Can anyone inform me as to the ideal oil temp a 1600 twin port motor should be running at when fully warmed up? Also safe acepted temperatures when running at speed on long trips? Thanks :jesus

Such a BIG answer for such a little question..

Seriously a hard question to answer

These are my opinions......

A 1600 twin port with deck closed and full tin should not get above 100 round the city. A sustained run at 120 km / hr i would consider nornal to get to say 115.
I would pull over at 120-125 and shut down before 130

A standoff on the deck lid will reduce 10 C.

Hotter ambient will increase temp. I would not go for an extended blast on a 40C day

Your name suggests you may have a manx??
I would chop 10C off my numbers there. I would think an open motor that sees more than 110C either has problems or was designed for an open engine area.
It also depends where the sensor is located.
I run mine in the rear pressure relief valve. Supposedly one of the hotter spots. It is on its way to the cooler.
One in the block/sump would read less.
It is relative rather than definitive.

That said i think you need to get oil above 90C to get rid of condensation

mmmm, how hot does it get in Mexico and Brazil ? and I'm sure they flog them over there !!!

That said, go by blue74l's numbers:thumb

mine doesn't get above 70 even in the 38 degree days over xmas. It runs a 9:1 compression, and an extra cooler. it never used to to go over 65 with the extended alloy sump. But saying all this, i feel my engine runs to cold am now going to cover the extra oil cooler.

The sender is tapped into the back right side of the case about 1.5 inches up and 2 inches from the side.

pheeewww,
thanks guys- i was just getting worried on chrismas day when driving the manx at about 110 kph for 40 minutes the temp started to aproach 90 deg. - I have a remote oil cooler and the temp usually doesnt go beyond 80 deg.... but it was a 30+ day

Blue74 has it on the mark as well as Bix.
It is equally incorrect to run the oil too cool as too hot, a fact often overlooked and not considered.

Oil specifications are "usually" defined at around 100 Deg.C so strictly speaking, you arent even heating the oil to its ideal temp.

Condensation and associated destructive acid formation will eventually evaporate away regardless of the temp of the oil just significantly slower at lower temps. this can mean a buildup where the car only ever runs short runs and never heats its oil.

What is a wise strategy is to use the biggest oil cooler you can possibly fit and employ an inline oil temp thermostat that simply bypasses the cooler at temps below the thermostat preset.

Exactly the same as a water-cooled engine thermostat in a nifty aluminium housing that just inserts into the oil cooler supply/return lines.

Often used on Air-cooled big bore road bikes in colder climates.
L8tr
E

Sounds like you're running a full-flow cooler, with no thermostat/flaps, or a cheap and inaccurate guage. The combustion of petrol (especially ULP,) produces gasses which combine with water to produce sulphuric acid. If the oil temp does not regularly get over at least 75C, this acid will eat the bearings ( a phenomenon pretty much every mechanic has witnessed - even if they didn't know what the cause was.) Regular engine oils (such as the non-synthetics we tend to use in VWs) will break down ahead of time if heated over 115-120C on a regular basis.

So, recommended oil temp is 80-110C when hot - provided you have a reliable gauge.

P.S. Some people might jump on my comment against overly low oil temps (simplified as it was,) as modern oils do contain chemicals to combat acidity - they do not, however, have enough to counteract consitently low engine temperatures.

I've got a worked 1600, a mechanic told me that i shouldn't let it get over 100c, simply because of the wires etc will start melting due to the heat...

My manx doesn't like going over 90k for long trips before it starts heating up. This may be a silly question, but on the last long drive i lost oil pressure when the heat when up. wots going on????

It is obviously running too hot. I trust your mecanic who gave you this advice is very experienced with air cooled veedubs. In any case, check your case for airleaks, make sure ALL the air is going where it is supposed to. The most common air leak ios around the plug wires, the large tight fitting washers that seal the s/plug hole are oftem missing, or old and not hard up against the tin ware. I have even seen so called mecahanics leave the heater hose connectors off the fan housing and just leave the holes open.. Make sure all the tin ware is in place, especially the little pieces under the barrels. Then go fit an oil cooler, and run quality oil, in summer in Bris I would run straight 50. Running hot is injurious to your engine health, and consequently your wallet
good luck,
tonyg

Im afraid that Craig beat me to that one
L8tr
E

Worried about the long trip i fitted a oil temp guage

Around town 70 - 80 degrees

on the trip averaging 100 - 110 oil temp was between 95 and 105 depending on the outside temp more than on the speed.

i have a 1600 TP with DCNF 40 petronix ignition empi monza pipes. no extra sump or cooler.

And latest news - my MDS 5 arrived !!! keen to try it out.

regards

Maybe some people should take note on what temps a 1600 runs at. :thumb

breville, thanks for posting, this was the same temps as my 1600tp.


Also the same temps as my base 1916cc would run.

my 1600 ran hotter than my base 1916cc.

"you... at the back... can you tell me what vaporlock is? and stop picking your nose, you have no idea where that finger's been.":alien

If you're running a full-flow oil cooler, your oil temp does not reliably reflect how hot your engine is running... Though some _never_ reach a healthy temperature (your oil-cooling system becomes unregulated.)

I haven't checked temp on new 1835 yet as it is just running in, it is fitted with an extra cooler mounted on opposite side of battery(hole cut) in kombi . Although I'm in sunny Queensland, out west here it gets as low as -5c in winter and I'm a bit worried that my bus will run too cool. Does anyone know where I can find one of those in-line oil thermostats that sends the oil through the filter only until it reaches a certain temp which then opens the line to cooler.?

An excellent idea, but will cost about $130 with postage from aircooled.net. I think Gene Berg is about the same price, but may cost a little more as they use DHL for everything. A lot of "experts" mention the bypass in the stock engine and it's ability to prevent blowouts in the cooler, a lot seem to miss the point it also provides a bit of primitive temperature control. A metallurgist friend suggests the VW engineers designed a little more than most realise into this area (but you need to take into consideration his father was a long-haired Kombi-driving science teacher [actually Master's, back when that meant something]) which supports the experienced VW/Jaguar/Honda mechanic's view that you _can_ have a too efficient cooler for your engine...

Sorry to throw you a curve ball, but those of us who don't have an engineering degree need to remember:

Oil cooling will not cure an overheating engine, only overheated oil.

Oil is designed to reach an operating temperature.

Engines are designed to reach an operating temperature: this is not an air-cooled problem. Many home-built marine engines run much too cool, for example - if you are making one, use a heat exchanger and retain the stock thermostat and coolant. High-performance engines often suffer with improved cooling systems, but reduced combustion chamber cooling due to it's increased area without improved coolant flow.

There are ways to use your extra-cool oil practically, but they need a good understanding of fluid dynamics and a fair dose of experience. (squirters used on the cylinders and valve train are common on HP, short-life engines.)

I have an 8 pass cooler at the front of my manx along with heavy large gauge oil lines runnig front to back. My last oil change I filled the motor till it was close to the top of the dipstick full mark than i ran the motor for about thirty seconds than check the oil level 15 minutes later to see if more was needed to fill the lines and cooler- it was cause the oil level now was about 3/5ths so I topped it up till the oil level was spot on. i than drove the car for around 30 minutes later that afternoon - the next morning I checked the oil level and it was showing well above the full mark. SHOULD THIS BE A CONCERN?My oil pressure will sit at about 60psi all day (drops a bit at idle) and only takes around 20-30 second to reach 60psi at start up. I have no oil leaks and my motor blows no smoke. :jesus

On a cold winters morning I struggle to get the engine past 60 degrees. There is also the problem of the throttle body on the carbie freezing and causing a rough idle.

On an ordinary day the engine sits at about 80 degrees and 90 for a warm day.

Stinking hot days are another story. If I'm going around town then the engine will hang around the 90 degree mark, however at 100 to 110km the engine just seems to slowly get hotter and hotter. After 40 minutes of driving at high speed the engine is hanging around the 105 degrees mark and this is as hot as I'm prepaired to let it get. My theory is that the coolent in a water cooled engine reaches just over 100 degrees (just past boiling) so I've made 105 my top safe mark. Luckly I've never had to drive long enough on a hot day to exceed this, but if I did I would pull over and let it cool down.