| [ Total Views: 1195 | Total Replies: 13 | Thread Id: 68672 ] |
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 Craig Torrens
A.k.a.: Craig Torrens
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| posted on April 21st, 2008 at 09:42 PM |
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Soft or Hard Rear Torsion bars for Drags ?
I'm assuming I need the car to squat in the rear...........so instead of the Type 3 torsion bars I currently have fitted, should I go back to
standard beetle ones ?
Cheers
Craig T
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GTMac
A.k.a.: Andrew
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| posted on April 21st, 2008 at 11:39 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Craig Torrens
I'm assuming I need the car to squat in the rear...........so instead of the Type 3 torsion bars I currently have fitted, should I go back to
standard beetle ones ?
Cheers
Craig T
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Craig you need to have enough power first for the car to squat! 
As you know I have the extra weight and power of the EJ20 but I run the larger 28mm torsions and I still get plenty of squat. Have not had problems
launching yet all be it relatively soft starts at 2.4-2.6 60ft's.
1971 Type 3 Fasty - EJ20T
I love 242HP sleepers. 
How many sets of lights does it take a $229k Carrera S to learn?
UPDATE: Cayman S, M3, B4 now added to the list. |
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dangerous
A.k.a.: Dave Butler Muffin Man
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| posted on April 22nd, 2008 at 05:54 AM |
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Squat is NOT what you want.
You DO want the weight to transfer to the rear, but squat is a result
of when this happens and it is too great for the tortions to handle.
The heavier the car,
or the faster it transfers the weight,
or the more torque you have,
the more spring you need.
Lower weight or power cars can get by finewith some form of stock tortion,
but constent launches require more spring in most cases.
Also lack of spring will cause the bump stop to hit too hard, and unload the tyre.
| Quote: | Originally
posted by westi
That's mad Alan.
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1303Steve
A.k.a.: Steve Carter
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| posted on April 22nd, 2008 at 10:11 AM |
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Hi
Dave should know, also even with IRS there is built in negative camber on squat so with too much negative camber you will get less tyre contact
area.
Steve
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mactaylor
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| posted on April 22nd, 2008 at 04:12 PM |
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are the corners getting too hard craig?
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1303Steve
A.k.a.: Steve Carter
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| posted on April 22nd, 2008 at 05:33 PM |
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Hi
He's getting old, so running a hillclimb might leave him a bit short getting to the dunny in time, drags are over much quicker.
Steve
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LIFE IN THE LOW LANE
A.k.a.: Brennden Alder
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| posted on April 22nd, 2008 at 09:55 PM |
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He needs a dry sump set up for his bowels perhaps. Storage tank behind the seat LOL
[size=4] ACCEPT THAT SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE PIDGEON AND SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE STATUE[/size]
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BeetleJuice
A.k.a.: Craig Paton
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| posted on April 22nd, 2008 at 10:15 PM |
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Squatting is what you do whilst taking a dump in the bush!
Weight Transfer...What Dave said.
CP
FringeDweller
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GTMac
A.k.a.: Andrew
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| posted on April 22nd, 2008 at 10:27 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by 1303Steve
Hi
He's getting old, so running a hillclimb might leave him a bit short getting to the dunny in time, drags are over much quicker.
Steve
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Quicker, thats still yet to be seen!
1971 Type 3 Fasty - EJ20T
I love 242HP sleepers.
How many sets of lights does it take a $229k Carrera S to learn?
UPDATE: Cayman S, M3, B4 now added to the list. |
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mactaylor
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| posted on April 23rd, 2008 at 07:04 PM |
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we still love you craig please come back with a witty retort!!!!!
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dangerous
A.k.a.: Dave Butler Muffin Man
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| posted on April 24th, 2008 at 06:40 AM |
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After thinking about this for a couple of days,
I have perhaps over simplified my response.
In response to craigs question, yes, keep the heavier tortions.
Or even get heavier ones if you plan to race more in a straight line.
You actually WANT weight transfer,
and infact, it WILL occur.
And also, any IRS (swingaxle too) will squat
when the transaxles reaction to torque tries to lift the front of the car.
But, sometimes a heavier tortion bar will prevent this weight transfer,
and limit traction.
But in most cases,
you need the added spring rate
to prevent the suspension from hitting the bump stop.
| Quote: | Originally
posted by westi
That's mad Alan.
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Craig Torrens
A.k.a.: Craig Torrens
Scirocco Rare
6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion
Posts: 8040
Threads: 347
Registered: January 10th, 2003
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Location: Sydney
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Time to go Salt lake racing, and actually achieve a result.
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| posted on April 24th, 2008 at 11:57 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by 1303Steve
Hi
Dave should know, also even with IRS there is built in negative camber on squat so with too much negative camber you will get less tyre contact
area.
Steve
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Yeah I have adjusted all the Neg camber out of the rear...........this was done by putting the car into a wall at Bathurst
Sounds like I will need to retain the T3 bars
Cheers Dave for the advice.
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2443TT
A.k.a.: Ian
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| posted on April 27th, 2008 at 12:03 PM |
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What about getting adjustable rate rear dampners to control the rate the spring compresses at? I used to have adjustable rate koni's on my previous
setup, and the new coil-overs im using have adjustable variable valving.
My understanding is that you always wanted the spring rate to match the dampener force, or you can get a way to hard a ride, or the other way is that
it bounces all over the road because the dampner can not control the spring. Of course drag being a lot diferent to going around corners...
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dangerous
A.k.a.: Dave Butler Muffin Man
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| posted on April 27th, 2008 at 02:06 PM |
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The principals are the same as I understand.
The damper is there to contol the spring.
So what ever spring medium, or rate, you choose,
the damper must be able to keep it under control.
I originally tried a damper with a gas charge to help,
but in the end, what I needed was a much higher spring rate.
Adjustability is nice to have so long as you dont get lost from your base line settings,
and the adjusting method(say with regard to your spring) does not have less strength than non adjustable.
My own car is not adjustable in any way other than ride height at front(stays the same),
And bump stops at the back(stay the same, but should never hit because they are just a saftey stop)
| Quote: | Originally
posted by westi
That's mad Alan.
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