| [ Total Views: 1637 | Total Replies: 21 | Thread Id: 20238 ] |
|
|
 shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 08:05 PM |
|
|
Type 3 weight?
Anyone know the weight of a late square back.
How quick would it be with 400hp?
We may just find out.... 
btw my slide calc says 10.40 @128 with 2500 lbs probably a bit optimistic but has anyone got a better idea on the weight? |
|
|
Cam
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1535
Threads: 187
Registered: August 27th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Melbourne
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: addicted
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 08:13 PM |
|
|
Late squares are about 1200KG from memory. Somehow I think they're more tho, since thats the weight of most brand new supercars.
|
|
|
shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 08:16 PM |
|
|
Holy crap! i heard about 960kg |
|
|
vwrallycar
A.k.a.: Andrew Rankin
Insano Dub Head
Posts: 721
Threads: 83
Registered: September 2nd, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Rockhampton, Queensland
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Black
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 08:24 PM |
|
|
yeah my 73 wagon says 1200 kg
|
|
|
Cam
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1535
Threads: 187
Registered: August 27th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Melbourne
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: addicted
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 08:31 PM |
|
|
Yeah, thats why I sold my early fastback. Shallow are'nt I? LOL
|
|
|
shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 08:42 PM |
|
|
Hmmm, Not encouraging but I might try it anyway, nothing to lose except ring and pinion sets  |
|
|
Kai.A.
Fahrvergnugen
Posts: 915
Threads: 76
Registered: September 29th, 2003
Member Is Offline
Location: Adelaide
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: dubless...
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 09:01 PM |
|
|
what's your planned route to end up with 400hp?
i've got a '67 square which hopefully will end up being quite fast once i've spent a small fortune on it (read: sometime in the distant
future  )
10.4 seems very optimistic tho, maybe if you found a way of getting really good traction....
kai
|
|
|
Cam
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1535
Threads: 187
Registered: August 27th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Melbourne
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: addicted
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 09:19 PM |
|
|
1200kg + RWD + Rear Engine = flippin fantastic traction. And self flippin ring and pinion  :thumb
|
|
|
Kai.A.
Fahrvergnugen
Posts: 915
Threads: 76
Registered: September 29th, 2003
Member Is Offline
Location: Adelaide
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: dubless...
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 09:22 PM |
|
|
i was just thinking that you generally can't fit a lot of ruber under the arches, with 400hp i think it'd spin the wheels loads....
at least with a bug you can have wider wings and huge rubber!
kai
|
|
|
 vw54
Super Administrator
Always Waiting 4 Friday
Posts: 16723
Threads: 378
Registered: August 26th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Sunny Sydney
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Oval resto ongoing
|
| posted on March 11th, 2004 at 11:06 PM |
|
|
| Quote: |
btw my slide calc says 10.40 @128 with 2500 lbs probably a bit optimistic
|
YOUR SLIDE RULE ------ LIES
If you can get a Type 3 down to 500 Kgs then may be with a 400 HP @ the wheels engine U might get downs to 10s ... But lot s of luck and the
first carton of CROWNIES is on me... just show me the time card.
No bull ive been Drag racing for quite a few years,,,, so i dont have a probnlem shouting U the beer,
WE have a 700 odd KG 1670LBs car and it aint got into the 10s as yet....
Please keep me informed.
|
|
|
Cam
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1535
Threads: 187
Registered: August 27th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Melbourne
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: addicted
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 06:04 AM |
|
|
Anything is possible. Some car journo's recently got the SEL600 Renntech tuned Mercedes into the 10's. And thats deep inot the 2+ tonne mark
with 600HP.
I think it will take you ALOT of testing and merciless updating of parts as you go, read: $$$
As for the wide tires... Have you got someone who is good at panel work? You can always widen the inner guard (that seals off the bellow intakes) and
then massage out the rear guards.
There is a full weight daily driven, type 1, NA early notch in the states that pulls mid 11's.
Don't ask me for a link tho, only seen it in VW trends. Peehaps place a want-ad for some online info at thesamba.com
|
|
|
AdrianH
Officially Full-On Dubber
Posts: 257
Threads: 20
Registered: March 5th, 2004
Member Is Offline
Location: New Zealand
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: rebuilding again
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 09:12 AM |
|
|
With 450 hp (nitrous) the guys from VW paradise are into the 9's, why wouldnt 400 hp make 10s ??
It would need a bit of a diet, and a mendeola trans (chi ching !!!)
|
|
|
Cam
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1535
Threads: 187
Registered: August 27th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Melbourne
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: addicted
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 10:09 AM |
|
|
Theres no reason why you could'nt at all. You would just have to work it through on paper first and use what new technology and info is
available.
It astounds me still that VW's are doing 12 seconds 1/4 miles. People reckon this is great because now we're racing Hondas and WRX's
that are'nt doing any better. But I have 30+ y.o mags with VW's eating alive V8's that are doing those times. Classic example, look at
the DKP cars. Using old school technology right down to the last nut and bolt and are running the times that they cars they're based upon used to
as well.
There is a NA street driven, full weight typeIV powered 1303 in Germany running 10's. With driver and fuel it would have to be close, if not over
the killer tonne.
Most quick 1/4 cars unless fully tubbed are building flat torquey motors. We see this constantly; A quick car changes hands and for the next few years
all the new owners do is bump up the HP... Big time.! With minimal results for their efforts.
|
|
|
shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 06:38 PM |
|
|
Not sure on your Logic there VW54 but a 500 kg car is 1100 pounds an that would be quick! somewhere in the eights I would imagine! BTW The car I have
at the moment ran 9.65 with 400 hp (flywheel)and about 1650 lbs race ready, Slide rule is about 1/2 second optimistic but only 2 mph faster. Gearboxes
are a concern and a mendeola is out of the question but I do have some great assistance when it comes to building boxes |
|
|
vw54
Super Administrator
Always Waiting 4 Friday
Posts: 16723
Threads: 378
Registered: August 26th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Sunny Sydney
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Oval resto ongoing
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 06:54 PM |
|
|
| Quote: |
btw my slide calc says 10.40 @128 with 2500 lbs probably a bit optimistic
|
Yr quoting 2500 lbs not 1100 wheres the 1100 come into it ????
Yes i agree 500 KG car with 400HP at the wheels would proberly go into the 10s for sure, maybe even 9s
This is Rods old car isnt it ??? Have you got the Scat engine sorted ???
|
|
|
shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 07:08 PM |
|
|
Yeah, rods old car, What Scat engine? |
|
|
shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 07:10 PM |
|
|
You said get a t3 down to 500 kg, Thats 1100 lbs, a bit lighter than I could manage!:o |
|
|
vw54
Super Administrator
Always Waiting 4 Friday
Posts: 16723
Threads: 378
Registered: August 26th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Sunny Sydney
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Oval resto ongoing
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 07:20 PM |
|
|
No we have a wires crossed here
yes a 500 Kg car with 400 at the wheels would be quick
An 2500 LB car as you said in the first post with 400 wouldnt be as quick...
Dosent matter as long as were havin fun n racing
Didnt Rods old car have a Scat engine,.... werent you selling all the other bits ???
|
|
|
shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 07:50 PM |
|
|
Rods car had all sorts of engines, but I was building my own. Not selling most of it anymore as finances have improved!
I think Ill go ahead with this idea of the squareback just because its different, itll still be quick , but not as quick as the race car obviously.
Shame it wont be ready for nationals or id start a betting pool on it! will it go under 11.00 or not? place yer bets! |
|
|
speedster356
A.k.a.: Peter Mcleod
Custom Title Time!
Plastic not Classic Racing
Posts: 1624
Threads: 256
Registered: August 25th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: CHRIST church NZ
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Producing boost again in NZ
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 09:01 PM |
|
|
It's one thing people like at the drags and that's something different. A squareback would be sweet. :thumb
I know of a fibreglass one piece speedster shell in nZ.
[Edited on 12-3-2004 by speedster356]
Spyder-WISD 07-09-05 11.6s @ 125 MPH
Speedster-WISD Nats 05 14.4s @ 89 MPH
Jet cruiser-Coogee 22-09-05 900 deg C @ 110,000 rpm
Weaseling out of things is what separates us from the animals....................Except the Weasel.
|
|
|
1303Steve
A.k.a.: Steve Carter
Scirocco Rare
Posts: 8636
Threads: 559
Registered: August 27th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Sydney, NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Parrot Heading
|
| posted on March 12th, 2004 at 09:07 PM |
|
|
This is what the Berg calculator said, this is a setup with ieal traction and gear ratios etc, but its still a guess.
You have selected ET for the 1/4 mile
Enter the weight of the car. ? 2500 (1133.98 kg)
Enter the sea level horsepower ? 400
Enter the altitude of the track ? 0
The sea level E.T. should be 10.73
The MPH should be about 122.1 to 127.0
|
|
|
shiftyvw
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 523
Threads: 44
Registered: September 11th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Seven Hills NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on March 13th, 2004 at 09:16 PM |
|
|
The gearing will be close to perfect whatever i build so it shouldnt be too far off if the weight and power are honest.
BTW I need a Good type 3 exhaust for a different car, Anyone know where I can get a big one? 1 5/8 or larger? need one before the nationals. |
|
|
66fastback
Casual Dubber
Posts: 32
Threads: 3
Registered: February 6th, 2004
Member Is Offline
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: waiting for tha
|
| posted on March 15th, 2004 at 03:56 PM |
|
|
http://www.tvwdra.org/programs/hp.htm
This sums up the above quite nicely.
I put in the fastback details, based on 2500lbs.
The car has run a 14.8. I then got it to calc the mph at 90. This is correct.
I then asked for the HP and it comes out at 153.
I am happy about this now. I think the car can do a 14.6-14.5. Just need suspension tuning.
My car is heavier too as I have a 6point roll cage and geabox bracing. That puts me closer to the 150hp- 170hp at the flywheel. That makes more
sense on where the engine is.
Now if I put that engine in to a bug at 890kgs that would get me a 13.2@101mph.
I'd rather get the fastback to that time than put the engine in to a bug. It's all fun stuff though.
[Edited on 15-3-2004 by 66fastback]
|
|
|
Cam
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1535
Threads: 187
Registered: August 27th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Melbourne
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: addicted
|
| posted on March 16th, 2004 at 06:31 PM |
|
|
Not to mention fastbacks are heaps more aerodynamic than beetles anyway.
|
|
|
