| [ Total Views: 3163 | Total Replies: 155 | Thread Id: 4816 ] |
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 Spook
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| posted on March 29th, 2003 at 04:39 PM |
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AHHH, the Yank constitution:
That all citizens shall have the right to bear arms............But other countries are a different matter.
John Howards 1st move??
To disarm the people, after 1(ONE) fruit bat went birko in Port Arthur.
I did ask a young man on his way to a protest what he thought his stake was in all this.
He wasn't real sure. He was 15.
I told him WW2 lasted 6 years, & he was old enough to be drafted in 3.
Now he has a reason.
And if you think that is a bit far fetched, consider this; half the world is for, half against.
What more do you need?? 
[Edited on 29-3-2003 by Spook]
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
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Flying VW
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| posted on March 29th, 2003 at 05:15 PM |
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I must say I was pissed off at the way they took our guns. As if to say we were naughty little kid's who couldn't be trusted to play with
them.
But I also believe a cruel Dictator like Sudan needs to be taken down.
BAJA NOW FITTED WITH A FULL FLYING REBUILD
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amazer
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| posted on March 29th, 2003 at 05:27 PM |
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number of british soldiers killed in iraq so far = 23
killed in helicopter crases = 14
killed in "friendly fire" = 5
killed by iraqis = 4
not a bad percentage huh.
Chris.... kombi pilot, oval dreamer... finisher #26971 2005 city to surf
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Spook
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| posted on March 29th, 2003 at 05:54 PM |
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Given, Saddam is a headbanger, the same as most leaders are headbangers.
But then, if the people want him removed, that's up to them.
Let's face it, the western media shows them all armed to the teeth, including kids.
This is all about removing the anti American leader & replacing him with a pro American leader.
If you think it will make one iota of difference to the Iraqi people, you are sadly mistaken.
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
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68AutoBug
A.k.a.: Lee Noonan
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 01:36 AM |
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RESTORE NOT WAR come on all you hippy Kombi owning peacnics out there (Saddam and Peace.... !!)
[size=4]Saddam didn't want a Peace of Kuwait when He Invaded the Country .... He wanted ALL of it... and now someone is going to get a PEACE of
Him... I love Peace.... man.... Shot Baby Shoot... Sorry I know this has nothing to do about VWs.... but it seems anything is allowed on this
forum... Just as Well We All Love VWs.... !! [/size]:o:thumb
[Edited on 30-3-2003 by vanderaj]
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
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KruizinKombi
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 06:24 AM |
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I know that as a moderator of other sections, I have no authority in General Chat, but as a member: Do you think it would be possible to keep all the
war-related posts under the one thread? I see enough about the war everywhere else I go, I don't want to see it here too.
Kruizin Kol
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kombiluva
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 08:47 AM |
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What percentages!
Amazer,
Mechanic failure-Helicopter crashes=14, considering the amount of airlifts involved, the enviroment that they are working in and the complexities of a
modern Helicopter.......not bad, considering the UK lost 23 troops in the Faulklands when a SeaKing hit a flock of Albatrosses.
Friendly Fire=5. I will not go into the complexities of the modern battle field here in this forum, however 5 killed by friendly fire is a waste of
life no matter which way you look at it.......it is however a risk that all commanders are aware of.
Killed by Iraqis=4. It could be said that they are just bad shots and need more time down at the rifle range!
Statistics.......you have to love them!
PS 78.58% of people that quote a statistic are wrong............ |
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68AutoBug
A.k.a.: Lee Noonan
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 04:23 PM |
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[size=5]To the Moderator , I would like to See ALL Non VW Posts deleted... including Peace Protests... this is a VW Forum.. Not a PEACE or War
Forum... as You said its on TV & everywhere else... 24 hrs a day... I did ask before to delete the "RESTORE NOT WAR" Postings ... but it
wasn't done... So I can enter My Posts on this Subject.. which are Opposite to "Restore Not War" postings... Apoligies, but You have
to be fair.. for One & All... Maybe starting Next Month - ONLY VW & Auto issues.. NO WAR or PEACE Postings.... If You check on My postings..
I haven't been on the forum lately, used to be daily... I do click on Most days but don't open or read any postings because that
"Restore not War" drives Me Crazy.... OK - for ALL You PEACE LOVERS ... Charge them $2 a Litre for Petrol.... and see how they like it....
Seeing they think that OIL is the Major cause for the War against a Nation that invaded another PEACEFUL Nation (KUWAIT) .. these Extremists
don't just go away.... they must be STOPPED.... At ANY COST.... (See how I See Red when I See stupid things written by "Peace not War"
advocates)
I LOVE Air Cooled VWs but I hate to Read about "make Peace" -- Hitler made Peace with Countries then invaded them... Peace doesn't
work... with EXTREMISTS... [/size] :thumb:thumb:thumb:thumb
[Edited on 30-3-2003 by 68AutoBug]
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
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Spook
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 05:22 PM |
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Lee obviously wants to be part of this war, so if someone will give him a gun, I'll pay his air fare!!!!!!!!
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
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fatboy
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 05:25 PM |
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Interesting
This is an interesting "News" report on the terrorist destruction of the Death Star (As in Star Wars) its quite old and I dont know who
wrote it but I found it quite entertaining (not sure if thats the right word?).
It was a bit long to post here but I have published it here
http://www.itsv.net/emperor.htm
" Captain Picard, why are there no Indians on the Enterprise ? Don't you need IT Support ? "
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KruizinKombi
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 05:32 PM |
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Spook: 
Lee: Make up your mind!!!
Oh yeah, and [size=6]Please stop shouting at us!!!![/size]
Kruizin Kol
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 vanderaj
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 05:38 PM |
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Colin
You are a super moderator. You can moderate all forums.
Lee, I am not *deleting* any posts. The war threads do not outnumber the normal threads, and they are constrained to one or two. So basically, nothing
is going to happen.
Andrew
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Spook
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 05:57 PM |
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Actually Andrew, there's three.
The "restore not war" thread, & here's the crunch;
Both the other two(this one inclusive) were started by the guy who is saying they shouldnt be here....
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
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waltermitty
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 06:26 PM |
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Lee Kuwait was annexed after WW2 from IRAQ it was IRAQ b4 then .Churchill justified the annexing by saying that creating another oil shareholder
(Kuwait ) would make oil cheaper for the west.
Go on have an open mind read and learn there have been many considered and knowledgeble responses on the Restore thread both for and against. I am
very heartened by the concern and response.
You know this free speach thing is actually a good thing it seperates us Aussies from the dictatorships and regimes that suppress it surely we should
not become like Sadam himself and repress opinions that you I or any of us dissagree with?
By the way communism was not defeated by the Americans it killed itself.
Mitchell
[Edited on 30-3-2003 by waltermitty]
23 windows ...8 too many!
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KruizinKombi
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 08:02 PM |
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Andrew, I am aware that I CAN delete or edit the posts, but as General Chat is not 'my' section, I don't believe it's my place.
Also like you, I don't think the posts should be edited, free speech is essential. I'm only asking that Lee stop creating new posts and
keep them under the original thread on this same topic rather than starting new threads and then asking for them to be deleted.
As far as I'm aware, Lee is able to delete his own posts anyway, right?
Kruizin Kol
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jenz58
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 08:52 PM |
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Lee, as Kol said please stop shouting.
If you are going to state something as a fact in these posts then please read up on the history of these events ands make sure that they are in some
way factual.
No one is denying you your right to believe what you do. Do you believe that all Iraqis are extemists? We are so lucky here in Australia that we
haven't had to live under a dictator. If we did have a leader like Saddam I am sure we would have people willing to follow just as some (not all)
Iraqis do.
Scary psyc. research (Stanley Milgram's study of obedience) has shown that people will follow orders even if it is doing something they would not
normally do, in this case the use of punishment (increase stength of electric shocks) on learning. In this experiment the people receiving the shocks
were collaborators of the experimentor, the shocks were not real, but the subjects/administering shock did not know this and were in extreme conflict
regarding orders but 2/3 carried out orders delivering the maximum level of 450 volts. The research results shocked researchers and sparked
controversy and prompted a review of experimental ethics in psych as well as social research.
Milgram devised sophisticated methods of debriefing for subjects of further experiments.
Milgram was interested in why German soldiers during WWII obeyed the genocidal commands of their leaders. He concluded that people in general are
astonishingly capable of blind, mindless obedience. The initial experience involved only male subjects but in a following experiment women showed the
same level of obedience with 65% giving maximum electric shock of 450 volts. He also later did across age groups and cultural groups:jesus
We are brought up to respect authority and can be carried over to situations requiring obedience. There is also the situation of not necessarily
respecting someone in authority but following orders due to fear of punishment.
Hopefully we can still show respect to those who earn respect ,whether they are in authority or not, and that we have the right to say no if we are
being asked to do something that goes against our moral beliefs without fear of punishment.
This is a classic study. Food for thought:jesus:sandrine |
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jenz58
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 09:33 PM |
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All of these percentages are lives lost no matter how :jesus
When I lost my husband last year as the result of a sudden heart attack everyone said 'At least he didn't suffer', because it was quick
and unexpected (died at work with no one there to help him). It is a shock to loose your partner and you go around in a very surreal/unreal world for
some time after. Your life is never going to be the same again but it does get better in time and you do love again even though it can be a bit scary
at first because you fear loosing someone again and feeling the pain.
OK we know people are going to die in war, lets hope that as few people as possible have to 'suffer'. I've nursed the dying but luckily
we have the means to keep people as comfortable as possible if they are in pain, this is not always possible in war.
These are lives and not percentages. |
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70AutoStik
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 09:38 PM |
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America may not have killed communism but the same cannot be said for democracy!
If you're going to give Lee a gun, I think you should give me one, too - but I'd rather keep mine for use on lawyers. I think we've
got our best people over there (and I'd like to see them all come back alive.)
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pangalactic
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 10:45 PM |
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Great Link
For anyone that hasnt read it, I thought i would post this link for the people that are obviously passiontate about this topic. Its a really
comprehensive thread into this mess from someone who is there.
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=b795bcc6f732fd7f5be69f95...
If ignorance is bliss we should be dancing in the streets.
Peace (of arse!)
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vanderaj
A.k.a.: Andrew van der Stock
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 10:55 PM |
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A little offensive :)
[ note: Dopegoat can be (ahem) a mite bit offensive, so don't check out the rest of the site. Okay, so it's very offensive, most of the time]
I think this thought might help to calm down this thread, or at least direct your anger towards me for a bit:
http://www.dopegoat.com/b2/imgs.php?action=list&imgid=621
hehehehe
Andrew
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vanderaj
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 11:02 PM |
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Okay, I'm going to merge all the threads.
Lee, stop creating them, as I'll simply merge the threads.
Andrew
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jenz58
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| posted on March 30th, 2003 at 11:27 PM |
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Lee please stop creating new threads, and please stop shouting when you do post.
Also the talk of carrying or using a gun by any of us is offensive. There are people out there using them for legitimate reasons and I'm sure
they do not get much pleasure out of having to use them. I know that was one thing my father (WWII) would never talk about. The only time he would
talk about his rifle was jokingly telling us about rifle inspections etc. Any other type of talk would have been saved for meetings with his old
mates, like a debriefing session. It is something that lives with them all their lives.
It was something to know these old men, they had an incredible bond. They looked out for each other. I'm sure the same type of friendships are
being formed now by our troops. No one else can understand or share the experience, so hard for us to comprehend what it must be like.
Debate is good, arguments a waste of breath. |
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amazer
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| posted on March 31st, 2003 at 01:14 AM |
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*sigh* andrew i didnt listen. I looked elsewhere on the site. there IS some naughty stuff on there. A lot of it i've seen before which may say
something about my group of friends. But this I like! Just wait till Osama drops over, then the party really gets started. Is it just me or is there
an amazing amount of pictures out there with a very stupid look on George Jnr's face?
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Chris.... kombi pilot, oval dreamer... finisher #26971 2005 city to surf
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Spook
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| posted on March 31st, 2003 at 07:12 AM |
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In case you've never noticed Chris, ol GI George aint the brightest looking man at the best of times.......
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
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amazer
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| posted on March 31st, 2003 at 05:24 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by kombiluva
Amazer,
Mechanic failure-Helicopter crashes=14, considering the amount of airlifts involved, the enviroment that they are working in and the complexities of a
modern Helicopter.......not bad, considering the UK lost 23 troops in the Faulklands when a SeaKing hit a flock of Albatrosses.
Friendly Fire=5. I will not go into the complexities of the modern battle field here in this forum, however 5 killed by friendly fire is a waste of
life no matter which way you look at it.......it is however a risk that all commanders are aware of.
Killed by Iraqis=4. It could be said that they are just bad shots and need more time down at the rifle range!
Statistics.......you have to love them!
PS 78.58% of people that quote a statistic are wrong............
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They arent my statistics. They came out of some pommie's mouth. He was wearing a uniform and its not the sort of propaganda that would lift
spirits so I believe it. Although he could possibly have played down the numbers a bit. maybe its more.
I would have thought that a sophisticated helicopter (and its not just one that has gone down) would be safer. This man is as close to the action as
you can get and he doesnt think its so avoidable either http://au.news.yahoo.com/030331/19/rdvp.html. Maybe I am wrong. But I can pretty much be self assured that when the boys are
sitting in the strategy planning room before a war, having more deaths due to their own incompetence than in battle is NOT part of the plan.
Chris.... kombi pilot, oval dreamer... finisher #26971 2005 city to surf
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Che Castro
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| posted on March 31st, 2003 at 05:56 PM |
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democracy my foot! it's only the rich who have any kind of say in America
Jon
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T3Forme
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| posted on April 1st, 2003 at 08:39 PM |
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Maybe we should put democracy to the test and have a vote on non VW threads on this forum, Providing it is one vote per member, this may calm some
people down a tad. Is this possible?
Jenz that Psych studied you mentioned reminds me of another i saw a doco about (May have been the same guy). This one was 10 or so uni students in a
mock prison setup 5 prisoners 5 guards. Basically what happened was the prisoners submitted to the guards and the guards went kind of power crazed.
The experiment was called of when everyone went nutty, it was terrifying to see what "normal" people are capable of in a sealed situation.
How simple for war crimes to be perpertrated.
I heard today our treasurer saying he would try to ensure that Australian companies got their share of rebuilding work after the war. This sickens me.
While the killing is happening these greedy little bastards are rubbing their hands together, dreaming of new worlds to plunder, and if reports are to
be believed, some US companies have already been awarded contracts!
$$$$$$$$$$ ALL KNEEL AND WORSHIP THE MONEY GOD! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Liam
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jenz58
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| posted on April 1st, 2003 at 09:21 PM |
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Not the same guy
Here's 'The Stamford Prison Experiment'
http://www.prisonexp.org/index.html
It was about what happens to good people who are put into bad places.
The researcher was Philip Zimardo. Here's a piece he has written on terrorist alarms
http://www.zimbardo.com/terrorist.html
Well there certainly are a lot of mind games going on, I think more so than any war before. Unfortunately our troops are over there and in the coal
face of it
:jesus
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Spook
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| posted on April 4th, 2003 at 04:02 AM |
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Oh what a lovely war
An interesting week all up I think.
Two carloads of women & children shot to hell........oops.
The British want an American pilot charged with manslaughter for dropping a bomb on their tank, killing one of it's crew.
Funnily enough, I thought if you went to war, you had a 50/50 chance of that happening anyway.
And quote of the year has got to go to Colin Powell.
"When we break the back of the Iraqi resistance, the Iraqi's will realise we come in peace"
So all the bombs they bought with them must actually be gifts.
How did that Star Trekking song go
We come in peace
Shoot to kill
Shoot to kill
Shoot to kill
We come in peace
Shoot to kill
Shoot to kill men.............:bounce
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
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Flying VW
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| posted on April 5th, 2003 at 06:39 PM |
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Go and get them |
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