German made

jamsha71 Slammed & Awesome Dubber

88 posts · joined Oct 2008 · 30 Dec 2009, 1:32 am

#754581

I've got a quick question for those history buffs.

How common are German made 1969 Beetles in Australia?

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Sides Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined May 2007 · 30 Dec 2009, 6:50 am

#754585

69 was a weird year for VW's here... for most (all ?) of the year the factory wasn't actually "building" any, but was instead assembling cars from "Complete Knock Down" kits that came from Germany. Partly because of it being a changeover year, and partly because of the Aust Govt. playing silly buggers with the "Australian Content" rules to the extent that VW was considering closing the factory down permanently.

So basically any 69 Beetle is very likely to be a German, and if it is (or used to be) a Semi-Auto then it'll DEFINITELY be a German. A whole heap of ways you can tell, but the compliance plate in spare wheel well saying 'Volkswagenwerke AG" is the giveaway.

Don't know the exact number of CKD's that came in during 68/69 - have a book that'd have the number and will check tonite, but I'd expect could be as many as 10,000 or so.

Why... you lookin at getting one ??? 68/69/70 beetles are a pretty good model to have...

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71-BEETLE-SEDAN AKA Josh

1,058 posts · joined Mar 2009 · 30 Dec 2009, 6:14 pm

#754689

When did they start making semi autos in aus?

Sides Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined May 2007 · 30 Dec 2009, 9:25 pm

#754730

My book is a bit vague on the details, but basically Australian production of Beetles had stopped by December 1967 and they just assembled what parts were left.

CKD assembly started in March 1968, with 6,433 beetles produced for the year out of 13,684 VW cars total (Beetle + Type 2 + Type 3 + Country Buggy)

Doesn't seem to have a hard Beetle assembly figures for later years, but has 14,472 total for 1969 and 17,104 for 1970.

There's actually no mention of semi-auto's being produced in Aus at all - just that "about 500 to 600" were brought in from Germany for 1968/69.

Clear as mud I reckon....

🤪

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cam070 Custom Title Time!

1,332 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 30 Dec 2009, 10:57 pm

#754751

Sides wrote:69 was a weird year for VW's here... for most (all ?) of the year the factory wasn't actually "building" any, but was instead assembling cars from "Complete Knock Down" kits that came from Germany. Partly because of it being a changeover year, and partly because of the Aust Govt. playing silly buggers with the "Australian Content" rules to the extent that VW was considering closing the factory down permanently.

So basically any 69 Beetle is very likely to be a German, and if it is (or used to be) a Semi-Auto then it'll DEFINITELY be a German. A whole heap of ways you can tell, but the compliance plate in spare wheel well saying 'Volkswagenwerke AG" is the giveaway.

Don't know the exact number of CKD's that came in during 68/69 - have a book that'd have the number and will check tonite, but I'd expect could be as many as 10,000 or so.

Why... you lookin at getting one ??? 68/69/70 beetles are a pretty good model to have...

Why are the 68/69/70 models so desirable?

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 30 Dec 2009, 11:28 pm

#754758

71-BEETLE-SEDAN wrote:When did they start making semi autos in aus?

ALL semi auto beetles were made in Germany...

and the 1968 automatic model was the first to have the IRS rear suspension that the Supers had later on...

1968-69-70 beetles all had the torsion bar front suspension and Disc brakes... 12 volts.. 1500 engines..

LEE

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colonel mustard Son of Jim - Creator of Good

2,829 posts · joined Feb 2009 · 30 Dec 2009, 11:41 pm

#754764

I personally don't know why you would bother with a semi auto for the IRS when you could have the far superior mcpherson strut front end, hey Lee?

cam070 Custom Title Time!

1,332 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 30 Dec 2009, 11:44 pm

#754767

68AutoBug wrote:
71-BEETLE-SEDAN wrote:When did they start making semi autos in aus?

ALL semi auto beetles were made in Germany...

and the 1968 automatic model was the first to have the IRS rear suspension that the Supers had later on...

1968-69-70 beetles all had the torsion bar front suspension and Disc brakes... 12 volts.. 1500 engines..

LEE

Is that the same set up as the 70's standard Beetles but with the 1600tp motor?

jamsha71 Slammed & Awesome Dubber

88 posts · joined Oct 2008 · 31 Dec 2009, 12:44 am

#754772

Hey Sides, thanks for that info.

My next bug project (once my son's Beetle on the road) is a 69 Beetle which does have "Volkswagenwerk AG" on the compliance plate. It also has "Made in Germany", just to be sure.🙂

It's very much a four-speed manual, not a semi-auto. So does this make it a CKD assembled in Australia, or a fully assembled import? It doesn't have an AS engine number.

I guess I'm just curious. I picked her up for a bargain price and although there's some work to do she idles nicely after a fuel pump clean out and once over of the carby.

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vw54 Administrator Always Waiting 4 Friday

16,723 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 31 Dec 2009, 6:44 am

#754793

heres a semi auto if your looking for one

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=80724&page=1#pid752724

I read it on FACEBOOK so it must be true

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=91278&page=1#pid848630

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=63561&page=1#pid624099

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=4832&page=1#pid452603

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=60650&page=1#pid574409

Sides Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined May 2007 · 31 Dec 2009, 7:22 am

#754797

colonel mustard wrote:I personally don't know why you would bother with a semi auto for the IRS when you could have the far superior mcpherson strut front end, hey Lee?

Yeah, see not everyone thinks that the strut front end are superior... hell, even Volkswagen dropped the strut cars and went back to building Ball Joint beam cars in 1975 !!!

Beam cars possibly don't drive as nice, and yes a strut car gives more options for tuning for circuit work, but it's also a lot more expensive to maintain or modify. Beam front ends are definitely stronger and you can still get some decent handling out of 'em... anyone noticed how almost all Beetles that get used in Hillclimb are Ball Joint beam and IRS ???

cam070 wrote:Why are the 68/69/70 models so desirable?

68/69/70 I think are popular because they're closer to the normal Beetle shape... don't have the fat-chick look of a Super of an L... but still have most of the mod-cons from a Super but without the struts. Things like 12V electrics, upright headlights, tombstone tail lights, fresh air ventilation (but no stoopid leaky vents at the rear window), better heater control, front disc brakes, collapsible column, better gear shift position, vented engine lid (1970 Australian) etc etc.

For me personally I think the 1500 Beetle is the nicest looking model Beetle... especially with the twin vent engine lid... only one that comes close (for me) would be an Oval

😉

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Sides Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined May 2007 · 31 Dec 2009, 7:36 am

#754804

jamsha71 wrote:Hey Sides, thanks for that info.

My next bug project (once my son's Beetle on the road) is a 69 Beetle which does have "Volkswagenwerk AG" on the compliance plate. It also has "Made in Germany", just to be sure.🙂

It's very much a four-speed manual, not a semi-auto. So does this make it a CKD assembled in Australia, or a fully assembled import? It doesn't have an AS engine number.

Hey no worries.

Hard to tell really, but as far as I know CKD cars were still marked somewhere with either Volkswagen Australia or Motor Producers Limited... possibly on a second compliance plate.

Someone told me once that the wipers are a giveaway also... German assembled cars had wipers secured to the shaft with a little grub screw, while CKD and Australian cars have a big nut that goes onto the shaft directly on top of the arm. The claim was that the wiper assy was part of the 5% that had to be locally sourced, but never been able to prove that one tho...

A 69 beetle done up nicely or even given a stock resto willl be a very nice ride.

👍

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colonel mustard Son of Jim - Creator of Good

2,829 posts · joined Feb 2009 · 31 Dec 2009, 9:52 am

#754832

Sides, I was just poking fun at Leé.

What I really think though - is that beams are stronger, but struts are more tuneable with far less effort (but not cost).

From my personal experiance/perspective - the super setup handles better for my driving. 🙂

pod i`ve got to finish this thing one day

4,980 posts · joined Dec 2003 · 31 Dec 2009, 10:37 am

#754842

well the wiper bit sounds right, as my 69 semi auto has the grub screw thing and they are a pain as they come loose every now and again🥲

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Sides Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined May 2007 · 31 Dec 2009, 11:50 am

#754851

Heh - no worries Col Mustard - I'm always keen to talk about the differences between 'em I guess !!! I've only ever owned beam cars, but seeing how much room STIDUB has up the front of his, hmmm... maybe one day...

😉

The wiper thing pod... the 69 German manual I used to own had wiper arms with the big nut, same as my 70 Australian... but the 68 (German) semi-auto I owned had the grub screws...

Haven't seen any other original 69 manual cars, so don't know if it's a true difference between the CKD and German cars, or if my 69 manual just had a different wiper mech put in at some point !!!

One of those little mysteries I guess... would love to know the answer...

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'60 KG Coupe - resto kinda started
01 New Beetle - gf's car, but I turn the spanners

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 1 Jan 2010, 12:40 am

#754910

colonel mustard wrote:I personally don't know why you would bother with a semi auto for the IRS when you could have the far superior mcpherson strut front end, hey Lee?

Hi

McPherson struts are fine on Lancers and Suzuki swifts.. lol

but I choose the Torsion bar front suspension... for a beetle...

as they are stronger etc... IMHO..

although We don't have the major rust problems as in the UK where the struts can fall out due to rust... in the body....

Rust in chassis is also bad over there with front shock towers on torsion bar beetles also rusting out...

cheers

LEE

PS: We All have Our opinions.. lol

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68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 1 Jan 2010, 12:46 am

#754911

Yes,
My 68 auto beetle has the grub screws...
As far as i know , it was only on German made 68 beetles.
it was a carry over from the German made 67 beetles...

the 69 beetles had the Nut holding the wiper arms on , the same as all the later beetles.. [from memory]

the small shafts etc are also used, as I was thinking of replacing mine with a later wiper assembly, when I was restoring My beetle, but the holes were too small..
so, I never did change it over. although I still have the wiper assembly with the nuts .. lol..

Lee

Sides wrote:The wiper thing pod... the 69 German manual I used to own had wiper arms with the big nut, same as my 70 Australian... but the 68 (German) semi-auto I owned had the grub screws...

Haven't seen any other original 69 manual cars, so don't know if it's a true difference between the CKD and German cars, or if my 69 manual just had a different wiper mech put in at some point !!!

One of those little mysteries I guess... would love to know the answer...

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jamsha71 Slammed & Awesome Dubber

88 posts · joined Oct 2008 · 2 Jan 2010, 12:03 am

#755096

Ahhh, well the wiper arm theory is an interesting one. My 69 Beetle has flats on the shafts and grub screws on the arms.

No second "Aussie made" compliance plate either, so I guess it's a fairly safe bet that she's been assembled in Germany...or maybe not?😏

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Sides Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined May 2007 · 2 Jan 2010, 9:28 am

#755132

Something else I've just thought of is the glass... pretty sure CKD cars got Aussie glass put in 'em...

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Sides Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined May 2007 · 2 Jan 2010, 9:33 pm

#755260

IN2VWS wrote:These figures are actual production figures, and does not include full imports.

What about CKD's ???

This history stuff can get really interesting hey... wouldn't it be cool if someone who actually worked there those years could pipe up...

VWDCQ vice pres & web dude - vwdcqinc.org.au
Join a car club - get car peeps

My toys
'70 Hillclimb Bug 'Jezebel' w/- Haltech EFI - http://bit.ly/VwTNtQ
'60 KG Coupe - resto kinda started
01 New Beetle - gf's car, but I turn the spanners