| [ Total Views: 2078 | Total Replies: 31 | Thread Id: 1257 ] |
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 vanderaj
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| posted on October 15th, 2002 at 10:45 PM |
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What could VW Australia do?
It's sort of interesting to see the poll results. I'm the only one to vote for a new Volkswagen. That means that very few of you indeed are
likely to buy anything new.
Is there something specific that VW could do to liven things up?
Andrew
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 KOM123
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 02:23 AM |
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A new Kombi that resembles a Kombi and one that most families could afford 
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Hutcho
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 03:20 AM |
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Yeah... respect their enthusiasts.
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Bugged Again
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 07:40 AM |
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Volkswagens are now luxury cars aiming for the well to do market, yuppies et al (if they still exist), therefore they have priced themselves out of
the enthusiasts market.
But i'd still consider buying a secondhand golf or passat if thats the type of car we were after. |
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vw54
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 08:14 AM |
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DROP there prices
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geodon
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 09:18 AM |
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Sack the entire marketing department!
VW rose out of the ashes by providing a cheap ultra-reliable car for the masses & then expanded into a similar concept for commercials. Their
current offerings are good quality items BUT at premium prices. Even the "humble" Polo is touted as a luxury small car. Jeez, their
marketing department must be blind to not see the only real growth market left for cars: ASIA!! When the populations of China et al want to trade in
their bicycles & mopeds on a car are they going to have trouble finding a cheap VW! No wonder the Japanese & Koreans are rubbing their hands
in anticipation. Why is VW's ingenuity being used to produce a sub 1000cc ultra economical high speed diesel 3-wheeled roadster (like we saw
their retiring charman drive to his retirement party!) instead of a low-tech $10K crew cab ute?
I think they have lost the plot a bit by ignoring the low end of the market. Even if they say there's no money in it, a success here can only
lead to better sales up-market.
(Ah! That feels better now it's off my chest!)
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vwrallycar
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 11:51 AM |
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i would like to c the original air cooled type 1 imported to australia. surely they would sell!!!
or at least new bodies
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bus914
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 posted on October 16th, 2002 at 12:05 PM |
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aluminium bodied kombies
mmm... aluminium bodied kombies exactly resembling the '76 model, with an injected direct fire flat 6 3lt aircooled motor, 6 speed sequential
gearbox, revised steering, anti lock brakes, climate control and electronically adjustable suspension.
or maybe porsche should build them.
i don't mind golfs but i'd only ever buy one for the wife or for rallies.
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jenz58
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 12:05 PM |
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Exactly lets create a market for the Mexican beetle. It would be sad to see them stop production
Sounds like the wheels are in motion though  |
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vwrallycar
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 09:24 PM |
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is there anything we can do about this? as in getting them imported on a large scale?
and does anyone in australia atill sell new beetle bodies
i remember seeing 2 twin cab utes and a beetle body all of which was brand new at a vw shop in sydney back in 96!
does anyone remember who this is or was?
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Grey 57
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 10:01 PM |
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Personally I'd hate to see 100's of Mexican Beetles flooding the streets like Hyundias. The reason I like my old air cooled beetle is
because of exactly that. It's old and there aren't too many around. And it's the same with any aircooled Beetle or Kombie. I get a kick
out of the reaction from other motorists sitting in their cookie cutter cars that all look the same. Also get a kick out of seeing a old beetle or
kombie in traffic because it;s something you don't see all the time.
Regarding new VW's they are selling a motza amount of cars in Australia at the moment compared to 5 years ago. Look around at the next busy
intersection. The Polos, Golfs and even the NB is reasonably good value when you add up the features.
Hyandias & Dawoo's are entry level cars at best. Used as stepping stones to aquire the better cars they aspire to own.
One of the problems Hyundai have is with repeat purchasing of their products. They have found that people buying their first new car would buy the
Hyandai on price but when the time came to trade up they would not consider Hyandai again. They would look to the makes with a better product image,
sporty, quality, luxury.
I think VW Aus understand that its pretty crowded at the bottom of a market and cheap and cheerful isn's always the best in the long run.
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Bugged Again
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 10:16 PM |
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If they imported the skoda you could then buy a cheap vw.
The golf has gone upmarket and up price in europe but it still remains the most sold car. vw must be doing something right over there.
Australia'a problem is that they sell the falcon and commodore to cheaply compared with european standards. the equivalent cars in europe cost
$60,000 which then makes a 20,000 polo sound relatively cheap. |
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Grey 57
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 10:21 PM |
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Your right about the Falcons and Commodes, they are really cheap compared to other countries. I had some American business associates over here last
week and drove them around in my company Ford Falcon and they couldnt believe a car of that size and features would cost the eqivalent of $15 - $16k
US.
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70AutoStik
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 10:23 PM |
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Why not fix the emissions problems with the Beetle that spell it's demise and produce them in Australia. Our currency is now worth so little it
should be viable (thanks Bob) and we certainly have the nous.
I have no problem with VW being a prestige name - but, maybe embarrasing the asian market with a _quality_ small car would help this?
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vanderaj
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| posted on October 16th, 2002 at 11:23 PM |
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Quality small car = Lupo with the 1.2 litre engine.
But remember, most Asian countries have extremely high tarriffs and other trade barriers for imported cars. I don't see how VW could make money
selling a $15k Lupo or $13,430 Old Beetle (what the Mexicans call a "Sedan" currently costs according to http://www.volkswagen.com.mx ) when the tarriff is like 100% or more in many
countries.
Andrew
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555bug
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| posted on October 17th, 2002 at 01:50 AM |
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I think a lot of people are off track on this one, 30~40k for a luxurious, semi powerful well engineered car is quite cheap. Just think about the
money that some of us pour into our VW projects and the numbers quickly get to the price of a new Jap car. I guess if you’re only spending 100 a
week on your toy it doesn’t seem quite as bad, but that’s a lease repayment on a new golf. I've got friends that started off with 1500 ovals
that have quickly turned into 20k money pigs......horses for courses |
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jenz58
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| posted on October 17th, 2002 at 09:24 AM |
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Well if the roads are going to be flooded with a type of car I'd rather see an old style beetle. It will give our streets character
We can be still proud of our originals, knowing that they are just that |
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Che Castro
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| posted on October 17th, 2002 at 08:54 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by 70AutoStik
Why not fix the emissions problems with the Beetle that spell it's demise and produce them in Australia.
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emissions restrictions and aircooled engines dont mix sorry the VW
aircooled flat 4 is really an antique, plus the beetle would never meet crash safety regulations, they are deathtraps compared to any modern cars.
I agree with grey 57, i get a kick out of driving a car that is very odd and not all that common anymore.
Jon
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Bugged Again
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| posted on October 17th, 2002 at 09:32 PM |
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I think vw should have a look at the latest benz commercials, they are really doing a good job on their image especially for a younger market.
The new passat commercials a few years ago were great, the 'a times are changing' ones. |
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KruizinKombi
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 08:58 PM |
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VW needs to return to the design philosophy of the pre-80's; affordable quality. Sure they weren't luxury cars, but they were always
comfortable (by the standards of their time) and affordable. They weren't a sports or a luxury vehicle, but they met the needs of the average Mr
& Mrs Jones and were affordable by the same.
Ok, so they weren't the cheapest cars on the road, but how many of the others are still on the road by comparison. I'm happy to pay a little
bit more for quality and longevity, but not for performance and luxury I don't need - even if I'd like it. I'd be happy with a new
70's Beetle and Kombi, with the appropriate emmisions and safety upgrades. EFI, cat converter, central locking/alarm would be nice (and
practical. Should be able to do it for sub-$20k and the car should last 20 years (minimum) with regular servicing.
Oh yeah, and VW Australia need to acknowledge older-model owners and make parts available and affordable. They could be making a killing on spare
parts based on turnover alone.
I'll put my order in for a brand-new 76 Beetle (Ball-Joint front end) and Kombi right now. By the time they do it I'll be able to afford
them both!
Kruizin Kol
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Bugged Again
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 10:55 PM |
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The mexican beetle doesn't comply with any emissiond standards, thats one of the reasons production is stopping in mexico.
i wasn't aware VW didn't supply parts for older cars, I just thought the mexican stuff was cheaper and easier to sell.
Mercedes makes parts, sometimes on order for any car they have manufactured since their inception over 100 years ago. Prices are obviously steep for
the custom made ones but you can get off the shelf parts for cars 40 years old. they have also linked all the car clubs from around the world and
invite reps to germany to have a huge pissup. you might have gathered my other car passion is old mercs. |
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70AutoStik
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| posted on October 18th, 2002 at 11:00 PM |
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emissions restrictions and aircooled engines dont mix
And you base this theory on? The original philosophy of VW - torque rather than peak power, combined with the fact that VeeDubbers continually fight
against what modern engineers need to produce: high combustion chamber temperatures, suggest the flat-four, with the right injection and an
appropriate cat, is ideally suited to an update with the right technology. I agree with your assessment of the crash protection provided by the
original design: but, with the guards included as part of the body and the whole area forward of the driver available, it seems like a pretty simple
problem to solve (with modern computer-simulation [and side-impact would be no more difficult])
Remember- Subaru still use a (licenced) copy of the flat-four (albeit in a front-engined format) to produce one of the fastest affordable production
cars on the road!
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MKIlurvn
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 08:54 AM |
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they can go shoot themselves with yet another disgracefull showing at the sydney motor show!!!
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KOM123
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 10:47 AM |
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They can give me a new Kombi as a gesture of good faith I'd never
buy one but I won't knock back and air-conditioned freebie!
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Phil74Camper
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 05:06 PM |
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I agree about the Motor Show, as I've just been there today. I asked for brochues - 'which one?' the girl said. All of them, I replied.
Er, we don't normally do that, she said...
Piss-weak stand. No videos or films playing, no big 'VOLKSWAGEN' sign, no shop to buy the dealer goodies like keyrings and caps, nearly
every VW in boring silver and most of the cars locked so you couldn't see inside. Oh well, at least they HAD a stand. I remember visiting the old
motor show at the showground in the '80s when VW didn't have a stand at all.
The Audi stand was pretty groovy though, and the girls were showing more cleavage there too.
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vanderaj
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 10:36 PM |
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They did the Silver thing here in Melbourne earlier this year.
Yaawwn.
VW has fantastic colors for all of its model range, like Tornado Red, Summer Blue, Cyber Green, and of course the wonderful black (for other
people's cars...)
My Cabriolet will not be a metallic silver one. I'm thinking Harvest Moon at this stage, but the beige interior is seriously putting me off.
Andrew
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Jay_1965vw
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 10:47 PM |
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They did the silver thing in Sydney and Melbourne last year too. Pathetic. Get some colour and life VW Aus!!
Jay
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Che Castro
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 10:52 PM |
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Aircooled engines cannot practically run lean fuel/air mixtures like watercooled engines, leaner mixtures = more complete combustion and less crap in
the air.
Porsche moved to Watercooling for a couple of reasons, one of them being to meet increasingly strict emissions standards.
I love old VW engines and all, but u have to face the fact that they are harsh, noisy, weak, inefficient and short lived compared to modern engines.
In its day it was ahead of its time, but it's day was the 1930's when it was designed!
Don't compare the VW flat four to the Subie flat 4. The inline 4 in a honda civic has a lot more in common with it than a VW aircooled flat 4.
The Subie is a modern engine, Overhead cams,
it has a counterweighted crank, full flow filter, 4 valves/cylinder with a pentroof combustion chamber etc etc
You could not practically engineer a Beetle body to match any relatively modern car in crash safety, have a good hard look at it. It is much easier
to start off with a new shape altogether, this is not to mention other defficiencies in Active safety with the original body, such as instability in
crosswinds as well as a billion other considerations like, crap drag coefficient (something like 0.44), absolutely pitiful lugguage space, flex in the
body the list goes on and on.
I love my Beetle for what it is, an old car. I feel comfortable knowing deep down that pretty much every other car on the road will be in a scrap
heap when they are 40 years old I love the fact that it is loud, noisy
and smelly. That people smile when they see it, that i wave and get waved at by other VW's. that people are suprised the boot is in the front
and that its so pitifully small, that i have to open the boot to refuel. No design is perfect, especially an old classic one 
[Edited on 22-10-2002 by Che Castro]
Jon
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KruizinKombi
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 10:58 PM |
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Crash-testing aside, I see absolutely no reason why an air-cooled motor couldn't be built with 5-valve heads, twin overhead cams, VTEC, EFI or
any other kind of modern technology. For the kind of money that companies pour into modern cars, I'm sure the aircooled motor would be viable. If
there is any reason why they haven't dont it, it is the noise output.
Kruizin Kol
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Che Castro
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| posted on October 22nd, 2002 at 11:13 PM |
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well water is a much better medium for absorbing heat than air, water galleries can be run inside the heads, cylinders , there is a much larger
"heat sink" in a watercooler. Watercooled engines' exhaust valves dont like to dance with pistons, as well as better emissions and
people dont usually remove the thermostat from them
Obviously aircooled's have their advantages too, such as no radiator, less weight.
Not that i am a watercooled convert
no i dont hate aircooled flat 4's i personally dream of a hot Type 4 engine in my bug, i just think that they are an old design that has its
limits.
Jon
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