| [ Total Views: 1213 | Total Replies: 22 | Thread Id: 107876 ] |
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 oldturtle22
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 04:28 PM |
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opinions on gas shock vs oil shocks
I own a 59 Beetle with a narrowed beam and dropped spindles and want to fit new lowered shocks but have seen empi sell gas and oil shocks.
What is better for narrowed lowered front ends??
Please share youre opinions and experiences?
Thanks Chris
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 Bizarre
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 05:47 PM |
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I doubt there would be any difference between empi gas and oil shocks
I would also stay away from Cofap
I use to have KYB Gas shocks on my lowered (strut) beetle and it handled well
Otherwise Bilstein
Futue te ipsum!!!
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 helbus
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 05:54 PM |
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My preference is KONI. You may have to check if you need shorter shocks if you are lowering a significant amount
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AA003
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 07:15 PM |
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Bilstein, Koni or KYB. Any of those will be good.
I read it on samba, so it must be correct.
Sometimes Volkswagen dealers sell spare parts. Amazing isn't it!
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ian.mezz
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 08:02 PM |
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oil shocks 
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landfall
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 08:04 PM |
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Tried the KYB gas on the front and nearly lost every bone in my body.
Being a newbee and not having any prejudices against EMPI and not wanting to waste another couple hundred dollars I thought I would give EMPI oil
shockers a try.
Agree, not the worlds best but certainly good enough and cheap enough to throw away if nor happy.
Currently have EMPI shocker on the front, lowered version and Monroe Gas on the rear with heavier sway bars front and rear.
Car handles as good as my sports car but not as good as the XR6T.
Ken
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AA003
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 08:33 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by ian.mezz
oil shocks
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They're all oil.
It's just that some are gas pressurised.
I read it on samba, so it must be correct.
Sometimes Volkswagen dealers sell spare parts. Amazing isn't it!
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psimitar
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| posted on December 11th, 2014 at 10:21 PM |
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DON't buy EMPI. Far too many horror stories on their build quality.
Boge, Bilstein, KYB, Koni, Bugpack are all good brands with Bugpack and Boge being the more affordable of the brands.
As for gas pressurised or not? Well, you may well find that due to the lowered vehicle having a firmer strung ride than a normal height Beetle that
the gas shock makes things far too stiff for normal road driving whereas the non-pressurised will give a more compliant ride. Also, the shocks valve
head should be roughly in the centre of it's range of travel to give the best ride and also stop the shock bottoming out due to lack of available
travel of the piston rod within the casing.
I don't think Boge sell shortened shocks but Bugpack do along with some of the more expensive brands.
madness is in the eye of the beholder  |
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ian.mezz
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 07:12 AM |
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opinions on gas shock vs oil shocks
oil shocks
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AA003
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 07:32 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by ian.mezz
opinions on gas shock vs oil shocks
oil shocks
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Reason?????
I read it on samba, so it must be correct.
Sometimes Volkswagen dealers sell spare parts. Amazing isn't it!
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HappyDaze
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 07:58 AM |
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There is basically no difference between the two, as far as the 'damping' action goes. They are both hydraulic.
Gas [Nitrogen], under pressure, helps keep the oil from'boiling' during high frequency operations, such as off-road racing. A good quality non-gas
shock should be quite OK for normal road use.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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landfall
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 08:10 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by psimitar
DON't buy EMPI. Far too many horror stories on their build quality.
Is this an opinion, a biased comment or fact?
If fact, please direct me to the proof.
I have tried the Search facility on this site and come up with zero.
We are of course talking about shock absorbers.
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oldturtle22
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 06:37 PM |
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Thanks for the tips all.
As my cars pretty low and not a great ride I had read somewhere that the oil shocks do give a slightly better ride due to not being pressurised so I
thought Id ask for opinions before getting a set to try.
psimitar, have you still got that early floor pan I sold you?
thanks again
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psimitar
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 08:21 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by landfall
Is this an opinion, a biased comment or fact?
If fact, please direct me to the proof.
I have tried the Search facility on this site and come up with zero.
We are of course talking about shock absorbers.
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From personal use of their stuff and from many other people around the world on other forums sharing their personal stories of EMPI gear.
Proof, well buy it yourself and if it lasts many years without problem then by all means continue buying the stuff but many long time VW peps have had
too many bad experiences so like them I gave an honest opinion for the OP to take on board and use to their own discretion. 
madness is in the eye of the beholder |
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psimitar
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 08:25 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by oldturtle22
Thanks for the tips all.
As my cars pretty low and not a great ride I had read somewhere that the oil shocks do give a slightly better ride due to not being pressurised so I
thought Id ask for opinions before getting a set to try.
psimitar, have you still got that early floor pan I sold you?
thanks again
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Yea, still sitting under the house. wondering what to do with really but it's out the way and not bothering anyone
Good luck with the shox. Kinda Wish i'd gone with oil as the gas really does stiffen things up and that's on 80 profile tyres 
madness is in the eye of the beholder |
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oldturtle22
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| posted on December 12th, 2014 at 10:18 PM |
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Ive sent you a PM psimitar
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matberry
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| posted on December 13th, 2014 at 09:23 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by HappyDaze
There is basically no difference between the two, as far as the 'damping' action goes. They are both hydraulic.
Gas [Nitrogen], under pressure, helps keep the oil from'boiling' during high frequency operations, such as off-road racing. A good quality non-gas
shock should be quite OK for normal road use.
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I agree, the difference is really in the valving which makes harder or softer feeling shocks.
The problem with many aftermarket shocks is that the valving is not correct for our light, softly sprung vehicles.
My opinion, oil for the front is pretty well a given unless harsh ride, heavily sprung, racer-ish suspension, Boge, Koni even Cofap for a limited
budget.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
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oldturtle22
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| posted on December 13th, 2014 at 09:41 AM |
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Thanks matt.
Im starting to lean towards oil. So the next question is EMPI the only brand to sell oil only shockys??
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HappyDaze
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| posted on December 13th, 2014 at 09:56 AM |
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In October, 1963 I drove a 1200 Beetle [Standard] in the Armstrong 500 at Bathurst. The Armstrong shock absorber company issued every compeditor with
a set of Armstrong shocks to fit to their car.
I must admit I was not too keen on these Armstrong shocks - Konis would have been nice - however Armstrong was the race sponsor, so we were obliged to
fit them.
Let me tell you...those shock absorbers absolutely transformed the Beetle ! Down 'The Esses' flat out in 3rd gear, over the 'Dipper' without any
loss of stability...marvelous. I wanted to keep those shocks to whack
on my own Beetle, but Armstrong wanted them back.  They were for
their "Testing and development" purposes, and must be handed back. Armstrong knew how to make really good shocks...if they wanted to. 
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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landfall
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| posted on December 13th, 2014 at 04:27 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by oldturtle22
Thanks matt.
Im starting to lean towards oil. So the next question is EMPI the only brand to sell oil only shockys??
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I'm not 100% sure but the Bugpack ones from VWHeritage maybe oil shocks as well.
Good luck with your hunt, that's why I ended up with the EMPI's.
Tyre pressure also makes a considerable difference.
Will be watching this with more than a little interest.
Still amused by the concept that ALL EMPI products are crap, considering that they are not all made by EMPI but contracted suppliers.
Ken
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petemart
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| posted on December 13th, 2014 at 08:48 PM |
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I run low in a 62 bug with a 4.5 narrowed beam and CB wide 5 dropped spindle disks up front that I have adjustable Koni classics all round and the
general feel and handling went from appaling 100% of the time with empi oil shocks to the car feeling stable and now being able to throw it into
corners with confidence.
From memory I think I set the rebound at 3/4 on the rear and 1/2 on the front.
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hellbugged
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| posted on December 13th, 2014 at 09:58 PM |
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Konis
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psimitar
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| posted on December 13th, 2014 at 11:09 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by landfall
I'm not 100% sure but the Bugpack ones from VWHeritage maybe oil shocks as well.
Good luck with your hunt, that's why I ended up with the EMPI's.
Tyre pressure also makes a considerable difference.
Will be watching this with more than a little interest.
Still amused by the concept that ALL EMPI products are crap, considering that they are not all made by EMPI but contracted suppliers.
Ken
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Yup, Bugpack are oil as are Boge.
As for Empi. It's not ALL empi products but a large majority. It's a bit of a minefield as Empi sold a large chunk of their product licences to
overseas companies and much of these parts are no made in china and other cheap labour countries where the quality of materials used is cut to the
bone to just comply with any standards required. Those parts still manufactured in USA or at least to the original product specs are good products but
knowing which is good and which is bad is like Russian roulette 
madness is in the eye of the beholder |
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