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 bajaben
A.k.a.: Ben Alderson
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| posted on April 11th, 2006 at 06:08 PM |
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aerodynamics
I need help with ideas, i got a bug eye baja and at anything higher than 80km/h it is quite unstable, i think its cause of the guards sitting up in
the air as they do. it also takes alot to push it up to any speed over abour 60. i was looking at getting a stock beetle shell and transfering it onto
the old floor pan but haven't got the money right now. If anyone has any ideas to try and keep it on the ground better i would love to hear it as im
about to put a mild 1916cc in there instead of the super mild 1776cc that currently pushes it along so i think the speeds will be increased alot very
quickly.
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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tassupervee
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| posted on April 11th, 2006 at 07:49 PM |
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To get the thing more stable, you need to lower it, stiffen it (suspension), lower profile wider tyres, rack and pinoin steering and so-on.
This will effectively render it functionally useless as an off-road jigger, which it is.
The opposite would be true if I wanted to off-road in my F-Vee, Id have to raise it, soften it, higher, narrower tyres blah blah blah. this would
render it useless as a circuit race car.
Its really a case for "horses for courses"
You may be able to settle somewhere in between and get a compromise of sorts.
Bottm line is that you will "take from Peter and give to Paul" and the car will be neither particularly good on bitumen or dirt.
You need to ask yourself the question, what do I want out of my Baja? If its bitumen performance, then unload a lot of dollars on suspension upgrades,
wheels, tyres and rack and pinion steering.
You can make your toy very agile on the road no question, but it will be close to useless on the dirt!
If you never off-road it than go for it.
Have fun widdit!
L8tr
E
Im not a complete idiot, quite a few parts are missing....
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bajaben
A.k.a.: Ben Alderson
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| posted on April 11th, 2006 at 08:57 PM |
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i got it when i was like 17 so i didn't know what i wanted so i turned it into a baja, its not for off road i just like the look of it. its already
for wider tires and they are about the same profile as stock vw wheels so its fairly low for a baja. when i get the disc brake kit it will be lowed a
little, and the sway bar on the front and the camber compensator on the back will help the handling. what im after is better aerodynamics so that its
not trying to lift itself off the ground at anything over about 60 or 70. i though about getting a set of wide eye guards and putting them on as they
are less open than the bug eyes ones. is there anything else that i can do to keep the front end down?
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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bajaben
A.k.a.: Ben Alderson
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 04:49 PM |
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come on guys and girls. i need oppinions, everyone has one of them.
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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oval TOFU
Son of Jim - Creator of Good
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 04:59 PM |
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I'm thinking your front guards will be acting like massive air brakes at anything over 60kph...
...and Robert's ya father's brother...
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bajaben
A.k.a.: Ben Alderson
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 05:05 PM |
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yeah that what im thinking, so is there any ideas on what i can put on to stop that happening. i wish i would put stock style guards back on but
can't. any ideas on the wide eye baja guards. would they be any better?
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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oval TOFU
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 05:24 PM |
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I think you can get guards that come over the front a bit more, but not as much as stock ones.. maybe chase up a pair of those...
...and Robert's ya father's brother...
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modulus
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 05:38 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by bajaben
come on guys and girls. i need oppinions, everyone has one of them.
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Here's mine. At speeds up to say 90 kph,, aero effects should not be enough to unsettle your Baja. I know that, for example, Baja Wes cruises his
Baja at 100+ kph and doesn't complain of instability, and that's with a "Thing" raised front beam. What you should be looking at is whether you
front end is in good nick, with no worn components, shocks OK, steerig box not sloppy, etc It might be worth getting a front end alignment at a VW
specialist. A little looseness in the fornt suspension/steering is *much* more likely to contribute to stability problems at speeds of up to 100 kph
than aero, even though you have jumped to the opposite conclusion.
Above 100 kph, as TasSV said above, it's a compromise; a Baja is not primarliy designed for high-speed cruising. However, it sounds like you don't
have a radical off-road only version, so it should track properly at up to and beyond 100 kph.
hth
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bajaben
A.k.a.: Ben Alderson
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 05:58 PM |
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Wes has the wide eye and the guards on that come over a little more, thats what im trying to get at. because mine almost stop when they are just
starting to come back over they have more area to grab air. the front end is all fairly new and tight except the steering box. i just don't
understand why the car seems to hit a wall when at about 70. accelerates fairly well till then but starts to almost struggle to get to 100 and above
120 takes ages to get there.
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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oval TOFU
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:04 PM |
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frontal area buddy! and that includes the air that gets channeled under your guards!
...and Robert's ya father's brother...
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modulus
A.k.a.: Peter Hill
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:04 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by bajaben
.. the car seems to hit a wall when at about 70...
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In aerodynamics terms, 70 kph is very low; the aerodynamic effect at that speed will be trivially small.
Run a series of timed 0-100 kph runs, then take your fron guards off and run another series. You'll find little difference.
hth
[ Edited on 12-4-06 by modulus ]
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bajaben
A.k.a.: Ben Alderson
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:06 PM |
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cheers. so when the worked 1916 goes in it should easily go past 100? i have only ever got just over 140 with this engine but im hoping the new one
should at least get me to 160 or 180
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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oval TOFU
Son of Jim - Creator of Good
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:08 PM |
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yeh, should be easier.. you'll just be sucking down the juice though
...and Robert's ya father's brother...
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bajaben
A.k.a.: Ben Alderson
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:18 PM |
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juice doesn't bother me, if i use it fast at least it stays fresh :P i just don't want to take it down the quarter and have it slowing down towards
the end because of the guards.
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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modulus
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:18 PM |
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Your intial stated problem was:
"i got a bug eye baja and at anything higher than 80km/h it is quite unstable"
It might be wise to attend to that before the land speed record attempt.
Good luck with it.
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bajaben
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:21 PM |
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well if its not the guards then it might be the steering box. and as the front end is tight and reconed then ill get the steering done. im getting a
sway bar and a camber compensator and disc brakes with dropped spindles so that will also help. im not gonna take it down the quarter till its safe
to. cheers for all the help
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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oval TOFU
Son of Jim - Creator of Good
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:22 PM |
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take off ya guards and go for a blat and that should get rid of one variable... it's not legal of course...
...and Robert's ya father's brother...
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bajaben
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| posted on April 12th, 2006 at 06:23 PM |
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its regoed as a 1600 so no problem about legality haha
trunk monkey, because sometime getting your car back just isn't enough
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oval TOFU
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| posted on April 13th, 2006 at 01:52 AM |
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nah, you need to have your wheels covered... ie: no open wheelers a la Formula 1...
too bad joe joe!
...and Robert's ya father's brother...
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4ThALaStTiMe
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| posted on April 13th, 2006 at 04:22 AM |
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check your front end....
Tie rods, king pins, steering box... whatever...
the guards won't make any difference..
I have a baja that sits a LONG way off the deck and is more than happy at 120...!!! (because the front end is in good condition)...
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shaihulud
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| posted on April 14th, 2006 at 06:36 AM |
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I'm intruiged by this thread. The Beetle body in stock form is aerodynamically stable at speeds of over 160 klicks, so your problem could well be the
air dam effect of your front mudguards. Maybe you could rice it up a bit with a big wanker wing on the front to give you down force. If you fitted it
in front of the big gap in your front mudguards that faces forwards and acts as an air brake, you might get the effect that you need and it would not
get in the way off road.
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DubCrazy
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| posted on April 14th, 2006 at 07:09 AM |
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i had a bugeyed and never had any stability problems i used to hit 120/30 daily .I am guessing you have worn parts on the front end causing it to
vibrate and wobble. i know when my lickpins became worn i used to get wicked wheel wobble where it had to much movement
the kit you have will make no difference at the speeds your talking about look else where for your problem as the guards are not it!!!!
............ steff...............
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Life with out a v-dub is no life at all!!!!!
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boof2332
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| posted on May 23rd, 2006 at 10:16 PM |
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I have a set of the wide eye guards if your looking. I know that my front end stability was compromised by the lowered front end. If you back
suspension is higher than your front then it will be unstable..The more rake you have on your front suspension, the more high speed stability you will
have.I had to put the spacers behind the bottom beam to push the front end foward at the bottom. Not sure if this relates to your baja, although worth
a look. Your tyres, alignment, balance and as said before....simply worn bits, could be the problem.
Good luck
Matt
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