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posted on March 1st, 2014 at 09:23 AM
Starting issues....opinions?
Hello everyone!
I just came back from a long holiday, to find my '72 bug having troubles. It was running fine, but then started sputtering, before dying. When I try
to start it now, it runs for 2 seconds, then quits. The battery and starter are good, but I think it might be an issue of getting fuel.
I was thinking of cleaning up the carbies, as the tank was low, and might have shot sediment in it, blocking some jets.
Or, maybe the electronic fuel pump got shorted out, because of the jump I got because my battery was low.
Any thoughts or suggestions on this? Thanks in advance....I miss driving the bug
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bajachris88
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posted on March 1st, 2014 at 09:45 AM
Does it go if you keep pumping the accelerator?
When you say carbies, you have dual?
If single, you could do the old, rev up and put hand over top of carb trick until motor drops to around idle speed. Vacuum pressure usually clears the
jets. Do it a couple times.
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posted on March 2nd, 2014 at 11:05 AM
Hey Chris,
Thanks for the advice! Yeah, I do have a dual carb set-up, and don't know if I could still do the "Vacuum clean" on my jets. I did clean them out
yesterday, along with changing the spark plugs(because I had some).
I can't get the car to idle. As soon as it turns over, it sputters for a couple of seconds, then dies. It runs rough for about 5 seconds, if I keep
pumping the accelerator pedal.
Today, I'll check the electronic fuel pump and fuel filters, to see if they are working good.
Any other suggestions??
Thanks again.
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posted on March 2nd, 2014 at 11:34 AM
If you wanna test if its fuel pump issues, (fuel starvation) fill the fuel bowls with fuel via the 'vent tubes' that you see at the top of the carb.
fill em up and see if it runs longer.
Alternatively, after it splutters and stops, with the engine off, go to the engine bay and press the accelerator with the air filters off. See if you
can see the accelerator pump squirt fuel down the guts of the carb for each. If there is no fuel in the bowl (fuel starvation), no fuel will squirt.
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
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nils
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posted on March 2nd, 2014 at 12:52 PM
Defiantly sounds like a blockage in your fuel system or idle circuit, would a dual carb set up run on just one carb?
Quit calling rust patina
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posted on March 4th, 2014 at 08:28 AM
Well, I checked to see if any fuel is getting into the carbs...and nothing. I'm thinking its the electronic fuel pump, as I don't here any noise
coming from it, with the ignition on.
This pump came with the car, so I'm not really accustomed to it, using the old style in my VWs for the last 20 years. It's set up near the front
left tire, so maybe got water-logged from the wet season up here in Cairns. I ordered a marine-style pump, with the same specs.....hopefully this
clears it up.
As for the dual carbs running off one carb: it will run, but not very good. I had the linkage come off one a couple times, before I fixed it, and it
runs like its stuck in second gear. Possible, but not ideal.... had to use the quick "zip-tie" fix a couple of times!
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posted on March 4th, 2014 at 12:09 PM
To confirm its the fuel pump,
fill the fuel bowls of each carb by pouring fuel down the 'vent tubes'. google image search to see what i mean.
This should provide enough a longer run time, then stall due to fuel shortage (as a result of pump).
Pump failure could be an open circuit, you might not need a fuel pump. Use a multimeter or light bulb to confirm you are getting 12 volts at the pump.
Could be as simple as a blown inline fuse.
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
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New engine in process: 94mm p&bs, 74mm C/w chomol Crank, 35.5x39 SP heads, turbo. Wierd combo, hopeful torque monsta!
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posted on March 4th, 2014 at 01:12 PM
Hi
You might have a safety fuel cut off, if not you should, you could try bridging it.
BTW you often still have fuel in the accelerator pumps even if there is no fuel in the bow,l that is until you use it up by pumping the pedal.
Steve
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posted on March 4th, 2014 at 06:47 PM
Thanks for the advice everyone!
I am getting 12V to the pump, but thought it was a simple fix, by replacing it.
Chris, when you say it could be an open circuit, what exactly do you mean? I checked all the wires and fuses, and they seem to be fine....? Where are
the inline fuses located? Separate from the fuse box, I assume. I traced the wires back, and no fuse...
....and safety fuel cut-off? Once again, I'm blank. I thought I ran into most problems/terminology Bugs have had, because of my luck with them over
the years. Now, I'm thrown new issues?? I might try some Googling....
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posted on March 4th, 2014 at 07:06 PM
I just found the post from the 2009 question on electronic fuel pumps...
Now that I know about the safety fuel cut-off, I will look around for it. Its not in the engine bay or the boot...
The past forum looks like it was undecided on whether or not to have a regulator...anything change since then?
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posted on March 5th, 2014 at 02:24 PM
Ok, so I changed the fuel pump, and added a fuel filter before it. It runs great, and I have fuel to the carbies.
But....the car is still not going. ;(
I have spark at the coil to the distributer.
I have spark from the distributer to the plugs.
I turned the distirbuter, to adjust the timing a little (no strobe light), still nothing.
I checked all the wires/fuses, and looked for any cutoff switches, and nothing.
Stumped, I am....my Beast has gotten me again! Any points of wisdom left?
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posted on March 5th, 2014 at 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally
posted by wesdem77
It runs great, and I have fuel to the carbies.
But....the car is still not going. ;(
You are going to have to be more specific.
Its running but its not?
How do you know fuel is at the carbs?
have you or have you not looked down the carbs as per suggestions prior about jets, accelerator pumps, checking if fuel is in fuel bowls?
confirm whether the past suggestions have or have not been checked, otherwise we'll be suggesting the same things again.
If you require further explanation on the above suggestions don't hesitate to ask.
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
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posted on March 5th, 2014 at 07:48 PM
Sorry not to clarify, as I guess frustration set in.
The engine cranks, but doesn't engage and run.
I tried the previous suggestions, and found the fuel bowel to be full, and am able to here and see the jets pump the fuel in the carbies. So, the
accelerator pump is working, and the carbs have been cleaned and are working.
Thanks again for your time, and dedication for helping VW'ers like me
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posted on March 5th, 2014 at 10:50 PM
Youadjusted the timing way back so you may need to reset the timing. You can static time it to get it to a base setting to be sure it'll run.
Otherwise, when were the valves last set?
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posted on March 7th, 2014 at 10:36 AM
Hi
I've had old cars broken down on the road and the only way I could get them to start was to heat the plugs with a gas torch burn the crap off them.
If your plugs are old try putting a new set in or heat them up up on the barby to burn off the crap as you have been pumping unburned fuel into the
motor for a while, let them cool before refitting.
I feel the new fuels are harder to ignite with older ignition system, I also go to many modern cars that wont start because they have been flooded,
many owners treat the ignition switch as and on/off switch and sometimes even modern cars need coaxing to start.
When I get to them the motors turn over like they are low on compression, they need to cleared by opening the throttle to full and cranking the motor
over.
I find a lot of modern cars will flood if say, you drive the car out to wash it, start it and drive it back in, the next time the owner tries to start
it it wont start unless a bit of throttle is given to clear it out, they keep trying and that's when I get called.
Steve
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posted on March 7th, 2014 at 02:35 PM
A can of start you bastard is great.
or any other aerosol 'starting fluid'.
If you spray that down each carb and try to start, if the ignition system is good it allows the engine to clear itself, start if comp is an issue, or
if fueling is a problem.
If it doesn't assist, then you can well assume its an ignition issue.
It assists with diagnostics.
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
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New engine in process: 94mm p&bs, 74mm C/w chomol Crank, 35.5x39 SP heads, turbo. Wierd combo, hopeful torque monsta!
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posted on March 7th, 2014 at 08:17 PM
Is the fuel old?
Might want some fresh stuff.
If it's low on fuel, a few litres of new fuel will make a significant difference.
Modern fuels have a 2 month shelf life (!)
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posted on March 8th, 2014 at 09:15 AM
Alright...still trying all the suggestions.
I reset the timing, as I marked the original spot it was in. As for the valves, they were adjusted a couple months back, before I left. If they are
maladjusted, I thought it would run bad, not cause starting problems??
I did change the plugs to new ones, and tried opening up the throttle fully and starting....still didn't start. I've had flooded engines before, and
was able to remedy it.
I never knew fuel had a shelf life!! In that regards, I did put 3 litres of fresh fuel in it, when the pump was replaced.
Now, I heard about the "start-ya-bastard" spray....I forgot about that, people says it works good. I'll give it a try today.
I checked my coil, and am getting 11.3v on it, so that's good. Maybe the distributer cap or rotor wore out. They're relatively new, but I'll pick
some up and give it a whirl.
Here's hoping! Thanks again everyone...the Gods of VWs, that's what I tell my girlfriend you all are
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posted on March 20th, 2014 at 07:30 PM
If the fuel side of things is working, you would tend to lean towards ignition.
Quite strange that it was running fine and then all of sudden not running well.
More strange that you are getting fuel & spark from the plugs. Yet no run at all.
I would think it would somewhat start(maybe rough) but still start.
That tends to indicate real bad timing. Ensure the distributor is fully seated, When you move the rotor does it sping bacK?
Good luck.
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posted on April 8th, 2014 at 05:58 PM
Well, after awhile....the problem finally got fixed!
The timing was off, as the distributor wasn't seated right, and the electronic ignition wasn't working right.
Also replaced the ignition coil and installed a fuel pressure regulator.
Now, all good! It's a trying experience sometimes, almost a love-hate relationship. Once it's running, though, it's the best feeling!
Thanks for all the advice everyone...
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posted on March 1st, 2014 at 09:23 AM
