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 Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 12:01 AM |
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Cold Air Induction
Righto after many a web search, im here asking the question.
Has anyone ran some form of adapted cold air inducted pod filter up front of T3 or maybe in the drivers rear vent housing(originalposition)?
U know like running a lenght of segmented SS tube up to the nose of the car and adding 8" pod filter, really ramming it in.
If so got pics, suggestions?
Been thinking about doing a force fed pod filter and sitting it in the original air vent with mods to the air vent to force the air in there. Note
"MY IDEA"....
Any downside or theories that are unpracticle in this design or adaption that U can forsee????
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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pod
A.k.a.: paul mrvw061
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 12:05 AM |
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try greedy53 last time i seen his t3 he had a pod filter in there somewhere up the air vent
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 12:12 AM |
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Yeh been chatting, with the man.
Just thinking of possibilites....
Opinions sought.
[ Edited on 2-5-2007 by Iwish4aSynchro ]
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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kombi kountry
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 09:01 AM |
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Sorry, i have no authority on the matter...but have wondered in the past whether the air box gets enough cold air
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 09:20 AM |
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Ahh the magic ricer words 'pod aircleaner'. Gotta be worth 22hp, right?!
See if you can get a bit more air into the std aircleaner box/intake first
[ Edited on 2-5-2007 by VWCOOL ]
Pay your debts, CxxT
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 09:37 AM |
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Well maybe not 22horsies,but maybe a little extra uuumph.
And how would one go about achieving more air in the OEM airbox????
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 11:24 AM |
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Without looking at the T3 box in detail - I've never looked at one - all you gotta do is look and measure for any possible restriction to airflow.
Could the entry hole be made bigger? Are there any narrowed-down sections of pipe that could be replaced/made bigger? Any sharp edges that could be
smoothed off? etc
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 3rd, 2007 at 09:50 PM |
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The original box is not the problem i think.
My thinking is the cavity where the airflow is obtained. Going to run a few basic tests and get some answers.
Thinking that the air around the cavity, whilst being channelled into the air box, it is somewhat of a retarded space. Meaning the air is creating
its's own negative flow. Following?
Standard car air flows directly from front to air box.
T3 air flow past side of car and skims into rear cavity, another problem with the caravelle is rear windows have a misdirection of air.
See image
[ Edited on 3-5-2007 by Iwish4aSynchro ]
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Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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greedy53
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| posted on May 4th, 2007 at 07:48 PM |
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thr later buses have that extra bit near the window early ones don't
also i have fitted a small air scoop to the right hand side vent only 1 inch and that gathers a greayb deal of air into the box
the airbox is a great area to use i have placed my airpod in there and that way it cannot be fed any cold air from the motor
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 4th, 2007 at 08:48 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by greedy53
thr later buses have that extra bit near the window early ones don't
also i have fitted a small air scoop to the right hand side vent only 1 inch and that gathers a greayb deal of air into the box
the airbox is a great area to use i have placed my airpod in there and that way it cannot be fed any cold air from the motor
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Do U mean hot air from the motor?
As said there is somewhat of a negative air flow with original air setup and that little add on in the rear windown does not help anyones cause.
Have u used SS tubing up the cavity or is your pod almost in the original position?
I am looking to achieve a Ram Air effect.
The air scoop is a good idea and i am thinking along the same lines, but is there any throw back by why of whistling or annoying high pitch as the air
flows around the scoop???
And what thought of that double 3"pod or a singular 6" pod filter setup. Which would be the greater advantage as the original air filter is huuuuge.
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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greedy53
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| posted on May 4th, 2007 at 10:13 PM |
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the little scoop on't ause any noise and just for fun pop a termometer in behind the tail light andor a run than heck temp in there i think you weill
be surprised
using the origional space is very easy to seal it off from any moter air and formes a ramed air affect as there is no where for the air to go haver a
look you make a plate using the origioal as a templateyou will have to make it a bit bigger than weld or glue a 3 inch tube in the center
[ Edited on 4-5-2007 by greedy53 ]
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 5th, 2007 at 09:17 PM |
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Sound theory and well worth the "trial" run effort before upgrade to 6" pod.
Been playing with the original today.
After testing the O2 Sensor several times it appears i am running at 0.8 average. In bentley manual it suggests to tune afm and o2 sensor, you use the
hex key in air box in turn with the main screw on the throttle body. Just found out today that my adjust screw in throttle body is half a turn from
being at full seated position. What is everyone elses set at.
WARNING dont adjust unless u know what u are doing.
According to Another article i read the hex key in air box can be used to adjust rich and lean mixture.
Winding the hex screw in leans the mixture and out enrichens the mixture, so i have adjusted this so i have a reading of 0.7-.078 @ O2 sensor, with
idle stabliser removed.
Before proceeding into further tuning i am wondering everyones point of view. With Mixture and O2 sensor readings.
No use updating to a pod if air and fuel mixture is out of whack.....
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 5th, 2007 at 10:29 PM |
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a pod is not an 'update'...
Pay your debts, CxxT
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 6th, 2007 at 11:40 AM |
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Upgrade or update it's almost the same in the end.
Update =
• verb /updayt/ 1 make more modern. 2 give the latest information to.
• noun /updayt/ an act of updating or an updated version.
Upgrade =
• verb raise to a higher standard or rank.
• noun an act of upgrading or an upgraded version.
So if it aint an update what wording would one choose?
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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koolkarmakombi
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| posted on May 6th, 2007 at 02:23 PM |
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pods
I suspect what vwcool was meaning that a pod can often flow less air, with more issues regarding length tuning, baffles and resonant frequencies.
Lots of pods actually end up losing power or changing where/how it makes power.
Same now applies to the ol K & N filter. Paper is often better.
There are exception, your idea seem worthy of investigation. Digi temps as greedy suggested. He may even find you one on ebay......
Commodores ?VT had a restrictive intake under the bonnet lip. Stanley knife fix. Early BMW motorcycles benefited from a heap of holes in the back of
the airbox.
[ Edited on 6-5-2007 by koolkarmakombi ]
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 6th, 2007 at 09:16 PM |
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yep, use whatever words you like - but unless you are increasing filter surface area AND you didn't have enough to begin with, it's a waste of time
and bucks
KKK, found 2rwkW with that stanley knife on a VT 5.0! Not much, but for 30 seconds' work... :thumb
[ Edited on 6-5-2007 by VWCOOL ]
Pay your debts, CxxT
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 6th, 2007 at 09:24 PM |
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OK so why not just say a pod can have the opposite effect. Thanks VW cool
Anyway, as u refer to commondores this was my original idea in theory to run a length of SS tubing up to front of T3, yes along way. But it would be a
definend Ram Air intake.
After basic tests Bag of flour and a bloody big fan along air intake cavity, i can say that a great deal of air actually gets in to the cavity and
then dispersal after cavity is well random so as Greedy suggested blocking the exit of cavity and or enlargening the intake pipe directly into air box
would be of greater benefit.
Equal to or better than a Ram Air effect i am going to adapt this process for trial instead of going straight to the pod setup..
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 6th, 2007 at 09:34 PM |
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According to - I think - Irving's Tuning For Speed, you will suffer a net loss from 'ram air' below speeds of 140?MPH. It may be better to reduce
the net aerodynamic and 'pumping' losses in the intake system you already have, rather than add to its inefficiency with 12-foot of pipe
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 6th, 2007 at 09:47 PM |
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Yeh, 12 foot seemed a bit extreme.
But i do run at 142MPH all day does this help?
Makes shopping a bit tricky.:P
"Pumping losses" ??
[ Edited on 6-5-2007 by Iwish4aSynchro ]
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 6th, 2007 at 10:02 PM |
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Pumping losses - simply how much energy is lost trying to get air into the engine by sucking it through small holes, around sharp corners etc
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 7th, 2007 at 09:50 PM |
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Ok so how about a funnel action large inlet and smaller outlet?
Bit like the action of a garden hose, sort of.
U know what i mean?
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 7th, 2007 at 11:00 PM |
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Yes, and any extra power gained from it - doubtful below 100mph - is less than the energy required to push the funnel through the air...
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 8th, 2007 at 05:13 PM |
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No funnel in the air.
Think air inlet at side cavity (Seepreviousimage) of T3 and then if u can, picture a large diameter hose with same size end equipped to inlet running
through to airbox. Following?
Then on the run to the actual airbox the tubing would decrease in diameter compressing the air basically.
The only protuding part MAYBE a small scoop style to direct the air in a little better.
Make sense?
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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koolkarmakombi
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| posted on May 9th, 2007 at 08:26 AM |
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Want to compress the intake?
super charger!
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 9th, 2007 at 08:47 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Iwish4aSynchro
No funnel in the air.
Think air inlet at side cavity (Seepreviousimage) of T3 and then if u can, picture a large diameter hose with same size end equipped to inlet running
through to airbox. Following?
Then on the run to the actual airbox the tubing would decrease in diameter compressing the air basically.
The only protuding part MAYBE a small scoop style to direct the air in a little better.
Make sense?
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Scoop, funnel, whatever... See my post above
Pay your debts, CxxT
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 9th, 2007 at 10:58 AM |
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electric supercharger???
OK so i f no extra power is gained; why at night or first thing in the morning does my T3 run better alot better?
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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koolkarmakombi
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| posted on May 9th, 2007 at 12:47 PM |
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electric superchargers are best at removing money from your wallet fast! There has been prev long posts about this, short version is that they are
crap and dont push enough to do much at all.
Cold air is more dense. This equals more compression for a given engine that when the air is less dense. Unlikely to ping due to coldness of air.
Cool intakes dont increase density beyond the level in the atmosphere at the time. A cool intake doesnt make a cold morning inside your intake.
My /5 bmw motorcycle loves cold damp mornings, definately has more effect than a 'type r' sticker....:P
| Quote: | Originally
posted by Iwish4aSynchro
electric supercharger???
OK so i f no extra power is gained; why at night or first thing in the morning does my T3 run better alot better?
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You are on the right track and asking the right questions!
This disclaimer does not reflect the thoughts or opinions of either myself, my company, my friends, or my dog: don't quote me on that; don't
quote me on anything; this disclaimer is subject to change without notice; text is slightly enlarged to show detail; resemblance to actual persons,
living or dead, is unintentional and coincidental; dry clean only; do not bend, fold, or mutilate; anchovies or jalapenos added to this disclaimer
upon request; your mileage may vary; no substitutions are allowed; for a limited time only while supplies last; offer void where prohibited; this
disclaimer is provided "as is" without any warranties expressed or implied
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 10th, 2007 at 10:28 PM |
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Yeh a lot more bang for your buck in cold air.
Ok so dense air forms at low points.
But also need cold air to form density of o2? Much like AC in a car.
Problem is moisture also forms at low points, so how to(dry ice)? It is almost the basics of NOS.
Wondering how to manufacture a false sense of cooling at air intake?? Apart from running a seperate vent/line from AC.
Now i wish i had a physics degree.
I will bang head against wall.
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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Iwish4aSynchro
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| posted on May 17th, 2007 at 10:00 PM |
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After some action and thought i have come up with this theory.
If i were to somehow cool the air in the original air duct/intake of T3, would this cause heavy/dense cold air to fall to bottom and then produce the
same effect as driving in cold weather? ie, first thing in morning or at night.
Working on this theory a pod filter would be used in place of original reverse snorkel air duct..
Got some ideas as how to cool the air but i will await input first.
" A cool intake doesnt make a cold morning inside your intake".
So where to cool???????
KKK i have been reading this and re-reading it again and again, so is it that u r referring to the cooling of fuel lines before branch and
injectors?
[ Edited on 17-5-2007 by Iwish4aSynchro ]
Keep the steering and the propulsion seperate . Still a Kombi...
It's all good, until it's bad, i suppose
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VWCOOL
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| posted on May 17th, 2007 at 11:19 PM |
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My last post in this thread...
This is a joke, right?
Pay your debts, CxxT
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