Fire Detection systems... ???
I dont want this to turn into a pi$$ing contest but lets try and give VW enthusiasts some good practical advice to help solve common 'old car' problems using readily available tools and replacement parts.
TorxKiwi 路
Well that was fun 馃槈
How about you all come over, have a crimping contest and get my lights working for me? I'll provide the beer and referee the pi##ing competition.
The car isn't going anywhere at the moment as it's awaiting brake parts from Classic Veedub. It could go, it just wouldn't stop.
AA003 路
If you're looking for sensible then Aussieveedubbers is not for you.
TorxKiwi 路
Sensible is boring ....... the beer for lighting offer stands.
helbus 路
Are the blinker and hazard operated off separate relays?
AA003 路
helbus wrote:Are the blinker and hazard operated off separate relays?
No
psimitar 路
If I was nearby I would come and help.
As for the insulated, each to there own. I prefer the uninsulated and if i had the crimper for bootlace connectors then they work great too but the insulated are crap IMO.
Engineers dont make the standards they just offer advice to politicians and the politician uses the easiest method for pure cant be arsed-ness but thats another issue entirely 馃檪
TorxKiwi 路
Ok. So I thought I'd have a decent crack at the wiring issue this afternoon and all I succeeded in doing was opening another can of worms and becoming increasingly confused.
Attached is a sample of wiring that I found behind the dash. There seem to be an awful lot of loose ends in the system and clearly some wires have shorted in the past and rather than resolve and remove the PO has just left the molten mess there. Anyway, can anyone help me out with the connections on the back of a '75 L Bug rocker style light switch.
Photos attached.....
Red to Fuse #2
Red/Grey to Speedometer Light
Black/Yellow to Fuse 10
Black/White to relay
I have two blank terminals, should they be connected, if so what to? I'd hazard a guess that this has something to do with my park lights not working ... and yes Black/White with exposed copper will be replaced.
psimitar 路
AA003 wrote:
psimitar wrote:if i had the crimper for bootlace connectors
Is that like an aglet? I thought that we were talking about electrical connections.
Engineers dont make the standards they just offer advice to politicians and the politician uses the easiest method for pure cant be arsed-ness but thats another issue entirely 馃檪
Politicians have nothing at all to do at all with Australian Standards. When AS3000 is updated it is all done by engineers.
And you just had to respond to be right.
As for the OP, give us a list of what's playin up and we'll see if we can work thro it.
TorxKiwi 路
Current situation is -
1. Headlight switch to first position, nothing happens, no park lights, no tail lights, no license plate light.
2. Headlight switch to second position. Headlights on low beam, tail lights on, license plate light on.
3. Flick lights to high beam, headlights on high beam, dash high beam indicator on, tail lights off, license plate light off.
AA003 路
Headlight switch connections.
30 Red (Battery + from fuse box) Live always
x Black/Yellow (Ignition switch +) Live with ignition on
56 White/black (to dimmer relay) Live with ignition on position 2
58 Grey (to park lights fuse 1 & 2) Live position 1 & 2
58b Grey/red (to speedo lights) Live position 1 & 2
TorxKiwi 路
Thanks, makes sense. Any idea which fuse the red should connect to? I found one end of the burnt out cable on about position 10 I think ...... I'm not at home at the minute so can't check.
psimitar 路
Go to the tech articles on thesamba.com they have wiring diagrams that for the most part will be fine for Oz. 30 is a direct feed from the regulator to battery connection. It should also feed onwards to the ignition switch term 30. If it's been messed with this maybe the other way round but that won't hurt anything.
AA003 路
The red is unfused. It should join the top of the fuse box around fuse 9 if my seppo diagram is correct. There will be another red there going to the ignition switch.
AA003 路
psimitar wrote:30 is a direct feed from the regulator to battery connection.
It's a '75 (alternator) No number 30 to the regulator.
TorxKiwi 路
Should I be using 10, 25 or other ampage cable?
AA003 路
Doesn't really matter for the red as the original is only 1.5mm (I don't know what that is in Australian bogan sizes)
Thicker is better.
The red is only for the park lights so it's probably only around 5 amps.
Do you know what caused the meltdown?
It might be worth doing a temporary connection with an in line fuse first in case there is another problem.
TorxKiwi 路
Not a clue what the cause was, it doesn't appear recent. I'll throw a fuse in to be safe. .
TorxKiwi 路
Ok. As a result of all the advice and assistance I now have functional head/tail lights, thanks all.
Next electrical problem. Hazards work, indicators and wipers do not. Indicator switch needs replacing or something simpler?
AA003 路
Check fuse 10 & 12 first.
Is there anything else, brake lights, fuel guage etc
TorxKiwi 路
Fuses 10 & 12 are good. Fuel gauge is good. Not sure about brake lights, I am waiting for a replacement brake line to arrive so don't have a complete circuit. I assume that it needs the pressure of a complete circuit to activate the switch?
psimitar 路
Have you downloaded the samba diagram to assist you trace things?
If hazards work all 4 corners then tis something to do with the switch. Find the black/green/white wire going into the switch and jumper it to the battery with a 5amp inline fuse to the battery. Now try each direction on the switch and if no light permanently then switch is dead or left/right wires from switch aren't connected. If does work then feed from flashed relay to switch is faulty.
TorxKiwi 路
I have both a test lamp and a multimeter.
vwo60 路
Purchase the correct manual for your car with the apropriate wiring diaghram.
TorxKiwi 路
I've downloaded the wiring diagram from The Samba and also have the Bentley handbook. The bulk of the wiring appears to match the diagrams but there have been quite a few modifications, not all great. I was really just seeking confirmation of where it is most likely that the failure is occurring so that I start looking there.
AA003 路
vwo60 wrote:Purchase the correct manual for your car with the apropriate wiring diaghram.
Easier said than done.
AA003 路
Pick a suitable earth for your test lamp/meter.
Put ignition on
Put positive side to fuse 12
Should light.
Put positive side to terminal 15 on hazzard switch Green
Should light
Put + side to term 49 on hazzard switch White (off position)
Should light
Put + side to term 49 on flasher relay White
Should light
Put + side to term 49a on flasher relay Blue (blinkers off)
Should light
Try the same for 49a on the hazzard switch Blue and Black/green/white.
TorxKiwi 路
Ran the recommended routine with the test lamp, light activated on all. Switch?
AA003 路
Put + side to term L on hazzard switch Black/White (off position)
Blinker switch Left, Ignition on
Should light
Put + side to term R on hazzard switch Black/Green (off position)
Blinker switch Right, Ignition on
Should light
TorxKiwi 路
Okay, progress and again it's a result of all the assistance, thanks again all. Better still I more or less understand what I was attempting to do, rather than just monkey see monkey do, so I learnt something in the process.
Jumped the connections in the socket that the turn signal switch group plug connects to. Successfully activated the horn, dipped headlights, activated left and right indicators and they flashed. Which I guess confirms that the switch is faulty.
Anyone got a spare for sale? How much should I expect to pay?
Lucky Phil 路
TorxKiwi wrote:Fuses 10 & 12 are good. Fuel gauge is good. Not sure about brake lights, I am waiting for a replacement brake line to arrive so don't have a complete circuit. I assume that it needs the pressure of a complete circuit to activate the switch?
Just bridge the terminals at the switch.
psimitar 路
If you have trouble sourcing the part in Oz give MegaBug in the UK a go. Used to be well stocked with working secondhand parts. Don't see why $30 won't get you a second hand one.
Okay. Took Sonny in for his roadworthy thinking I'd taken care of everything, how stupid was I.
1. Indicators are flashing at too fast a rate. Checked bulbs all are 12V 21W. I have wired in side mounted LED flashers which I have disconnected. Still flashing too quickly, as though a bulb is out. Same deal when using hazards. Could it be the relay?
2. Park lights aren't coming on, headlights go to low beam at first stage of two stage switch. I'll check the wiring to the secondary small bulbs.
4. Drivers seat doesn't lock into the upright position ie: can be tipped forward without using the lever. I'll try and have a look at the mechanism and see if I can sort it or otherwise bolt it upright. 馃檨
psimitar 路
1. clean all earth connections as a rusty connector increases resistance and hence the faster flash rate. Heck clean all connectors from the flash relay onwards 馃檪
2. sidelights use a pretty awful connection method. Check for 12v at sidelight positive feed. If this is OK then it's corrosion and earthing problems. I fitted modern sidelights with a dedicated earth wire.
3. that'll do 馃檪
TorxKiwi 路
Replaced relay, indicators now all okay. Think I fried it when fixing earlier problem that required replacing lever/switch.
Park lights fixed. Both bulbs needed replacing but wiring had once again been 'spaghetti'd' to all hell. Fixed a couple of mis-wired circuits and all is now fine.
Steel wool shoved up both tail pipes. Silenced sufficiently to pass inspection. Will pull it out afterwards.
Bolted seat in upright position, rear seat access via passenger door only which is fine.
Fingers crossed that the pedantic bastard doesn't find anything else!! At least I can be certain that it is absolutely roadworthy.