Only For Imported Notch S Interested Dubbers !!
1500S - June 18th, 2010 at 01:59 PM
Thought we may as well put some more info here as a few of our Veedubber clan have requested "the differences" between the German import 1500S of
1964 to 1965 and the locally produced 1965 only Australian built one.
Adam (Empi) has listed some of them but here are some pics to make things a bit clearer.
Me being fanatical on them?? Not really but after seeing write-ups during th mid 60s in "Safer Motoring" mags it always seemed to be "the
pinnacle" of the Type 3 range. As Joel points out, The later ones handle much better than the early ones, even the magic 1969 model with the newer
rear end but with the better looking 
shape had the smaller discs
up front. However, the interest is in saving a model rather than any handling issues, just as many have saved the 'orrible Ovals and splittie
Kombis
If you think you have an imported 1500 S or think you know where one is in a paddock somewhere quietly rusting away, maybe it's time either to save
it or at least get the trim parts to make a look-a-like one.
By the way, this isn't a look-a-like! It is a fair dinkum around March 1964 German import 1500s. When I bought it, it didn't have the pushbutton
switch but as I had it it went to good use. Production wise, it just missed out on it. For the same year time of production here in OZ, many dashes
had the transition plastic fill plate so the later switches could be fitted.
DH
bajachris88 - June 18th, 2010 at 03:50 PM
i always have a softspot for the type 3 dash. I rekon the gauges rock. gets me clucky every time... awwww...
vlad01 - June 18th, 2010 at 05:48 PM
I quite hate the early gauges, I love the late ones though
btw does anyone have any late black Australian gauges? I have been looking for like a year and still cant find any.
68AutoBug - June 18th, 2010 at 06:01 PM
Never ever saw those switches before Dallas...
EXCELLENT...
I had a 1971 Variant with similar gauges but I preferred the later black gauges..
Loved the look of them... now have a black speedo in My beetle
I remember the 1500S coming out in Australia..
I was a fanatic back then... [too young to have a licence]
I loved the checkered upholstery which didn't like our sun..lol
Did they have premium petrol back then Dallas??
as I remember reading of the domed pistons...
and high octane fuel needed...
cheers
LEE
PS: and then the Aussie twin S... lol ...
1500S - June 18th, 2010 at 06:52 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 68AutoBug
Never ever saw those switches before Dallas...
EXCELLENT...
I had a 1971 Variant with similar gauges but I preferred the later black gauges..
Loved the look of them... now have a black speedo in My beetle
I remember the 1500S coming out in Australia..
I was a fanatic back then... [too young to have a licence]
I loved the checkered upholstery which didn't like our sun..lol
Did they have premium petrol back then Dallas??
as I remember reading of the domed pistons...
and high octane fuel needed...
cheers
LEE
PS: and then the Aussie twin S... lol ...
|
They had to run on the Super of the day but run a bit hotter here than Europe! The standard thing they seemed to do was change the domies for the
standars flat top ones. The exhaust valves were crap back then and gave problems with cracking of the valve head. One of the valves in this motor
reminded me of that as it looked exactly the same as the one I had in 1967 in the OZ N.
I've got a set of NOS domed pistons but no cylinders to go with it. Anyone know where I can get a set of NOS 83mm cylinders??
DH
57oval - June 18th, 2010 at 06:56 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 1500S
Thought we may as well put some more info here as a few of our Veedubber clan have requested "the differences" between the German import 1500S of
1964 to 1965 and the locally produced 1965 only Australian built one.
Adam (Empi) has listed some of them but here are some pics to make things a bit clearer.
Me being fanatical on them?? Not really but after seeing write-ups during th mid 60s in "Safer Motoring" mags it always seemed to be "the
pinnacle" of the Type 3 range. As Joel points out, The later ones handle much better than the early ones, even the magic 1969 model with the newer
rear end but with the better looking shape had the smaller discs
up front. However, the interest is in saving a model rather than any handling issues, just as many have saved the 'orrible Ovals and splittie
Kombis
If you think you have an imported 1500 S or think you know where one is in a paddock somewhere quietly rusting away, maybe it's time either to save
it or at least get the trim parts to make a look-a-like one.
By the way, this isn't a look-a-like! It is a fair dinkum around March 1964 German import 1500s. When I bought it, it didn't have the pushbutton
switch but as I had it it went to good use. Production wise, it just missed out on it. For the same year time of production here in OZ, many dashes
had the transition plastic fill plate so the later switches could be fitted.
DH
|
Looks like your March 64 notch missed out on red needles on the gauges compared to my Jan 64 1500N
1500S - June 18th, 2010 at 08:04 PM
| Quote: |
Looks like your March 64 notch missed out on red needles on the gauges compared to my Jan 64 1500N
|
Can't remember if it had them now on the originals which were in it. I changed the miles speedo for a km one. Had them cluttering the space up for
years and ended up giving some of the things to another Type 3 owner. The clock was there as well as the fuel gauge but I changed it all to 12 volt
during the restore work. I think the red needle ones were gone by mid 64.
Has your early 64 got the dash plastic fill for the later light and wiper switch? Someone on fleabay has a dash section for a pushbutton but why
would anyone hack a dash when it's so easy just to cut the slot.
DH
68AutoBug - June 18th, 2010 at 08:35 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 57oval
Looks like your March 64 notch missed out on red needles on the gauges compared to my Jan 64 1500N
|
I used to paint My needles orange... lol
I haven't done My latest speedo, but can;t remember what color the needle is.. lol
All You need now Dallas, is a KMH speedo with a tripmeter... lol
LEE
1500S - June 18th, 2010 at 09:29 PM
I think I had one Lee but it was the black faced recessed one and it was in the old Birch green 69 which ended up somewhere in QLD. What about the
"nipple pink" colour needles that Holden used on the VE instruments.... NOOOOO!
DH
57oval - June 18th, 2010 at 09:35 PM
| Quote: |
| Quote: | | Quote: | Originally
posted by 1500S
|
Looks like your March 64 notch missed out on red needles on the gauges compared to my Jan 64 1500N
|
Can't remember if it had them now on the originals which were in it. I changed he miles speedo for a km one. Had them cluttering the space up for
years and ended up giving some of the things to another Type 3 owner. The clock was there as well as the fuel gauge but I changed it all to 12 volt
during the restore work. I think the red needle ones were gone by mid 64.
Has your early 64 got the dash plastic fill for the later light and wiper switch? Someone on fleabay has a dash section for a pushbutton but why
would anyone hack a dash when it's so easy just to cut the slot.
DH
|
Yes the dash has the black plastic cover strip where the push button controls would normal sit. Also have the 140 kmh speedo
1500S - June 18th, 2010 at 09:47 PM
Good to have the km speedo. Was a pain in the ass doing the mental conversion and the stick on things looked plain ugly. The S models had the 100
mph or 160kmh in them.
I did have the trip in the 69 Lee. I clipped the pic from whereisflicity's resto photos. It had all S interior except I had to use the Fastback
rear side armrests. All the other stuff except rear seat backrest came out of a 63 Square in Deloraine, Tas.
DH
vlad01 - June 19th, 2010 at 09:52 AM
yeah the late aussie gauge are ftw imo.
I just bought a few days ago a 68 Porsche 912 tacho to replace my speedo. direct fit they are. Porsche 912 have 115mm tacho 
Then later I will toss the clock for a vdo 220km or even 300km electronic speedo. I just am looking for the late 72-73 black fuel gauge now to
complete the set.
btw the 1500S was 8.5:1 comp ratio?!??
1500S - June 19th, 2010 at 02:16 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by vlad01
btw the 1500S was 8.5:1 comp ratio?!??
|
But only on the German import generally, even some of those came in with flat top 7.8:1 I believe. Maybe a couple of OZ ones had the 8.5:1 by special
request but generally was discouraged.
DH
68AutoBug - June 19th, 2010 at 05:23 PM
From memory the TWIN S Aussie type 3 had a standard engine with twin carburetors..
LEE
1500S - June 19th, 2010 at 06:09 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 68AutoBug
From memory the TWIN S Aussie type 3 had a standard engine with twin carburetors..
LEE
|
That's what I thought and knew at the time Lee. I think too many of our fellow Veedubbers got the specs from the imported one confused with the
local engine:
Phil Matthews wrote in his history of VW in Australia:
1965
"The locally made 1500S is introduced, a high compression twin-carb model that is only £40 more than the normal 1500 sedan."
Maybe VW at first thought they would use the high comp engine but the track record of the imported ones in 1964 having overheating problems in our
summer caused a change of direction. Maybe the Ampol Trial of 1964 decided the imported specs engine's fate even though the 1500S placed 2nd as
well as another two placing high on the list. The only difference from the N engine and the S engine here was the twin carbs. Can't remember
what dizzy was used here on the '65 but was possibly the vacuum advance only from our '64 N. The one in my S is the 1964 one year only
vacuum/mechanical advance. No dizzy caps available for them here so I had to modify one to fit.
DH
57oval - June 19th, 2010 at 07:19 PM
Do you have the M249 option plate on your 1500s next to the fuel pump?
1500S - June 19th, 2010 at 07:42 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 57oval
Do you have the M249 option plate on your 1500s next to the fuel pump?
|
It could have been there when I stripped it down but can't remember. Too long ago! That's what I thought regarding the flat pistons at the time.
Hard to tell what had happened from 1964 to 2000 but it certainly didn't look like it had been apart much. It still had the original heads on it
with the long rocker studs the same as the 40 pony power engines of the day complete with the almost compulsory burnt and cracked 30,000 mile exhaust
valve. What headaches they gave until we modded them with the short studs! I used one of the heads but the other had a dodgy exhaust valve
seat.
DH
68AutoBug - June 20th, 2010 at 01:32 AM
Interesting about the distributor Dallas...
I presume they are the same size as the 009 or SVDA Bosch dissies??
they aren't the large early type of dissy??
I have a new Bosch cap here off a Mitsubishi I have owned over the years.. looks the same size as the VW ones..??
but whether its the same ?? I also have points and rotor.. lol
they ARE different... but may actually fit My SVDA bosch dizzy????
I have enough problems so I won't be trying to fit them..lol
I can't ever remember reading of HIGH compression engines in Australian type 3 twin S...
in the advertising... just twin carburetors...
I didn't know that the M codes had a badge..??
was that for the High Compression engine???
cheers
LEE
PS: reading today of the new HOT GOLF with about 177kw
but in Europe they are 200kws...
detuned for the heat in Australia... lol
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 1500S
| Quote: | Originally
posted by 68AutoBug
From memory the TWIN S Aussie type 3 had a standard engine with twin carburetors..
LEE
|
That's what I thought and knew at the time Lee. I think too many of our fellow Veedubbers got the specs from the imported one confused with the
local engine:
Phil Matthews wrote in his history of VW in Australia:
1965
"The locally made 1500S is introduced, a high compression twin-carb model that is only £40 more than the normal 1500 sedan."
Maybe VW at first thought they would use the high comp engine but the track record of the imported ones in 1964 having overheating problems in our
summer caused a change of direction. Maybe the Ampol Trial of 1964 decided the imported specs engine's fate even though the 1500S placed 2nd as
well as another two placing high on the list. The only difference from the N engine and the S engine here was the twin carbs. Can't remember
what dizzy was used here on the '65 but was possibly the vacuum advance only from our '64 N. The one in my S is the 1964 one year only
vacuum/mechanical advance. No dizzy caps available for them here so I had to modify one to fit.
DH
|
1500S - June 20th, 2010 at 08:45 AM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 68AutoBug
Interesting about the distributor Dallas...
I presume they are the same size as the 009 or SVDA Bosch dissies??
they aren't the large early type of dissy??
I have a new Bosch cap here off a Mitsubishi I have owned over the years.. looks the same size as the VW ones..??
but whether its the same ?? I also have points and rotor.. lol
they ARE different... but may actually fit My SVDA bosch dizzy????
I have enough problems so I won't be trying to fit them..lol
I can't ever remember reading of HIGH compression engines in Australian type 3 twin S...
in the advertising... just twin carburetors...
I didn't know that the M codes had a badge..??
was that for the High Compression engine???
cheers
LEE
PS: reading today of the new HOT GOLF with about 177kw
but in Europe they are 200kws...
detuned for the heat in Australia... lol
| Quote: | Originally
posted by 1500S
| Quote: | Originally
posted by 68AutoBug
From memory the TWIN S Aussie type 3 had a standard engine with twin carburetors..
LEE
|
That's what I thought and knew at the time Lee. I think too many of our fellow Veedubbers got the specs from the imported one confused with the
local engine:
Phil Matthews wrote in his history of VW in Australia:
1965
"The locally made 1500S is introduced, a high compression twin-carb model that is only £40 more than the normal 1500 sedan."
Maybe VW at first thought they would use the high comp engine but the track record of the imported ones in 1964 having overheating problems in our
summer caused a change of direction. Maybe the Ampol Trial of 1964 decided the imported specs engine's fate even though the 1500S placed 2nd as
well as another two placing high on the list. The only difference from the N engine and the S engine here was the twin carbs. Can't remember
what dizzy was used here on the '65 but was possibly the vacuum advance only from our '64 N. The one in my S is the 1964 one year only
vacuum/mechanical advance. No dizzy caps available for them here so I had to modify one to fit.
DH
|
|
This is the '64 only dizzy Lee. Scarce as hens teeth here in OZ but quite a few hanging around the US as it seems there were plenty of 1500S cars
got to there.
DH
vicelore - June 20th, 2010 at 02:49 PM
Thanks Tons for putting all this info up 1500s Very Nice..
Cheers Vice
Dyno - June 22nd, 2010 at 12:23 AM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by vlad01
I quite hate the early gauges, I love the late ones though
btw does anyone have any late black Australian gauges? I have been looking for like a year and still cant find any.
|
Have a set of the Aussie 73 only with trip speedo and tacho... I like the Early 1961-64 red needle gauges btw.
Dyno - June 22nd, 2010 at 12:28 AM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 68AutoBug
Never ever saw those switches before Dallas...
|
Take a close look at the "wrap around" dash......
Dyno - June 22nd, 2010 at 12:33 AM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by 57oval
Do you have the M249 option plate on your 1500s next to the fuel pump?
|
The M249 Tag was an "s" engine WITHOUT the domed pistons which is why it specified the low octane rating fuel recommendation.
Dyno - June 22nd, 2010 at 12:42 AM
Dizzy? Rare? here is a few of mine...
On the left is the ZV/PAU 4r6(61-63 Type 3)
In the middle ZV JCU4R3(1500 S for the first few months of production)
On the right is a NOS ZV PAU 4R5(61-64 1200 bug/bus)
Detail... even the cap is different(341 part number)
empi - June 22nd, 2010 at 10:56 AM
Dyno , been waiting to see how long before you pop up!! how are ya? Its been a while?? Common pop up some pics of some Type 3 goodness.
Ad
vlad01 - June 22nd, 2010 at 11:21 AM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by Dyno
| Quote: | Originally
posted by vlad01
I quite hate the early gauges, I love the late ones though
btw does anyone have any late black Australian gauges? I have been looking for like a year and still cant find any.
|
Have a set of the Aussie 73 only with trip speedo and tacho... I like the Early 1961-64 red needle gauges btw.
|
have a fuel gauge? I am actual after only a fuel gauge and if you have any late stuffed clocks would be great to. Plan to fit a VDO electronic 80mm
speedo into a clock. Already have a late Porsche 912 tacho on its way to replace the speedo's dash place.
Cheers.
1500S - June 22nd, 2010 at 01:25 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by Dyno
Dizzy? Rare? here is a few of mine...
On the left is the ZV/PAU 4r6(61-63 Type 3)
In the middle ZV JCU4R3(1500 S for the first few months of production)
On the right is a NOS ZV PAU 4R5(61-64 1200 bug/bus)
Detail... even the cap is different(341 part number)
|
"In the middle ZV JCU4R3(1500 S for the first few months of production)"
As I said, pretty rare here in OZ! How many dizzy caps have you got hoarded Dyno! One too many??? I posted on here years ago to find one after exhausting all normal avenues and came up with a blank.
Anyone got a spare 4 x 83mm standard bore NOS cylinders doing nothing as well. C'mon Adam, you must know where there are some collecting dust!!..
I've got the NOS 8.5:1 bits to fill them up with. 
DH
68AutoBug - June 22nd, 2010 at 04:46 PM
NOS Distributors>>>>
YIKES....
How did you come to have all those...????
and Yes on the dizzy cap... big notch in it..!!
I tried to put a 009 cap on a VW SVDA dizzy and the cap fitted OK.. but the locating notch was on the other side??
great photos.... Now where do You live... lol....
LEE
empi - June 22nd, 2010 at 07:31 PM
Oh dont get him started!!!! NOS type 3 unobtainium .... i think Dyno may have some of that too.......
1500S - June 22nd, 2010 at 07:36 PM
| Quote: |
Originally
posted by empi
Oh dont get him started!!!! NOS type 3 unobtainium .... i think Dyno may have some of that too.......
|
A milling machine gets that shape notch in rather quick.
With my NOS stuff it's only NOS until it gets put on the car to use! We're only on this earth for a good time, not a long time so not much use
hoarding stuff for the offspring to throw in the dump.
Mind you Adam, I have two NOS up to 1963 Type 3 front left brake slaves. Do you have any use for them? If so I'll send them down with someone from
Melbourne if they are at Valla.
DH