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Author: Subject:  1916's and so on (edited yet again) - stay on track please.
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posted on September 29th, 2006 at 10:24 AM



its an engine i am planning.

yeah the case also im thinking of getting a cb aluminium "super case" which is already clearanced for 86mm stroke.

so should i decide to up the cc down the track could replace the 69mm crank with any other of choice without too much hassle.

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posted on September 29th, 2006 at 11:12 PM



I have an old type 3 TLE engine I was given by a friend. I was thinking of going up to a 1641 but that sort of screws up which class I'd fit into for khanacrosses. So a 1916 is a better option if I plan to have the case machined at all for bigger pots. So, what can expect with everything else standard (crank/rods/heads) but just 94mm pots? I am talking ultra budget. How long would it all last? What will be the difference or should I stay with a stock 1584? The longterm plan is a turbo setup of some sort. ;)

p.s. this would all go in a midmount tubeframe car with swingaxle and a BJ front beam.




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posted on September 30th, 2006 at 12:00 AM



someone on here....bizarre maybe has a stock engine with 94's and i think kadrons........ithink its bizarre.



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posted on September 30th, 2006 at 11:01 AM



Quote:
Originally posted by pete wood
p.s. this would all go in a midmount tubeframe car with swingaxle and a BJ front beam.


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SRY a bit off topic, but........

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posted on September 30th, 2006 at 04:06 PM



TSV, swing axle = cheaper, lighter, easier, better for tight tracks.

Now back to the slander. What do I get for 1916cc and stock everything else?




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posted on October 5th, 2006 at 06:42 PM



my combo would be,

ally case, full flowed
scat h-beams
72mm stroke crank (to get closer to the 2000cc mark)
w130 engle cam
standard rockers
cb wedge port heads with 42, 37 valves
and running dual fuel injection throttle bodies like the one vw paradise sell, fully programmable.

hey dave what kind of a shorter rod would you run? I looked at using my 1200 rods in my 1915 but looked a bit week.
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posted on October 5th, 2006 at 08:46 PM



The 1800 type 4 can be lightened and rebushed for use in type 1.

But I was thinking more of a custom rod like the Pauter or Carrillo.

Many moons ago, Bergs tried a Ford 289 Windsor and 170 persuit rod.
These are a tad longer and shorter respectively, than 5".
The short rods also need BDC interference checking and clearancing, of the pin boss of the piston.

1200 rods are weak looking, but I have seen them survive OK in 7000rpm 1835 drag engine.
It had 20mm pins, but I would be scared to use them myself with 22 pin.
Possibly removing the bush and hone the hole with a graphite or teflon coating in the hole.

Now I am rambling.
Bolt may also be an issue.

Shorter rod may need a slightly wider lobe centre and a little more duration on camshaft.

[ Edited on 10-10-2006 by dangerous ]




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posted on October 10th, 2006 at 09:00 PM



My Combo

94 p & c's
69 counterweighted, re ground to 72.3 (or about that, to give 1999.99cc's)
Std mag case (PRC has to use original case material if i ever want to go down that path)
H beam rods-Chevy journal
engle 120
1.25:1 ratio rockers, (with the 120, 253 dur @ 0.050', and just .496' lift)
Cb wedge port, slightly tidied up (top spec)
cromo push rods
billet followers etc
twin 48 ida's
1 5/8 exhuast

plus lots of other bits and pieces.




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posted on October 10th, 2006 at 10:17 PM



Quote:
Originally posted by pete wood
TSV, swing axle = cheaper, lighter, easier, better for tight tracks.

Now back to the slander. What do I get for 1916cc and stock everything else?


What is 'everything else' ?




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posted on October 12th, 2006 at 11:07 AM



I've got 2 alternatives now.

1. stock heads (machined of course), valves, cam, some sort of headers, a single carb, probably a pict or something.

2. above interals but drawthrough turbo/blower system. will it cope with that?




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posted on October 12th, 2006 at 12:49 PM



Put Kaddies on it; forget a stocko pict. It doesn't feed 1600cc very well; things get worse with 25 percent more capacity



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posted on October 12th, 2006 at 01:47 PM



Kads cost too much money, I'll go a turbo and a cheap 2 barrel, same cost, more power. :tu:



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posted on October 14th, 2007 at 08:50 PM



my 1916 would be right up daimo's alley,
69mm old forged berg crank
prob go with carrillo's
welded 044's maybe moved exhaust guides 44X37.5 gb 1.4 rockers
gb316 cam
dry sumped
48 ida's
as21
would be old school but fun!




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posted on February 12th, 2008 at 09:06 PM



Quote:
Originally posted by BiX
My Combo

94 p & c's
69 counterweighted, re ground to 72.3 (or about that, to give 1999.99cc's)
Std mag case (PRC has to use original case material if i ever want to go down that path)
H beam rods-Chevy journal
engle 120
1.25:1 ratio rockers, (with the 120, 253 dur @ 0.050', and just .496' lift)
Cb wedge port, slightly tidied up (top spec)
cromo push rods
billet followers etc
twin 48 ida's
1 5/8 exhuast

plus lots of other bits and pieces.


Any updates on your motor Bix ?




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posted on May 2nd, 2008 at 10:46 AM



Quote:

Here is my ultimate street 1915.
This combo would most likely change depending on what the final use is,
but I would drive this on the road no worries.
For specific racing use, I would up the cam and comp and use larger venturies, and shorter rods.

CW crank.
FW about 12lbs(8 dowel).
Clutch around 1700lbs with stock disc and pressure plate located tight in FW.
C95 cam with stock rockers or
V26 Engle with 1.5 rockers.
Stock length rods(I like the scat H-beams or eagles ( good value))
"B" piston kit and shortened barrells
(That way can use short pushrods)
Stock early oil pump.
Crank ground to give 1.5 thou clearance on rods and 2.0 on mains.
Cam bearings oil clearance checked, and ground .25 if oil clearance exceeds .002".
small deep sump.
9.0:1 with .040 deck
Out of the box(porting) CB wedge ports, with spring shims fitted,
but flycut to attain comp reqd(maintaining tight deck).
48IDAs with 37 vents, dowelled manifolds to heads.
Max 1 5/8 merge.
Stock late cooling system.

For racing-only I would use a shorter rod,
but fanshroud to carb clearance and fitting it, is an issue for street use.


whats the advantage of this combo, would it be a higher reving engine? how hard would it be to fit the standard tin ware?
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posted on May 2nd, 2008 at 10:46 PM



Quote:
Originally posted by Craig Torrens
Here's my 1916 power..............POBJOY of course, is there any other ?


i think there are a couple of people that have dared to risk the copyright infringment.:lol:

who looks after Cambells 1916, it seems to go really well?

does EFI add to a final horsepower reading or just make an engine more driveable throughout the rev range?......

....i've been told this is a similar feeling from the twin plugs, is that the case for those that have upgraded to it?........

....i suppose i would be pushing my luck for before and after dyno sheets for that upgrade? (ps i looked at the set up of them at Stans and like the value, execution and principle behind it, i long for detailed pictures that i wasn't game to ask to take as it was a while ago)...........

sooooooooooo would it be a worthwhile thing for me to go to twin plugs and EFI ? even with thoughts towards computer contolled ignition too boot

for sure i like D.B's combo back on page one, seems a little familiar
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posted on May 3rd, 2008 at 12:48 PM



Here's mine;

Fully flowed and clearanced RIMCO case (for that future upgrade if needed :yes:)
CB performance MAXI 3 full flow pump - blueprinted
CB performance lightweight lifters
Scat 1.25:1 4340 pro comp ratio rockers
CB performance 2242 camshaft (294 intake duration)
CB performance Magnum 8640 chromoly straight cut gear set
New Steve Timms ported and cc'd 043 heads, 40x35 valves, ported, chromoly retainers, stainless valves, dual springs (to run 8:1 static compression)
Match ported intake manifolds
44 IDF Webers
CB 69mm welded crankshaft with 8 dowels, balanced
Scat 4340 chromoly I beam rods with ARP bolts
12lb german forged flywheel, 8 dowelled.
Gene berg deep sump extension (1.5 lt extra oil approx)
Aircooled.net 6160 alloy pushrods
New Mahle A's P&B that have been balanced
1 5/8 s/s (supposed to be s/s) sidewinder exhaust
Bosch 009 with compufire module
MSD 6AL ignition and MSD blaster 2 coil
Scat billet serpantine pulley kit

I've a pair of 48mm EFI throttle bodies for it in the shed too. Not 100% sure it's worth the dollar outlay to upgrade to EFI though... Quick estimates indicate around $2-$3k could easily be spent all upon the entire EFI conversion.... hmmm




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posted on June 3rd, 2008 at 03:18 PM



Quote:
Originally posted by Craig Torrens
Quote:
Originally posted by BiX
My Combo

94 p & c's
69 counterweighted, re ground to 72.3 (or about that, to give 1999.99cc's)
Std mag case (PRC has to use original case material if i ever want to go down that path)
H beam rods-Chevy journal
engle 120
1.25:1 ratio rockers, (with the 120, 253 dur @ 0.050', and just .496' lift)
Cb wedge port, slightly tidied up (top spec)
cromo push rods
billet followers etc
twin 48 ida's
1 5/8 exhuast

plus lots of other bits and pieces.


Any updates on your motor Bix ?



Yep it was built last year, and has been running, Only done one event, as rallying has taken all my time and money. But aim stopping the rally for a while to focus on my own car. it is a bit of a screamer engine. Not much below 3k, then comes on very strong to 6k plus. Will rev right out to 7k plus. No major issues and will be taken to dyno day here in july.....

Edit - One issue....noise!!! with the 48ida's and 1 5/8 exhaust and fatboy, we estimate over 98dB.... maybe even 100, so need to make it quieter for mt cotton and lakeside.




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posted on June 23rd, 2008 at 11:18 PM



Call me a masochist, but has any one gone done the road of offset grind a crank to 78mm and used narrowed golf rods with say 90.4 pots?

Newt




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posted on June 24th, 2008 at 06:36 AM



You will need an early 6 volt crank due to the oil holes location, and you must nitride again to get the hard surface suitable.
The one I have seen had extra large radii to help with strength,
but still flexed around enough to cause a fron pulley leak.

Counterweighting would help,
but all this costs more to do than an off-the-shelf china steel-nitrided 78 (not cast).

Do that with a 94 bore and you will be very happy.




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posted on June 24th, 2008 at 08:27 AM



Just what I'm building for a trike now Dave, but as you know I had issues with the crank needing work, and now the CB heads, one getting replaced by CB for a casting flaw after the chambers were finished !!!! DOH !
Still 2165 seems a nice combo, worked in the chop for a few years that saw up to 9000 RPM, shame the heads couldn't keep up !




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posted on June 25th, 2008 at 11:41 PM



Dangerous,

Ive had the offset ground crank and modified Golf rods for a couple of years. Where in WA would you get the crank Nitrided?

Also any thoughts on a heavier front pully to dampen vibration? Though Im happy just for a little more power and limit the revs to around 5k.

The package is leaning towards 90.5 B pots, welded heads (40 inlet 35 exhaust), 12lb 8 dowl flywheel, compression a tad under 10:1, twin SUs (45mm - cos' I have them on the shelf), the AP3 cam, 009 ( or 010) dizzy.

Newt

As a topic for conversation - whats the diference in drive-abilty of a 78x90.5 verses 69x94????




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posted on June 26th, 2008 at 06:20 AM



Quote:


As a topic for conversation - whats the diference in drive-abilty of a 78x90.5 verses 69x94????


oh dear:no:
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posted on June 26th, 2008 at 08:06 PM



Sorry, I thought it was serious question.

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posted on July 22nd, 2008 at 08:20 AM



Craig fruther update after dyno day,

130hp at the rear wheels. The curve just starts to flatten at readline ~7k

Next step is a better ignition as its just a std coil and 009 at the moement, and some dyno tuning, but going for more midrange.




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posted on July 22nd, 2008 at 01:26 PM



Great result Bix.............can you post your dyno chart in the dyno section, would be good to see your power curve.



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posted on July 22nd, 2008 at 07:38 PM



if i could build a engine , i would but it would suck. ha

so ill go for a pobjoy twin plugged steroid donk. its all a dream at the moment.
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posted on July 23rd, 2008 at 11:21 AM



Quote:
Originally posted by BiX
Craig fruther update after dyno day,

130hp at the rear wheels. The curve just starts to flatten at readline ~7k

Next step is a better ignition as its just a std coil and 009 at the moement, and some dyno tuning, but going for more midrange.


how much did that lovely engine set you back? (ballpark)




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posted on August 1st, 2008 at 09:40 AM



Dyno chart up in racing section.

Price, i haven't really added it up...... but 5 figures..... Everything was new except for the dizzy and coil. Plus the machine work and treatment of the crank etc adds cost, barrels, pistons and chambers are ceramic coated etc etc. It was built to run as a club car, ie be able to drive on the street when required. No problem doing a trip to sydney for racing, but also at the same time not meant to do weekly duties.




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posted on January 11th, 2010 at 06:28 PM



If it wanted to get a bigger engine would i be better off building my own, eg buying parts and putting them toget or would i be better of buying a turnkey one.

What are the best increases, like cylinder wall thicknesses etc. I just wanna know a rough price on each one as well.

I want to use it as a daily so no wild fuel guzzling carbs and something with enought tourqe to pull a snall boat out of the water but enough top end to cruise at 110-120kms without being super loud. And i wanna be able to do some burnouts. And must have straight cut gears, love that wine.

Cheers, if this isnt in the right spot please move it.
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