hard lines for external oil cooler ?????

hi guys n girls,

i just purchased myself a rx7 oil cooler to be mounted up the front.

.now what do i use for hard lines,copper,alloy,what?? i just looked at some copper for $30 for 6 mtrs "cheaper then flexi lines" , but i think you can get different grade copper pipes....

so what's reconmended...

thanks

I've only heard of using copper pipe..
whether its the heavy duty straight pipe or the usual water copper pipe that is sold by the roll...??

but the copper pipe also helps cool the oil down as it flows thru it...

no corrosion problems in Australia...

Lee

Hi

I've always used 1/2 rubber without any issues.

Steve

ive used copper pipes on several cars and braze on barbed fittings....but yes seen rubber used plenty of times as well.

be sure to use a oil thermostat and even better, a berg pressure relief pump cover too!....way to easy to blow off the lines when oil temps cold without these

buy the RED ( pink ) Rubber hose from Pirtek

Its the BEST has a thick wall not cheap but really good

been using it for over 10 years

Make sure you fit an inline thermostat

Real steel tube theres no substitute when u head into the gravel trap at 180ks and rocks sandblast it

I use a combination of steel and rubber. To allow some movement between the engine and fixed mounted fileter and cooler.

thanks guys...

i think ill use the copper lines with the push lock hose and yes im running a thermostat.as for pump ill be using cb's shadeck maxi 30 pump..thanks again boys.

merry xmas.....

I would reccomend that u don't bother mounting it up front. i used an RX7 oil cooler as well on my beetle engines, I mounted mine above the gearbox to the underside of the parcel tray, it was out of harms way & was more than good enough to keep the oil cool.

Doing lap after lap at Eastern Creek with the last 2275cc engine I built, the oil temp wouldnt' go over 100d, with no fans or ducting going to the oil cooler. I also always ran the standard doghouse cooler as well.

Hope this helps

regards
Jak

I agree with Jak. ^

^^^ me too 🙂

For fuel/oil hard lines the correct tube is 5052 Aluminium.

doh now im confused on what to do....i have a 12 row cooler i have used for years that's mounted near the torsion bar housing which is good for 4x70-80 second laps on a 30deg but any more laps then that or hotter temps the oil starts to rise to 120 or so .

when i give myself my rx7 cooler for chrissy ill go see how it will fit above the gearbox...and besides shorter hoses = less oil to change.yay....

vw54 wrote:buy the RED ( pink ) Rubber hose from Pirtek

Its the BEST has a thick wall not cheap but really good

been using it for over 10 years

Make sure you fit an inline thermostat

Just checked Pirtek's website, and these hoses are good for 61.5 bar (890psi) before they will burst!

Yeah just remeber Jak is in a 1302 with all the extra benefits of their evolved cooling

Boot vents etc

Just do what needs to be done to keep YOUR temps under control....motors ain't cheap

Hi

The only problem that I can see with using hard lines is that if they get squashed they stay squashed, rubber lines bounce back or rips.

I fitted a front mounted oil cooler to my WBX bug using pink Pertec lines. I have now fitted this same cooler and lines to my sons 1904cc bug, it has no internal cooler just the front mount, doesn't overheat no matter what you do, flat out on a freeway or stuck in Sydney traffic, most of the time its just above the thermostat opening temperature.

If you want to do ghetto fittings for the RX7 cooler, the breather hose fitting on late model bug fuel fillers is the same thread just weld some 1/2 tubes into them, I think that you can buy them nowadays from fitting places

Steve

ps Jak has a 1302, they still had the small vents under the window, the 1303 got the bigger vents

agree with mat use ally pipes better heat dissapation you can weld on AN fittings and make the system neat with hydraulic clamps from any hose mob. Also try to use a slightly bigger pipe as the bigger pipe is easier to pump through even if you have a restriction at the end.

120 deg aint that hot have run them past 150 with good oil and had no probs [pre oil cooler days)

Heard today that copper has problems when used with diesel or petrol, with diesel has a reaction creating a green corosion with the sulpfur, so makes me womder if sump oil has anything that may create 'issues'.

Not sure I agree that your 150* oil temps are 'ok' Rudi.

yeah 150 geez,melt down.a gauge that reads more then it is ??

Use steel lines. Silver solder an olive to the ends of the tube to be your pseudo hose barb. Mounted mine with stauff clamps.

if you are looking at the different cooling potential of the lines to solve a problem, reckon you are screwed.

I used copper lines no problems at all😵‍💫 one down either side of the car in the channel where the body bolts are ,safe there....

amazeer wrote:Use steel lines. Silver solder an olive to the ends of the tube to be your pseudo hose barb. Mounted mine with stauff clamps.

if you are looking at the different cooling potential of the lines to solve a problem, reckon you are screwed.

Dunno bout that, as any help is worth the work. never discount the "free" benefits of the right material selection!

So is above the gearbox the place to mount one. I have a turbo street car in the build and it is going to be driven hard. I was thinking last night while looking at it to mount it under the parcel shelf but not flat up under it but at 90 degrees to it facing out close the rear rear shock. Anyone done this or have any idea if it would be better than tucking it away?
Thanks
HEath

ill let u know how mine goes above the gearbox in a few weeks

Hi

How much airflow will you get above the gearbox? Not much, if you can mount it at the front.

Steve

Thanks Steve,
Obviously that would be the best place for it but I have a radiator already there.
This is why I was thinking of trying to make it more upright that flat against the luggage area.
T54

im going to use some ducting

i ended up mounting my cooler above the gearbox and the oil is getting a lot hotter then previous.i do now have a wilder engine which will make things a tad hotter but still my oil is getting 110deg where before with my old setup would sit at 90deg.so i think im going to mount it up front...

does anyone know if cams allow to run lines inside the cabin ??

Hows the new donk feel?

more power😂 have not done any power runs yet,i have taken it to 6000rpm a couple of times and still have another 2000 to go...it really starts pulling from 4000.......still trying to jet the thing ....so far it wants bigger idles then 60's with the 48mm webbers....im not yet sold on that size carb and might bolt on my old 44's and see how it runs....

What size venturis?

Do you run the bootlid closed?...... I found running one fresh air tube across the backside of the cooler helped.

the vents are 40's....the 44's have 36 and 38's....

yeah i thought about scoops and stuff but means more clutter in that area.so it would be easier to just mount it up front out of the way ...

cnfabo wrote:more power😂 have not done any power runs yet,i have taken it to 6000rpm a couple of times and still have another 2000 to go...it really starts pulling from 4000.......still trying to jet the thing ....so far it wants bigger idles then 60's with the 48mm webbers....im not yet sold on that size carb and might bolt on my old 44's and see how it runs....

Before you give up on the 48,s get them running spot on then make a decision.
What size capacity is your motor and compression, rev range you said is max8000rpm. 60 idles are on the biggish side for a VW motor under 2000cc. 40mm vents are also as large as you would go on a under 2000cc, unless it,s a drag motor with no low range torque requirements.

Cheers Col

colin wrote:

cnfabo wrote:more power😂 have not done any power runs yet,i have taken it to 6000rpm a couple of times and still have another 2000 to go...it really starts pulling from 4000.......still trying to jet the thing ....so far it wants bigger idles then 60's with the 48mm webbers....im not yet sold on that size carb and might bolt on my old 44's and see how it runs....

Before you give up on the 48,s get them running spot on then make a decision.
What size capacity is your motor and compression, rev range you said is max8000rpm. 60 idles are on the biggish side for a VW motor under 2000cc. 40mm vents are also as large as you would go on a under 2000cc, unless it,s a drag motor with no low range torque requirements.

Cheers Col

1916cc,10.5:1,cb2289....the only reason i went for 48's is because my head guy wanted me to chase as much hp probably.my innovative AF gauge says its lean at idle with 60's and f11's.....

As a start i would try 55idles with 155mains and 40 vents
If you use the 38 vents go down to 150mains
You can then with these combos trim your high rpm mixture with your air jet.
hope this helps a little.

Cheers Col

i tried 55 idles and it was way to lean...its got 180 airs and 155 mains currently....im off to south africa sunday morn for 6 weeks holidays so don't have any time to play till i get back..

Does running a front mounted cooler drop oil pressure at all?

No

No pressure drop, but I believe there has to be some loss of volume due to extra line length. The other negative is the extra oil that doesn't get changed during servicing. Porsche did it so it can't be too bad, but I prefer to keep all lines as short as possible.

Ive run the cooler Rx7 up front for a while now no drop in pressure no flow issues ,temps will run higher with cooler mounted above transmission cheers Rudi

When I'm keen matt, I use a 20litre drum pump to prime and also push out old oil when changing

Disconnect to and from lines, add a hose clamp and catch bucket and away it goes.

Surprisingly when pidgin out the old oil with new, it goes from black old oil, thru murky mix, to clean new oil in just a few strokes of the plunger


My latest thing has been propping the bootlid at the bottom as opposed to the top, with a 10 degree drop of oil temp!

any updates on the cooler and hot engine temps?

no not yet.just got back from africa 2 days ago..tomorow ill move the cooler up front so hopefully this fixes the temps....

did moving the cooler help ? What temps are you running now ?

yes its up front and the temps i have seen up 140+, hope my gauge is wrong😂

cnfabo wrote:yes its up front and the temps i have seen up 140+, hope my gauge is wrong😂

just put black tape over the screen !😂

Craig Torrens wrote:

cnfabo wrote:yes its up front and the temps i have seen up 140+, hope my gauge is wrong😂

just put black tape over the screen !😂

😂😂

Get a dipstick tattle tail

hellbugged wrote:Get a dipstick tattle tail

???

Ouch, thats hot. What gauge setup, what oil & pump, what cam and CR......?????

castrol edge 20/50w,cb 30mm shadeck,10.5:1 ,cb2289cam speco gauge

Hope the gauge is wrong, maybe AFR's are lean?.....

We use rubber 3/4" hoses on both our cars with home made oil coolers (made from intercoolers) on the dry sump return line. Works real good.

matberry wrote:Hope the gauge is wrong, maybe AFR's are lean?.....

Did you check your AFR ?

I hear you have a problem with your motor and the heads are off.....hope its all ok ?

I don't think Chris runs any kind of AFR reader or logger....

Craig Torrens wrote:

matberry wrote:Hope the gauge is wrong, maybe AFR's are lean?.....

Did you check your AFR ?

I hear you have a problem with your motor and the heads are off.....hope its all ok ?

Na, no probs with the motor, I pulled the heads off for a look as I had a big lean out at barbagallo in December , was my stupid fault as I ran the tank dry!dick head!!!!! Everything is back together, gearbox is finished and ready to send back from dangerous's, and all my dry sump stuff is ready to install.

Humpty I have a innovate afr

Sounds good Chris, the dry sump will help fix oil surge and give you a few extra ponies 😎

Are you using the CB dry sump kit/parts ?

Hey Chris,
really love your work over there in the west.
140 if correct, is very hot for oil temps.
Please keep us updated in regards to your dry sump mods, i am very interested.👍👍👍
What was your reason to go to a dry sump?.

Cheers Col

Craig & col , Rene seams to think ill get lower temps with the dry sump setup as I'm keeping oil out of sitting in the case. I also got rid of the eBay rx7 oil cooler and I got 2 mocal 11 row coolers instead. I'll post some pics up. Yep cb pump and pulley. Dash 12 lines the whole system and a friend made a big tank for me.

Cheers

Going deluxe Chris... Well done mate.... How you driving the pump for the dry sump?

The only worry I had with my dry sump set-up was the high crank-case temperatures. The magnesium case loses strength when the temps get really high......and the oil that normally cools the case is sitting in the oil tank. Just another thought......not trying to frighten you, Chris.😁

The oil cools the case? Darn u have me scared now!