| [ Total Views: 2443 | Total Replies: 16 | Thread Id: 72360 ] |
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 DamianG
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| posted on October 18th, 2008 at 10:14 AM |
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Does 091 + Albins Gears Mean unbreakable?
Hi All
VERY interested in an EJ20T in a beetle but the gearbox seems to be the biggest issue (I know, there's lots of big issues).
Seems as though an 091 rebuilt with Albins Gears would give good strength. I like to drive pretty hard (Why else would you build a turbo beetle) and
would be going to regular street meets at the Perth motorplex so I'm looking for a reliable solution.
My brothers XD falcon with stroker cleavland is running 11.3sec (With MASSIVE wheelspin) and I'd like to outrun him  so that is the power level I'm looking at.
cheers
Damian
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11CAB
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| posted on October 18th, 2008 at 10:25 AM |
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The answer is NO...... any VW box is breakable..... I broke every tooth of the pinion of a 091 box with a standard 2L aircooled Kombi motor.
Shock loading is what will break things
65 Meyers Manx
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DamianG
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| posted on October 18th, 2008 at 12:58 PM |
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I realise nothing is unbreakable, but most of the breakages of the 091s I have seen people mention were those who "Took a chance" on an old worn out
one. Turbo torque usually won those competitions.
I'm looking to use one of those too initially to get it on the road, but wont be giving it any curry till I can afford to get it rebuilt.
So with the realisation that nothing is "Unbreakable" with enough effort, can I still expect a good life out of the 091 when built for strength.
cheers
Damian
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hellbugged
A.k.a.: Daimo Pell
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| posted on October 18th, 2008 at 10:43 PM |
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yes you can expect good life..........that's what's in the hellVWrx notch (200KW @ wheels)and it takes every thing i have given it!..........
like banging into second at full drift quick enough to hold the slide and continue on reguardless.............or changing back to first at speed.
BUILT by experts would be the key, Dangerous could do it for you, no doubt there...........
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GTMac
A.k.a.: Andrew
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| posted on October 19th, 2008 at 09:20 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by hellbugged
yes you can expect good life..........that's what's in the hellVWrx notch (200KW @ wheels)and it takes every thing i have given it!..........
like banging into second at full drift quick enough to hold the slide and continue on reguardless.............or changing back to first at speed.
BUILT by experts would be the key, Dangerous could do it for you, no doubt there...........
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Daimo, you havnt broken it.......................well thats saying something then isnt it?
Someone who knows what they are doing with the rebuild is the key.
1971 Type 3 Fasty - EJ20T
I love 242HP sleepers. 
How many sets of lights does it take a $229k Carrera S to learn?
UPDATE: Cayman S, M3, B4 now added to the list. |
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hellbugged
A.k.a.: Daimo Pell
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| posted on October 19th, 2008 at 09:46 PM |
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"""""""
i'm not sure wether your dismissing what i've said or agreeing there Andrew?
if only you could have made it up to Valla on the Thursday and Friday
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pete wood
A.k.a.: figure itout
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| posted on October 20th, 2008 at 09:15 AM |
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two words; FULL REBUILD (before the turbo engine goes in)
two names; SCHIMO, DANGEROUS
two terms; MECHANICAL SYMPATHY
if you do these things you should be fine. 
And people need to stop treating 091s as mechanical fuses. there is a finite supply of them. 
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 matberry
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| posted on October 20th, 2008 at 11:21 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by pete wood
two words; FULL REBUILD (before the turbo engine goes in)
two names; SCHIMO, DANGEROUS
two terms; MECHANICAL SYMPATHY
if you do these things you should be fine.
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Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
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GTMac
A.k.a.: Andrew
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| posted on October 20th, 2008 at 09:53 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by hellbugged
"""""""
i'm not sure wether your dismissing what i've said or agreeing there Andrew?
if only you could have made it up to Valla on the Thursday and Friday
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No totally agreeing with you Daimo, just sure if there is someone on this forum who has worked the hell out of their gearbox in all conditions, its
you
1971 Type 3 Fasty - EJ20T
I love 242HP sleepers.
How many sets of lights does it take a $229k Carrera S to learn?
UPDATE: Cayman S, M3, B4 now added to the list. |
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DamianG
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| posted on October 29th, 2008 at 11:53 PM |
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Thanks for the replies. i'll get in contact with Dangerous. I'm hoping the price wont be too disappointing.
Also, When the BUILT boxes fail, what usually goes on them.
cheers
Damian
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dangerous
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| posted on October 30th, 2008 at 07:46 AM |
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Better than 11.3's with radials and stock weight?
That is not going to be a cheap option.
Many guys that do those conversions use a stock 091 box with no problems,
but with boost and engine mods that will go low elevens life will be short.
Having a clutch that is very soft will help the trans life.
Among all the modifications that can be done to a bus box,
the replacment intermediate housing
that allows the use of a bug nose cone and shifting mechanism
is a big improvement, but adds considerably to the cost.
Unless LanD Industries in Canada is now making an 091 version,
an 8mm case-spacer and additional work will be required to adapt a Berg, or 'Morris Race engines' 002 version.
These housings range from 399 to 500 US dollars.
Other PARTS cost worth consideing are:
Albins gear set: around $1500 or more depending on their freight costs.
Albins superdiff ? $800? plus you will need additional spider gears.
Often with 09 trans, the hardening from the side and spider gears is worn off, so these need replacing too,
but this is dependant on the quality of your core.
My own trans took 60 hours plus parts to prepare:
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=58055&page=14
It is a 002 trans with 091 case and a spool to replace the diff centre.
I probably have about $4000 invested in parts,
so you would have to factor in
the cost of labour,
cost of a good core,
Cost related to the US dollar now being around $1.67 australian,
and various other nightmares related to a job this complex,
like that yours will be based on an 091 and not 002 like mine.
All that sounds like a bad dream hey?
Well I hate to scare you off,
but that is th reality of the whole story.
As I said at the beginning, a stock 091 will get you on the road,
and you may preferr to upgrade each part as they fail.
The other advantage o the slow upgrade method,
is you can see if you want to make ratio changes based on how the stock ratios perform.
Another option diff-wise,
is the Peoquin torque biasing diff.
It is like the Quaife in design, and very good quality.
I would guess these are arount 1200 to 1300 US dollars(you do the conversion)
A steel hub for third and 4th, from Albins(+$200? plus freight?),
and chromolly pinion nut($66 plus freight?) are some other things that I would do.
I would say that the weak link in mine now would be the actual case.
I am not a fan of weld on braces, like the US builders do,
but there is an Aluminium version of the case that is stronger than the stock magnesium case.
Enough typing for now,
DB.
| Quote: | Originally
posted by westi
That's mad Alan.
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dangerous
A.k.a.: Dave Butler Muffin Man
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| posted on October 30th, 2008 at 08:03 AM |
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Some other pages wrth a look:
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=58055&page=6
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=58055&page=9
| Quote: | Originally
posted by westi
That's mad Alan.
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DamianG
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| posted on October 30th, 2008 at 11:00 AM |
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Thanks dangerous
THAT IS SCARY. Its actually putting me off doing the conversion at the moment. Its the only thing that stops me going full bore into it.
I've been considering doing an idividually constructed vehicle instead. The gearbox costs should cover the engineers fees and then some. This way I
can build a custom chassis using S13 Nissan Silvia rear suspension, late model RX7 aluminium front suspension put an LS1 in the front with a T56 6
speed in a 11-1200kg car. Chuck the radiator where the engine was. WOOO HOOOOO. All in a VW body.
My wife would kill me if she new I was even contemplating this but its a scary fast bug one way or another. She just thinks (probably because I told
her) it will be a resto project with the kids. Just a bit of cheap fun. YEAH RIGHT!!!!!
Perth has a club that deals with building ICV sports cars (mainly lotus 7 replicas) so I'll see if they can help with an estimate of costs and how
friendly the authorities will be. They meet a week on thursday so i should have a much better idea then.
I also find out if I loose my license for 9mths on monday (Long Story, but I'm innocent).
cheers
Damian
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pete wood
A.k.a.: figure itout
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| posted on October 30th, 2008 at 11:29 AM |
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a cheap way round the superdiff is to find a later T3 kombi 4 spider gear diff. Wes and I both have these in our 091s.
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trickysimon
A.k.a.: Simon Azzopardi
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| posted on October 30th, 2008 at 12:04 PM |
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9 months?!
Long story short please?
Simon
P.S Woo 400th post
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DamianG
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| posted on October 30th, 2008 at 07:18 PM |
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OK here goes......
Got a letter in the mail saying I needed to hand my license in for too many demerit points. This was a 3 month suspension. I handed it in at the end
of april.
I didn't start driving again until 3 months and 2 days later. That same day I got pulled over (just a random thing as I was obeying all the rules).
They proceeded to give me a summons for no license and put a yellow sticker on my car for my bumper sticking out just a few centimeters. I was pretty
upset.
Went to court a couple of weeks ago to find out my suspension didn't come into effect until 6 days after I handed my license in.
I also had a fine suspension (in WA they suspend your license for unpaid fines) for an unpaid parking fine which I had taken care of a few days prior
to handing in my license.
Further investigation revealed that this wasn't lifted until the 30th due to administration lethargy. Also. your 3mth suspension doesn't start until
the fine suspension is lifted. NOBODY IN THIS DAMN DEPARTMENT KNOWS WHAT IS GOING ON. EVEN AFTER THE FACT I COULDN'T GET A PROPER ANSWER ON DATES
AND WHAT HAD HAPPENED.
If I'm found guilty it is an automatic 9month suspension and minimum $400 fine. Could be as bad as 3 years and $1500.
Nervous till monday.
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trickysimon
A.k.a.: Simon Azzopardi
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100km/h is only 9 seconds away
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| posted on October 30th, 2008 at 07:27 PM |
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Dam man that really sucks, hope you get the verdict your hoping for
Simon
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