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 landfall
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| posted on August 26th, 2014 at 02:11 PM |
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Narrowing the Beam BJ
Just starting to tackle the fitting of adjusters and narrowing the beam on my 1976 BJ Beetle.
Comparing the torsion leaves that I have taken out of the standard beam with the 2"' narrow ones supplied, I find that in actual fact the 2" ones
are 13/4" (45mm) narrower?
I now assume that I will only be cutting 45mm out of my beam?
Am I correct in this assumption? Or have I missed something.
Thanks for any assistance.
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 matberry
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| posted on August 26th, 2014 at 04:51 PM |
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Measure twice and cut once....the only set of "purchased" narrowed leaves I have dealt with are useless unless going even narrower as they were
different side to side and created all sorts of drame. I shorten og sets to get the right but definately need to be careful, esp. with B/J as the
dimples aren't all on the same side of the pack
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psimitar
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| posted on August 26th, 2014 at 10:55 PM |
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Yea, as Matt says you are better off narrowing the OE leaves cos you can't guarantee that the torsion arm grub screw locating dimples will be in the
correct position to pull the arms snug against the beam seals.
When I did mine I made the dimples a few mm closer in from the dry fitted position to ensure the arms weren't a loose fit against the beam seals 
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hellbugged
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| posted on August 27th, 2014 at 05:34 AM |
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Can you compare the length between the dimples on the narrowed leaves and standard.... A few calculations later find your needed narrowing amount.?
Sounds like you best compare center to ends between the two as well
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landfall
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| posted on August 27th, 2014 at 08:00 AM |
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Thanks for the advice, some good tips to go on.
Because of previous mods by PO I was reluctant to disassemble the front end without having replacement parts in my hand, therefore the purchase of
shortened leaves.
Even still. I am guessing the angle of the upper beam installation (see photo for previous mods).
The only advantage I now have is that I have a spare pair of leaves in the event of a stuff up.
Any tips on the correct angle of the upper leaves appreciated, so far I am just going to copy the lower unmodified ones.
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matberry
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| posted on August 27th, 2014 at 08:10 AM |
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yep, same as lower tube is as good as it gets
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
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landfall
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| posted on August 27th, 2014 at 09:43 AM |
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Thanks Matt,
The dimples on the narrowed leaves appear to be in the same position as the originals.
Keeping everything crossed for a simple job.
So far it's been a p*^#k of a job.
I would like to murder the person who worked on this car.
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psimitar
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| posted on August 27th, 2014 at 11:43 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by landfall
Thanks Matt,
The dimples on the narrowed leaves appear to be in the same position as the originals.
Keeping everything crossed for a simple job.
So far it's been a p*^#k of a job.
I would like to murder the person who worked on this car.
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and I'd like to murder the business that 'repaired' the bodywork on mine. I've seen monkeys do a better job. Was gonna say professional but that
word needs deleting from the dictionary due to the amount of cowboys that hide behind that word these days 
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Smiley
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| posted on August 28th, 2014 at 07:29 PM |
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Maybe this will be of some help to you?
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=78783&page=1
Smiley
If you said I was a Volkswagen man, you'd be right.
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vwo60
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| posted on August 29th, 2014 at 10:32 AM |
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I hope that with the standard of the welding shown in the photo you will reweld the top beam also. it looks that the weld was put on with a spoon with
no penitration at all.
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DakDak67
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| posted on August 29th, 2014 at 02:39 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by vwo60
I hope that with the standard of the welding shown in the photo you will reweld the top beam also. it looks that the weld was put on with a spoon with
no penitration at all.
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WOW, another non relevant comment in a "Narrowed beam thread" . Are you really that bored?
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landfall
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| posted on August 29th, 2014 at 05:28 PM |
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When I cleared the muck off the top beam and saw those welds it was a case of "must fix immediately."
I am a fairly competent welder but even so I will be taking the whole beam to a professional and having him TIG weld the adjusters. beam carriers and
repair any work as necessary.
Thanks for the link, it has been a great help.
Most of the work has been completed. I elected to make sleeves to insert and keep things straight and strong.
Will tack weld it all together then refit it to the car. take accurate measurements to get the wheels centre both sides (they were off centre) check
height adjustments, etc. then off to the professional for the final welding job.
Paint all components, fit drop spindles, cut steering rods and a wheel alignment. Then move on to the next phase.
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Boozo
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| posted on August 29th, 2014 at 09:10 PM |
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good luck. narrowed beams FTW!!!
It will never be good enough for that man.
[size=4] '59 or Kombi?....feeling confused [/size]
'59 bug
'68 bug
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psimitar
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| posted on August 29th, 2014 at 10:15 PM |
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Don't forget to shorten only the RHD thread side of the track rods unless you have a LHD M14 tap to hand
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vwo60
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| posted on August 30th, 2014 at 06:47 AM |
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That is the exact reason why accidents happen, I commented on the welding not the beam, it is funny how it is totally revelent to the post, just the
narrowed beam deciples just do not get it, as the guy in WA found out.
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psimitar
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| posted on August 30th, 2014 at 06:12 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by vwo60
That is the exact reason why accidents happen, I commented on the welding not the beam, it is funny how it is totally revelent to the post, just the
narrowed beam deciples just do not get it, as the guy in WA found out.
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Yup, crap welding will result in you front suspension parting company from your vehicle when you least expect it.
So always remember to have suspension welding done by a competent or coded welder. Tis your funeral otherwise.
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Governor
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| posted on August 30th, 2014 at 07:50 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by DakDak67
| Quote: | Originally
posted by vwo60
I hope that with the standard of the welding shown in the photo you will reweld the top beam also. it looks that the weld was put on with a spoon with
no penitration at all.
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WOW, another non relevant comment in a "Narrowed beam thread" . Are you really that bored?
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I thought it was extremely relevant, its a safety issue due to the state of the welding, nothing to do with how narrowed it is, didn't see that
mentioned at all!!
I believe your post was the first non relevant one!
And this is another.
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DakDak67
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| posted on August 30th, 2014 at 08:21 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Governor
| Quote: | Originally
posted by DakDak67
| Quote: | Originally
posted by vwo60
I hope that with the standard of the welding shown in the photo you will reweld the top beam also. it looks that the weld was put on with a spoon with
no penitration at all.
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WOW, another non relevant comment in a "Narrowed beam thread" . Are you really that bored?
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I thought it was extremely relevant, its a safety issue due to the state of the welding, nothing to do with how narrowed it is, didn't see that
mentioned at all!!
I believe your post was the first non relevant one!
And this is another.
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Oh really? how do you or anyone else know how that beam is welded? did you xray it? how do you know it hasn't just been secondary
welded ..badly. I'm sick of seeing shit canning of every Narrow beam thread. Everyone's an expert.
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Boozo
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| posted on August 30th, 2014 at 10:07 PM |
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when I was 14 I had a bush basher baja, with dodgy cut and welded front beam. It coped years of abuse, never broke, even bent the bulkhead itself due
to running out of brakes and I had no idea what I was doing with a welder. for a beam weld to break it would have to be a seriously bad weld.
Having said that a good welder and someone who knows what they're doing should be a no brainer for any form of street regoed car.
[size=4] '59 or Kombi?....feeling confused [/size]
'59 bug
'68 bug
'82 import T3 BUS. aircooled
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Boozo
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| posted on August 30th, 2014 at 10:09 PM |
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I'd also be more concerned for the leaves......seeing as only 1 set is actually turned.
[size=4] '59 or Kombi?....feeling confused [/size]
'59 bug
'68 bug
'82 import T3 BUS. aircooled
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landfall
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| posted on August 30th, 2014 at 10:20 PM |
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Exactly why I purchased a new set of pre-narrowed ones. Not only does my life depend on the quality of this job, but so does yours and every other
road user.
When the job is completed, if there is any doubt at all about safety, I will purchase another standard beam and revert to standard.
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vwo60
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| posted on August 31st, 2014 at 06:45 AM |
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Governor, the car should not be on the road with welds like that, i work in engineering in the oil and gas industry and am involved in welding code
and proceddures every day, it is typical to see people who know nothing about welding to comment, as long as you are prepaired to take responsability
for the outcome of modifications like this that can cause an accident thats fine, like the guy in jail in WA.
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HappyDaze
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| posted on August 31st, 2014 at 07:48 AM |
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You really open a big 'can of worms' when you try to turn an old Beetle into something it was never intended to be......I know.
All the components have a small percentage of 'over-design', but when major changes are made to suspensions, it can far exceed the original limits
of some parts. A lot of thought and research should go into any modification, before rushing in.....it may save big trouble later on.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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landfall
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| posted on August 31st, 2014 at 08:04 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by HappyDaze
You really open a big 'can of worms' when you try to turn an old Beetle into something it was never intended to be......I know.
All the components have a small percentage of 'over-design', but when major changes are made to suspensions, it can far exceed the original limits
of some parts. A lot of thought and research should go into any modification, before rushing in.....it may save big trouble later on.
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Before rushing in??
This modification is being done to undo the terrible work that has been done to this vehicle to make it safe. I expect the job to take at least three
weeks because every step of the way is being checked and rechecked. I have carefully researched it, purchased the suspension mods book recommended by
members of this site, talked to VW experts/specialist and still am.
The final step is that the car will be taken to a mechanic who specialises in preparing race car suspensions for fine tuning.
Can you explain where I have "rushed in?"
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hellbugged
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| posted on August 31st, 2014 at 08:43 AM |
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Im sure Greg is just generalizing rather than pointing the finger at you 
It's clear you are cleaning up the issues the car came with
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HappyDaze
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| posted on August 31st, 2014 at 11:58 AM |
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Daimo is correct....I wasn't 'pointing the finger' at anyone. Perhaps I should have used the word 'One', instead of 'You'.
Just pointing out that one needs to take care when one starts modifying things. 
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
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landfall
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| posted on August 31st, 2014 at 04:20 PM |
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Thanks Greg, I could not agree more.
When I had our workshop many years ago, I used to get young bucks coming in and asking for a big increase in engine performance.
I used to make a point of telling them if they wanted to beat their mates to a certain place then the best mods to do this was handling and stopping.
Don't rush in to engine mods or any other mods without thinking it through.
Plus recognise your own weaknesses and strengths, don't get out your depth. Something the PO has obviously done in many areas.
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 helbus
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| posted on August 31st, 2014 at 07:06 PM |
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When I got engineers reports (VASS in Victoria) which use the VSB14 guidlines. I have had every vehicle checked for track width. This is measured
from centre to centre of tyre. I have been within the 25mm change allowed. So legally and within Registration, Roadworthiness, Engineers reports and
insurance, I am covered. Two times I have been questioned by Police on the road, and they have been satisfied with the paperwork presented. Therefore
I can only recommend you get an Engineers report in your state to facilitate the convenience, safety, legality and insurance coverage that you and as
you would expect other cars and drivers on the road to have.
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landfall
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| posted on September 1st, 2014 at 03:50 PM |
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Getting the measurements to correct the offset of the beam.
Made up the jig up against the outside of each mudguard tp find the centre of the vehicle. Before the LH wheel was proud of the mudguard by 22mm and
the RH wheel was 7mm proud, offset 15mm.
Everything tack welded together, checked and rechecked, including fitting all the components. Stripped back down and off to the welders tomorrow.
Getting there and feeling a great deal of satisfaction that at long last I will get a decent ride.
Thanks to everyone who has encouraged me and helped.
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bugmaniaar
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| posted on September 1st, 2014 at 05:14 PM |
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