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 Trevally
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 04:35 PM |
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Newbie + VW + new wheels = confusion
Hey guys. I'm from Adelaide and i just bought myself a slightly damaged 1971 1300 Beetle. It is very clean on the inside and most of the outside
except for a 2 minor dents. I also bought a convertable 1600 as the 1300's engine is f*cked... The 1600 is nowhere near as clean as the 1300 so i'm
gonna use the engine from the 1600 in the 1300 and stick with the rest of the 1300...
Now the mags are literally just the rim... the one you can put a hubcap over... i'm most likely going to get the beetle painted black and i was
looking at some new 17" rims... This is where the problem begins. Standard rims are 15" but i know nothing about the nut configurations and the
offset. I don't even know how to figure it out. Now this is what i read off of the standard tyres: "165 R15 86 S Radial Tubeless OR 34"... I have
no fricking idea what this means... i just need to know all the information i need to tell a tyre company so that they know what rims to give me...
Cheers for any help!
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 04:55 PM |
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being a '71, it's probably a 4 bolt rim.
if so, I think it's a 4x112pcd. that's the bolt pattern of your rim.
you'll need to know the offset of the rim too.
this is usually stamped on the rim somewhere. you;ll see something like 4.5jj 14.
4.5 is the width of the rim, jj is the offset ( I don't know how this translates on mm) and 14 is the diameter of the rim.
best bet is to take a rim to the tyre place, or better still, the whole car, and try a vew rim styles on your car.
it does help though if you know your bolt pattern and offset when you're choosing rims, so you know what's gonna fit for starters.
BTW, welcome to the forum. 
where in Adelaide are you? |
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Trevally
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:00 PM |
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Cheers. I look at the rim when the heat dies down... I'm in woodville area... Only 16 but got the car for something to do in the holidays and now i
can't stop planning things. My dad and i were supposed to go pick up the 1600 today but we forgot...
anyway cheers for that... i'll get back to you when i look at the tyre next.
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:01 PM |
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sorry, just re-read your post.
you're using the 1300 right? with the 1600 engine.
in that case, you have "wide 5" bolt pattern. (5x205 pcd)
you're limited to about 6 styles of rim, unless you use adaptor plates, or get your drums drilled to a new bolt pattern, or change your brakes.
but don't worry, some of the 5x205 pcd rims look sweet.
nearly all of them are 15"s though. |
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:04 PM |
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no probs, I'm at Klemzig, about 20 mins from you.
while it's hot outside, have a play with this, and get some paint/wheel/ride height ideas.
good way to waste an afternoon.
http://www.busselecta.com/bugselecta/ |
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bus914
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:14 PM |
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4 stud is 4x130 pcd.
j -i think refers to the wheel being a safety rim which they're all required to be.
ET is the usual designation for offset, but i don't know what value is best.
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Trevally
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:22 PM |
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Nah i'm pretty sure they are 4 nut... i just got out there (and straight back in after 30 seconds!) and looked at the wheels. the spare is 4 nut but
i can't see the others because of that chrome cap... how do i get that piece of crap off? I looked at the rubber on all of the tyres but its hard
while your standing up, and i didn't notice anything apart from the fact that the rubber is a different brand on every wheel! Kumho on this one and
some japanese brand on the next...
Played with that site and i like it . Only rims i liked were the
porsche ones at the end... not into that other chromed stuff... I really want something like these rims: LINK
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bus914
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:32 PM |
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these have the 4 stud pattern
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Trevally
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:43 PM |
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Those rims. When you say "these" are you refering to the car or the
wheels?
cheers
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bus914
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 05:55 PM |
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both.
if i remember the old magazine article correctly the wheels are simmons brand and were made in the correct pcd. the owner is in Australia someone here
may know him.
hubcaps have 2 small holes on the outer edge. the hubcap removal tool looks like this:
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Trevally
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 07:07 PM |
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Nice... About that tool... where the hell do i find that? thats ok i'll go look for it now...
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Trevally
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 07:23 PM |
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Found it... bloody thing was too small so i used a bar of metal as a handle and pulled it off... it was pretty damn rusted under there... its 4
nut.
Now when you refer to numbers like
Is that the gap (in mm) between each nut? i assume it is but if it is then is that (in the picture) following path A or B?
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Che Castro
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 07:53 PM |
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Hey. the pattern of the holes is called the PCD (pitch circle diameter)
here is a good article which will show you everything you need to know
http://www.germanlook.com/Html/Tech/Tech22FittingModernWheels.htm
Jon
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cash67
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 08:45 PM |
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17 ins would be cool, but if you drop it you will probably run into another problem or two. Unless you get a narrowed beam in there.
Most of the "New Rim" choices out there are for new cars, what you will have to do is use adaptor plates like previously posted, this again can
throw your offset out further and cause your tires to rub your fenders everytime you turn a corner or hit a bump. If you don't drop it with 17 s you
would look like you where ready to Baja. Your car though do what makes you happy though My first car at yoir age was a 72 super beetle. I loved dreamin about all the stuff to do to it. Have fun and good luck!
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Trevally
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| posted on January 10th, 2005 at 08:55 PM |
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Cheers... I just read that whole article and that guy is a legend but makes it seem like a whole lot of work...
vwtyp2 - where do you get spares etc for your beetle in SA?
cheers
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Che Castro
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| posted on January 11th, 2005 at 07:58 AM |
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You should also take note of legalities. in NSW spacers are illegal unless fitted from factory (none of the aircooled VW's were as far as I know).
Also adaptors that have two stud patterns are illegal as well.
There are rules regarding wheel width and diamter too. Must be within +/- 15mm overall rolling diameter (this is for the tyre). Also wheel width is
regulated - look at this link http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registration/downloads/vsi/vsi09_rev4.pdf Obviously this is only for NSW.
A cheap and legal solution would be to get new blank discs and drums and have them drilled for 4x100 PCD - same as a lot of modern small cars - this
gives you a lot of choice of rims.
Jon
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Trevally
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| posted on January 11th, 2005 at 09:37 AM |
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Where do i get new blank discs?
I'm pretty sure S.A. doesn't have as strict rules as NSW... YET...
cheers
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Trevally
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| posted on January 11th, 2005 at 07:56 PM |
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Ok guys, We got the 1600 delivered (towed to our house...) today. Like i said the thing is in shocking condition inside and out:puke... only good
thing is the engine. SOUNDS TOUGH:thumb:thumb:thumb!
The wheels are 4 nut (???)... Is that what they are supposed to be? and they are about 130PCD... just did a rough measurement with a ruler. Also they
are 195 75 R14... Does that make them bigger or smaller than the 1300s wheels?
Anyone know if this is a genuine 1600 and or what model it is etc?
In other words anyone know anything about this model? pros cons any warnings etc?
cheers
[Edited on 11-1-2005 by Trevally]
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 11th, 2005 at 09:25 PM |
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closest to you would be Volksfactory at Braeside Ave, Holden Hill.
speak to Paul, and tell him Daniel from the bike shop sent you.
or for servicing, Bob at VolksCare at Tania ave. Windsor Gardens.
you can fit big rims, if you find the right bolt pattert, the right offset, and the right width.
check out the 17"s on my Bay.
they're 17x8" ROH adrenaline with 225/45 rubber.
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 11th, 2005 at 09:26 PM |
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before that, I had MWS BRM replicas in 5x112 pcd.
thet're a 15x5.5"
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Trevally
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| posted on January 11th, 2005 at 11:57 PM |
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That looks crazy! I like it. Did you have to get your thingos (i keep forgetting what they're called) drilled for a different PCD or did they just
fit normally? Can the guys from Volksfactory supply me with predrilled drums, or whatever they are called, with the right PCD i need (4x100) or can
they drill mine as they are?
Also there is a place right next to Castle Plaza edwardstown called Volks Auto and they were going to fix the original 1300 engine we had before we
decide to scrap that idea and just buy a 1600 with a working engine...
cheers for that.
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BiX
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| posted on January 12th, 2005 at 12:36 PM |
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the other option, is to get some custom made. eg by simmons, they will drill a wheel to suit your pattern. but it depends on how much you want to
spend.
I have no sympathy for my car, only the wallet that pays for it!
Go hard or go home!!!!
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 12th, 2005 at 02:04 PM |
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the wheels I have now came off a Mercedes.
they're the same pcd as Kombi, so they bolt straight on.
some BMW's are the same too.
you'll find that a few cars share wheel sizes.
if you go the 4x100 pattern, it's a common size.
used by mk 1, 2, & 3 golf; heaps of jap cars, pulsars, lancers, etc.
this will give you heaps of wheel options.
look at 2nd hand ones too, you'll find heaps of ricers trade in their 17"s to get 19"s, so you can get cheap packages.
I think it's illegal to have your drums double drilled. I may be wrong.
best to get new blank drums, and get them drilled, and do your brake shoes while you're at it. then you've got new brakes.
you could also try Dean at Intervolks on Main North rd. for your drums.
price of reconditioning/rebuilding an eng. is pretty pricey.
volks auto is where we get our mk 4 golf serviced.
I'm good mates with Andrew who works there.
probably easier and cheaper to pick up a running 1600 twin port from Volks Factory or VolksCare.
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Trevally
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| posted on January 12th, 2005 at 02:35 PM |
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Well BiX, I'm looking at spending as little as possible but staying legal. Also want a different PCD not just specialised rims otherwise i'd have to
go to them everytime i want new rims...
Vwtyp2, How much would the new blank drums cost me for a set of 4? Why would i need to do the break shoes?
If its not illegal to double drill the drums then i could do it at home as we have a stainless steel company that we kind of operate in our backyard.
We have proper drill presses and HEAPS of other heavy duty tools. The guy that works for us is a legend at welding stainless and mild steel so he
should be able to weld something over the originally drilled holes and grind them down to look like nothing was ever changed...
How does that sound?
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 13th, 2005 at 08:46 AM |
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you could re drill. that's what most pleces do anyway. and if you have the facilities, go for it.
you may not need the brake shoes, just a good time to do it, while everythings apart.
I'd say just re-drill your old drums, it's gonna cost you next to bugger all, and you can do it in whatever bolt pattern you like. |
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Trevally
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| posted on January 13th, 2005 at 09:19 AM |
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Yeah if anything i would get them redrilled but how do i get the correct PCD if you draw the circle through the middle of where the nut sits? That
makes it slightly harder... although i think i know how it could be done... By drawing 2 lines diagonally accross to each nut (like in the picture)
and redrilling each nut exactly 15mm further down on that line. 15mm from one side and 15mm from the other makes the circles diameter 30mm shorter
leaving the PCD at 4x100... does that sound right?
cheers
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 13th, 2005 at 01:03 PM |
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that sounds about right, one way of doing it.
or put the drum in a lathe, and centre it, then mark your 100mm diameter in there, and use that as a centre.
If you call around the vw places, one of them may have a jig to re drill hubs.
try Car-Tek (formerly vee dub centre) on south road at edwardstown. |
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Trevally
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| posted on January 13th, 2005 at 01:23 PM |
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Cheers for that. Car Tek is right next to my dads work so shouldn't be hard to get them to do it... Do you know how much they'll charge?
Oh by the way i read that thread in the drags section about your first attempt. Looks nuts when launching and goodluck next time!
cheers
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vwtyp2
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| posted on January 13th, 2005 at 02:36 PM |
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not sure, give them a call.
speak to Michael or Shane.
thanks, I can't wait till next time. |
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malcolm
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| posted on January 14th, 2005 at 09:39 PM |
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wheels
divide 4 into 360 and that will give you the angle of each hole but get a engineering shop to do it.overall diameter is worked out by width multiplied
by . profile times 2 + diameter of wheel = overall diameter convert wheel dia into mm. ie,165/80/15=645 155/80/15=629 so a
205/45/17=616.3 I,m using a 205/45/17=616.3 on the front an a 225/40/18=637.2 on the back both a within the 15mm+/- of the orignal overall diameter.
go with of an ET 35-50 V-force can drill blank disc or drums in any pcd.
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