Looking at setting up the front end of my rally car for hill climbs and sprints. At the moment it is stock 61 beetle, with disc that push the track out about 15mm a side. I’m running 165 R15 Michelins at the moment but am getting too much under steer. What tyres are people running etc. how do you get them to turn in?
i never got rid of excessive understeer till i worked my way up to 195's.
195/50s
205/60's potenza GIII's
on 6 X 15 inch fronts and seven inch (porsche) rears
with whiteline bars front and rear does the trick for me.
biggest problem now is oil starvation in the corners!
can you fit rubber like that under standard guards or are you wide guards? I figure I will have to go wide at the front at least as my 195 fit under the rear at the moment.
under standard guards!
Hey, mr. one, are you using the ball joint-irs pan? wot size are the sway bars?
link and swing.
18mm front 22mm rear
[ Edited on 5-6-06 by dumone ]
coilover shocks with 'relaxed' leaves & torsion bars?
torsion bars of choice would be sway-a-way, 26mm or 28 sway-a-way for me soon
no need for coil overs, bilsteins or konis do the trick
run two height adjusters up front for standard "spring" rate, one for stiffer ride.
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=33580
[ Edited on 5-6-06 by dumone ]
ok. wot about caster & camber settings? ball joint front that i have has adjusters. i have a static hub gauge for setup but dont really know where to start.
http://www.clubvw.org.au/some_articles_of_interest_writte.htm
read inch by inch & handle with care
[ Edited on 5-6-06 by dumone ]
OH MY GOD!! praise the lord o mighty -one... the info i've been looking for. very much appreciated.
knock yourself out killer
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yeah helps 20-22psi front
24-28psi rear
think he's running 195's on the rear tho, so understeer is a certainty
What kind of offset have you rims, to get the to fit under standard guards? Also running a quaife.
[ Edited on 5-6-2006 by wombatone ]
on here, look under fuchs', they're the same as the cookie cutters i'm running.
going to fuchs' in the next couple of weeks.
jealous on the diff there matey. got to go irs before i can use my ZF...
http://www.magrowheels.com/wheelwts.html
narrowest tyre on widest wheel gives best turn in and quickest response (within reccomendations for width)
so a 195 on a six inch rim will respond better than same tyre on a five incher
[ Edited on 5-6-06 by dumone ]
I not think 205 would it under the back of my bug with the 6x15 I'm running but how would 195 front and rear go? would you still run lowwer pressure in the front?
Do you have any pictures of the car understeering that you could post?
Is the front lowered?
Do you have any aftermarket components on the car at the moment?
CYA CT
yeah, i just like the feel of the 205's. with the limo diff, you for sure could get away with a it of oversteer:thumb
as Steve Carter pointed out in a recent thread, the tyres we run on our VW's are most often designed for much heavier vehicles, so you can get away
with the benefits of lower pressures and still have the tyres live a good lifespan.
the very lightweight of the front end allows lower pressures than the rear with the added weight of the drive line back there.
consider using a quicksteer extension on the steering arm. it's the best way to gain enough lock, quick enough to catch em when you are pushing the
traction limits
thanks for the clues will have to see about new rims and sway bars.
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| Originally
posted by dumone consider using a quicksteer extension on the steering arm. it's the best way to gain enough lock, quick enough to catch em when you are pushing the traction limits |
I have got plenty of lock, just no grip. As for the quick steer extension on the steering arm, I would have thought there would be illegal on a street car. Don’t really know. Can an arm of another model be used? Are there different length arms? As for ride hight it is stock. The only pics I have at the moment are on the Ampol re-run thread.
My thoughts.
1. The quaife could be causing the front end push.
2. If the front coil-overs increase the front spring rate then you're not getting enough weight transfer on to the front wheels to allow good
turn-in.
Try
1. Softer front shocks
2. Stiffer rear springs
3. Increase tow-out on the front
I hope that helps.
CYA CT
One last thing.
How much do your tyre pressures increase by from cold to hot? Are the front tyres working?
Do you have bump stops on the front shocks? How much room do you have before they they stop compressing. If you're hitting the bump stops that could
also be a cause.
CYA CT
I’m not sure what the tyre temps are doing, I never got a change to check on that but will next time I take it out. The front end is dead stock except I am running GR-2 KYB all round. There is lots of wheel travel except the wheel hit the guards before the bump stops as the track is 30 mm wide due to the discs. I have picked up some softer shocker so will trial them soon, will also have to get a pair of aero guards for the front so I can lower it a bit and stop the wheels hitting. The rear torsion bars are type 3 Wagon so I think they are harder than stock.