| [ Total Views: 513 | Total Replies: 8 | Thread Id: 47330 ] |
|
|
 DIY-DUB
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1591
Threads: 288
Registered: April 4th, 2004
Member Is Offline
Location: Ipswich
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on December 27th, 2005 at 10:44 PM |
|
|
Roll cages
Ok heres a question for all the caged people and people that know about them, heres the situation...
Fabricating skills, check
Metal work general know how, check
studied lots of different designs, check
pondered the rules and regulations relating to both racing and road sides of the story, check
the question still remains, could i legally build my own cage BY MYSELF and still have it passed by transport authorities etc and scrutineering @
races etc?
|
|
|
Dasdubber
A.k.a.: Alan Agyik
23 Windows of Awesome
DAS Resto Haus
Posts: 5746
Threads: 289
Registered: August 26th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Gold Coast
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue
Mood: feeling fine...
|
| posted on December 28th, 2005 at 07:14 AM |
|
|
That's a good question and one which I hope someone will be able to provide a definite answer to. I had my cage built by Custom Offroad and therefore
certified by an engineer - apart from visual inspection I am not sure what other tests someone would have to do if you were to build it yourself -
you'd still have to pay an engineer to sign off on it ultimately, so maybe talking to an automotive engineer would be a good starting point.
Also you have to be sure that you would trust your welding skills in the event you rolled your beetle and the cage was the only thing between keeping
your neck intact or not. I can weld pretty well but for safety related aspects prefer to leave it up to the pros - I am not discouraging you by the
way....just making sure that aspect has been "checked" by you too.
|
|
|
jvl054
Wolfsburg Wizard
Posts: 403
Threads: 11
Registered: May 28th, 2005
Member Is Offline
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: pure tubular adrenalin subiepower
|
| posted on December 28th, 2005 at 09:40 AM |
|
|
Cams specify that if you are racing your car that it must be done by a Professional cage builder.All cages or approved cages are now, must have a tag
or stamped for approval.You may have it approved by RTA but i know Cams have there rules and are alot tougher.Ring Cams and find out who is your local
Cams Scrutineer, this way before heading to a track it can be approved if the job is done right.Cams srutineer will exspect on the spot before track
day......My question to you is do you know what a ROPS form is? ....This must be filled in with all specified diagrams and sizes of cage
tubing.....JVLRacing
|
|
|
DIY-DUB
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1591
Threads: 288
Registered: April 4th, 2004
Member Is Offline
Location: Ipswich
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on December 28th, 2005 at 11:07 AM |
|
|
thank you both very much for the advice.
|
|
|
bat69
Insano Dub Head
There is no status
Posts: 791
Threads: 84
Registered: April 12th, 2005
Member Is Offline
Location: Newcastle
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: I'm EXCITED!
|
| posted on December 28th, 2005 at 06:34 PM |
|
|
Yes CAMS allows you to build your own cage provided it is built to their specs. i.e steel quality/grade/diameter, correct possition of bars and cross
brace etc. When you go to log book the car (all cars which compete in cams open events needs a log book e.g. basically state events, but not always
the case) you need to fill the rops and the specs of the cage. You sign your life away saying the cage is built to the specs you say. Before you run
at your first event a scrutineer must sign off on it as compling with the regs. Provided you have the skills etc there is nothing stopping you from
building your own cage.
As far as regos go for QL I dont know. I hope that helps.
White Knuckle Racing Team
"Drive it like dirt"
|
|
|
DIY-DUB
Custom Title Time!
Posts: 1591
Threads: 288
Registered: April 4th, 2004
Member Is Offline
Location: Ipswich
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on December 28th, 2005 at 09:15 PM |
|
|
yep, any help and advice on the matter is much appreciated, im able to make one but im wondering if my idea is a possiblity to have it given the tick
by both trasnport authorities AND cams etc scrutineering...
|
|
|
Brad
Wolfsburg Elder
Posts: 3764
Threads: 332
Registered: August 24th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: SE QLD, Mt Nebo
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Manx Buggy Building
|
| posted on December 28th, 2005 at 10:12 PM |
|
|
In answer to your question ....
If you have a weld cert number and sign on the dotted line then I can't see you will have any issues in getting your cage complianced by a DoT
approved inspector. If you don't have a weld cert number then you will need to find the engineer you are going to use and make sure he is happy with
a visual inspection of your work prior to paint and clean up, or if he wants other forms of testing.
In queensland an internal cage does not need to be complianced unless you need to move the seat belt mounts into it to stop them fowling and it does
not interfear with you getting into and out of the vehicle. The LH8 only really covers bars which need to be complianced due to seat belts, this is
not the same with CAMS.
The big question you need to ask is how much is it going to save you by building your own cage ?? As a guide to build a 4 point roll cage in a bug you
could use the following:
6 m of tube - say $100
2 x cone locks to join rear braces - Say $100
16 x m10 grade 8.8 bolts, washers and cone lock or nyloc nuts say $20
2 x 7/16 threaded seat belts sleevs or similiar - say $25
8 x 150 x 75 x 6mm plates with 4 holes in each - say $20
1 L or etch primer and 1L of top coat or powder coat at around $150
Eng Cert - $88 - $220 depending on where you go
CAMS cert .. depends on where you go
So materials for a 4 pt would be around say the $500 mark
Then their is time .. I estimate around 6 - 8 hrs when it is all said and done.
Then you need to get the tube bent unless you can do it yourself in which case ... cool.
Oh also to get a DoT tage you will probably need new retractable seatbelts fitted.
The as already said you are putting your neck on the line which is fine until you sell the car or let someone else drive it. If you build your own
cage and it ever fails due to manufacture fault then you are liable, sad but true.
To compare a 4 pt fitted is around $1100 mark depending on the state of the bug and a few other issues, but that will give you a guide.
I hope that helps you out. I see quite a few owner built cages, some are works of art, others are just accidents waiting to happen. If you are keen
and have the time I would say go for it. If you do decide to build your own, buy a copy of the code or practise and find an engineer before you start.
|
|
|
Brad
Wolfsburg Elder
Posts: 3764
Threads: 332
Registered: August 24th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: SE QLD, Mt Nebo
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Manx Buggy Building
|
| posted on December 28th, 2005 at 10:12 PM |
|
|
Oh and also CAMS has just changed their rules yet again about cages so make sure any info you use is up to date ...
|
|
|
tassupervee
A.k.a.: Knob Jockey
Custom Title Time!
That really hurts doesnt it!
Posts: 1171
Threads: 25
Registered: September 21st, 2003
Member Is Offline
Location: Huon Valley SouthernTasmania
Theme: UltimaBB Psyche Blue
Mood: Moody!
|
| posted on December 29th, 2005 at 12:18 PM |
|
|
To comly with the cams side of things, you need to have the latest book of rules and regulations Schedule J-Rollover Protection.
All of the drawings and engineering data are in there including specifications for all, removeable joints, mountings and tube spec and bend radius.
If the cage is built to these specifications, you can apply for Cams Homolagation.
If you follow the rules in there along with drawings, you should be sweet for competition.
However, if you want to build your cage differently, then you need to submit your specifications and designs including the results of testing the cage
to Cams for individual cage homolagation.
You really dont want to do this.....really, really dont!
There are bend radiuses to consider (tube ceterline radius to be at least 3 times the tube diameter), minimum tube diameter and wall thickness. Method
of attachment of removeable members and so-on blah.
Always submit a detailed drawing of the proposed cage along with attachment methods, tube specifications and so-on to cams for initial approval before
going ahead with your cage.
It may save a shiteload of drama later on if specifications change, which they do on a regular basis.
if it all passes muster with cams, you can sign off on a Cams Rollover Protection Homologation certificate detailing dimensions, methos of
attachments, design pecularities and a declaration that the structure can withstand the forces as noted in the cams regulations.
Sounds like fun eh?
Now whether this cage complies with transport requirements is another story and Brad knows a shitload more about that than I!!
Best of luck M8
L8tr
E
Im not a complete idiot, quite a few parts are missing....
|
|
|
