| [ Total Views: 1818 | Total Replies: 24 | Thread Id: 1324 ] |
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 Grey 57
A.k.a.: Dean
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 01:29 PM |
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Whats the best Oil
Whats the best brand and grade of oil to use in a Type 1 1600 aircooled engine.
Driving usually is a mix of low speed city and high speed freeway. (Vic Cruises)
Cars not used every day, maybe once a week. 
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Phil74Camper
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 05:58 PM |
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Any good quality name-brand oil is fine. You don't have to stick to monograde 30w oil like in the old days, as modern technology has gone way
beyond that. Any normal 20w-50 is perfect. I prefer Castrol myself but that's just me.
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70AutoStik
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 10:35 PM |
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Valvoline is good, and cheap. I've never tried synthetics, because too many people with a lot of experience recommend against it (usually
flywheel seal leaks are reported, sometimes cracked heads.)
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555bug
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 11:52 PM |
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motul and agip are really good if you can get hold of them.
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KruizinKombi
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 11:59 PM |
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I use Mobil XHP in anything I think is worth the cost, and the cheapest stuff I can get in anything else!
Kruizin Kol
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Baja Wes
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| posted on October 19th, 2002 at 08:04 AM |
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I use valvoline XLD 20W/50 premium with the gold label. It is cheap and always the latest SAE specification, it has to be good quality to keep up with
the latest specs.
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 vw54
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| posted on October 19th, 2002 at 08:04 AM |
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Well for the last 25 or so years ive been using Target or Wollies home brand.....
I dont believe that it matters what brand name it is as long as you do your Maintanence regulary
I change my air cooled oil every 1500 miles
Never had a problem with any of my engines
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Grey 57
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| posted on October 19th, 2002 at 10:05 AM |
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Thanks all. We have a cruise next weekend and I need to do some maintenance to ensure no breakdown and no tears (mine from my loved beating me up if
we have to push it somewere):thumb
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The_Bronze.
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| posted on October 19th, 2002 at 12:43 PM |
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I've researched this topic heaps of time before I even had a VDub and from what I read it dosen't really matter what oil is used provided it
changed regulary. There were two main rules I did pick up though.
Rule 1 - It is highly recommended that you shouldn't exceed a 30 grade oil in viscosity apparently because the oil galleries are not bit enough
to pump 30+ grade oil through them upon start up, especially on cold mornings. Therefore I have always used 5w-30 or 10w-30 grade oils and let the Dog
idle for three minutes before moving off.
Rule 2 - If previously you haven't used a detergent oil then don't swap to one until after a rebuild. It will remove the scunge holding it
all together and allow movement to occur in what was previously a well sealed mill.
For that reason they say stick to one brand of oil. I use what ever is available and is the cheapest but I do read the back closely and change oil
every 3000 miles. I think the best grade for the dollar at the moment is 'SL' for $21 for 5 litres. Email me for the name as it new to
Australia.
[size=4]Bronze.[/size]
Rathmines, Lake Macquarie, NSW.
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aussiebug
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| posted on October 19th, 2002 at 02:50 PM |
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The Bronze said:
> Rule 1 - It is highly recommended that you shouldn't exceed a 30 grade oil in viscosity apparently because the oil galleries are not bit
enough to pump 30+ grade oil through them upon start up, especially on cold mornings. Therefore I have always used 5w-30 or 10w-30 grade oils and let
the Dog idle for three minutes before moving off.
My comments. A cold 20 grade oil is thinner (when cold) than a straight 30 oil. A HOT 50 weight oil is a LOT thinner than a COLD 30 ( a hot 50 is
about 15 centistokes and a cold 30 is about 180 centistokes), so when thinking about the size of the oil galleries and flow rates, there is absolutely
no reason NOT to use a 20w50 multigrade. The 20 number indicates a thin-when-cold oil for easy starts, and the 50 number indicates a
thins-less-when-hot oil for good lubricating flim thickness in a hot engine.
VW started recommending multigrades in the late 70s (when the multigrades started getting good) - just about the time we stopped getting aircooled VWs
in Aus.
> Rule 2 - If previously you haven't used a detergent oil then don't swap to one until after a rebuild. It will remove the scunge holding
it all together and allow movement to occur in what was previously a well sealed mill.
What you say is quite correct Bronze, but these days ALL motor oils are high detergent oils. The only non-detergent oils readily available are
two-stroke oils, (these are non-detergent because they are burned in the combustion chamber and you don't want incombustible detergents gumming
up the spark plugs).
The VW engine should always use detergent oils - this means that all the crud is held in suspension in the oil so it can be flushed out at oil-change
time. The detergent prevents the crud sticking to the insides of the engine.
Read any VW Owner's Manual and you'll see a recomendation to use "HD" oils. HD means High Detergent - not Heavy Duty as some
folks think.
So don't worry about the detergent issue - just use any decent quality 20w50 (or straight 30 if you prefer) engine oil and change it at least
every 3000 miles - the VW engine will be quite happy.
In fact I've been using Castrol XLA for many years - this is a 20w60 (yes 60) oil, which works well with any VW engine having a few thousand
miles on it - I would not use it on a brand new rebuild, but it's great for keeping worn engines working a little longer (I've been driving
VWs for over 30 years, and have clocked over 1/2 a million kilometers in them - I keep log books).
And re vw54's comments about using Target or Woolies oil - these oils are made by the major oil manufacturers, though they may use cheaper
additives to keep the costs down. You may find that they loose viscosity (feel watery) after a few thousand miles, but if you change them more often
(as vw54 does) then they will still work fine.
As a VW mechanic friend of mine once said - "I have NEVER seen a VW engine fail because of the brand of oil used - but I've seen a few fail
because there wasn't ANY brand of oil in the sump!"
In other words, the VW is not critical when it comes to engine oil brands - just remember to keep it topped up as needed, and change it at least every
3000 miles - best insurance for long life you can give a VW engine.
Regards
Rob
Rob and Dave's aircooled VW pages
Repairs and maintenance for the home mechanic
http://www.geocities.com/aussiebug1970/ |
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Grey 57
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| posted on October 19th, 2002 at 06:26 PM |
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Well here's another one for you
My 1600 seems to be manufacturing its own oil. After a long run (like a cruise) I will check the oil level the following day. The levels sitting about
5 mil below the level. I will check it a again in a week and it will be 5 mil or more above the level. ??
Does the oil cooler hold the oil for a long time after you turn the engine off? Is this were the oil could be coming from?
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70AutoStik
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| posted on October 19th, 2002 at 09:43 PM |
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aussiebug - some interesting stuff there. Many years ago, I was searching for a non-multigrade oil for an old Ford (which was a bit "loose"
for MG oils,) and when I called Ampol, a freaky thing happened - they put me through to an actual technician. What this guy had to say was very
interesting, including the fact that he recommended _any_ major brand of MG oil! He could only give me the name of an Ampol and one other
"single" grade oil, however. The relevant point is that he suggested that the "no-name" oils are often produced by the lowest
bidder, somewhere in asia (then bottled in Australia so the lable will look good.) I don't know if this is true of any of the local cheapies,
but I'm a little wary of any oil that can't be traced back to it's source. One wonders what ever happened to the "recycled"
oils (filtered, and additives put back in,) which were the only oils this guy strongly recommended against (amidst a big lecture on using a quality
oil filter and changing the oil on time, or sooner in adverse conditions.)
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68AutoBug
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 posted on October 21st, 2002 at 08:58 PM |
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Best Oil...
I tried but couldn't post a reply to that topic.... I have changed over to CASTROL Magnatec 10w-40 Engine Oil.. It seems to be an excellent
oil with polymers to help reduce friction & wear, while the engine is warming up to operating temperature... It costs around $27 for 5 litres.
One thing I would NEVER do.... is Use CHEAP Oil.... If 5 litres of Engine oil costs under $12.00 You are looking for trouble by using it... I
really believe that You Do Get What You Pay for.
I did read somewhere, that Synthetic Engine Oil shouldn't be used until the engine is run in.... and anyway, it is a bit expensive to throw away
after 3,000 miles or 5,000 kms.... :o
[Edited on 21-10-2002 by 68AutoBug]
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
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aussiebug
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| posted on October 21st, 2002 at 11:30 PM |
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MOre oil in sump???
| Quote: | Originally
posted by Grey 57
My 1600 seems to be manufacturing its own oil. After a long run (like a cruise) I will check the oil level the following day. The levels sitting about
5 mil below the level. I will check it a again in a week and it will be 5 mil or more above the level. ??
Does the oil cooler hold the oil for a long time after you turn the engine off? Is this were the oil could be coming from?
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Grey57,
I'd be looking at the fuel pump if I were you, and having a good sniff of the oil on the dipstick.
The only way you can get MORE oil in the sump is for it to become contaminated with fuel - a leaking fuel pump diaphragm will sometimes do this.
You should always check the oil level the same way too - say in the morning before you start the engine. This ensures that all the oil that should be
in the sump IS there. If you measure it in the mornings (cold) you'll get a different reading to just after switching off - hot oil expands, and
some will still be clinging to the insides of the engine etc.
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Herbie Down Under
A.k.a.: Richard Graham
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 01:57 AM |
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I use Mobil 1 in my engine. Its 5w rating is excelent and it is very thin. The reason I use it is it is great in my engine but also I use no choke
on my 1640 and it takes a while to warm up. With the Mobil 1 its warm in a matter of mins. With the normal 20w stuff it takes a while longer. But
for $50 for 5 litres it is expensive BUT its the only oil to EXCEED the American standards where all the others just meet the standards. |
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vw54
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 07:27 AM |
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Grey 57
" My 1600 seems to be manufacturing its own oil. "
Yes i would be checking the fuel pump. I had this happen to me on a type 3 and it ended up flushing the sludge out of the bearings and causing a
knock.
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Baja Wes
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 08:32 AM |
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I have seen wear index tests on magnetec and it performs pretty bad. Heaps of people have told me not to use it.
The oil I use is SJ/CF, which is a far superior grade to what is required for the VW, and it costs about $13 for 5litres.
I would recommend chosing a brand and sticking to it. By switching types of oils you are mixing them (not all oil is drained), so the additives from
one oil will get in the other oil and you never can tell just what effect that will have. If you stick to the same brand you won't have that
problem.
[Edited on 21-10-2002 by Baja Wes]
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 Bizarre
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 08:36 AM |
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Yep
check it........ quickly
I have heard terrible stories about contamination and fires with this problem
Futue te ipsum!!!
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68AutoBug
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 02:33 PM |
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Wes,
Where did You read that Magnatec is NO Good...? I have only read the Castrol literature.. I used to use the XLD Super with the gold label....plus
NULON in My last Lancer .. I think I have a couple of 5L containers in the shed. I also have 4 x 5L of Magnatec too. I have noticed in My 2001 1.8L
16V Lancer that the engine is much quieter with the Magnatec compared with the Valvoline the Mitsubishi Dealer uses. I would be greatful for some
more info on Magnatec Wes... good or Bad.!!:o and Yes I also believe that Once You have selected an Oil ... Stick to it I was
thinking of using a Shell oil a couple of Years ago, it was a semi synthetic oil - like mineral & synthetic oil mixed together.!!..:o As someone
said... It depends on how much Your engine is worth to You.... After thinking about that.... Maybe We ALL should be using Mobil 1 !! I Have always used an oil Additive in My Cars gearboxes-Diffs etc... I
have been using NULON - Aussie made with Teflon- for about 10 years Now- with NO Problems..
:thumb
[Edited on 22-10-2002 by 68AutoBug]
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
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68AutoBug
A.k.a.: Lee Noonan
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 posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 03:47 PM |
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Help Me Wes
I won't be able to sleep tonight Wes, unless You can tell Me
that Castrol Magnatec IS Better Oil than Woolies Home Brand or Bi Lo oil...
and Yes, the bit about NOT using a high Detergent Oil is NO longer Valid... unless You have made a machine that takes the Detergent Out of the
Oil!!
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
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Alita
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| posted on October 24th, 2002 at 02:32 AM |
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Anyone here use Penrite? I use it for my Beetle - it rather expensive though.
Someone suggested using Repco but it was a little too watery for my Beetle and it didn't like it. |
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gearboxless
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| posted on October 24th, 2002 at 09:14 AM |
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I use Penrite HPR30 in my bug. There's no way it is too watery, I even remember someone saying it has the consistency of syrup, although they may
have been talking about that superthick HPR50 stuff used dodgy brothers car yards for cars with 'well-worn' tolerances.
I used to use K-Mart's Motorpro KMX $13 jobby, and the pressure seems to be better with the Penrite (same 20-50), however this thread coupled
with the price of the Penrite may force me back to the KMX. If you want to stick with Penrite though, try to buy a 20L drum when Super Cheap has one
of those 10-15% off days on long W/Es and it works out significantly cheaper.
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Baja Wes
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| posted on October 24th, 2002 at 12:01 PM |
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I have seen a wear index test performed (by QUT) on various big brand oils and magnetic didn't fair too well at all. I will try to get a copy.
If the engine sounds quieter it probably just means the oil is thicker.
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Grey 57
A.k.a.: Dean
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| posted on October 24th, 2002 at 12:11 PM |
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Ended up using Valvoline XLD Plus 20/50. Looked at the SJ/CF but decided that a thin oil may not be the best for an engine of unknown mileage.
Don't too many heating probs in Melb.
Oils must be a lot cheaper outside of Vic, the Repco price for SJ/CF was $29.95!!!:o
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Baja Wes
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| posted on October 24th, 2002 at 12:14 PM |
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here's something funny regarding oil additives being crap
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1996/9607/slick.htm
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Baja Wes
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| posted on October 24th, 2002 at 12:22 PM |
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and the engine oil bible for those bored people.
http://www.fernblatt.com/longhurst/engineoil_bible.html
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Grey 57
A.k.a.: Dean
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| posted on October 24th, 2002 at 12:58 PM |
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Interesting stuff long read tho. Did'nt realise about petrol and the dangers of hydro carbons passing into the blood stream. Was servicing the
oval yesterday and washing parts in petrol and got a fiar bit on my hands as you do. Woke up this morning with what can only be described as a
hangover headache. Will be using rubber gloves in the future I think
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70AutoStik
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| posted on October 25th, 2002 at 12:06 AM |
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Hey, good article - but why didn't they take action many years ago?
Also, I have a bit of a problem with the second article - it only recommends oils for use at ambient temperatures up to 40C, it's gotten well
above that every day for the last week or two! (and my boss' wife has driven her '70 every day and it sounds just fine to me, even when it
was 47...)
[Edited on 24-10-2002 by 70AutoStik]
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