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 RainbowFarmer
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 posted on December 30th, 2004 at 02:25 AM |
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Valves
Ugh... Could someone please advise us what this means... and what to do next...:o
The first valve on the 3rd cylinder seems to be seized shut (can't get the feeler gauge in it, and have not tried to force anything) and the second
has free play when set.:duh
This little "project" is getting a tad tricky.... any help here would be great.
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Andy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 10:06 AM |
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Some more details would be nice, what engine, what car, stock or modified, inlet or exhaust valve?
Just a general answer, I assume you have the engine in the correct position (TDC for the cylinder you are check)?? If so for an air cooled VW valve
seats can recess into the head causing the valve gap to close. All other wear opens the gap.
If it's recessing, but still runs OK, set the gap a little above spec and monitor it frequently (every 100klm or so) and check your not over heating.
If the gap remains stable you may be OK, if not your up for a new head. Also always check with the engine at "room temp"
Good luck.
Richard 
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 11:35 AM |
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1600 unoriginal motor - but standard... one of those replacement ones.
How do I set the gap when it is siezed shut? I was setting them to .006m but the gap is closed.
What do you mean by "all other wear" opens it? Should I try putting on a bikini and scaring it open? :P
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Andy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 11:47 AM |
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Hehehehe, make sure no one's watching if you try the bikini. We'll need photo evidence though, I'm sure it will work. :party
Stock 1600 heads are be pretty good unless they've been re-built heaps of times or are running hot.
By siezed shut do you mean you can't push the valve in, or just that the gap is now zero?
If it's still running I guess the gap (valve to adjusting screw)is zero, then just back the screw off until it free's up and set the correct gap.
Bad wording I guess, by "all other wear" I mean things like warn adjusting screw, warn cam etc will cause the valve gap to open up (not move the
valve)
Oh and I hope you mean .006"
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 12:21 PM |
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Will find you a photo mate - promise. I have backed the screw off and can't get the feeler gauge in to set the gap. Backing off the screw, doesn't
free up the gap (as it sposed to...)
And the other one can be set, but wobbles around a fraction, so won't stay set at the gap... I'll check the screw on that one... but it seemed to go
back together allright, just wobbled about once its all done up again.
...It didn't respond at all to the bikini.
Does the motor have to come out to fix this? And where do I go from here?... Can they be replaced individually? We live in the middle of no-where and
the nearest VW mechanic I know of is about 500km away...
Am really gonna need your :sandrine help here mate...
How come we don't have a smiley in a bikini pulling hair out and looking very confused?
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Andy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 12:42 PM |
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Can't wait for the pic now :jesus
I was sure it would have done the trick! Maybe a one piece is better? We'll need pics again.
Was it running before the little "project" was started? If so did it run OK? If not symptoms?
If the screws backed off all the way and still tight I would first guess you don't have the cylinder at TDC. If it's that far out you'd be posting
a different question like there's a hole in your piston or there's bit's of valve coming out the exhaust or something.
If it was running, flip the distributor cap off and make sure the rotor is pointing to where the No 3 lead goes to, and your on the TDC mark, not the
timing mark on the pully.
I don't think it's all that major, so don't worry how to replace just yet.
Your right though, there's a few smilies missing from the list 
I thought you'd have a few more opinions from others by now though?
[Edited on 30-12-2004 by Andy]
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 01:37 PM |
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Sent em all sneak previews of the bikini shot....
I think they've fainted or something. :puke
Yes the precious-all-my-dreams-came-true-thing is running, but roughly. Backfiring under deceleration and increased load. Not huge bangs,
just a popping kind of backfire. Not much power and it has become hard to start now.
That's about it... Thanks for being there.
Such is life
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Andy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 02:40 PM |
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:thumb :thumb
Just don't take the bikini off, that's goin' too far!!!
So is that a vw thing as in 181/182? Just leave it with me and I'll fix if for you, free of charge even! (no guarantees of you gettin' it back
though).
So I guess it's the inlet valve (center valve, not outside one)?
I still don't think it's that terminal until you find out a bit more, maybe just allow for a "valve job" some time soon.
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Chewy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 05:05 PM |
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You do have No 3 cylinder on the rock (valve opened changing from exhaust to inlet) and No 1 at TDC on the compression sroke right?
Not TDC on the rock on No 1?
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 06:37 PM |
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Mmm.
Just went and checked and yes... I'm pretty sure I'm doing what you said Chewy.... lining up the fan belt pully with the top dead centre mark...?
Don't know what the rock is though... There are two marks on the pully... one is 360 and the other 180... that right?
Dunno what Rich means either...by 181/182? It is a 75 Kombi with a replacement 1600 engine (accordin to some site somewhere where I looked up the
number...)
The nut comes right back but the valve won't move... tried tapping it... nuffin. Seems stuck fast. The pushrod (rod thing down the bottom that pushes
out onto the metal thingy) must be jammed maybe? Cos it just seems locked in too far up the top... and won't move. Is this making sense? Tried taking
a pic, but there wasn't enough light.... but maybe you know have the idea? All the others were no problem. Just this one.
Just allow me a little time for me to interpret your tech talk, apply it to the manual (work out what you are talking about) and then look at the
motor again... Did I also mention I am blonde?... Afraid so.
So - is it still something with the lining up? Or is something buggered? No idea.
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Chewy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 08:02 PM |
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Sorry my last post was a but confusing, don't worry about the rocking for now.
Just take the dizzy cap off and make sure the rotor is pointing at the No 1 cylinder lead.
That should make sure you have the No 1 cylinder on the compression stroke which means that both the valves on No 1 cylinder will be closed.
IF there is still no play betweem the valve and tappet then you may have a problem.
Good luck
Chewy
[Edited on 30-12-2004 by Chewy]
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 08:38 PM |
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Ummm. I have been setting the rotor to the number 3 cylinder... It is the number three cylinders that are causing grief.
Should it all be done with rotor on 1??? Is that it?
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Chewy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 09:10 PM |
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Whooooooops.. I meant 3
sorry..
Ill be quiet now :blush
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 09:44 PM |
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Aw. Tis alright chewy.
Long as we are both talking about the same thing...
Your sig says you threw a rod... do they actually sieze?... Have you heard of them jamming like this? If so, what is the next step?
Am going to go do a search and see if I can find anything on it.
Thanks for your help. Hopefully, Richard was right, and we will stumble across some way to free it up. Am still worried that the motor will have to
come out to work on this... does anyone know?
Such is life
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Chewy
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| posted on December 30th, 2004 at 09:58 PM |
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Depends what the problem is, if its just a dead valve you can take the heads off while the engine is in the car. It would still be a dog to get the
head off tho.
If its something like a jammed cam-follower (bit that pushes on the push-rod) then you would have to remove the engine and split the case, but I doubt
that would be the case as the rocker would be at an angle opening the valve 24/7.
Yea my engine threw a rod, literally, into the side of the crank case. You can see the results in my avatar.
the rod got crushed between the crank and cam-followers, got bent in 5 different ways :duh
You should take ya dub down to the local garage and get them to have a look see I reckon.
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 31st, 2004 at 01:36 AM |
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Ooookay. Next Question...:duh
Our nearest VW mechanic is over 100km away. Is it going to be okay to run it like it is? Can/will they run on 3 cylinders without further buggering
them up? Or should we be looking at towing it over?
We did limp into the RACQ dude about 30km away a couple of days ago and he was a right prick... had no idea or respect for the
precious-piece-of-peace-provoking-art/rolling-history-machine....too busy going on about it being stubby-time. He is the same der head that told us
the last van had "had it" and once we deregistered and retired it as a goats cubby, a mate called up and said "Not so!"...
So a tad hesitant about interrupting his liquid lunch again...
You think we would be considered mobile... or should we piggy-back it over to town?
Such is life
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last celtic warrior
A.k.a.: Steve Barnes
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| posted on December 31st, 2004 at 06:31 PM |
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Umm, this is starting to sound rather scary... Which I hope it isn't, for your sake Rainbow.
While the rocker cover is off, rotate the motor (the crankshaft pully, not the whole engine. LOL) and watch the valves open and close on number 3.
It's real easy if you just park on a level surface, pop the Dub in 4th gear and push it a little to make the motor turn over.
If the valves are going up and down, that's a start. Next, unbolt the rocker assembly from the head and remove it. If either valve stem tries to come
out with it, start panicing. What this would mean is that the valve has lost it's head, which would mean it's probably become part of the piston
now... Alternatively, if the valve stem is still held firmly in place but the thing protrudes a little further than the other one, then it's
"valve seat recession" and that's pretty bad too, but not quite so devistating. In any case, check things over more before driving it
anywhere...
I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. And if I'm right, can I have a piccy of you doing the repairs in ya bikini? (I just got the nastiest look from
my fiance that I've ever seen cloud over her usually beautiful face. Yes, she's watching me type my death warrant here)
P.S. If it's not too much trouble, can you combine the bikini and one piece options by just wearing only one piece of your bikini? (OK, I think
tonight's the night I die):bounce
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RainbowFarmer
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| posted on December 31st, 2004 at 07:58 PM |
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Just got your message and have been out in the yards today, so will do this tomorrow. Thanks heaps - hopefully this will help work out exactly what is
amiss.
If you are still alive tomorrow (and your missus-to-be hasn't chewed you up too much) I'll let ya know what results. Me thinks this sounds like it
might lead to a "flowers, chocolates and down on ya knees mister!" job...
but you asked for it, so just do it (*winking at fiance*)
Do appreciate your help though... and will let you know what happens.
***Fingers, legs and eyes crossed***
Such is life
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Andy
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| posted on January 1st, 2005 at 09:24 AM |
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Hey,
I'm back again. Sorry you still have'nt got it sorted.
Following what "last celtic warrior" said will help you know what's happening. You could also do this with the motor in neutral and have some one
turn the motor by the pully (or spanner on either the crank pully nut ot generator/alternator nut).
As he say's it sounds like valve seat recession (you would have heard bigger noises if the valve end broke off).
As for the 181/182 comment, a VW "thing" is an actual VW model and had the 1600 motor in it. the model code was 181 or 182.
Good luck!
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