| [ Total Views: 1766 | Total Replies: 23 | Thread Id: 112140 ] |
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 Greeny2798
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| posted on February 9th, 2017 at 10:26 PM |
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Single stromberg on 1600cc
PostPosted: Yesterday 11:50 pm Post subject: Single Stromberg carb on 1600cc Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post
Hey guys, I've been search around for a while now but I can't seem to find much of what I'm looking for. I've read in some places that people use
to run strombergs on earlier model beetles, I was wondering if I would be able to run one on a centremount set up on my 1600cc just to get a couple of
extra hp out.
Also wondering what I would need to do like whether it would need a new manifold or if it just fits on the stock 34pict manifold and just stuff like
that.
Also before anyone says just go dual webers they will come eventually but due to lack of money and knowledge I want to try this first and there are
plenty of holdens I can get one off. I'm very new to this and will appreciate all the help I can get. Thanks in advance.
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BlasterTheRedBajaBug
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| posted on February 9th, 2017 at 11:40 PM |
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Look, it is pretty simple, step one: keep what you have, Step two: save until you can get dual webers as it saves doing two swaps and would be
cheaper.
Nobody can drive you crazy, unless you give them the keys.
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sander288
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 10:34 AM |
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It could be done, but you would need a new manifold, the Solex one won't work with it.
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 barls
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 11:03 AM |
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there is a reason that they weren't the popular choice of carb for the vws.
from what i was told long ago it was the amount of mucking around to get them right and keep them there.
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modnrod
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 12:44 PM |
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OK, I've done only 5 real-life conversions using 1BBL Strombergs, so here it is. Unfortunately it's only experience though, not current internet
wisdom, so it might not be valid. The conversion actually was quite popular in the 70s and 80s.
With the current nice new/reco Solex's now readily available out there, I wouldn't run a Stromberg unless I had a really good one (and a really crap
Solex) in the shed, because there is a bit of mucking around involved.
If you have one though, and are keen......
The throttle cable angle can be improved a lot by re-drilling the fanshroud holes, the manifold flange "holes" need to be made into "slots" then
bolts used, and the flange also needs blending to allow for the bigger throttle plate size. Then basically you are in. Jetting is pretty close to
bang-on by using the stock 161/173 settings on a 1600, while 1835s prefer the 202/Ford200 jets. The rest is a bit of mucking around, but vastly less
involved than any other carb conversion.
The benefits are better float control on bumpy/corrugated roads, much better tolerance of dirt/muck in both the fuel and the air system, and a finer
air-fuel mixture, which works noticeably better in cold long-runner manifolds. The real life difference is a definite improvement you can feel
straight away in smoothness and throttle response, with slight pick-ups in power and economy.
Downsides are it's fiddly, and they splutter and nearly stall around fast sudden left-handers.......just like the old Holdens did too! You will need
big sticky tyres to notice it though, 165s won't do it.
Here is a brand new NOS never-been-used one I've saved specially......
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Greeny2798
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 03:12 PM |
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Thanks for your help modnrod, yeah I heard they were popular back in the 80's that's what got me interested. I don't have one lying around but
I've seen some ones that look good for less then $100. Due to living in rural Australia single centremounts have interested me more and I live out on
a farm too so this would obviously be better for that. I'm still not bang on about what I want to do with the engine that's why in the mean time I
wanted to do a cheaper conversion that will get a little more hp and try and get rid of the notorious flat spot. So is it just the carb from the eh
red motor?
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Greeny2798
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 03:17 PM |
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Plus I'm so sick of seeing everyone on every forum put go dual webers or dells, obviously it works and when I eventually get more displacement I'll
probably do it too but I just want some originality, considering old aircooled volkswagens have so much character I don't want it to be like everyone
other one
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modnrod
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 05:12 PM |
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Twin Webers are light years ahead of an old leaky Solex combined with a cheap crappy 009........but against a nice well-tuned Solex with a good
manifold the benefits are much less than the marketing dept would have you believe. Under 3000rpm they are only marginally better, from 3000-4500rpm
they are noticeably better, and over 4500 the difference is a lot, maybe 15%, but that's where stock stuff stops so why bother?
A well-tuned Solex 34, SVDA and DP manifold with good heads (which are sometimes cheaper than a set of IDFs) will be better everywhere than duals on a
stocker all day.
If you want duals on a stocker coz you like the sound or the looks that's a good enough reason, why not? Each to his own, that's cool.
Personally I prefer the aesthetics of a centremount, and personally I prefer carbs with power valves for all-round street use, especially
part-throttle economy tuning. There are heaps of happy people the world over using single Kadrons on 1600s to replace old Solexs too, same thing
really (lots in Brazil of course).
Your EH red motor Stromberg will be perfect if you want to try it out. If it doesn't work the way you want there are lots of options out there for a
stock original look while still having decent performance. Use the vac adv dizzy for the best result, you have decent manifold vacuum so might as well
use it. Solex's aren't perfect, they need good fuel filters and air filters (I use oiled foam to stop the dust), but it takes 5mins to clean them
out once a year.
PS: Oh, if you live on a farm, and your driveway is as badly corrugated as ours is  and your highway trips end up at the dentist, you feel like mucking around just to amuse yourself, try to make a new manifold out
of 1-3/8" exhaust tubing and throw a Holley 350 on it. Isolated runner, not plenum. Purists will excommunicate me for sure, but it's the best
all-round combo for crap conditions I've tried.
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AA003
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 06:42 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by modnrod throw a Holley 350 on it. Isolated runner, not plenum. Purists will excommunicate me for sure, but it's the best all-round
combo for crap conditions I've tried.
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I had one of those on my Beetle rally car back in the 70s/80s and it never missed a beat.
I read it on samba, so it must be correct.
Sometimes Volkswagen dealers sell spare parts. Amazing isn't it!
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Greeny2798
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 07:42 PM |
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Modnrod might have to look into the Holley combo, might pm you in a couple of days if I can't find anything if you don't mind
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Greeny2798
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 07:45 PM |
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Also I'm very, very new to the bug scene so it means a lot for this advice 
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modnrod
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 08:44 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Greeny2798
Modnrod might have to look into the Holley combo, might pm you in a couple of days if I can't find anything if you don't mind
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I don't mind at all, but I'll give you what I can find for you now if you like?
As said, you will have to make it, you won't find a manifold or linkages or anything off the shelf.
The closest-looking set up is probably the "Zenith" that all the US websites go on about........
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=vw+zenith+carb+pic&client=safari&c...
.......and this is the type of manifold (top left pic).......
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=vw+zenith+carb+pic&client=safari&c...
You can very rarely find them online and then maybe make an adaptor up, but this stuff is all gone nowadays really.
I actually have a Holley 350 ready with parts, slosh tubes fitted, jet extenders, blue gaskets, etc, but I have to still make a manifold up to suit. I
think though I'm going to stick with the Solex personally, as you mentioned earlier it's all about the original aesthetics for me. I have new bushes
(the UK bloke), big throttle plate (off a Holley! LOL!), I have the venturi out, and I'm not scared. Well, maybe a little bit scared.
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grumble
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| posted on February 10th, 2017 at 09:06 PM |
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I ran a pair of early strombergs off an FC Holden on my 1500 single port in my 1955 bug a lot of years ago, there was a lot of jets available then,I
used the venturi reducers smaller main jets etc made my own linkages and balance tubes. Initially I had a lot of trouble with flooding but this was
rectified with a good filter and a tank on the top of the fan housing for constant feed. When they were balanced and running well the acceleration and
top speed was awesome for the time and there wern't many cars that could touch the litt;e black beetle between Taree and Tuncurry and then I brought
my Ghia and sold the bug in 1967. Happy ending, I still have the Ghia and enjoy driving it it immensely.
I also ran a pair of the 32PDSIT's off a type 3 on the Ghia successfully, not as much buggering around, just used a few stromberg carburettor
insulators to adjust the height and modified the linkages to suit. these ran quite well ,not the same raw grunt as the strombergs but more economical.
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Greeny2798
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| posted on February 11th, 2017 at 01:59 AM |
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Monrod, the solex set up sounds really good, you expecting the same 'performance' as the stromberg with this set up. I'd love to have a crack at a
lot of these different, old school set ups it's just a bit hard where I live due to there being next to no enthusiasts/specialists and a lack of
mechanical knowledge on my behalf.
Grumble, that sounds awesome, love the ghia's, they are just beautiful car. I also read in the only other post I've found about these stromberg set
ups that you are the man when it comes to this stuff
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grumble
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| posted on February 11th, 2017 at 06:55 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Greeny2798
Monrod, the solex set up sounds really good, you expecting the same 'performance' as the stromberg with this set up. I'd love to have a crack at a
lot of these different, old school set ups it's just a bit hard where I live due to there being next to no enthusiasts/specialists and a lack of
mechanical knowledge on my behalf.
Grumble, that sounds awesome, love the ghia's, they are just beautiful car. I also read in the only other post I've found about these stromberg set
ups that you are the man when it comes to this stuff
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We tried the twin barrel Weber off the 2 litre Cortina,they ran OK but flat spots etc,I successfully ran a Weber clone from a Lada Niva on a S
bug,the Lada carby was more successful and gave good performance with reasonable fuel economy.
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Greeny2798
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| posted on February 11th, 2017 at 07:02 PM |
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So much customisation, makes decisions hard 
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grumble
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| posted on February 12th, 2017 at 10:15 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Greeny2798
So much customisation, makes decisions hard
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Research and developement it is called,if you have a stromberg try it, the bolt holes are close (I used the grey motor insulating blocks to lift the
height of the solex's to a workable height) fit a venturi reducer and jet to suit. if it doesn't work satisfactorily try some adjustments,at the end
of the day you will have learnt siomething and not relied on someone elses opinion which may or may not be correct.
Before my Dad lost his sight he was the greatest tinkerer that I have ever known and I know he got a lot of satisfaction from this and gave all of his
boys a thirst for knowledge and repairing items that were broken.
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HappyDaze
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| posted on February 12th, 2017 at 10:52 AM |
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How true, grumble.  R & D ! Now that's a better way of
putting it...I just knew it as 'mucking around with VWs'.
So much to learn from tying out different combinations. On a 36hp, I've tied Amal, SU, and Judson with stock carby. On 40hp, there was Nikki, SU, and
Zenith.
Believe it or not, I had the best results from 2 SU carbies...once they were tuned right.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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Greeny2798
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| posted on February 12th, 2017 at 11:01 AM |
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Yeah I've been reading forum threads since before I got my bug but with it being a 45 year old car with one of the simplest engines made there it
just so much choice out there. At the moment I'm liking the idea of stromberg or the 350 Holley, although it may not be the greatest carb set up in
the world it does have reliability, can deal with bumpy roads and dirt and still give slight performance increases.
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grumble
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| posted on February 12th, 2017 at 07:41 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by HappyDaze
How true, grumble. R & D ! Now that's a better way of
putting it...I just knew it as 'mucking around with VWs'.
So much to learn from tying out different combinations. On a 36hp, I've tied Amal, SU, and Judson with stock carby. On 40hp, there was Niky, SU, and
Zenith.
Believe it or not, I had the best results from 2 SU carbies...once they were tuned right.
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Greg, SU's are probably the only one that I haven't tried although I had a fair bit of experience with my brother's Cooper S with big bore,high
compression etc,that was one little rocket ship. I tried Datsun 2 barrel carbies,making manifolds and adaptors the same as you did and learnt a lot
but i think the Strombergs worked the best and gave the most pain until we worked them out. Modification and adaption isn't about getting it right
1st time but working it out so that it works well.
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HappyDaze
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| posted on February 13th, 2017 at 07:41 AM |
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Those Datsun carbs are probably what I used. They were Nikki brand, and were progressive 2 barrel...with a handy glass window on the side, for
checking float levels.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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modnrod
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| posted on February 13th, 2017 at 10:03 AM |
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Here we are talking about this stuff (best conversation in years btw!  ) so I had a quick look and.........
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/182451555723?ul_noapp=true
TADA! I just bought some off him for a different carb.
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Newt
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| posted on February 20th, 2017 at 06:39 PM |
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Twin SU's
It is as it is - If you didnt enjoy today, you've missed the opportunity.
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grumble
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| posted on February 20th, 2017 at 07:19 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by HappyDaze
Those Datsun carbs are probably what I used. They were Nikki brand, and were progressive 2 barrel...with a handy glass window on the side, for
checking float levels.
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I used to love those carbs when I worked for the Datsun/Nissan dealer everything was accessible and and you didn't have to be a rocket scientist to
set them up,I tried the Hitachi off my wife's wrecked 1600 and one off the bluebird.
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