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 Jak Rizzo
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| posted on July 26th, 2012 at 07:18 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by 1303Steve
| Quote: | Originally
posted by vw54
LG
i know a good VW engine bulider
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just need a good VW engine then
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LMFAO
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 vw54
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| posted on July 26th, 2012 at 08:42 AM |
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yeah it might just put out MORE power
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toey1984
A.k.a.: nathan kirkman
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| posted on July 29th, 2012 at 06:57 PM |
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how did you go sorting it out lou?
Nathan
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lou0060
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| posted on July 30th, 2012 at 02:18 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by vw54
yeah it might just put out MORE power
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yea and put struts in as well.......
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising 
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust 
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief 
1960 beetle - old school low & slow  |
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lou0060
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| posted on July 30th, 2012 at 02:34 PM |
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hi Nathan, ran at QR on saturday with the vw watercooled guys and the dreaded 4500rpm cut out happened again from the word go. NOT HAPPY!
will be visiting the dyno guy this afternoon and ripping him a new AH!!
When I got home I hooked up a "check engine light" to see if I could get a code but it just flashed constantly so not sure what that means....
The car rans really strong up to about 4400rpm in all gears and pulls strong up to there. If I drive it at 4400rpm it is fine and was good for about
160 down the main straight. But as soon as you push above that in any gear it just starts to miss. When this ahppens boost drops right off to zero.
Up to 4400 in 3rd it's boosting to 10 psi so I know the primary turbo is working so something is happening with the prespooling of the secondary
turbo.
My next plan of attack is to check all the vacuum hoses, again, check the secondary turbo actuators and clean all the soleniod terminals, again.
I think I have my temperatures working fine now as I stayed out for the 30minute session and temps were about 110 for water and 60 for oil. I am
going to play around with the airflow over the engine with some panels to direct the air flow down away from the intecooler and inlet hose and
wrapping the exhaust to reduce the temps a bit more as well.
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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vw54
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| posted on July 30th, 2012 at 02:41 PM |
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remove the 2nd turbo and ECU fit after market
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lou0060
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| posted on August 5th, 2012 at 06:04 PM |
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well we took the car up to Mt Mee on Saturday to a mates place and ran up and down his dead end street. took a while but we got the 4500rpm jitters
to happen again. then I hooked up an led light to the CEL lead and finally got a code. 33! that is the speed sensor.
well we checked around and sure enough the speed sensor lead from the ecu is not hooked up! so, what has been happening is that the car runs okay in
the first 3 gears but once you shift to 4th it sends the ecu into meltdown mode and won't let it rev above 4500. When you cut the engine out it
restores the ecu and then it revs okay until you get to 4th again and the cycle continues.
Okay, stop laughing! why wasn't the speed sensor connected. Well you might recall that in the initial build I lost my wiring legend and we were
trying to get the car ready for Warwick last year and got the wiring done at midnight the Tuesday befoer Warwick and then had to finish putting the
car together. Well my electrician didn't know we needed a speed sensor and tucked that cable away out of sight.....
So the car ran alright at Warwick cause it didn't go thru enough cycles in each run. It was only when we ran at Lakeside and Wakefield that we
discovered we had an issue.
Anyway, today I ran 2 wires from the ecu to the front and mounted a permanent LED for the CEL and also a cable from the speed sensor pin to the speedo
cable ready to adapt to the VDO 412.009 sensor which I'll arrange this week. Cross fingers but I am sure this will sort out our problem and we
should be ready to hit LS on the 18th.....
If we get a chance we'll dyno the car again before then to see what it really makes....
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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vw54
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| posted on August 6th, 2012 at 09:41 AM |
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go to dyno first
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ian.mezz
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| posted on August 6th, 2012 at 08:15 PM |
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NO speed sensor don't normally cause a problem .
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lou0060
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| posted on August 7th, 2012 at 02:18 PM |
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hi Ian, my dyno guy thinks the same as you but I am convinced this is my problem. Joel has eluded to it before in other threads and from what we can
find on the subi forums the speed sensor problem is associated with not reving past 4000 rpm or so. I've ordered the VDO sensor that fits into the
back of the speedo rather than make up one like Joel did with a set of magnets and hall effect sensor, in fact the delivery driver has just walked in
with my sensor...
got to go.....
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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1303Steve
A.k.a.: Steve Carter
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| posted on August 7th, 2012 at 03:09 PM |
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Hi Lou
Only problem with the VDO sensor being driven off the speedo cable is how will you turn it while the car is on the dyno? Electric drill on the speedo
cable.
Steve
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lou0060
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| posted on August 8th, 2012 at 07:17 PM |
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Hi Steve, yes I did think about that but the speedo sensor was the easy way out. I fitted it last night and wired it all up now just need to get onto
the track, or lonely road somewhere...
here are some pictures.
if the car runs okay now then I can close the book on the 4500rpm and then start looking at why the power is down. My guess is that it was not
spooling the second turbo on the dyno due to the sensor not picking up any movement. I have printed out a technical manual on the Subi twin turbo and
am going to study it tonight to see just what effect the speed sensor has on the system.
When we run the car up to the point that the ecu starts to limit the revs to 4500 it has plenty of power right through the rev range 7000 plus so the
ecu must work for a period and then must register that it is reving and loading up but no vehicle movement and then shuts down to the 4500 limit.
anyway, the earliest I can get it on the dyno is late next week and the next LS meet is the 18th so will post results once these things happen.
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1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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1303Steve
A.k.a.: Steve Carter
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| posted on August 8th, 2012 at 10:55 PM |
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Hi Lou
I have the same VDO sensor in my bug and I also drive my digital speedo with it.
Did you notice the car stalling at all, no speed sensor can cause that.
Steve
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lou0060
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| posted on August 11th, 2012 at 09:20 AM |
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sooooo Steve, if you disconnect the speed senor wire from the speedo adaptor what does your engine do? I realsie yours is a later model and might use
the speed senor signal in a different way but this 4500rpm limit is mentioned on subi forums regardless of vehicle age, even late model STI WRX's
have posted a similar problem.
i wonder how many vw swaps have their speed sensor hooked up and how many don't. Also do we know if the speed sensor is only required on turbo EJ's
as oppossed to NA engines??
Anyway plan today is to take the car down some back streets behind work and see what happens.
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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1303Steve
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| posted on August 11th, 2012 at 09:36 AM |
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Hi Lou
I've never run mine without the speed sensor.
Something that I will need to look into is if the VDO sensor will give too many pulses and the ECU will think I'm going much faster than I am and
cause a shutdown.
Steve
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ian.mezz
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| posted on August 11th, 2012 at 11:59 AM |
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I DO NOT have a speed sensor in my bug and i also had a na with NO speed sensor either. both run fine.
i don't think any of the 4 subaru powered vw at our dyno had speed sensors and we didn't use a drill
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q_hJU9pd3A&feature=plcp
When I worked at Holden the bomadore use to do the similar thing , so to make sure that we had a faulty crank or cam sensor , we would have to drive
the car around in 2nd gear to get the heat into it and when it played up , we just had a bottle of water that we would tip over the sensor then it
normally would run fine again, then back to the shop to replace the faulty part . Good old factory traind Holden Technicians.
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lou0060
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| posted on August 11th, 2012 at 06:18 PM |
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happy days!
just spent 1 hour hooning up and down some back streets and car has performed brilliantly! I did at least 20 runs up and down a quarter mile run
running up to 7000 rpm thru most gears and no problems. car easily revved pasted 4500 in 1st, 2nd and 3rd and pulled away well in 4th without the
dreaded 4500rpm limiter kicking in. temp was up around the 100 degrees and fans had kicked in a couple of times so I think everything was pretty much
the same as the last time we ran it and had issues so I am pretty sure the problem is solved.
this means we are ready for the 18th at Lakeside. we'll run VW watercooled happy laps in the morning to dial car in and make sure all is well and
then have practice till noon followed by the open sprints in the afternoon. I'll post some results next weekend.
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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lou0060
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| posted on August 11th, 2012 at 06:30 PM |
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great video by the way Ian. Your's is a real sleeper hey!
what engine are you running, year and ecu? I am keen to figure out why my speed sensor needs to be connected and others don't. There must be some
logical and technical reasons why this has happened.
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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1303Steve
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| posted on August 11th, 2012 at 06:48 PM |
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Great news Lou
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toey1984
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| posted on August 19th, 2012 at 08:07 AM |
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Happy to see it all came together mate.
Nathan
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toey1984
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| posted on August 19th, 2012 at 08:09 AM |
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How does the vally of death go with the 4 speed?
Nathan
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Joel
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| posted on August 19th, 2012 at 10:28 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by lou0060
I am keen to figure out why my speed sensor needs to be connected and others don't. There must be some logical and technical reasons why this has
happened.
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Every fuel injected EJ engine needs a speed sensor, just some don;t present the symptoms as much as others.
Early ones like mine and Ians don't have limp mode so no rev limiting but they still run better with one.
I've been in the passengers seat of Ians and seen the check engine light coming on every time we were rolling down a hill.
I can disconnect mine and it's still drivable.
As I mentioned it doenst have a limp mode but every time I coast over 35km/h my check engine light comes on with the Idle valve code and as I come to
a stop the revs drop right down.
Not enough to stall but the charge light does start to glow then clears itself, others will stall, it depends on the idle valve setting and how gummed
up it is which make them lazy.
The reason all that happens is when you are coasting along like downhill the engine is spinning say 2000rpm but your foot is off the throttle.
The computer sees there is no throttle and thinks the car's not moving as no speed signal but sees the revs are at 2000rpm and says faaaarrrrrk I'm
idling at 2000rpm with no throttle and not moving, somethings wrong.
That's why they usually spit code 24 (idle valve) when the VSS isn't working.
the later stuff also uses the speed sensor to dictate what speed it runs the cooling fans at.
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lou0060
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| posted on June 17th, 2013 at 07:54 PM |
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soooo, been a while since I added to this thread. Suffice to say the problems I have been having with the twin setup have persisted and in fact still
casued some issues at Wakefield this year, although it did run a bit harder than last year. Still 1.21 was not were I thought I would be so we limped
home once again and deleted all the go-pro footage......
However, I have had a major breakthrough and will be at QR on Friday this week for what I think will be a huge turn-around in peformance. Stay tuned
and maybe this time I won't feel the need to delete the go-pro footage......
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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vw54
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| posted on June 17th, 2013 at 08:03 PM |
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lets see it LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOuieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
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vassy66T1
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| posted on June 18th, 2013 at 07:04 PM |
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Hope it goes well Mate!
You deserve it 
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lou0060
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 08:35 PM |
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yes I know it has been nearly 3 years and I have struggled with my twin turbo set up BUT today at QR general practice, in the rain, we finally got
both turbos boosting and holy shite, it is a weapon!
I am trying to post a vid but it's taking ages. We had a ball this morning and can't wait for a dry run.
I'll post the vid on the circuit forum. thanks to everyone who tried to help and for sure won't be going single turbo!
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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hellbugged
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 09:06 PM |
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So what was the fix ?
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ian.mezz
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 05:06 PM |
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sounds like the hose came off and you got max boost
great news
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lou0060
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 08:45 PM |
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Hi Damian, its almost too embarrasing to say!
we have done a lot of behind the scene and off the air "fixes" to try and solve this twin turbo issue over the past 2 years and spent a lot of time
on the uk legacy forum as they have a heap of twin turbos over there and some pretty knowledgable people.
But anyway we tracked it down to the secondary exhaust gas actuator which is a double acting actuator that uses both vacuum and boost pressure to
function. And we had the hoses on back-to-front.....
so instead of sucking we were blowing and instead of blowing we were sucking......
1971 karmann ghia Cabrio - Cruising
1963 beetle Sunroof - gathering dust
1968 race beetle - twin turbo Subaru - stress relief
1960 beetle - old school low & slow |
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hellbugged
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 11:05 PM |
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Bugger.... Good it's solved now tho.....nothing like having engine sorted so you can concentrate on driving and dialing in the rest of the car
Look forward to some footage!
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