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Author: Subject:  2443 Twin turbo street bug project, back on track again.
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posted on July 20th, 2012 at 10:08 PM



Awesome Ian :) :tu:



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posted on July 21st, 2012 at 04:08 AM



A plumbers nightmare, but beautiful none the less! Can't wait to hear about the startup/running.

Jason




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posted on July 21st, 2012 at 09:37 PM



Thanks guys.

If you think under the engine lid looks crowded, you should see under the parcel shelf... Where the air filters and intake piping, intercooler and pressure piping, surge tanks, fuel pumps, fuel lines, vacuum and pressure lines and of course the wiring ! I'll post a picture when its done.

No noise just yet but the fuel system is now finished. I only managed to get 1/2 the wiring done today but hope to finish it tomorrow morning.
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posted on July 26th, 2012 at 09:30 PM



Looking good. I'm sure this thing will be a beast
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posted on July 26th, 2012 at 10:35 PM



Its Alive! Finally. :smilegrin:

I've been itching to start the car the last few days but had opted to get the last of some changes made to intake manifold piping. With all that done now, today was finally the day.

The car started and ran on the 3rd attempt thanks to the mapping that I had from the last time I had the engine together. I have only had to make some changes to base timing as the setup is now running from a triggers that fire off the back of the flywheel.

The new flywheel trigger setup triggers directly off two extra long pressure plate bolts that are installed at 180 degree. I have a hall effect sensor installed through the back of the engine case to detect these longer bolts that protrude 3mm through the back of the flywheel. They trigger at around 52 degrees BTDC. Im using the same cam trigger as before which is mounted in the factory oil pump location.

There is still plenty to do before I can drive the car, but now that I've heard it run I should be able to get through it all pretty quickly. Most of it is tidying up vacuum lines and also fitting solenoids for the sequential valving.

Here's a video of the car idling around 1100 rpm. Its a little rough still but you get the idea. Throttle response is still a little slow off idle, but more tuning will help with this. The higher compression has greatly improved the crispness of the engine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiX3cRdVgsA 
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posted on July 26th, 2012 at 10:56 PM



Great work dude!



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posted on July 27th, 2012 at 07:41 AM



Good stuff Ian - sounds tough as !!!

:tu:

Re the throttle response - have you considered using more than two 180 deg separated marks for the flywheel trigger... say instead of 2:1 either 4:1 or even 12:1 ???

Way was explained when setting up mine is that the number of "teeth" affects how quickly the ECU registers changes in engine rev's... letting the ECU move up the map earlier in response to a throttle input, as well as giving more consistent/accurate calcs for BTDC.

Race cars tend to use less teeth...V8 Supercar are a I think 4:1... while street cars use more, like as much as 36:1.

Just an idea of course... could be that makes naff all difference in reality, and I guess tough to mess with anyway now it's all bolted together.




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posted on July 27th, 2012 at 09:17 AM



I see where your going with this. Adding more reference points can give the ECU an option to calculate the engine speed on the last two pulses before a Reference pulse, or on a group of them. Calculating RPM more accurately will allow the ignition angle and injection phasing angles to be more accurate, and therefore more responsive by having an optimal ignition curve.

I could run 6 longer bolts and have 6 reference points, and then just tell the ECU to skip 2 of the 3 pulses that it gets before it counts another Reference pulse. I'll have to ask Wolf if there is a benefit in doing this my the v500 ecu.
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posted on July 27th, 2012 at 10:26 AM



Very sweet ian!!!



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posted on July 27th, 2012 at 05:21 PM



Whats the expected output in Kw? if unknown yet can we have a guessing comp? winner might get a ride?



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posted on July 27th, 2012 at 05:37 PM



Quote:
Originally posted by 2443TT
I could run 6 longer bolts and have 6 reference points, and then just tell the ECU to skip 2 of the 3 pulses that it gets before it counts another Reference pulse. I'll have to ask Wolf if there is a benefit in doing this my the v500 ecu.


I wasn't aware of the pulsing thing with the Wolf... far as I know my Haltech uses all teeth for RPM and Crank position calcs... just a different way to flay the same feline I guess.

But yeah, you're getting what I was thinking... I think !!!

;)




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posted on July 27th, 2012 at 06:12 PM



The wolf's triggering setup can adapt to just about anything you can dream up. Though I'm not sure if it would use all of the 6 pulses that it would get in a 360 degree roation for RPM calculation or not. It might just use the elapsed time between the last two pulses, which in theory produces a more accurate reading as the engine speed can't change as much before the reference point. Using all the points the ecu could probably calculate a rate of acceleration/deceleration between multiple crank rotatational points. I don't see that as being likely though.

As it is, most crank based trigger setups are FAR superior to any cam based trigger system. Especially on anything modern with a over head cam setup driven by a belt. Stretch of the belt during high revs can cause ignition and cam timing to move 2-3 degrees on a Nissan GTR engine. EJ20's would be worse if they didn't use a crank trigger as the belt is even longer. All the top end tune cars i've seen switch to a crank based trigger for this reason. They usually are able to finely tune top end a little better for the ultimate power tune and a smoother torque curve. But really such a higly tuned engine is also a bit of a time bomb. If your engine can't tolerate 2-3 degrees of ignition drift occasionally, it certainly won't tolerate a bad tank of fuel without detonation.

Power estimates... a conservitave 300hp to the tyres at 1 bar boost should be easily achivable and should be nice and drivable for the street. With water/meth injection and 1.4-1.5 bar that should make 400-440 whp. That will also max the current injectors.

My goals for this car have changed over the years and power isn't enough for me anymore. I want a more drivable experience and a wide power band. When Townsville drag strip closes next month, the closest drag strip to me is a good 16 hour return trip so it will probably never see a drag strip unless someone starts doing the 1/8th mile events at the Innisfail airport again. It should be good fun at the sprint events that I compete in though. I'll be in the same class as the nissan silvia's and the 5lt v8's.
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posted on July 27th, 2012 at 11:52 PM



Honda did timing off the cam instead of at the crank (back in the days of twin points........you beauty) on the old CB350twins, amongst others. Those things spun up to 10000 when you had a small Megacycle cam and a bit of compression. The standard motor at 8500 redline had as much as 5deg timing difference, but just to make it interesting, the timing could waver BOTH ways, adv or retd, and quite often at 10000 it would waver 6 or 7 degrees like a resonance sort of thing.
Made tuning somewhat problematic........:lol:

Thank goodness for crank triggers!
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posted on July 28th, 2012 at 09:36 PM



Made a fair bit of progress today finalising the vacuum lines, boost lines, and the solenoids that control the valves. Its getting complicated and pretty crouded in there.

I still need to fit an idle control valve, one more solenoid, a coolant pump for the water-air intercooler system and its air bleed valve. And then there is the water/meth injection system to deal with!

Wiring is close to finished. It will all be loomed together once its finished and the last two valves are wired. Ive been able to keep with the concept of a single plug to allow the engine to be easily isolated from the EFI loom thanks to a main harness plug from a hyundai sonata I raided at the wreckers.

Does this look crouded or what!

http://users.on.net/~iswinkels/Hosted/Intake/DSCF0728.JPG

You can see the fuel system fairly well here. Two pumps and 2 surge tanks, each feeding a rail with a centrally mounted regulator.
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posted on July 29th, 2012 at 12:40 AM



I'd love to see the look on a regular mechanics face if you rocked up and asked for a tune up or to have a problem fixed. I reckon it would take them a day to try and figure out what you have created, .......mind you, what you have created is amazing!
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posted on August 31st, 2012 at 09:31 PM



Nice!!!!
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posted on August 31st, 2012 at 10:11 PM



Thanks guys.

The car had its first outing about 2 weeks ago, I forgot to post up a photo.

Here's a pic before I washed it. Its got the carbon fibre engine lid back on the car now.

http://users.on.net/~iswinkels/Hosted/Outside.jpg

I didn't go far as the car needs to be re-tuned from scratch. I've been too busy with work lately to spend more time on the car. Hopefully in the next few weeks I'll be not working all weekend for a change and can have some fun.
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posted on September 1st, 2012 at 06:20 AM



Great stuff Ian

The complexity of the build still blows me away




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posted on February 12th, 2013 at 09:52 PM



Any updates Ian?



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posted on February 13th, 2013 at 03:47 PM



^^And any more recent video footage?

Looks amazing!!Great stuff!




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posted on March 5th, 2013 at 03:11 PM



Hi Guys,

Sorry for the slow reply, for some reason I only received notifications of your posts today which is odd...

Latest developments are that I have changed the wheels and tyres, as the porsche wheels were looking pretty old and tired. The semi slicks on them had a few cracks too and weren't safe to drive on anymore.

So The car now has a set of Volk Racing TE37's in titanium grey, 18x8.5 fronts and 18x10.5 rears. I went with Fereral 595 RSR semi slicks too, as they are about the best semi you can get at the moment that is still streetable, yet not a competition tyre like an RE55. 235's and 285's from memory.

The main hold up with progress has been that I have too many projects on the go. Renovating a house, working long hours etc don't give me much time to finish the last of the car. In recent months, all I've done is work on the house. Building false walls, plaster boarding, and cornice. Now undercoat finally...

This last part of the puzzle with the car has been the engine management and tuning software that I am working on. I can't say much more about it than that at the moment, but will reveal more about this when its closer to being finished.

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posted on March 5th, 2013 at 03:38 PM



Hi Ian

Good to hear your still going on the project. You will love the Federals, I have them on my bug.

Steve
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posted on June 3rd, 2014 at 12:17 AM



This thing ever get finished?



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posted on June 3rd, 2014 at 07:13 AM



Is a project car ever finished?

I haven't done anything new to the car since the wheel change last year. The project has been on hold so I could finish my house, which is finally nearing completion.

I've only driven the car a few times and it has gone well on those occasions. I do need to do something to quieten it down a bit though. When the house is finished I am planning on switching back to a single turbo, most likely a Precision 5558 or 5858. This will allow me to fit a better muffler system and reduce the complexity of the whole setup a little.
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posted on June 3rd, 2014 at 09:05 AM



Great to hear that this beautiful project is still on the simmer. Looking forward to any updates when convenient.



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posted on June 6th, 2014 at 11:57 PM



Firstly love the car and the engineering that has gone into it... Have been following it quietly since you started posting :)

You mention a wheel change last year ?
I just looked back through a few pages but couldn't see anything, does it no longer have the directionals on it ?




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posted on June 7th, 2014 at 02:36 PM



Nice wheels dude ;)

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posted on June 8th, 2014 at 08:22 PM



Where's the like button.



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posted on November 20th, 2014 at 07:18 PM



this thing is boss ! would love to know whats going on with it now
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posted on November 21st, 2014 at 02:57 PM



Quote:
Originally posted by reub
Nice wheels dude ;)


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