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 CBKO294
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| posted on November 19th, 2016 at 08:32 AM |
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Country Buggy Exhaust
Does anyone have drawings, dimentions, CAD files, detailed photos or all of the mentioned items for original CB exhaust?
My CB has the original engine but the OG exhaust was not with the car.
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 19th, 2016 at 11:34 AM |
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Attention: Steve Muller & others
As best as I can remember, Bill Moore contracted a limited number of orders for reproductions of original spec CB exhaust systems as they came from
the factory.
I have no specific knowledge of the numbers fabricated in that production run, or the fabricator, but I do remember they were done in stainless and
looked like works of art. I will search my files for photos.
I'm sure some of you original AVD Aussie CB forum guys have some recollection of some of that production......Nathan, Graham, Steve
Muller, etc.? ..... and can perhaps fill in some blanks.
Here is what I would suggest, based on info long posted in this forum:
1. Read the thread entitled Bill Moore's legacy http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=107807
2. Be proactive! Contact Steve Muller via the email addy offered in the above thread and inquire about Bill's CB exhaust data and file and ask if he
can release it for public use. info@volksmuller.com.au
To quote the 1st post in the cited thread:
"As you all know, the passing of Bill Moore has left a real void in the international community of Australian Country Buggy enthusiasts. There
have recently been a number of people concerned over Bill’s legacy and the future of Bill’s historical collection of CB related information,
documents etc. In regards to this, Stephen Muller (Bill’s best mate and fellow CB enthusiast) has been given the role of custodian and accordingly
is now in possession of Bill’s collection including his beloved Country Buggy. As I’m sure you can all appreciate this sizeable collection will
take some time to go through, however rest assured that it’s in good hands and will be preserved for generations to come.In regards to the
Australian Country Buggy Register, Bill made the decision to move that to volksculture.com where he could easily maintain it and link individual
vehicles via KO number to associated albums of photos. Currently this is being maintained by Ashley Roan (co-founder of Volks Culture along with Bill
and Stephen Muller).Please refer any further questions in regards to Bills historical collection and CB related information directly to Stephen Muller
at info@volksmuller.com.au and information submissions for the Australian Country Buggy register to
Ashley Roan at ashley@page2.com.auThe Australian Country Buggy Register can be found here: http://www.volksculture.com/group/country-buggy-register/page/country-buggy-r... All the best Ash"
| Quote: |
My CB has the original engine but the OG exhaust was not with the car.
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I could be wrong, but due to the extremely limited number of CBs produced, I believe the exhaust systems were fabbed "in house" at Clayton or by an
Aussie subcontractor for VW Australasia. The vehicle concept, design and execution was done entirely in Australia. Fabrication of the exhaust system
in Germany ("OG") and shipment to OZ would not have made economic sense, IMO, since there was virtually nothing like this exhaust system used
anywhere in the VW lineup of vehicles.
Regards,
Steve Koontz
Gas City, IN, USA
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 19th, 2016 at 02:26 PM |
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Old Bug CB Resto
Found some pics of Randy Carlson's Old Bug CB restoration several years ago in California. These include several shots of the stainless exhaust.
http://www.oldbug.com/cbuggy.htm
The Country Buggy Register lists this as KO 273, Chassis # 118310277.
The are no pics of this CB on the Registry, although the pics are at the link above.
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
* Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia !
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southspark
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| posted on November 19th, 2016 at 07:22 PM |
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The original s/s reproduction mufflers were made for my C/B by Mcgrath Mobile Mufflers ,Freemans Reach ,Sydney. ph.0418 966 579 .ii Bill had a few
more sets made made but the cost of manufacture was very high due to the low volume.
If you contact Bob Mcgrath tell him Paul sent you.
Regards Paul
ps I did recognise the muffler in the pics.
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CBFAN
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 02:32 AM |
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I appreciate the Information.
They looks very simple to make. If I had dimensions I could fabricate my own set. The photos help and it would be awesome to get some photos of the
details of the Exhaust off someone's CB. Examples would be where does that stainless steel attach strap mountil to etc.
Thanks
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 02:37 AM |
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I'm working on more details and finding more pics.
I have communicated with a couple of other CB people. Awaiting their replies, but it's the middle of the night in OZ.
We'll wind up with something workable here..........just don't start rolling, bending, welding this afternoon.
;-)
Regards,
Steve
Please PM me. I know you are a US owner.
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
* Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia !
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CBFAN
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 02:41 AM |
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Also, helpful dimensions would be:
-what diameter are the exhaust pipe that runs out the rear of the car just above the bumper?
- what is the length of the muffler tube?
- what is the diameter of the muffler tube?
- what is the length of the support strap?
I am pretty sure I can fabricate a set for my CB if I had these dimentions.
Thanks again
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 03:46 AM |
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cb john may also have some info about the repro exhaust systems.
Pics of John total restoration of KO 271 shows some limited parts of an OEM style CB exhaust. Perhaps John will jump in here and tell us what he has
and who fabbed it up for him. Knowing John's metal working skill set, I wouldn't be surprised at all if he made his own system.
Perhaps he can supply some additional pics and build specs of his exhaust system.
The following pics are posted at Volks Culture:
cb john's KO 271CB exhaust system:
KO 343:
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
* Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia !
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ArtyP
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 09:29 AM |
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I had to make new muffler about 30 years ago and what I did was got all the good bits were mostly heavy gauge ,then i rolled up some 16 Gauge mild
steel and cut end caps all the bits from inside the original were ok as was one tail pipe but I couldn't get tail pipes of the same diameter so I had
to use slightly bigger ones ,they are all in good condition ( I think ) and this is about the last thing I have to do before I start putting the whole
Buggy back together, From memory the size of my the muffler is pretty close to the original size and I have one original tail pipe (I am about to try
and get some pipe the same dia. instead of using my bigger ones) so if anyone wants some measurements I can help the.The other thing about the
originals had 2 joining seams sticking out about 5 mm at 3'oclock and 9 o'clock but it is pretty hard to replicate that unless I start again.
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southspark
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 10:49 AM |
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The strap on top isn't standard (not a good idea to mount exhaust to body) the bottom one is.Bill never had specs drawn up as he had one right side
NOS that the muffler bloke used as a sample. The size of the pipe is the same OD as a Beetle tailpipe ,we could only get that in s/s .The flanges out
of the heads were bolted on to an engine & J pipes welded in situ.to get the angles correct. The rear J pipe came into the same front chamber as
the front one ,the exhaust gas then went through a baffle towards the back & then forward to come out on the top.
I could draw it from memory if you need it .I could scan & email. I went trough my old C/B stuff all I could find was a vague photo from a dealer
info sheet .
I still have a fair bit of documents of the C/B including an original NOS instruction manual(not a copy)if any interest send PM.
Regards Paul
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 11:25 AM |
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ArtyP & southspark,
Gentlemen, whatever you or anyone else can lend to this discussion regarding your observed dimensions, your own examples via photos, data from
original VW Australasia literature, etc., will be sincerely welcomed by CBKO294, and me as well.
I'm still wondering about the fabricator Bill originally had make a small batch of mufflers and pipes.........anyone know???
Frankly the forum isn't quite the same animal it previously was before we lost Bill Moore. He would want all of us to continue to contribute to the
knowledge base in whatever way we can. Bill showed us the path, it is those remaining who must follow it, and emulate Bill's example.
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
* Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia !
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CBFAN
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 12:21 PM |
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I am beginning to scratch build a Country Buggy from a VW pan and this info on the exhaust helps a bunch. I doubt I can get it as nice as John's but
hope to get close. Just trying to gather all the pertinent info I can right now. Being that my CB will be a custom scratch build the dimensions
might not be good for my build but the photos and info will get me very close to what I need to make up.
Great group with lots of helpful people.
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CBKO294
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 01:45 PM |
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Hey CBFAN are you in the United States? You seem like you are on US time on most of your posts. I am in the midwest if you need any info or photos
to help you out on your build shoot me an email.
I have a buddy who owns a welding business who has welded custom exhausts for people in the past. I will have him make my exhaust once I get the
proper dimensions on length, circircumference , etc. I will be best if he makes it right off my car so he can get proper fit. If interested in a set
for your project it would be easy for him to make an extra set at the time he makes mine. Just let me know if interested.
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 02:15 PM |
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KO 211:
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
* Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia !
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southspark
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 02:20 PM |
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Hi there ztnoo ,too much Bacardi ? posted details yesterday.FYI
Mcgrath Mobile Mufflers 0418 966 579
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 02:37 PM |
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It doesn't hurt to ask around.
There may be more than one answer to this topic.
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
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frog
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 09:07 PM |
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I have a pair of original CB exaust 's... Are they needed for dimensions before it's too late? I have promised them to someone soon...
"-Hannovermetalmadness-"(Infectious desease with no known cure).
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 20th, 2016 at 09:18 PM |
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If you can do a dimensional take off of every aspect of the muffler, headers, and tail pipe, that would be much appreciated here. Any photos you can
supply would be warmly welcomed as well.
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
* Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia !
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CBKO294
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| posted on November 21st, 2016 at 06:14 AM |
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Hey Frog,
Exactlty what ztnoo said about the dimensions on the muffler, header, tail pipe etc. would be greatly appreciated.
Photos are alway great.
Thanks for your imput.
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 21st, 2016 at 06:59 AM |
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Addtitional Resource
For Everyone's Information:
I posed the same question over at VW Country Buggy Australia Facebook Page.
There's a slightly different membership there than here at the CB Forum, so I thought doing so might elicit a greater body of knowledge from a
broader audience.
I am getting some replies over there, but the real details some many people want to know, haven't emerged yet.
For Facebook users here at AVD, I would suggest meandering over to that site to check things out.
VW Country Buggy Australia Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/groups/302252683315626/
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 22nd, 2016 at 03:15 AM |
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southspark,
PM sent.
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 23rd, 2016 at 09:22 PM |
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Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 24th, 2016 at 04:44 AM |
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Old Muufler Thread by Country Buggy Bill
CB muflers - for sale posted on December 20th, 2007 at 05:51 AM
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=66649
"I have had another 5 sets of CB mufflers manufactured in Sydney by the same guy who has done the last 20 odd sets supplied over recent years.
The barrels are the same size as the original CB mufflers with similar internal baffles and are made in 1.5 stainless to
last forever.
The set ( two each) of mufflers, tailpipes, header pipes, gaskets, clamps, nuts and bolts sell for $660 complete. I
can parcel post anywhere at buyers cost.
The sets are made for 1300 or 1500 single port only and have pre heater pipes
If interested contact me at; countrybuggybill@hotmail.com
Bill Moore"
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bevoracing
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| posted on November 24th, 2016 at 09:18 AM |
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Apparently there is a jig in existence, although I haven’t seen it. I presume it’s the one that Bill used to get these made. I plan to make my
own exhaust, after the motor has gone in, just as soon as I get a minute to get back to the project. I’ve looked at the 181 Thing pipes with a view
to cutting them up but it might be just as easy to start from scratch. I bought an F125 motor years ago with the front bends still on it, pulled out
of the box, so I’ll use them to get the muffler position. Never actually seen an original set. Interestingly looking at it yesterday the tip with
the holes in it isn’t there any more. Must “slip” into the pipe.
My shortened single cab has an interesting set of home made high ground clearance pipes on it.
Cheers
Tony
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 24th, 2016 at 10:25 AM |
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| Quote: |
Apparently there is a jig in existence
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Tony,
Steve Muller said he is in possesion of it over at VW Country Buggy Australia Facebook.
For those AVD members who don't "do" Facebook, allow me to provide the information:
1. "Stephen Muller The jig is in my possession The cost is astronomical. I have also looked at getting the made o/s BUT minimum
order was for 20 units Approx cost was $ 8-900. I can refresh the process again it's not something I can cover unless enough people put $ down to
make it happen. I do have an original sample if some had a better contact"
2. "Stephen Muller The CB muffler run about 8 yrs ago was actually built by a friend of mine. Bill and I both worked on this project and many others
as bill was my best friend. Bill applied himself to historical facts and I added in the mechanical facts We actually worked together with many a
discussion. Basically Bills information is not lost a lot remains with me. Happy to share the knowledge too."
3. "Stephen Muller This was just before Bill died. It's not a 5 min exercise for me or the guy quoting this out. It will all depend on response The
biggest hurdle was pre heat castings that's why it is going to be expensive Solution was a cheaper approach as per the the 10 built earlier. Even
looked into buying cheap Brazilian type1 exhaust systems and cutting off the castings So to make them 100% correct was always going to be
expensive."
* https://www.facebook.com/groups/302252683315626/
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
* Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia !
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 24th, 2016 at 10:35 AM |
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Just for the visually and intellectually curious about a VW Thing exhaust, I can see possibilities maybe going this route.
 
Fine tuning the proper daily ratio of Maxwell House to Bacardi 151.........
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Cornwallvw1
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| posted on November 24th, 2016 at 08:42 PM |
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I have a complete set (minus Gail pipe) I'll take a photo of and post asap
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steveo169
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| posted on November 24th, 2016 at 08:51 PM |
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cornwell
Nice offer -photos are good but measurements and drawings are even better.
I've gotta hijack this by asking - can I buy it?
Cheers Steve
ko668
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Cornwallvw1
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| posted on November 24th, 2016 at 09:07 PM |
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Sorry, not for sale. I need to use it to Copy at some point in the near future.
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ztnoo
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| posted on November 25th, 2016 at 04:29 AM |
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To continue this muffler discussion, I have been looking around a bit more. I'm not saying this is a bolt on Saturday afternoon project, but the
standard Thing exhaust for a '73 which had pre-heat pipes, but no heater boxes because the passenger's compartment was heated with a gas fired
heater under the front bonnet, might be the most compatible, ready made system which roughly duplicates the original CB exhaust system.
The Thing had tailpipes which exited thru the bumpers rather than above the bumper on a CB. Rather than the tailpipe emanating from the center of the
muffler body, the tailpipe opening exits the rear and is fitted with a zig zag tailpipe which allows it to pass through the bumper.
To me the beginning question would be what is the exhaust port to exhaust port width dimension on a 1300, 1200, or a 1500? Bill Moore's sets were
supposedly for 1300s & 1500s. The second question would be assembled width dimension of the Thing muffler assembly from exhaust port mounting
flange to flange?. I would assume that distance might be slightly great than the distance on a 1300 or 1500 engine, but I don't know that for fact.
Things were equipped with 1600 two port engines. I would expect the dimension to be slightly different. But is that the case, there room for some
novel innovation (spacers, short assemblies, etc.) to adapt this system to a CB.
This possibility might well prove cheaper than fabbing up something custom made. Just throwing ideas around.
It might be a reasonable compromise solution between the exact duplicate of a CB exhaust system and what can be some pretty hideous looking
aftermarket systems. It would basically be the same layout as stock, if tailpipes could be bent to exit the CB body.
If this could be done for $500-$600 as opposed to something between $800-$1,000, there might be some interest out there.
http://www.jbugs.com/product/181251053G.html?Category_Code=vw-thing-stock-exh...
Used: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1955746
 
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