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 ttriebler
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| posted on April 1st, 2011 at 09:20 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by humpty
... If this box proves to be stronger (they are not very strong in a Subi by the way
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er ...yeah... I think you will find that 3 million units (or whatever the number is) working fine out there will prove you wrong. Maybe they don't
hold up well to idiot p platers with 20psi boost dumping the clutch at 6000rpm and then grinding them into 2nd gear. Anyway....
Reversed gears for Subaru transmissions.
Fit a Subaru 5 speed to your rear engined car
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ttriebler
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| posted on April 1st, 2011 at 09:32 PM |
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Thought I'd share some pix for those that are interested. A customer here in Sydney is fitting up an EJ22 and 5 speed subie box into his type 3
resto. He sent me some pix tonight of the dummied up drivetrain with the output flanges lined up for straight axles.
This retains the stock torsion bar, has some clearance notched into the firewall under the rear seat to give a bit of clearance for the nose of the
box (similar to beetle install). The shifter bolts onto the vw shifter rod like the beetles do.
There's plenty of room at the rear of the trunk, clearance for the pulleys and so on. (I think a flat 6 would fit there as well by the way).
Looks like the drivetrain may even be able to be lowered more, not sure if enough to fit a flat trunk...??
[img] [/img]
Reversed gears for Subaru transmissions.
Fit a Subaru 5 speed to your rear engined car
www.subarugears.com |
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johny rotten
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| posted on April 1st, 2011 at 10:45 PM |
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the axles on the subi box look a lot lower from the crankshaft centre line compared to vw transaxle
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ttriebler
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| posted on April 2nd, 2011 at 06:31 AM |
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55mm difference. So using a subie box your engine (VW or Subie) is 55mm higher or your box is 55mm lower than a VW/VW or Subie/VW. Not insurmountable
in the world of custom stuff.
Reversed gears for Subaru transmissions.
Fit a Subaru 5 speed to your rear engined car
www.subarugears.com |
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dangerous
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| posted on April 2nd, 2011 at 07:07 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by ttriebler
| Quote: | Originally
posted by dangerous
Looking good!
Are the diff gears available to the public soon?
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Thanks for the compliment!
??????? been selling them for quite a few months now.
Direct to public via my website http://www.subarugears.com
We managed to put around 3000 kms on a set of 3.9 diff gears out of China, with a torsen LSD fitted. Used on the street and up at Stockton for a day
too. Didn't blow up! Even a couple of 5000rpm dumps in there on tarmac.
Just stripped that box for a look and to change to clutch type LSD and the ring and pinion look good. Not everything out of China is junk - I overspec
the material and they have a good QA process.
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That is good to know.
I think these are a viable option for those that want a 5 speed and can do a little fab themselves to mount it.
If people are worried about breaking the sube trans there is always the option of better 1st thru 5th gears from Albins.
| Quote: | Originally
posted by westi
That's mad Alan.
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modnrod
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| posted on April 3rd, 2011 at 12:03 AM |
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| Quote: | I think these are a
viable option for those that want a 5 speed and can do a little fab themselves to mount it.
If people are worried about breaking the sube trans there is always the option of better 1st thru 5th gears from Albins.
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If that's the case, I can't see why you wouldn't just do a Kombi box.
Please don't misunderstand me, if I could just get a Subi 5sp, throw the reverse diff gears at it, then chuck it in the back I reckon fantastic! As
long as......
The end result is AT LEAST as strong as a built "L" bug SSP, preferably a bit stronger, like up to Kombi strength.
The end RPM at 100kph in the Subi O/D isn't too far below 3000, otherwise in summer there MAY not be enough cooling (in MY summer anyway).
The weight is within 20kg or so of the "L" box (again, the Kombi box weight).
Custom driveshafts aren't a $500 necessity to drive anything with it.
If these conditions are met, I reckon great! Well done that man!
I do have to back up Humpty though on the strength in std form. I've lost count of the amount of times I've hammered 12sec WRX's off the line for
the first 100m in my old hotrod baja, becasue they were sick of fixing their Subi boxes, and so took it easy out of the hole. It isn't a myth,
they're not all pimply-faced teens with no mechanical sympathy, 12's seems to be the mark where they stress the std box.
Hopefully though, with 400kg less weight, a lot less rotational mass (not 4wd), and 100hp less for your average 12sec Beetle, they should survive
fine, even with a few years of 1.7sec 60ft times under the box.
Will the Subi box last through this OK?
Again, not having a go at all, these are genuine questions?
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modnrod
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| posted on April 3rd, 2011 at 04:48 PM |
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| Quote: | In the meantime
I've been working on the automatic box for all those American Vanagon owners that want them.
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As said above, sounds excellent.
The 4sp O/D auto would be my first preference too please!
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ttriebler
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| posted on April 3rd, 2011 at 08:23 PM |
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Yeah no dramas modnro. The subi boxes aren't unbreakable as all things arent't. But most of them are designed for 206kw or so (more than 99% of
power that people really run) with 4wd at 1500kgs or so. Running at 900 or 1000kg in 2wd gives you heaps more room, then if you use late model stuff,
even better.
Boxes are lighter than Kombi. Width with my subaflanges is same as Kombi or beetle (adjustable) so just bolt up your cv's and axles.
End RPM's are whatever you want....4th gear is around 1:1 and 5th gear 0.78:1 so depends on your tyre size.
anyway...things are progressing nicely. My initial customer has now done over 4,000kms on his 5 speed subie box in his ej22 daily driver beetle with
no probs. And the list keeps on groing...
Reversed gears for Subaru transmissions.
Fit a Subaru 5 speed to your rear engined car
www.subarugears.com |
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modnrod
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| posted on April 3rd, 2011 at 11:46 PM |
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Thanks for the quick answers man. And yes, for what it's worth, I reckon a 12sec Beetle is way less stress than a 12sec WRX obviously. For maximum
launch, with enough cooling revs, I reckon that .78 O/D with the 4.44 would be perfect.
When do you expect the kit for the 4sp O/D auto version to be available? Same deal, 4.44 gears. Are the auto's to be original 4WD boxes too, or are
the 2WD auto's compatible?
This is for a 5-bolt crank (Type4, Type5).
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ttriebler
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| posted on April 4th, 2011 at 05:51 AM |
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I wish I could answer that question with a bit more clarity. Testing & R&D always take 100 times longer than you would like.
Firstly I am going to test a fwd 4 speed auto box that is reversed and bolted to an ej20. Probably in a vanagon. If that all works out OK the
modification will work for any/all subie auto boxes : 4 speed, 5 speed 2wd or 4wd, also 4wd converted to 2wd. I may have to make up some parts to
easily convert 4wd autos to 2wd autos so that the housings don't spew oil out the back etc. That process will still take a few months from now.
Then we will move onto looking at how that can mate up with vw powerplants as well. My billet vw/subie adaptor plate for manual engines will also work
with the auto box, will just have to look at the drive plate and either redrill a subie one or make a custom one to suit the vw engine and all the
correct offsets.
Target is to have all that completed, tested, priced and released within 2011
Reversed gears for Subaru transmissions.
Fit a Subaru 5 speed to your rear engined car
www.subarugears.com |
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modnrod
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| posted on April 4th, 2011 at 05:38 PM |
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Thanks again.
Redrilling the Subi one for 5bolt might be the easiest, possibly with a spacer flange between crank and flexplate, but I spose it depends on bolt
diameter/spacing/PCD.
End of 2011! Holy crap, I hope so, but that's a hard task, best of luck with it though. I'll be watching man!
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humpty
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| posted on April 4th, 2011 at 06:17 PM |
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I have a Subi powered Notchback in the works at the moment, that would make a good platform for an auto box.... Currently thinking along the lines of
a Porsche Sportomatic with manual shift, but I'm open to options.... An auto instead would make for a very cool driver and rapid acceleration!
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ttriebler
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| posted on April 4th, 2011 at 06:27 PM |
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Hey Humpty, the Subie auto is HUGE and I can't shorten it as much as the manuals. I doubt it would fit in a type 3 without cutting into the torsion
bar and/or moving the engine right back to the rear of the car. Time will tell what it actually fits into but the main aim is to provide autos for
Vanagons.
Reversed gears for Subaru transmissions.
Fit a Subaru 5 speed to your rear engined car
www.subarugears.com |
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modnrod
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| posted on April 4th, 2011 at 06:40 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by humpty
I have a Subi powered Notchback in the works at the moment, that would make a good platform for an auto box.... Currently thinking along the lines of
a Porsche Sportomatic with manual shift, but I'm open to options.... An auto instead would make for a very cool driver and rapid acceleration!
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Just remember Humpty, when you launch the thing with the 100hp NO2 kit all in, an idle launch with HQ 90/10's will look very cool with the instant
weight transfer!
We obviously have the very same thing in mind for the future........
Make mine grey primer. 
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