| [ Total Views: 2434 | Total Replies: 18 | Thread Id: 107541 ] |
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 57 oval
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| posted on November 1st, 2014 at 05:56 PM |
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rak and pinion steering
Does any one know if you can convert the steering box type of steering on a 74 beetle to the rack and pinion type off of a later bettle.? If anyone
has done it I would love to have a chat.
Cheers
RJ
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 helbus
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| posted on November 1st, 2014 at 06:37 PM |
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As far as I know, it cannot be done, the bodies are different.
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ian.mezz
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| posted on November 1st, 2014 at 07:43 PM |
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buggy ones
http://www.dansperformanceparts.com/buggy/susp/buggysusp%20rack&pinion.htm
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silver
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| posted on November 1st, 2014 at 07:57 PM |
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Not street legal though
Keeping it real !
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karmann141
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| posted on November 1st, 2014 at 09:01 PM |
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Yes it can be done but you'll need a 75 L Bug rack. There's plenty of info out there on how to do it - just have to search.
I copied this a while ago but can't remember the source, but this is the guts of it.
"I fiited r & p to my 72 Superbug, it was a lot of work but I feel it was worth doing.
A few tips:
1 Take accurate measurements from the donor car
2 You will need to remove a brace from below the spare wheel well.
3 I needed to dimple the chassis to clear the rack, either use a 75 or later pan, dimple the pan or cut out the section and weld in a 1/2 circle
section.
4 I needed to slighty dimple the body to clear the steering coupling.
5 I made up my own captive nuts to hold the rack onto the rails and just cut a slit in the inner guard and slipped it in and then welded up the
hole.
6 Learn to drive your car again, the steering is that sharp."
Will post link if I find it again.
1961 K Ghia - Porsche 5 sp, EJ20T, Brembo's, Dble A arm susp
1974 L Bug - Porsche 944 brakes, Boxster 16's
1974 Bay Camper - EJ20, twin radiators, Boxster 16x7's
Half Beetle trailer with Boxster 16x7's
2011 Tiguan TDI 4Motion
2010 LR Discovery 4 TDV
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Joel
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| posted on November 1st, 2014 at 10:15 PM |
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That would be SteveCs old yellow Sbug but 75Lbug racks only work in Lbugs and Sbugs, not standard torsion bar bugs.
Because Supers tierods steer from the front of the spindle and beam bugs steer from the rear you would end up with Irish steering using an Lbug
rack.
turn left it will steer right.
From memory the done thing in Europe is Mk1 Golf/Polo racks.
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Subarugears
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| posted on November 2nd, 2014 at 07:49 AM |
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I am currently doing a steering rack conversion on my buggy build. It uses a Daewoo / G.M. centre steer rack which eliminates/minimises bump steer.
In order to use it, I am creating a pair of billet aluminium mounts that allow you to simply bolt it to any front beam.
There is also a manufactured 'reverser' that moves the tierod bolt location to the 'correct' side of the rack for use in a beetle.
This type of conversion has been done a number of times by various individuals before me, with brackets welded onto the front beam.
It has been engineer approved on their cars as it uses a manufacturers rack and pinion instead of an unproven aftermarket one.
The result has been vastly improved steering response and effort.
I'll post some pictures up over the next few weeks once the first brackets arrive and we fit everything up to the beam.
If the price of the pieces is reasonable to manufacture, I may look at offering them commercially as a kit - giving people an option to go to an
engineer-approvable, bolt-on, rack and pinion conversion.
Here's a quick screengrab of the design which is almost done.
The red tubes are the torsion bars.
The "D" is what holds the rack and is adjustable so you can dial out bump steer according to your suspension travel.
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cnfabo
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| posted on November 2nd, 2014 at 08:01 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Subarugears
I am currently doing a steering rack conversion on my buggy build. It uses a Daewoo / G.M. centre steer rack which eliminates/minimises bump steer.
In order to use it, I am creating a pair of billet aluminium mounts that allow you to simply bolt it to any front beam.
There is also a manufactured 'reverser' that moves the tierod bolt location to the 'correct' side of the rack for use in a beetle.
This type of conversion has been done a number of times by various individuals before me, with brackets welded onto the front beam.
It has been engineer approved on their cars as it uses a manufacturers rack and pinion instead of an unproven aftermarket one.
The result has been vastly improved steering response and effort.
I'll post some pictures up over the next few weeks once the first brackets arrive and we fit everything up to the beam.
If the price of the pieces is reasonable to manufacture, I may look at offering them commercially as a kit - giving people an option to go to an
engineer-approvable, bolt-on, rack and pinion conversion.
Here's a quick screengrab of the design which is almost done.
The red tubes are the torsion bars.
The "D" is what holds the rack and is adjustable so you can dial out bump steer according to your suspension travel.
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I would be interested in the brackets only for my race car if the price is fair.....
Fabo...
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nbturbo
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| posted on November 2nd, 2014 at 08:18 PM |
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He wants to swap the recirculating ball box from his Fat Chick with a rack steering from another Fat Chick
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Joel
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| posted on November 2nd, 2014 at 09:22 PM |
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They may both be fatchicks but there is a big difference in the steering between a Beetle and a Superbug.
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Subarugears
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| posted on November 2nd, 2014 at 09:34 PM |
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I think he means the Daewoo fat chick. Lanos. Ugly as.
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nbturbo
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| posted on November 3rd, 2014 at 05:33 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Joel
They may both be fatchicks but there is a big difference in the steering between a Beetle and a Superbug.
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I don't get the difference then- I thought everything with McPherson strut front end was a Superbug,but there was a model of Superbug with the big
curved windscreen, but still a Superbug.It thought these big windscreen models were nicknamed the Fatchick because of the screen.Will have to get both
steering types along side each other to check out the differences.
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57 oval
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| posted on November 3rd, 2014 at 05:59 AM |
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Thanks NB yes they are both curved screen beetles, both strut front end about 8 months between production dates. One has a steering box the other Rack
and pinion. The only difference I can see to date with out stripping the cars is there is a brace that goes under the fuel tank from one side to the
other, looks easy enough to get off. Reason behind the steering change is I occassionly get horrific steering wobble, there is no pattern to it , you
can try to make it do it and it wont, it may happen once today then not again for a week or it may happen three times in a row. Wheel bearings,
balance and steering knuckles are all good. Reading a few posts it seems to point at possible steering box so hoping the conversion will fix it. And
before we get the smart arses with the all the struts are shit etc, each to there own, boys thanks to those above that have replied
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Joel
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| posted on November 3rd, 2014 at 06:02 AM |
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Anything with struts is a superbug regardless of flat or curved windscreen.
when 57oval said he wants to put R&P in a beetle not a Superbug we can all only assume he means a torsion bar front end.
Just a terminology mixup, fatchick just means any late model VW, can mean strut or torsion bar bugs, put a baywindow next to a split and you'll see
why its not just beetles.
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Joel
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| posted on November 3rd, 2014 at 06:08 AM |
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Ok so its a Superbug not a beetle, all good.
you can do the swap but theres a bit of work in, its a body off to do it properly if you dont want to cut out your spare wheel well to clearance the
frame head.
That wobble you are experiencing is the Super shimmies.
swapping to rack wont get rid of it, its not in the steering.
Have a read of the sticky about it, fairly easy to fix
http://www.superbeetlesonly.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=1298
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vwo60
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| posted on November 3rd, 2014 at 06:28 AM |
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Just as karmann141 stated in his post, he already has done the research and I checked the vehicle out with him, not such a large job, just attention
to detail.
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Joel
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| posted on November 3rd, 2014 at 09:35 AM |
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I've got all the bits here to do mine, the biggest part of the job is clearancing the frame head.
rack cars have a deeper frame head to clear the rack, you either need to cut out the spare wheel for access then weld it back in or take the body
off.
The brace just removes with a few spot welds drilled out.
I'm going to use nutserts to mount mine.
You need both steering shafts too, both are different lengths on rack cars.
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modnrod
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| posted on November 3rd, 2014 at 03:31 PM |
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I've got all the R&P stuff at home to do my '73, but to be honest I also have my steer box apart now to inspect, check, clean, tinker, etc.
I don't mind the steering box if it's halfway OK, and since I intend to only ever run 165R15 or 185R15 tyres and soft comfy shocks, I figure there
can't be all THAT much difference between the two (we're not talking 195/60R14 Advans and Volks TE37 rims here after all.........).
Seems to me a lot of work for little gain in my application perhaps? 
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Uber Kafer
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| posted on November 5th, 2014 at 04:49 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by modnrod
...
Seems to me a lot of work for little gain in my application perhaps?
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Well, its quite an improvement on the earlier Superbug steering. I would recommend doing a test drive with a rack & pinion Superbug.
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