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 karmann54
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| posted on May 28th, 2003 at 09:20 PM |
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36HP twin carb kits
Has anyone had any experience fitting dual carbs to a 36HP motor? There were a few kits using two 28PCI carbs. What are they like? What jetting
should be used? Does anyone know where I could find some manifolds etc.
I am more after the vintage speed look rather than any huge performance increase. As I need to rebuild the engine, I could install a mild cam as
well. Any benefits/problems there? I have a '54 oval cabrio, so the extra weight tends to slow it down a bit.
Any comments on peoples experiences would be appreciated, as I will need to be building up a motor in the next couple of months.
Angus (Brisbane)
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Grey 57
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| posted on May 28th, 2003 at 09:42 PM |
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good question. I'm interested in this mod too.
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type82e
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| posted on May 28th, 2003 at 11:47 PM |
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there was an article in one of the last aussie veedub magazines on an appendix J racer here in australia running an oval beetle and he had a fully
worked 36 hp motor I think he was getting 115 MPH out of it?
cant find it right now but somebody else must have a copy handy
I think stan pobjoy had a hand in it as well as a company called 36hp racing? not sure
marcel
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 vw54
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 07:46 AM |
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There are 3 different type sets of Carbies for a 36hp.
1. The main one you find in Aussie is the Ken Virgin set that was made in Adelaide by Ken. The carbies as 28 picts ofa 36hp, and have differnt jets.
The carbies attach or sit on the mainfolds with the throttle shafts running across the car like the rear axles. These use 2 steel mainfolds, there
about 8 inches tall, and have a cross bar linkage that runs behind the fan housing. They work well and give the motor more torque.
2. theres another Aussie set similar to above, but uses alloy mainfolds marked left and right. The carbies sit at 90 degrees to the virgin set up.
The throttle shafts run from front to back, and use a cross linkage that sits in front in the fan and under generator.
3. this is a German made set I carnt remember the name, but it was sold with 2 mainfolds 1 air cleaner 1 carbie, and had short alloy mainfolds. You
had to use yr existing carbie and air cleaner.
Yes I had the virgin kit attached to my 56 Oval and its was great, I only removed it to fit a Judson.
I have a set of # 1s and 3s for 36hp complete and a set of virgins for a 40hp, but sorry there NOT for sale .
The Ken Virgins set perform better than the Judson, more torque and better responce.
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geodon
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 08:28 AM |
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I bought a kit decades ago for my 1st car- a Manly Tan oval. It was a George Reynolds kit. From memory, it had 2 aluminium manifolds & the carbs
(28PCI) mounted at right angles to the orig posn. It came with all the linkages but had no choke I think. I also have vague re-collections of jets etc
being included & a couple of pancake filters. On the question of choke, I think early Porsche 356's had no chokes anyway- the explanation
being: to start, pump the pedal to prime the engine via the accelerator pumps then let it warm up a bit before you drive off!
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vw54
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 09:15 AM |
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Geodon
Yeah thats the type number 2 kit i am describing, you maybe right there with George Reynolds... they would have to be an Aussie kit, Ive only ever
seen the mainfolds for sale and one actually fitted toa car. Carnt remember the air cleaners
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whatnow
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 11:15 AM |
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if anyone has a linkages for the 2nd kit (george reynolds?), i would be interested in getting photo's and dimensions for them as i have a set of
manifolds but no linkages.
thanks.
henry.
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whatnow
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 11:25 AM |
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type82e, there was a 58/9 (bigwindow)
car that used to run in group NA (part of the old appendix J).
of course his name has compleetely left my head...
the car had a 36hp. ported bigvalve heads (done by the drivers relitave), pobjoy CW crank, pobjoy cam (the same as in his 1916's), pobjoy sump,
homemade steel manifolds and linkages.
most of the 36hp parts have since been sold as he stepped up to a 40hp motor.
the heads and sump are now in a warm 36hp hopefully soon to be on the road (not my car unfortunately). the crank was unusable (the metalurgy of 36 hp
cranks wasn't quite up to scratch, i know 5 standard cranks were checked before an uncracked one was found for the fresh motor).
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karmann54
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 04:57 PM |
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Thanks for all the info so far. Am I correct in saying that all the kits mentioned above are straight bolt-ons, ie there is no bottom-end work to
cams etc.
Dave do you have some photos of your kits. If I can't find one I might try and make one up.
Angus
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whatnow
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 05:02 PM |
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just remembered... the guy who ran the race 36hp was alan challis (sp?).
karmann, i'll see what i can do about pics of the manifolds for you.
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karmann54
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 07:26 PM |
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whatnow
some photos would be great. Any chance of getting some measurements - height flange to flange, and offset of top flange to bottom flange.
Then I'll just need to figure out the linkages........
Angus
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Craig Torrens
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 07:46 PM |
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I bought the heads, anti surge sump and the carbies from Alan's motor.My 36hp motor is now complete and ready to run but I need to make/fit
linkages. The cam "whatnow" quoted is not quite correct, it has the similar rev range as Stan's 1916's, not the same. I have also
used the same grind as Alan. Give Stan Pobjoy a call for all the specs. Vintage Vw will also help with all the bearings, gaskets, seals etc
It must be the most expensive $perHp motor I will ever do !!!!
All in the name of fun !
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blk56
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 07:49 PM |
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there was a set of carbs on buy and sell :vader
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Grey 57
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 07:49 PM |
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what sorta horse power do you think it will make Craig.
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Craig Torrens
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| posted on May 29th, 2003 at 08:01 PM |
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???????????????
next dyno day, I will shred tyres :sandrine
Alan dyno tuned his so I will try and get you some figures.:thumb
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vw54
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 07:51 AM |
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heres a few pics
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vw54
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 07:51 AM |
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more
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vw54
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 07:53 AM |
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these are pics of the second set i mention
Lets call them George Reyonlds, not sure who made them but they work
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vw54
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 07:55 AM |
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just done some research. We believe that the alloy mainfolds were made also by Ken Virgin, I forgot the pics last post
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vw54
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 07:56 AM |
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forgot the pic AGAIN
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 kombi_kid
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 04:30 PM |
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what dont u have dave??????
cheers
rhys
it aint just cool its aircool'd
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karmann54
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 06:06 PM |
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I'm glad other people have a bit of an interest in this.
Dave
Can you take a photo of the linkage assembly, a close up of the connection to the carb and also the centre arrangement where it attaches to the
accelerator cable.
I am surprised at how tall and how much offset to the side the inlet manifolds have. height is probably to fit the linkages in, or make easy access
to the plugs?
I have a cheap Brazilian standard inlet manifold, that I might try cutting up to make the dual manifolds, just need to make an extra carby flange.
I also have two NOS 28PCI carbs that I will use. They will have standard jets, what size should they be?
Craig, I'll be interested to see how yours goes, how far away are you from starting her up?
I am only really aiming for a vintage look, but I think a mild cam would really help to use the extra carb. I'll try Stan Pobjoy for the cam
specs. However if I put a standard one in it means I can swap back to a stock motor easily.
I am a bit worried about height, as although my cabrio doesn't have the correct decklid now (it has louvres cut into a sedan lid) one day I hope
to find one. I don't want the carbs interfering with the cabrio rain guards.
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vw54
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 07:12 PM |
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Karmann54
Which type or set do you have. The pics aabove are of the type 2 set as described and i dont have any of the linkages for these.
I only have a set of linkages for the Ken Virgin set or type 1
and i have a set for the German carbies but they have shorter manifolds and would be different to the type 2 or George Reynolds.
But i will take some pics. I remember i measured the jets in the GErman set and made them to suit. I presumed that the Germans would have tested
there twin carby set and fuel air ratio would be right, and i was correct as they ran sweet.
I also had a Kombi 010 mechanical dissy and a set of Jack Brabham ?Lukey Ehaust system so the performance was enhanced.
I used the STOCK 36 hp cam and found it worked great. Dont think u need that
Rhys
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what dont u have dave??????
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Ive been collecting any playing with VWs twice as long as you have been born Rhys.
Sorry mate its a habit
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Craig Torrens
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 08:41 PM |
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Remember the crank is the weak link, so think long and hard before you attempt to extract any power from a 36 HP. I did it because I wanted the
ultimate 36 HP period race motor !!! :thumb
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Craig Torrens
A.k.a.: Craig Torrens
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| posted on May 30th, 2003 at 08:43 PM |
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thanks for the photo's Dave :thumb:thumb
keep em coming:beer
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karmann54
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| posted on May 31st, 2003 at 11:03 AM |
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Craig
I hear what you are saying about the crank. I think I will just go for the carb set-up alone and remain stock otherwise, except probably a 010
dizzy.
Dave
I don't have any set at all, only the carbs. Because of my concerns with height as far as the cabrio decklid rain trays, perhaps the shorter
german set is the way to go. Are you able to send some pictures and dimensions of that set - it would be much appreciated.
I think I would prefer the linkages to go in front of the fan housing as you look at the engine, for easier access. Is that how the german set goes?
Did you have any concerns with the virgin kit linkages going behind the housing?
There is a repro kit being made by a guy in the US, manifolds and linkages. It is a copy of the old EMPI kit. However it isn't cheap, I'd
like to look into doing my own first.
Angus
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