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 grinderman
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| posted on June 20th, 2013 at 08:47 PM |
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V8 is dead
Just flicking through local car mag (wheels i think) having a read about new vf dunnydore and I spot an interesting test with this so called 'world
class" car comparing the 6.2lt V8 calais vs 4.0lt turbo six G6E foulcan, hemi V8 chrysler 300 and just for the hell of it an Audi A6 3.Olt V6 turbo
diesel. Understandably the Audi had the best interior by far and also the most refinement but suprisingly the comparibly tiny twin turbo A6 left those
knuckle dragging V8s in its diesel dust. One figure had me spellbound ......13.2 second quarter mile . Holy shit it smoked those big suckers and I
didnt see a economy figure but I'm guessing the heavy luxo Audi might win that comparo too! Downside was price difference but I would have one diesel
Audi over 2 chev powered holdens anyday.
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waveman1500
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| posted on June 20th, 2013 at 11:28 PM |
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As you say, double the price at least for the German machine. And who needs that much power anyway?
The Commodore is world class, if you can show me a better large car for $35,000 that will do what a Commodore does then you are doing well. It will
tow over 2 tonnes, will reliably do big mileage, has low servicing costs, amazing fuel consumption for the size and weight of the vehicle (with the
V6) and they are very quick for their price range too. All that and you get dual-zone climate control, colour touch screen radio, parking sensors,
rear-view camera, auto-park assist and just about all the electronic bells and whistles under the sun on the VF base model! For $35 grand! Put all
those options on a Golf and it will cost more than that.
Now, compare that to a BMW with similar size, features and power. You need at least a 528i with a few option packs, which will set you back north of
$100 grand. The BMW is a different class of vehicle, obviously, but for three times the price it would have to be!
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 helbus
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 12:00 AM |
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Need a few facts.
Holdens are not Chev powered. They are GM Drivetrain powered
V8's naturally aspirated compared to a V6 turbo is very different
V8 engine in power, harmonic vibration, torque dynamics is better than V6.
The V6 advantage is the shape , size and production costs and to enable front wheel drive
The ultimate in engines is the V12 second is the inline 6. Look up the engineering profiles on these engines. Their major drawbacks are the size and
the limitations for front wheel drive or East West engine configuration as most front wheel drive cars are.
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donn
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 06:04 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by waveman1500
As you say, double the price at least for the German machine. And who needs that much power anyway?
The Commodore is world class, if you can show me a better large car for $35,000 that will do what a Commodore does then you are doing well. It will
tow over 2 tonnes, will reliably do big mileage, has low servicing costs, amazing fuel consumption for the size and weight of the vehicle (with the
V6) and they are very quick for their price range too. All that and you get dual-zone climate control, colour touch screen radio, parking sensors,
rear-view camera, auto-park assist and just about all the electronic bells and whistles under the sun on the VF base model! For $35 grand! Put all
those options on a Golf and it will cost more than that.
Now, compare that to a BMW with similar size, features and power. You need at least a 528i with a few option packs, which will set you back north of
$100 grand. The BMW is a different class of vehicle, obviously, but for three times the price it would have to be!
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I dream of a day when a chicken can cross a road without being asked for it's motive!
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AA003
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 06:34 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by helbus
Need a few facts.
The V6 advantage is the shape , size and production costs and to enable front wheel drive
Look up the engineering profiles on these engines. Their major drawbacks are the size and the limitations for front wheel drive or East West engine
configuration as most front wheel drive cars are.
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The Audi is 4WD and north south engine.
I read it on samba, so it must be correct.
Sometimes Volkswagen dealers sell spare parts. Amazing isn't it!
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HappyDaze
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 06:50 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by AA003
| Quote: | Originally
posted by helbus
Need a few facts.
The V6 advantage is the shape , size and production costs and to enable front wheel drive
Look up the engineering profiles on these engines. Their major drawbacks are the size and the limitations for front wheel drive or East West engine
configuration as most front wheel drive cars are.
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The Audi is 4WD and north south engine.
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So is my new Landcruiser......AND IT'S A V8 [turbo Diesel].
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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Klaus
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 12:04 PM |
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why pay 35k now when in 4 yrs it will be worth $3500
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grinderman
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 04:58 PM |
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The Calais in question was $55,000 so it may be worth $5,500 in 4 years In all seriousness its an illusion that people have, that bigger is better. With 230kw and 650nm of torque from 1450 rpm it just shows that maybe a
3 litre engine is all you need. Plus 6.4lt/100km average economy for a large heavy all wheel drive car is something to think about. A V8 TD cruiser
would have to be chipped and exhausted to match that power and please dont start about how 'stressed' the little engine must be............old wives
tales crap. German efficiency wins again.
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waveman1500
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 05:34 PM |
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If you want to spend $120 grand on a car, then by all means go your hardest. Personally I would rather get the Commodore SV6 for $35k (or a used one
for $20k) and not have to pay a mortgage repayment for something which depreciates like a bucket of prawns in the sun.
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wolfgang54
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 07:53 PM |
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people not wanting V8's!!!
what are you guys going to do next... swap scone recipes????
1954 Beetle
2003 Beetle 2.0
2004 Turbo Beetle 1.8
2007 Touareg tdi (retired)
2009 Pajero Tdi Shorty (retired)
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1973 P76
Wish list:
Porsche 550
zooey deschanel
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tweety
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 08:28 PM |
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beg to disagree with owning V8's. I am in my late 50's, run my own business so have many tax deductions like on fuel and still cant afford to run a
V8.
Never could afford one in fact. In the 70's some mates had the Monaro's and Falcons and spent half their pay on fuel. But they loved them so much
they wouldnt budge on them. Fair enough. But I suggest that under 20,000 kms a year an average worker could afford one. Lets do some quick maths.
At 20,000kms a year a V8 getting 14l/100kms would cost say $4200 a year of $85 a week. In comparison a Hyundai i30 turbo diesel (I own one) gets 5.5
L/100kms. Fuel cost over 20,000kms would be $1650 a year. I'm economy biased so I'm already thinking about the 2 and a half grand difference and
what I'd do with it lol.
But consider someone driving 80,000kms a year? a difference of $10,000. It is now getting serious in savings.
The modern bonus is that the turbo diesels are not loafers. My i30 steams along wonderfully, eats hills and does it all under 3000 rpm, revving it
more is being silly. I've now done 230,000kms in 4 years a saving of around $28,000 over a V8. Put in perspective its $20 a day or a free meal for
two people daily or a new car every 4 years.
Thats why I could never justify a V8. Even if I only travelled 20,000 kms a year. Its also why I cant justify my trike getting 14l/100kms so the
supercharger will be swapped for EFI shortly. I just dont like burning money.
So the V8 is dead? wouldnt bother me personally.
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vlad01
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 09:22 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Klaus
why pay 35k now when in 4 yrs it will be worth $3500
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haha I wish, make that 20+ for that price.
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vlad01
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| posted on June 21st, 2013 at 09:34 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by helbus
Need a few facts.
Holdens are not Chev powered. They are GM Drivetrain powered
V8's naturally aspirated compared to a V6 turbo is very different
V8 engine in power, harmonic vibration, torque dynamics is better than V6.
The V6 advantage is the shape , size and production costs and to enable front wheel drive
The ultimate in engines is the V12 second is the inline 6. Look up the engineering profiles on these engines. Their major drawbacks are the size and
the limitations for front wheel drive or East West engine configuration as most front wheel drive cars are.
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I thought flat 6 was considered best from engineering point of view?
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE |
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AA003
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 07:26 AM |
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This is a bit of a bogans vs enthusiasts thread.
I read it on samba, so it must be correct.
Sometimes Volkswagen dealers sell spare parts. Amazing isn't it!
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Klaus
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 08:30 AM |
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Rather be a bogan than a try hard hipster with no talent haha
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vlad01
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 09:10 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Klaus
Rather be a bogan than a try hard hipster with no talent haha
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haha Zing!
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE |
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nils
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 03:48 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by wolfgang54
people not wanting V8's!!!
what are you guys going to do next... swap scone recipes????
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Quit calling rust patina
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grinderman
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 05:21 PM |
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HAHA what are you talking about? Hipsters only ride pushbikes of the 'fixie' variety. And if they have to drive it would be an electric car. When
holden goes the same way as ford (not if,but when) will bogans then drive BMWs and Mercs because they will be the only V8 rear wheel drive
combination? or
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vlad01
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| posted on June 22nd, 2013 at 07:38 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by grinderman
HAHA what are you talking about? Hipsters only ride pushbikes of the 'fixie' variety. And if they have to drive it would be an electric car. When
holden goes the same way as ford (not if,but when) will bogans then drive BMWs and Mercs because they will be the only V8 rear wheel drive
combination?or
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or maybe the LS1 conversions will overtake and become the norm?
anyway, I know (knew, he is dead now) a bogan that had BMWs and drove them like a bogan.
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LIFE IN THE LOW LANE
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 10:33 AM |
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Who cares about V8's when I have a big block VW? V8 style torque with half the capacity and half the cylinders and fuel consumption lol
[size=4] ACCEPT THAT SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE PIDGEON AND SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE STATUE[/size]
Alder Outlaws VW Racing - check it out on fb!!
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AA003
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 10:54 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by LIFE IN THE LOW LANE
Who cares about V8's?
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The Bogans!
In NSW we have the Bogan triangle. The Illawarra, the central coast and the western suburbs.
I read it on samba, so it must be correct.
Sometimes Volkswagen dealers sell spare parts. Amazing isn't it!
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Dirty Den
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 04:53 PM |
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The Bogan Triangle!
Well speak for yourself buttercup.
I got a Beetle (Juice) and a Vespa (Pam) call em the V-Twins and between em they havent got 8 cylinders. |
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helbus
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 05:40 PM |
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In Melbourne we have the Bogan belt
Goes from Greensborough around through Eltham, Ringwood, Boronia, Ferntree Gully, Doveton, Dandenong and all the way to Frankston
Then ther is the short belt in the Western Sububs Altona, Sunshine, St Albans
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grinderman
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 06:03 PM |
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We've got the great bogan divide. It runs from Ipswich to Gatton and because it is a low socio-economic area most of the falcadores are only six
cylinder models anyway, but they do have FPV and HSV (who'd want one) stickers. But once you get up the range to toowoomba then the rednecks take
over and if you have to ask what a '5 poster' is than you wouldn't understand...............
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esevwbits
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 07:05 PM |
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commodores are shit.
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ian.mezz
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 07:42 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by esevwbits
commodores are shit.
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all cars are made to wear out, so you always have to buy a new one to keep the car makers in business because that's what they make their money on is
selling new cars .
Its just that commodores wear out a bit faster 
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ian.mezz
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 07:44 PM |
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oh and a five cylinder motor is supposed to be the best
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Snap Crackle Bang
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| posted on June 23rd, 2013 at 08:29 PM |
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A 7 cylinder would be even better than a 5, but no-one makes one. The beauty of an odd number of cylinders is the total kinetic energy of the pistons
and conrods does not change by very much over the cycle.
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shaven
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| posted on June 24th, 2013 at 01:20 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by AA003
The Bogans!
In NSW we have the Bogan triangle. The Illawarra, the central coast and the western suburbs.
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After living there in the 80's & 90's... This made me laugh ... ALOT
| Quote: | Originally
posted by esevwbits
commodores are shit.
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YES
I love V8's... watching, driving or racing. Both my VW engines are well about spec... I drive'em ... then I just fill them up
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vlad01
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| posted on June 24th, 2013 at 06:29 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Snap Crackle Bang
A 7 cylinder would be even better than a 5, but no-one makes one. The beauty of an odd number of cylinders is the total kinetic energy of the pistons
and conrods does not change by very much over the cycle.
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so they are perfectly balanced?
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE |
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