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 bugsy
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 posted on March 30th, 2005 at 11:16 PM |
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buggy engine
hey all,
i was jus curious if anyone knew specific engine power and torque of a 1915 cc? d engine in my buggy is supposedly only a 1600 which i dunno yet but
dun think itll b anythin impressive. so i was jus curious if theres much difference between the two in a drastic sense or would it jus b feasible to
look at a subaru conversion if im gonna b forkin out money?
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VWCOOL
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| posted on March 31st, 2005 at 10:46 AM |
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eeekk.. how long is a piece of string? Typical 1916cc with Kadrons and not-too-stupid cam has around 90hp at the tyres
Pay your debts, CxxT
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RISKY^VW
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| posted on March 31st, 2005 at 06:48 PM |
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yeah u can get about 2X the hp output at about 3 -4 X the price!
for that big go water cooled
http://www.austech.info/forums
The best tech forum around
oh sgetty will you respect me in the morning
things could be worse you could live in kentucky
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bugsy
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| posted on March 31st, 2005 at 09:55 PM |
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hmm is 90 hp at the tyres alot for a buggy? i mean it dun sound like much but i hav no clue on how these things go, like if u were to compare it wit
say between an excel and a wrx which would it be closer to?
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MUD BASHING ANYONE ??
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| posted on April 2nd, 2005 at 12:17 AM |
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90hp at the treads is a fair bit in a buggy it would really get up an move and no pipes or that stuff that leaks out all the time what do you call it
the stuff you wash your car with ahhh thats it water :vader
You only need two tools
Wd40 if it don't move and it should
Duct tape if it move's and it shouldn't
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VWCOOL
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| posted on April 2nd, 2005 at 09:26 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by RISKY^VW
yeah u can get about 2X the hp output at about 3 -4 X the price!
for that big go water cooled
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lol... yeah, I have a choice: a 350kW-plus, 383ci (6.3-litre) stroker injected Holden V8 for my Senator, or an air-cooled 'Stan Steroids' 1916cc for
my Bug to replace the 'baby' 1916 I already have. Guess what I'm getting?!
Water-cooled's cool, but air cooled is cooler :P
Pay your debts, CxxT
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VWCOOL
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| posted on April 2nd, 2005 at 09:27 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by bugsy
hmm is 90 hp at the tyres alot for a buggy? i mean it dun sound like much but i hav no clue on how these things go, like if u were to compare it wit
say between an excel and a wrx which would it be closer to?
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WRX
Pay your debts, CxxT
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bigbaja
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| posted on April 2nd, 2005 at 02:31 PM |
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water has got to be better since they dont make aircooled any more
but every thing has water in it now
bang for buck water wins every time no argument
[size=4] Terry - Custom Off RoadComponents[/size]
28 Hayward Street, Stafford QLD 4053
Ph: (07) 3356 4356 - Fax: (07) 3356 6765 |
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MUD BASHING ANYONE ??
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| posted on April 2nd, 2005 at 03:08 PM |
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If you like water go for a swim me air for ever unless i get out of dubs but that wont happen. Even if i was going to put a water bottle in my engine
bay it would never be a subie or anything else 4cyl i dont see the point you are taking a old worn out 4cyl out and replaceing it with another one
thats half worn out and you have no back ground history it may not even go and has been sitting in a recking yard for how ever long in the rain no
thanks. In my bug i would never put somthing water cooled all you need is one stick one tree root and its all over call the tow truck even if there
more reliable how long are they going to go with a broken off sump and i stick through a water hose ??
You only need two tools
Wd40 if it don't move and it should
Duct tape if it move's and it shouldn't
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VWCOOL
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| posted on April 2nd, 2005 at 03:16 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by bigbaja
water has got to be better since they dont make aircooled any more
but every thing has water in it now
bang for buck water wins every time no argument
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yeah I agree.... but then it's not a VW any more:P
Pay your debts, CxxT
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bugsy
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| posted on April 2nd, 2005 at 11:19 PM |
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thanx for d info ppl! d 1916 sounds pretty damn good. So wat would u reckon it costs to get someone to do it. i kno noone can gimme an exact figure
but ballpark would b great
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Brad
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| posted on April 3rd, 2005 at 10:41 PM |
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mmmm
| Quote: | Originally
posted by MUD BASHING ANYONE ??
If you like water go for a swim me air for ever unless i get out of dubs but that wont happen. Even if i was going to put a water bottle in my engine
bay it would never be a subie or anything else 4cyl i dont see the point you are taking a old worn out 4cyl out and replaceing it with another one
thats half worn out and you have no back ground history it may not even go and has been sitting in a recking yard for how ever long in the rain no
thanks. In my bug i would never put somthing water cooled all you need is one stick one tree root and its all over call the tow truck even if there
more reliable how long are they going to go with a broken off sump and i stick through a water hose ??
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What a silly thing to say ... 4WD are water cooled and go much harder off road than your bug ever would.
If built correctly a Water cooled car will not have any of the week points you mention.
As for not knowing the history ???WTF ??? you have no idea what your VW engine has been up to..
As for modifying and it not being VW ???? VW never made a baja, buggy, baja bus etc etc it just depends where you want to draw the line.
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MickH
A.k.a.: Michael Hutchinson
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| posted on April 3rd, 2005 at 10:49 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by bugsy
thanx for d info ppl! d 1916 sounds pretty damn good. So wat would u reckon it costs to get someone to do it. i kno noone can gimme an exact figure
but ballpark would b great
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I can sell you my 1916 injected Pobjoy engine if ya want it for your buggy. Engine has new valves and pistons/cylinders. Has a Weber 48mm quad
throttle body injection and since all put together has done less than 1000km. The injection alone cost over $6000 (have reciepts) $8500 and it is all
yours delivered to Brisbane. Subaru is better.:thumb
tssnq.com.au
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Andy42
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| posted on April 3rd, 2005 at 10:57 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by MUD BASHING ANYONE ??
If you like water go for a swim me air for ever unless i get out of dubs but that wont happen. Even if i was going to put a water bottle in my engine
bay it would never be a subie or anything else 4cyl i dont see the point you are taking a old worn out 4cyl out and replaceing it with another one
thats half worn out and you have no back ground history it may not even go and has been sitting in a recking yard for how ever long in the rain no
thanks. In my bug i would never put somthing water cooled all you need is one stick one tree root and its all over call the tow truck even if there
more reliable how long are they going to go with a broken off sump and i stick through a water hose ??
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Yeh must be why all the rally cars use aircooled motors hey. NOT..
A buggy is no longer a vw so why pretend it is.
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Boozer
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 12:28 AM |
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owee. this is getting nasty.
THe MC Bat Commander's motto: "Never do now, what you could do for 24 hours straight, all night, the night before."
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MikeM
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 09:14 AM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Andy42
A buggy is no longer a VW so why pretend it is.
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This is a VW forum yeah? Lets not get to carried away. Buggies owe allot to VW suspension and geometry.
[Edited on 3/4/2005 by MikeM]
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Andy42
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 01:59 PM |
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I did not say they do not use a lot of Vw gear but I still stand by the Fact they Are not a VW made item and as such who cares what brand bits you use
in them as they have no factory base model to go by. You can always stick to your VW motor if you wish. But even you are planing to use teh subi
motor and not a VW motor.
This is the joy of a buggy you can use whatever you wish to try to adapt to them or if you want to stay with the tried and tested ideas you can do
that as well.
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MikeM
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 02:34 PM |
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I agree there is very little VW left in my buggy. The Body is gone, the floorpan cut in half, floor replaced with sheet, after market bushes,
bearings, seals, subaru motor, kombi gearbox with all after market gears etc etc.
When you get right down to it the only thing VW left on my buggy is the torsion bar suspension, 1/10th of the original floorpan, and a kombi gearbox
outer shell.
But I still think of it as a VW derivative. The VW scene is where buggies seem to fit in the world of cars. and I like taking my buggy to VW shows. I
don't want the VW guys to think "A buggy is no longer a vw so why pretend it is. " So don't come to our shows any more. Cuz that would suck.
So I'm not arguing with you, I agree that at the end of the day you can do whatever you like to your buggy, or any VW for that matter.
I'm not pretending my buggy is a VW, but It will still be a VW derivative.
MUD BASHING ANYONE ?? You underestimate the power of the dark side. In time you will understand, it is ... inevitable.
Go for a drive is Baja Wes' V6 Baja and you'll know what I'm on about.
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wibble
A.k.a.: Warren Way
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 05:19 PM |
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aawwwww group hug time!!
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MikeM
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 05:24 PM |
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Yeah group hug. It's been one of those days, and I'm over it.
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bugsy
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 08:16 PM |
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hey everyone sounds good wat everyones throwin out with ideas, but seems like a 1916 is gonna cost alot of money. i was sorta hopin that maybe i
could get some bang within a 2-3k range. i mean the 1916 for 8500 im sure would go hard as but haha im a uni student so funds for me r strict.
does anyone kno wat the cost of turbo'ing would be? or a relatively cheap solution for power at all?
thanx heaps
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MUD BASHING ANYONE ??
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 09:02 PM |
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Oh hi brad its amazing how you jump out from behind your rock when somone starts saying bad things about subies and yes 4wds are water cooled but
there were desinged to be and there are no or very little water hoses in danger but you cant hide them that well in a buggie when water pipes go from
back to front with a radiator sitting out in the open up front and remember one stick and your walking dude! or i could tow you with mine.
Mike m i agree no one knows manxs as subie beach buggies or what ever there a vw beach buggie and based on genuie vw stuff and i agree wes v6 would
have some serious go in there and why would you wast your time with a stinken subie motor when you could have that i dont see the point maybe i cant
see it but i build cars for off road not to take to the drags on the weekend and the most offroad action it will see is getting up your drive way,
sorry if i pissed anyone off im just specking my mind
You only need two tools
Wd40 if it don't move and it should
Duct tape if it move's and it shouldn't
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MickH
A.k.a.: Michael Hutchinson
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 09:28 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by MUD BASHING ANYONE ??
Oh hi brad its amazing how you jump out from behind your rock when somone starts saying bad things about subies and yes 4wds are water cooled but
there were desinged to be and there are no or very little water hoses in danger but you cant hide them that well in a buggie when water pipes go from
back to front with a radiator sitting out in the open up front and remember one stick and your walking dude! or i could tow you with mine.
Mike m i agree no one knows manxs as subie beach buggies or what ever there a vw beach buggie and based on genuie vw stuff and i agree wes v6 would
have some serious go in there and why would you wast your time with a stinken subie motor when you could have that i dont see the point maybe i cant
see it but i build cars for off road not to take to the drags on the weekend and the most offroad action it will see is getting up your drive way,
sorry if i pissed anyone off im just specking my mind
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It's fine to speak you're mind and everyone will have their own opinion....but you realy need to learn how to spell and to respect other peoples
opinions. I've always had VW powered cars...in fact our family had one of the first 6 delivered to Australia.I've owned a few offroad VW cars that
actually go offroad not just up driveways and they were VW powered. Unfortunately when it comes to bang for buck a water cooled engine is a cost
effective alternative to a VW engine for both reliability and power,regardless of the brand of engine. Radiator hoses seldom get sticks poked through
them when they are run through the inside of the car and the motor has decent bash plates. If radiators are protected well enough they are fine up the
front of a buggy. I've seen a few 4 wheel drives with branches and star pickets through the radiators and engine covers. At least in a buggy the
engine is out the back and protected. I see some relevance in what you are saying but dont share your point of veiw. Each to their own:thumb
Hey BUGSY...what is your location???might be able to help you out..
[Edited on 4/4/2005 by Mick H]
tssnq.com.au
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Andy42
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 09:46 PM |
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Ok this is a good indication of why either the v6 or the subi is a good choice for water cooled. As torque is what it is all about in offroad cars it
is plain to see the facts.
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helterskelter400
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 10:12 PM |
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i still like the warm fuzzy feeling i get when i'm up the end of the track/beach with a 40 year old car, technology and bits totalling $2000, while
the 100 series owners are worried their 32x11.5s wont get them home and whether the scratches will buff out or need some paint, or else they've
already turned around 'cause its too much to risk...
oh yea, its also about a real lack of $$$ for me. if my poxy old 1600 wont get me out at 3 pound, i'll have a bit of a dig and let it down to 2
pound. if that dont work, its exponential traction at 1 pound. with no valves in tyres it'll paddle through powder (try it youself, you'll get
goosebumps when its off the clutch). when this motor goes, i'll see my freindy neighbouhood vw feind and redo a bitsa.
if i wanted and could afford something to do the canning & beyond, i'd strip and rebuild. this would be the time to consider a scooby donk.
otherwise, they'd be more use in bay kombis chukking lazy laps of this wide brown land.
:thumb
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bugsy
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| posted on April 4th, 2005 at 11:32 PM |
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hey mick H im in sydney down near campbelltown. im tryin to put a new engine in my car an i was thinkin eitha a 1916, turboin the 1600 i got or goin
for subaru power. suby would b d best specially if i could turbo dat
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MUD BASHING ANYONE ??
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| posted on April 5th, 2005 at 06:43 PM |
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Im going to leave it here and say bring it out my style offroading not hard sand or the sanding quater and well see how good these really are as i
have seen these motors offroad and i will be sweet so see you all in the bush if you can get there bye
You only need two tools
Wd40 if it don't move and it should
Duct tape if it move's and it shouldn't
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ratbug
A.k.a.: Andrew Todd
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aka toddy101
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| posted on April 5th, 2005 at 06:56 PM |
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Just wondering if your aiming for a mostly offroad, or onroad buggy? My subi powered buggy is a little pocket rocket on the road, has more go than my
turbo laser running 15psi boost and other mods! But... comparing it to other vw powered buggies on the beach, it's no better, the extra power is
ruined by wheelspin and extra weight.
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J&SBlue
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| posted on April 6th, 2005 at 02:16 PM |
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Well said Ratbug.
I think most people need to put more effort into suspension, tyres and setup of the car and less into trying to make it a rocket offroad.
I have gone from a oil ozzing standard 1600 SP to a 1835 TP motor. On the dunes, the 1835 makes a fair bit of difference in getting up the harder
dunes. But, offroad, on dirt/mud tracks and hills, it has made no difference.
Some people seem to be more concerned about how much power of how big there motor is, rather than how good the car is at doing what you want it to
do.
Just my 2 cents....now with inflation down to 1 1/2...
Mark.
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Andy42
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| posted on April 6th, 2005 at 04:25 PM |
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I think for beach use just about any motor will do. This was proved when we did the manx club run with the red rocket zooming about. Was either a 1300
or 1600 and standard as. The same for moderate off road. But if you saw where some of the guys like wes, brad, dyno, mud bashing go and quite a few
others I reckon it does not matter if you use water or air cooled you need heaps of torque and to try and keep the revs down . That is why with the
aircooled guys they like the type 4s and strokers. Otherwise you have to attact everything with a shit load of revs so you can get up it. Then again
that always looks impressive for the bystanders :P
As for the aircooled Vs water cooled that is something that I suspect will never see agreement by both sides.
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