| [ Total Views: 5298 | Total Replies: 23 | Thread Id: 62832 ] |
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 whereisfelicity
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| posted on May 30th, 2007 at 09:29 PM |
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Rust Repairs / Respray
Hi everyone,
I've got a 69 notch which has some rust around the back window and a few other minor places / nothing major (i hope) that i want to get repaired. the
paint is in fairly bad condition and would be after a complete respray also.
anyone able to recomend somewhere / someone on the gold coast that would be willing to take on this sort of work ?
also what $$$ should i be expected to pay for a full respray ?
any help would be great .
Thanks,
Ben
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 30th, 2007 at 09:38 PM |
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a full respray is several-to-many thousand...
Pay your debts, CxxT
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supercharged 66
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| posted on May 31st, 2007 at 07:44 AM |
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Hi Ben, I know it is not on the coast, but I have my ghia in with a fellow in northgate Brisbane. He takes his time and does a really good job. He
has worked on quite a few vw's. His name is Brett Brackley, at Brackley Body works. 07 3256 6301. I would suggest to strip the car so it is easier
to see and get at the problems......Give him a call and he might be able to help...cheers zsolt brisbane.
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Dasdubber
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| posted on June 4th, 2007 at 07:34 PM |
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I've shot you a U2U Ben.
Alan
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kmesh
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| posted on October 5th, 2008 at 04:32 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by supercharged 66
Hi Ben, I know it is not on the coast, but I have my ghia in with a fellow in northgate Brisbane. He takes his time and does a really good job. He
has worked on quite a few vw's. His name is Brett Brackley, at Brackley Body works. 07 3256 6301. I would suggest to strip the car so it is easier
to see and get at the problems......Give him a call and he might be able to help...cheers zsolt brisbane.
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So can he strip the car out and refit it all, becuase i am looking at getting rust done in my beetle, and i would like the whole lot done
professionally, not by me. Do you know if he does that?
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 helbus
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| posted on October 5th, 2008 at 07:50 PM |
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Full respray being strip body to bare shell, remove all existing paint and substrates to bare metal, assess, repair any rust and paint using correct
and lasting procedures to lasting and quality finish often starts at $20,000.
You think of 250 hours work and what you would be charged fairly by a plumber, electrician, mechanic. Then think of lawyer, accountant, architect at
those hours. $20K is not so far out!
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rearengine
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 11:04 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by helbus
Full respray being strip body to bare shell, remove all existing paint and substrates to bare metal, assess, repair any rust and paint using correct
and lasting procedures to lasting and quality finish often starts at $20,000.
You think of 250 hours work and what you would be charged fairly by a plumber, electrician, mechanic. Then think of lawyer, accountant, architect at
those hours. $20K is not so far out!
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I will bite and say that I cannot agree and feel that this one of the many things that is wrong with our society.
I studied hard to do a job that supports people in the community services field, I and most of my colleagues earn between $20 -$30 an hour, with no
pay for overtime.
A car resto company charging a bug owner $80 an hour (even inclusive of overheads) is daylight robbery, especially when the sprayer is probably
getting between $18 to $27 an hour.
Dont get me wrong, Builders, lawyers, etc are also overpaid, but we are talking about the cost of a 250 hour respray.
For mine $40 dollars an hour at 180 hours should give me a pristine inside out job. I know that dont happen, but it should.
For people restoring bugs and 3s, etc, $20000 is just Bull$$% type pricing and morally unfair in my honest opinion.
We are not talking ferrari or classic porsche restos here and in the long run its just some greedy boss lining his own pockets. I know its a business,
but I prefer a business that doesnt rely on ripping people off to make themselves wealthy.
Having said this, I know there are reputable places that will do work for between $40-$50 an hour (and not slap on an extra 50 hours).
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helbus
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 11:33 PM |
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I know that I would not be doing a car for you where I work then. $75 per hour is a common trade rate. Good trade workers don't learn with a uni
degree, but EARN with skill, time, patience the ability to do a good job. Your job is to find the right person. Reputable places will charge $70-$80
an hour.
Personally at home I wont do it. Not even for $50 an hour. The time I could spend earning that money, I can spend with my family and be poor. Stick
your plasma TV's, central heating, jetski's, flight's and home theatre in another spot. I have family. Being in the poverty line and with them is a
warm feeling.
I appreciate what you do that supports people in the community services field. You just need to respray your own car if you are not happy with
tradespeople working on it. Supercheap Auto have supercheap tools, compressors, sprayguns, paint etc. if you want a super cheap job. Do it and post
pics of how you go with it, I am interested.
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DubCrazy
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| posted on October 10th, 2008 at 03:37 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by rearengine
A car resto company charging a bug owner $80 an hour (even inclusive of overheads) is daylight robbery, especially when the sprayer is probably
getting between $18 to $27 an hour.
For people restoring bugs and 3s, etc, $20000 is just Bull$$% type pricing and morally unfair in my honest opinion.
We are not talking ferrari or classic porsche restos here and in the long run its just some greedy boss lining his own pockets. I know its a business,
but I prefer a business that doesnt rely on ripping people off to make themselves wealthy.
Having said this, I know there are reputable places that will do work for between $40-$50 an hour (and not slap on an extra 50 hours).
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quite simply u get what u pay for, if u dont like the pricing then sure there are people around who will do it for a lower rate and in a few years
when ur bugs rusting up again and the paints starting to show signs of age the people who spent in ur terms "bullshit prices" will still be
smiling at how fantastic there car looks.
resto is just that, no matter the breed of car,bike,etc
Have u any idea of the costs for a bodyshop? i think u mite be suprised, its not a cheap game to be in and most owners/bosses are very fair with
there staff (not all i know) but a good name in this trade is a hard thing to achive and even harder to keep.
up to u mate u can pay the big bucks and get a good job or u can cut corners
go for the supercheap route and i will sit with helbus and be intrested to see the pics..
steff...................
Life with out a v-dub is no life at all!!!!!
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vw54
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| posted on October 10th, 2008 at 06:11 AM |
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finding a panel shop thats actually interested in doing the job will be the hardest part
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rearengine
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| posted on October 10th, 2008 at 06:29 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by helbus
I know that I would not be doing a car for you where I work then. $75 per hour is a common trade rate. Good trade workers don't learn with a uni
degree, but EARN with skill, time, patience the ability to do a good job. Your job is to find the right person. Reputable places will charge $70-$80
an hour.
Personally at home I wont do it. Not even for $50 an hour. The time I could spend earning that money, I can spend with my family and be poor. Stick
your plasma TV's, central heating, jetski's, flight's and home theatre in another spot. I have family. Being in the poverty line and with them is a
warm feeling.
I appreciate what you do that supports people in the community services field. You just need to respray your own car if you are not happy with
tradespeople working on it. Supercheap Auto have supercheap tools, compressors, sprayguns, paint etc. if you want a super cheap job. Do it and post
pics of how you go with it, I am interested.
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So its either $20000 grand or supercheap auto? seems a little extreme to me. I have had quotes from reputable places from between $4500 to $7000,
thats seems a better middle ground to me.
You talk about being asset poor but family rich, thats where I am at too (also cant afford the plasma), however it seems sad that at $20000 grand,
only the truly wealthy get to see your work.
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Dasdubber
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| posted on October 12th, 2008 at 08:10 PM |
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It's been said above already but you get what you pay for. I charge $66/hr, and I would be lucky to see close to half of that (mind you for the first
year or two of starting such a business I won't in fact take anything home due to the capital outlay and expenditure for setup).
Although this is getting a little off topic I still think its relevant as I did restore Ben's notch for him (original thread starter), and after he
sold that I have done all the rust repair on his splitty at your "bull$hit type pricing". Regardless of the make of car being restored, the
overheads of this type of business change minimally (porsche/ferrari/vw splitty etc).....if you want quality work, it takes a lot of time, thus a high
cost....if you want cheap work, time will have to be reduced to stay under the quoted price which means the quality of work is also reduced (ie
corners are cut).
I'm sure you'd get quite a surprise to see in detail the overheads (despite your scepticism) of such a business, the turnover required just to
breakeven is not insignificant - just a few examples of my costs include: accountancy fees, advertising, sponsorship, insurances, council fees,
workcover, equipment purchases/maintenance/depreciation, IT services, phone/fax/net charges, travel expenses, rent, solicitors fees, waste charges,
personal protective equipment, blah blah blah.
I know many of these things are similar in a variety of businesses, but before you throw around the insinuation of "greedy bosses" getting rich by
overcharging, perhaps you should try and do a quality restoration yourself, keep track of the hours you spend, the equipment you need to purchase,
then factor in rent etc (if you were in a dedicated premise), to work out how much you would have to charge per hour to cover your cost and make a
living. The expenses I have outlayed in the last two months will mean it will take me about 5-7 months before I actually recover that money and take a
small wage home for myself even at a "highway robbery" rate of $66/hr. I'd happily work for you for $30/hr on your restoration if you want to cover
all my costs!
Hope this rambling is of some value.
Al
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helbus
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| posted on October 12th, 2008 at 08:52 PM |
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LOL truly wealthy is the word for sure. A lot of resto's where I work end up with $50K labour bills. The work is charged at an hourly rate, with all
work written in diary form with heaps of digital pics. You get what you pay for. I only see restoration in a perfectionists high end field these days,
sorry but I don't know how to quote cheap anymore. It is my fault, my failing, I am bad, please don't talk to me anymore, I am not worthy. LOL
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Notch Nut
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| posted on October 12th, 2008 at 09:15 PM |
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Funny how some people can't understand that it takes the same skill to do a rust repair on a porsche/merc/bmw etc as it would on a vw/ford/holden if
you want the same level of quality in the finish.
Probably explains why supermarkets don't charge you a different price for oranges based on you yearly income?
I think the biggest problem with society is that there is some belief that obtaining an Arts Degree is an achievement worthy of significance. 
I'll be happy to do a full respray for rearengine for about 10 slabs, if and only if he does all the prep work and supplies all the spray cans.
If you can't fix it with a hammer,
you have an electrical problem....
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rearengine
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| posted on October 12th, 2008 at 10:23 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Notch Nut
Funny how some people can't understand that it takes the same skill to do a rust repair on a porsche/merc/bmw etc as it would on a vw/ford/holden if
you want the same level of quality in the finish.
Probably explains why supermarkets don't charge you a different price for oranges based on you yearly income?
I think the biggest problem with society is that there is some belief that obtaining an Arts Degree is an achievement worthy of significance.
I'll be happy to do a full respray for rearengine for about 10 slabs, if and only if he does all the prep work and supplies all the spray cans.
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I dont have an Arts degree, so lets not get personal
I suppose its just a shame that it costs the average Jo $20000, to get their beetle resprayed these days, when you can buy a new car for less.
The average Jo just cant afford that, its not your fault as you guys have clearly explained, its simply the extreme overheads that cause you to charge
$80hr.
To be fair Dasdubbers $66hr is a pretty far cry from $80, so at least its coming down. But starting at $20grand is well... the mind boggles.
Maybe with the impending economic downturn, the $80hr places might have to shave some of the slush to maintain the work.
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Dasdubber
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 06:58 AM |
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I can understand what you are saying, but not all jobs cost $20K. I did a beetle respray not too long ago which was around the $9K mark, but it was
not bare metalled, was not colour sanded, and only a certain amount of time could be spent on the panel work to keep the costs down. I cannot
guarantee rust won't rear its ugly head, and despite having a good sealer over the previous paint, I cannot guarantee reactions between the paint
(manufacturers can't give a warranty on their paint systems either when applied over the top of other paint).
So you don't have to pay $20K, but to flog the saying yet again "you get what you pay for" still applies.
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vw54
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 08:52 AM |
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theres a lot of work that can be done on any car by the owner before the panel shop starts
Remove all trim and interior undoing the guards and just bolting on with 1 or 2 bolts, removing the glass and stripping the doors removing the
wiring harness, paint stripping the car back to bare metal , getting the heavy rust areas sand blasted all this takes time of the panel shop
and can be done by the owner
all this can take heaps of time and will cost you maybe a weeks work by the panel shop
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squizy
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 09:50 AM |
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I think a fine example of a good paint job showing its age really well is Rose's oval. It was painted in the late 80's, and still looks great. It
comes down to doing it right first time, so that you don't have to revisit it - this car is testament to that. I'm not in the trade game, but to me,
yes you have to shop around, but in the long run, you get what you pay for.
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helbus
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 09:58 AM |
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Leaving the hourly rate aside. I will talk hours time instead. An example of a bare metal respray on a 30-40 year old vehicle, regardless of the make
could be seen as follows
30 hrs Disassemble all components, trim, glass, mechanical, panels etc.
50 hrs strip all body to bare metal, and remove any substrates existing. This could also be done by paying for media blasting in many area's
250 hrs fabricate and weld any rust panels required. Finish surface of repaired areas to acceptable standard for painter
250 hrs surface prepare body and panels, etch prime, epoxy coat, fine filler work, putty, paint, color sand, polish. About 10 lots of full rubbing
along the way.
100 hrs reassembly
It can take more for a larger or worse condition vehicle, it could take less time for a smaller, better condition or new parts available vehicle. So
many factors. Yes a Ferrari would cost the same hourly rate as a VR Commodore. New parts are probably available for the Commodore, making the job
quicker, and the Ferrari owner may have expectations far exceeding original factory quality, making the job take longer. Actual money cost can be
lowered by reducing the number of hours you pay for. This can be done by doing some of it yourself, or by buying new parts to fit instead of having
them repaired or fabricated.
Hope this helps.
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Notch Nut
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 05:18 PM |
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The old saying goes. Time is money.
Unfortunately the cost for doing a job like this prohibits alot of people from spending double or more the cars value on a resto. Hard to justify
unless you are a perfectionist with some dosh to spare or you plan on keeping the car (as opposed to the wife! :smirk .
I am considering doing a paint job myself on the notch eventualy as it has had an accident and since been repaired. To keep the costs down, I am
getting a pro to do the rust repairs (I can't weld for shit and freely admit that!) and I am doing the prep work and painting myself. Gotta start
somewhere and might even learn a thing or two.
BTW rearengine, only kidding about the arts degree. The offer
of 10 slabs still stands though!!!
- Adam
If you can't fix it with a hammer,
you have an electrical problem....
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rearengine
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 09:41 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Notch Nut
The old saying goes. Time is money.
Unfortunately the cost for doing a job like this prohibits alot of people from spending double or more the cars value on a resto. Hard to justify
unless you are a perfectionist with some dosh to spare or you plan on keeping the car (as opposed to the wife! :smirk.
I am considering doing a paint job myself on the notch eventualy as it has had an accident and since been repaired. To keep the costs down, I am
getting a pro to do the rust repairs (I can't weld for shit and freely admit that!) and I am doing the prep work and painting myself. Gotta start
somewhere and might even learn a thing or two.
BTW rearengine, only kidding about the arts degree. The offer
of 10 slabs still stands though!!!
- Adam
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I am doing the same Adam... one day
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rearengine
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 09:43 PM |
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I am also assuming Geelong Bitter slabs are right for the 10 slabs
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Notch Nut
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 09:59 PM |
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Pfft! I am a man of class and substance. Melbourne Bitter for me!!!
If you can't fix it with a hammer,
you have an electrical problem....
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Hutcho
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| posted on October 17th, 2008 at 07:23 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by vw54
finding a panel shop thats actually interested in doing the job will be the hardest part
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Im hearing that, Dave.... and Im a Sparky!
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