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 Bizarre
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| posted on October 7th, 2008 at 07:28 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by newoldmanx
Does it mean god doesn't love me
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No - you drive a buggy
Futue te ipsum!!!
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 kmesh
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| posted on October 7th, 2008 at 07:57 PM |
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I don't really have a problem with religion until they start to talk about it...
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LUFTMEISTER
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| posted on October 7th, 2008 at 09:00 PM |
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The part that (sh*ts) gets to me is when they say "all the answers are in the Bible"
then when you raise points that are total against current popular opinion, they say no thats not relevent or you misunderstand what they meant.
if you are going to sprout that one book/translation has all life (and afterlifes) answers, then you can not pick and choose the bits that do not
offend or are not completely ridiculous (the arc story) or just plain works of imagination (garden of eden).
Someone quoted the Bible should be treated like the yellow pages, but the yellow pages does not tell you you are going to hell if you do not read it
and not another book.
Customer service is not dead in Australia.
Always after HAZET & MATRA & VW factory tools
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pete wood
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| posted on October 7th, 2008 at 09:04 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by newoldmanx
where does faith come from??? who decides who gets faith and who doesnt.
Are you born with it, do you wake up one morning and just believe, or talk yourself into it, or does god give you a "sign" that you cannot
mistake
Does it mean god doesn't love me because he hasn't given me an unmistakable sign, so i can have faith too, i could pretend to believe. I just dont
think having faith is a conscious decision. Where does faith originate if it originates from god why wont he give me some
Does it mean god doesn't love me
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I think it's different from person to person. Some people have a "defining moment" when they feel like they are touched by God. For others, it's a
process. Weighing up the arguments for and against, reading the bible and spending time talking it through.
In answer to your question, I think God cares immensely about everyone (and I know this is opening the floodgates re discussion on suffering). I also
think that if we really want to trust God, we can. After trusting in nothing but yourself it can be very hard, but he is trustworthy.
Dubb61, Good point. The bible doesn't have the answer to everything. Anyone who says it does is deluded. The bible talks about a
limited scope of things. That God created the world, that we rejected him and how he is working to fix things up. There are some other things, but
it's not exhaustive. It can help us to understand our world better in a general sense but there aren't details on everything.
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grogy
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| posted on October 7th, 2008 at 09:54 PM |
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if u worried bout goin to hell, dont sweat it
someone on the forum said if they goin to hell they goin in a vw, so still some seat available
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Newt
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| posted on October 8th, 2008 at 01:17 AM |
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Now this is a somewhat interestiong post.
I thought that there was only two religions.
Man reaching out to god and God reaching out to man.
Newt
It is as it is - If you didnt enjoy today, you've missed the opportunity.
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grogy
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| posted on October 8th, 2008 at 03:59 PM |
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u rite there is only 2, false n true. love is the defining mark, but thats not permissiveness, nor is it cruelty, nor politically allied with
nationalism
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Wild1
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| posted on October 8th, 2008 at 06:49 PM |
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Pete, if god loves everyone immensly, then why do children and infants starve endemically in poor countries for example. Have they sinned?
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LUFTMEISTER
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| posted on October 8th, 2008 at 07:50 PM |
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No need for God to answer that. OVERPOPULATION for the areas resources they live in. Same as all the wildlife in an area during drought or plague. But
not allowing certain Christians the right to use contraception does not help the situation.
Customer service is not dead in Australia.
Always after HAZET & MATRA & VW factory tools
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kmesh
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| posted on October 8th, 2008 at 08:37 PM |
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It must be God's will then that i don't believe in him???
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pete wood
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| posted on October 8th, 2008 at 09:16 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by DUBB61
No need for God to answer that. OVERPOPULATION for the areas resources they live in. Same as all the wildlife in an area during drought or plague. But
not allowing certain Christians the right to use contraception does not help the situation.
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DUBB61, I couldn't have said it any better...especially the last sentence.
Interesting thing though. Have been reading J.Blainey's "a very short history of the world". He cites the improved farming methods of the west
impacting the developing world as the reasons for over population...and then starvation. Prior to that there was just starvation.
Wild1, sin is a small word describing thinking or acting in a way that says "God is not the boss of me". So in answer to your question, I think
everyone has.
Kmesh, the bible says we make our own mind whether you'd trust God or not...and I think you know this is true for you too. Nice try though. 
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newoldmanx
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 07:23 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by DUBB61
No need for God to answer that. OVERPOPULATION for the areas resources they live in. Same as all the wildlife in an area during drought or plague. But
not allowing certain Christians the right to use contraception does not help the situation.
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"OVERPOPULATION for the areas resources they live in"
how many ppl does two fish feed
the area they live in is called the world, the world produces enough food to feed everybody very well peoples priorities are why many starve
for example taking the food out of starving kids mouths to... repaint a vw, buy those rims i just have to have, spotties, stereo, new seats etc etc
not to mention the cost of the old christian vs muslim debarcle that has re-surfaced with a new catchy title "the war on terror"
its just a car for f*%k sake
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newoldmanx
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 07:34 AM |
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"But not allowing certain Christians the right to use contraception does not help the situation."
religion comes second to instint. We instinctivly reproduce (add to that christians were also told to "go forth and multiply")
contraception would mean that ppl were haveing sex for fun!!!!!
the bible says sex is for reproduction (IF ONLY WE WERE CALLED TO GOD THE WAY WE ARE CALLED TO SEX)
so it makes sense to me that christians not be given contraception, plus it means more in the coffers = more prime real estate, more pope mobiles,
more gold more power and more fancy dresses for the clergy = HAPPY DAYS
its just a car for f*%k sake
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Phil74Camper
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 07:46 AM |
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That is nonsense. The world cannot produce enough food to feed everybody now, and croplands are already suffering from salinity problems, erosion and
lack of water. Vast areas of irrigation land, usually originally set up in semi-arid land anyway, are becoming unsustainable. Look at the Murray
Darling river - it is already at the point of over-use and parts of the MIA are being turned off. The Colorado River in the US does not even reach the
sea any more - every single drop is being used for storage and irrigation. The problem is common around the world. And haven't you been reading the
news reports about dangerously low fish stocks in the oceans of the world? How can you possibly say that the world can support nearly 7 billion
people? It can't. Period.
Political problems certainly cause localised witholding of imported food and starvation - Somalia, Ethiopia etc, but the fact remains that those parts
of the world (and many more) will NEVER be self sufficient in food. More and more countries are having to import food and water. There are too many
people in the world now, and more people in future will only make it worse.
No one is taking food from starving kids to buy VW parts etc - a particularly irrational argument. As already mentioned, Australians are one of the
highest givers of foreign aid in the world, and one of the highest contributors to charities.
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newoldmanx
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 02:01 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Phil74Camper
No one is taking food from starving kids to buy VW parts etc - a particularly irrational argument. As already mentioned, Australians are one of the
highest givers of foreign aid in the world, and one of the highest contributors to charities.
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by world standards, if you have clean running water in or even near your house you are FILTHY RICH
if you have a flushing toilet in or even near your house you are rolyalty you own a palace and are FILTHY RICH
sadly to most ppl in austalia these are seen as basic rights not ultimate luxuries
if you can afford these AND own a toy car to squander money on while people starve DONT TALK TO ME ABOUT YOUR "GOD" OR RELIGION AND SIN ETC
As of 2008, the World Bank has estimated that there were an estimated 982 million poor people in developing countries who live on $1 a day or less
The real problem is poverty. As the market responds to money and not to actual need, it can only work to eliminate hunger when purchasing power is
widely dispersed. Promoting free trade to alleviate hunger has proven to be a failure. In most developing countries exports have boomed while hunger
has continued unabated or actually worsened
its just a car for f*%k sake
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grogy
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 02:39 PM |
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the earth can produce easily enuff food for 7 bill or heaps more, its bad management ,greed, destruction of forrests etc. in 1987 the world spent 87
mill per minute on weaponary, its gone up since then. the system has based its finances not on caring for peoples needs but on mad, or as its more
properly known mutualy assured destruction.
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Phil74Camper
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 02:54 PM |
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I started to respond about the 150% food production and the 1 in 7 going hungry but you edited it before I could finish!
OK, the UN FAO is a scientific body and one would have to accept their conclusions, but predictions need to be given with caution. I suspect they may
be saying that existing world nutrition standards may continue until 2030 - and we already know that many of the world's population are not
adequately fed. This can only increase in future. And what happens after 2030?
I don't believe the Greenpeace statement; while I respect them, they are a political, not scientific organisation. Think about what they claim.
Let's assume the world's population is 7 billion now. We supposedly produce enough food for 10.5 billion people, 1.5 times the existing total, yet
only 6 billion are adequately fed. Are they saying that enough food for 4.5 billion people is produced now, and going 'missing'? That's enough to
feed everyone in world just 20 years ago. If one person eats just 2 kg of food a day, that's 9 million tonnes per day - 3.2 billion tonnes of food
per year - vanishing. I don't believe it.
And of course you need water for all those people too. Where is that going to come from?
And even if the 'missing' food could be found, and perfectly distributed to everyone, it's only enough to last until 2030 or 10.5 billion people.
Then what?
There would be a lot more starving people without organisations like World Vision, and we are going to need more such work in future. But we are
getting off the point, which is that infinitely expanding population is not only unsustainable and unrealistic, it is impossible. That's not a
'doomsday bubble', it's reality. We are still at the point where it's not too late to do something useful about it, but withholding contraception
(whether for political or religious reasons) is irresponsible.
I take on board all your points about the contrast between our society and the hundreds of millions - soon thousands of millions - who are in poverty.
But more people in the world is not a solution. It is simply impossible for 100% of the population to have the same standard of living as the
wealthiest, apart from the fact that the earth does not have the resources to allow it. Free trade does not have all the answers, no. But neither does
any other system of government. But it is the best we have.
The Romans had running water, central heating and plumbed toilets. But even then it was only a percentage of the population had them, and in the end
their society was unsustainable - all resources are finite.
Contraception is PRECISELY the point of being able to enjoy sex, a perfectly normal and natural process, without the complications of reproduction (if
we so choose). Why are humans (and particularly religious humans) the only species with hang-ups about sex? Dolphins do it fun (one of the only other
species to do so) without any guilt.
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grogy
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 04:13 PM |
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humans got hangups about lots stuff, or maybe its conscience...... contraceptives that stop the female egg from fertilizing is not against bible
principals, so its is ok to enjoy a relationship in harmony with scriptural principals. life is sacred....... but if u are not terminating a
life..........
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Wannavee
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 04:58 PM |
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My opinion and mine only,
and i WONT enter into a bulls.t debate about it.
Absolutely NOT ONE PERSON can PROVE to me
that god exists.
You prove it in black and white that there really IS a god
and ill believe it (maybe).
All i have heard and read from people is that 'he' exists
or its 'God's way'.Thats crap as far as i'm concerned.
Neglecting your own family and putting god and the church first is NOT a christian thing to do is it?
Someone VERY close to me has this dilemma.
I believe I am a good 'christian' in the sense of the word.
I help fellow man yet I am not a believer,and this taints me as an athiest from people who have their
head up their asses.
No,i dont 'believe',yet if you were in trouble or i could help you in a time of need,
regardless of whether i knew you or not,i would help.
Only today (this is the reason for responding to this topic,otherwise i wouldnt have replied) i saw an asian woman
beating the shit out of a 3 to 5 year old child (and i'm talking punches and a knee to the leg) on a main road in view of all traffic.
And what did she say? GOD WILL PUNISH HIM!!!!! FOR WHAT????
What could that poor kid have done to deserve that?
I shoulda returned the favour for her child of her there and then.Bitch
As far as i am able to tell with my limited intelligence,nobody can ever win this world debate as to whether god exists or not.
If you believe,good onya,thats your thing.I dont,so dont try to convince me he/she/it does!
Apologies for a long winded excuse for a reply,and i could say a lot more
but ive said enough.Cheers
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MickH
A.k.a.: Michael Hutchinson
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 05:43 PM |
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Just remember the thread topic "Why are people against religion".....it's getting somewhat off track.
I'm against it as I veiw it as simply another form of corruption that is trying to justify itself.
tssnq.com.au
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kmesh
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 06:24 PM |
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About religion in general then WTF is up with Scientology? Do you know what those people think...
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MickH
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 07:59 PM |
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Do they know?? LOL..
tssnq.com.au
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Newt
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 09:00 PM |
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South Park did a really good explanation about it a while back.
It is as it is - If you didnt enjoy today, you've missed the opportunity.
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Notch Nut
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| posted on October 9th, 2008 at 09:29 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by kmesh
About religion in general then WTF is up with Scientology? Do you know what those people think...
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I'm guessing you have an overload of some really bad theatans going on. Want a personality test???
If you can't fix it with a hammer,
you have an electrical problem....
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Wannavee
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| posted on October 10th, 2008 at 02:30 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by MickH
Just remember the thread topic "Why are people against religion".....it's getting somewhat off track.
I'm against it as I veiw it as simply another form of corruption that is trying to justify itself.
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Fair enough,i got a bit carried away
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baja burley
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| posted on October 13th, 2008 at 09:36 PM |
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how do you explain amphibians turning into reptiles turning into humans if evolution is not true??
There are three types of people in this world - people who can count and people who can't....
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newoldmanx
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| posted on October 15th, 2008 at 04:58 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by baja burley
how do you explain amphibians turning into reptiles turning into humans if evolution is not true??
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and then back to wanna be amphibians on the piss
wonder what were going to "turn into" next btw alot of ppl in
the world see no difference between amphibians reptiles humans rocks trees water and air including many of Australias indigenous language groups
its just a car for f*%k sake
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pete wood
A.k.a.: figure itout
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| posted on October 15th, 2008 at 05:17 PM |
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If you believe Christ died for your sins, you don't have to worry about being held accountable because he's taken the punishment.
Sin = "God is not the boss of me" - Simple as that. What he didn't know before eating the fruit was good or evil, so he couldn't choose evil.
They were naked and "not ashamed", coz they had nothing to be ashamed of.
| Quote: | the "apple" is
scripture
and the "tree of knowledge" the bible
makes total sense 
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ummm, no 
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grogy
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| posted on October 15th, 2008 at 06:01 PM |
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eating the fruit meant he would decide for himself good and bad... in other words the fruit was a symbol of rulership or sovreignty...... being
ashamed meant he now knew what it was to have a guilty conscience
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LUFTMEISTER
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| posted on October 15th, 2008 at 07:01 PM |
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I thought we already concluded that the old testament was a work of fiction. It has no more relevance than a science fiction novel. Loosely based on
what could have happened, but with no relevent evidence and as such should be taken as heresay.
Sin is a moral line in the sand that (hopefully) moves as societys develop, otherwise we would still be getting stoned to death for saying
jehovah.
Customer service is not dead in Australia.
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