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 steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:23 AM |
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judson supercharger rebuild and fram bypass oil filter
Bought an oval project a few years ago and it came with a recon. engine ,gearbox and a judson.I thought the judson was brand new as every thing else
was new(Pulleys,Oiler etc.)But when running was noisy but pretty much same as others i have heard.Decided to pull it apart and found out it was well,
stuffed see photo.
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1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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HappyDaze
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:34 AM |
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The vanes must have worn away quite a lot, to get that sort of wear on the rotor. Maybe had the wrong [or no] oil, also.
Is that a crack between the slots? If so, the rotor's rooted.....sounds like that place in NZ.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:36 AM |
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the slots are mean't to be 3/16" wide but are well passed that.It has also been machined oversize so it is time for a new rotor.
The body is badly grooved but should hone up ok.
New rotors are available but are $700 plus postage and vanes $100. So i think first will try to make one.The vanes being oversize ,i should be able to
mill these down to the right size.
I have ordered a billet of aluminium 90mm in dia.and 200mm long.
Have honed the body and has come out ok.
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1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:41 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by HappyDaze
The vanes must have worn away quite a lot, to get that sort of wear on the rotor. Maybe had the wrong [or no] oil, also.
Is that a crack between the slots? If so, the rotor's rooted.....sounds like that place in NZ.
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The vanes aren't worn that bad.The original rotors are quite soft,as they are a cast alloy.The rotor is not cracked but is rooted as you said.
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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 vw54
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:41 AM |
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Steve
I can not see any cracks in the rotor I have had Judsons since the early 90s in both cars
My rotors are similar in wear and have just add new vanes to make them work
Greg can you see cracks ???
new parts available from the guy in Ney York George F i can look his details up if you want
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HappyDaze
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:43 AM |
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Looks like you have things under control, Steve. What grade of aluminium are you using? See if you can get a 'radius' in the bottom of the slots,
when milling them.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:51 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by HappyDaze
Looks like you have things under control, Steve. What grade of aluminium are you using? See if you can get a 'radius' in the bottom of the slots,
when milling them.
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Have forgotten grade ,i went to a aluminium suppler and told him what i was going and the said this is the best grade for machining(it is not 6061 i
think it was 5 something)But will be a lot better than original.
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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vw54
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:53 AM |
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Honestly i wouldnt worry about that one Mine are similar in wear and still work Good
I have purchased a few items from George F in Ney York hes really good and easy to work with for the parts you need
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 matberry
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 07:58 AM |
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What about remachining the slots and putting in spacers or thicker rotors. ??
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 08:05 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by matberry
What about remachining the slots and putting in spacers or thicker rotors. ??
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The slots have already been machined oversize with thicker vanes.
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 08:20 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by vw54
Honestly i wouldnt worry about that one Mine are similar in wear and still work Good
I have purchased a few items from George F in Ney York hes really good and easy to work with for the parts you need
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I have also purchased parts from george.
It was working ok as you stated but iam very fussy .(It costs me a lot of money at times but it is the way i am)So i will be machining a new one or
trying to.If i mess it up i will have to buy one from george.
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 01:02 PM |
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tried to press the shaft out of rotor but it would not move.My mates 20 ton press was starting to bend.I think i will make a new shaft as this one has
a few battle scars.
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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vw54
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 01:50 PM |
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Its NOT meant to be removed the steel shaft has tangs on it to stop the alloy section from mooving
its cast as one piece when being made
Please ask questions before you do any more damage
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 04:08 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by vw54
Its NOT meant to be removed the steel shaft has tangs on it to stop the alloy section from mooving
its cast as one piece when being made
Please ask questions before you do any more damage
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What questions do i ask? Iam going to make a new rotor and shaft because mine is worn out. Tell me how please?
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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HappyDaze
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 04:47 PM |
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Reckon you are on the right track, Steve. How will you 'key' the al. rotor to the shaft? Please show us your progress...... It will be interesting
to see the results.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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vw54
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 05:30 PM |
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yes well the hard bit will be keeping the shaft n rotor together
It would be good if you could get a lump of alloy cast onto the old shaft and machine up a new rotor
Interest to know if the OD of the old rotor has varied or still concentric ( so just the slot has worn )
May be easier to mill the slot wider and obtain thicker bakelite material for the new vanes
Ive been fiddling with these since 1984 or so
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waltermitty
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 06:05 PM |
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Dave i am sure you have been fiddling with it since before 1984,
Mitchell
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 06:41 PM |
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As there is very little load on the rotor,a good shrink fit should be ok.I will freeze new shaft i have made and heat rotor to as hot as i can.Then
when shaft and rotor heat up should all hang together.Iam limited by my measuring equipment (have only digital calipers and my old calipers from
apprenticeship) Will start for about a .005" interference fit ,which is a lot and
slowly machine shaft until it fits.Will keep you informed
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 06:57 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by vw54
yes well the hard bit will be keeping the shaft n rotor together
It would be good if you could get a lump of alloy cast onto the old shaft and machine up a new rotor
Interest to know if the OD of the old rotor has varied or still concentric ( so just the slot has worn )
May be easier to mill the slot wider and obtain thicker bakelite material for the new vanes
Ive been fiddling with these since 1984 or so
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The rotor has already been machined for wider vanes.I think i have already stated that.
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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20bkombi
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| posted on October 5th, 2012 at 11:31 PM |
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Hi Steve, it was nice to meet you at Warwick, will have to catch up and chat again soon.
Any pics of the new rotor and shaft??
Are you going to cut the new vein slots after pressing the shaft in?
Aaron
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vw54
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| posted on October 6th, 2012 at 06:53 AM |
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Steve
I take it you have seen this http://www.vwjudsonregister.org.uk/
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 6th, 2012 at 08:11 AM |
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Thanks vw54 yes have read it inside out,
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 6th, 2012 at 08:15 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by 20bkombi
Hi Steve, it was nice to meet you at Warwick, will have to catch up and chat again soon.
Any pics of the new rotor and shaft??
Are you going to cut the new vein slots after pressing the shaft in?
Aaron
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Hi Aaron ,I enjoyed our chat at Warwick and it was nice to meet you.
Iam about to put up the pictures of the shaft,and hope to fit the rotor to the shaft and then machine the rotor.
Steve
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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HappyDaze
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| posted on October 6th, 2012 at 08:37 AM |
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Steve, I assume you have in mind some form of 'keying' of the shaft & rotor? Perhaps you could also bore the rotor under-size, to provide an
interference fit. Leave the shaft in the freezer for a while, and heat the rotor in the oven [200c?] before pressing together. There are people around[Dangerous?] who could help with precise dimensions, etc.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 6th, 2012 at 08:40 AM |
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I have made up the shaft the same specs as the sample,the thread i screw cut (last one i did was about 40 yrs ago) and fits nut like a glove.Next to
bore the Rotor i made up two boring bars from 12mm and 16mm s /s i had at hand .I want them to be rigid as possible as it is a long hole.
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1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 6th, 2012 at 09:13 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by HappyDaze
Steve, I assume you have in mind some form of 'keying' of the shaft & rotor? Perhaps you could also bore the rotor under-size, to provide an
interference fit. Leave the shaft in the freezer for a while, and heat the rotor in the oven [200c?] before pressing together. There are people around[Dangerous?] who could help with precise dimensions, etc.
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Hi Greg,Thanks for the input,yes i will be going for a interference fit.Heat the rotor in the oven,shaft in the freezer and then
heat the rotor with mapp gas to get it hotter and then if it does not fit ,remove .001" of shaft until it will fit.This may seem long winded but i
have only a digatal caliper which isn't that accurate when talking .0005" Will let you know how it goes.
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 7th, 2012 at 07:54 AM |
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I tried a test cut in the old rotor to make sure it would work out ok.You can see the amount of wear .Also on the judson registry read about the case
history ( i do not know how to do a link, i only learn't how to upload photo's last week).It states that the vane should be a neat fit in the
slot,or air will bypass the vane and you lose effeciency .Commonsense pretty much.They will work in this state sort off,and be fine for a drive around
the block but i like to know that i can drive from bris. to melb.Also in the resto of the oval the engine was rebuild to new specs. as was gearbox
,the whole car actually (it won 3 trophies at action day) So i want the supercharger to be the same.
Well onto the machining of the rotor first up was to bore a hole slightly undersize of the shaft.
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1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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NUG637
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| posted on October 7th, 2012 at 01:55 PM |
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farkengruven
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| posted on October 7th, 2012 at 02:13 PM |
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Good luck with your project.
What is going to prevent the rotor from sliding/moving on the shaft when the finished product is in the Judson and actually working on the road? Just
the interference fit?
Is it worth pinning the rotor to the shaft, so it cannot move in any direction?
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steve burgess
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| posted on October 7th, 2012 at 04:06 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by farkengruven
Good luck with your project.
What is going to prevent the rotor from sliding/moving on the shaft when the finished product is in the Judson and actually working on the road? Just
the interference fit?
Is it worth pinning the rotor to the shaft, so it cannot move in any direction?
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I am hoping the interference fit will be enough,if done right.There is not much of a load put on it.It is only 36hp remember,but if
anyone has ideas how to pin it to the shaft let me know.Thanks for the support
1956 judson supercharged oval
1975 kombi camper
1976 kombi panel van
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