| [ Total Views: 3734 | Total Replies: 24 | Thread Id: 78552 ] |
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 scooby split
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| posted on August 22nd, 2009 at 06:00 AM |
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subaru in auto split
Hi folks
here's my splitty converted to auto with a type 3 VW Variant automatic gear box i have a subaru 2 lt engine im going to put in the bus my question is
will the auto box handle aprox 135 bhp of subaru power without blowing
cheers phil
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urban_myth
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| posted on August 22nd, 2009 at 11:26 AM |
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i run the same box behind a v6 3.8ltre without any problems in a late model bay window kombi. iput extra clutch plates and changed the band lining to
kevla material.there are no super diffs for the boxs so i just spaced up the spider gears with extra shims.you can adjust the length the gears hold
through the grub screw in the middle of the vacuum module.ihave raced my van on the 1/4 mile under full power stalling up to 3000rpm on the line and
running consistent times off 15.7secs i have done about 20 runs without probs.
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scooby split
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| posted on August 22nd, 2009 at 06:53 PM |
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Hi urban myth
i have had a bay auto too and i did concider fitting a bay auto box to my split but there wasn't enough room, the variant type 3 auto box is smaller
but even so it pushed my old aircooled 2 inches further back i only just managed to get the rear vallence bolted up
so do you think this box will be as strong as a bay auto box and can i up grade it to take the extra power, were can i get the parts to do it, im in
the UK and have never taken an automatic apart before so i wish you lived closer
i dont think there are too many people over here who now much about these old boxes but im willing to have a go if i can get the parts 
cheers phil
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urban_myth
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| posted on August 22nd, 2009 at 08:36 PM |
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hi .yes i feel this box willbe strong enough.i have fitted this box to a splitty before when fitting aporsche engine.we removed the cradle an moved
the box forward to within 5mm of the torsion tube.it also took me awhile to find an automatic specialst who would do thework compently.i am not good
on the auto sidec but can do the diff.the diff ratio in the type 3 box is 3.65 where the bay box varies from 4.8 to4.11.i also have used both of the
boxs and have found them both good the type 3 box is lighter and the diff is easier to work on being in a cradle off its own.changing the line
pressure and adding the extra clutches will make a difference.the torque convertor stall as per standard is 2500rpm so unless you go to a 6 cylinder
engine will be fine. you can also fit needle bearings in the convertor instead of the brass bushes.this creates less friction but needs to be done by
a torque convertor specialst.i am currently having made a convertor with a centrifugal lock up plate which will lock the convertor up at about 60 to
80khm lessening any slippage. you usually lose between 15 to 30% drive through the the convertor. hope this helps.geoff
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scooby split
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| posted on August 23rd, 2009 at 06:04 PM |
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Hi Geoff
yes the box in my bus is also as close to the torsion tube as i can get it and it would have made things much easier to work on if i had removed the
cradle but it's so clean and orignal under there i cant bring my self to chop it out
thanks for all the good tips im going to have to find some one that knows there auto's over here that i can trust
any way im going to get a vangon-subaru adapter from kennedy in the states so i thought i might fit a bus torque converter too my box if it will fit
on, the type 3 converter has a nipple in the middle that fits in to the gland nut on the flexi plate im sure the kennedy adapter has no gland nut so
do you think i can get away with fitting the bus converter to get round this problem ?
cheers phil
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nbturbo
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| posted on August 23rd, 2009 at 06:29 PM |
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The Type3 and the Bus use the same 003 auto trans-but the diff sections are the difference-as stated the final drive ratios are way different and the
Bus diff is so heavy with an all cast iron housing.They both use a spigot to locate the convertor in the gland nut in the Type 3, or the crank in the
Bus.I have a Type 4 motor on a Type3 auto in my Oval Beetle and I am building a Beetle Drag Car with the Bus auto and an Autocraft motor.Redrilling a
Type3 flexplate to line up with the 8 crank dowells for the Autocraft, and just punch out the spigot bearing from the gland nut.On both cars I had to
cut into the torsion bar tube to get the trans far enough forward and to fabricate a compact front mount.
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seagull
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| posted on August 24th, 2009 at 12:58 AM |
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You can mod the auto by fitting an extra clutch pack & have the plate lightband ground , it will snap through the gears
I had the converter fully serviced on my trike when the auto was rebuilt
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seagull
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| posted on August 24th, 2009 at 01:01 AM |
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O I made my adapter plate & drive hub my self , how ever the drive hub is not easy to machine . It uses the stock Vw flex plate
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scooby split
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| posted on August 24th, 2009 at 06:41 PM |
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Hi folks some great info
nbturbo i remember chatting to you on the automatic register im automatic samba on there i have a pick of the modifed gear box mount if you still need
it
well ive had a look at my old vangon flexi plate and theres no gland nut type fitting for the spigot to fit in to so i may have to adapt the kennedy
adapter plate unless i can fit the vangon torque converter to my box?
Hi segull have you any picks of your adapter plate to see how to get round this problem would i just fit the gland nut to the kennedy plate i dont
think i would be up to makeing my own plate we i havent got the tools
cheers phil
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scooby split
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| posted on August 25th, 2009 at 02:54 AM |
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Hi folks im going to have to sort out an adapter plate soon i've gone beyond the point of no return and ruined a good subaru
ive got all the loom out now so its time to work out how to bolt the subaru to the vw any one got any ideas ?
cheers phil
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nbturbo
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| posted on August 25th, 2009 at 08:14 PM |
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I know who you are now-good to hear from you again.If the Vanagon had a Type4 engine-then the spigot on the convertor actually fits into the end of
the crankshaft.I haven't had anything to do with a Suby conversion yet-but I would imagine that the adaptor kit would already have that taken care
of-whether they just make a knock in bush for the end of the Suby crank,or something that goes under the OG flywheel mounting bolts.Seagull would be a
great help here because I know he has done this conversion many times.
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scooby split
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| posted on August 25th, 2009 at 09:36 PM |
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Hi nb
how's the splitty coming on ?
and yes your right ive just pushed the flexi plate on the torque converter and it fits i just got it wrong when looking at my two flexi plates the
hole looked too small in the vangon plate and much larger in the type 3 plate i'll put my glasses on next time
seagull
so i should be good to go with the kennedy adapter plate ?
i just hope i can bolt that rear vallance back on ive been doing some measuring and it's going to be a tight fit ,the adapter plate will push the
engine even further back so i could do with having the front pully cut down to allow more room for the vallance,does it need to be this deep as im
only running the alternator off it and would this cause any problems with the running of the engine ?
any way this would be the last resort it still might fit
cheers phil
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seagull
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| posted on August 29th, 2009 at 10:29 PM |
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Hi Phil , I have just got back from QLD
You will need the full Kennedy kit for this as it has all the parts you need.
by te way were are you ?
also are you going to throw away a good gen 2 liberty ? Cry ( I have one of these )
also have a look at the ign barrel , black wire to the key is the theft wire ( you need to get this section right when you wire it )
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warb
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| posted on August 30th, 2009 at 10:11 PM |
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cool, what kinda splitty is that?, i notice the belly pans and drivers side rear door hinges.. early double door panel?.. or LHD 23?..
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scooby split
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| posted on August 31st, 2009 at 01:43 AM |
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Here you go warb
yes its 23, it was a lhd untill i converted it to rhd
seagull
i'll get the keneddy kit orderd pronto
im over here in the UK and im hoping to sell the rest of the car to help fund the rest of the project
thanks for the advice with the wireing
cheers phil
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nbturbo
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| posted on August 31st, 2009 at 08:39 PM |
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Phil-that pic would look just right for a VW calender.
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scooby split
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| posted on October 17th, 2009 at 03:19 AM |
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automatic uprating
thanks nb
that pick was taken on a camp site in germany on the way to bad camberg
well ive been busy the adapter plate is on its way from kennady in the states the wiring is nearly done and ive sold the rest of the subaru now its
time to have the gear box sorted out this is what ive posted in the type 3 section so if any one in this section can give me any advise it would be
most appreciated
im having my type 3 automatic gear box uprated to handle a subaru engine the guy say's he wil mig weld all the vains in the torque converter and fit
a stronger stator
he will fit a 4 planetary gear to replace the stock 3 gear planetary and fit bigger clutches will this be enough to handle 145 BHP or is there other
things i should be asking him to do?
ihope you can help i dont know much about these gear boxes and i can only afford to do this once so i dont want to be ripped off
the 2 boxes i have have different markings on them whats the difference between the boxes and which would be the best one to have modified
oh forgot to say this auto box is going in my splitty thats why i need the extra power
cheers phil
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Joels72Lowlight
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| posted on October 17th, 2009 at 07:36 AM |
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Where are you putting the radiator?
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mackaymanx
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| posted on October 17th, 2009 at 07:59 AM |
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You need the code located on the web on the diff, this will tell you which box you have.
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scooby split
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| posted on October 17th, 2009 at 08:28 AM |
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Hi joels
the radiators going underneath between the front of the belly pans and the back of the front beam, im going to fit an mazda RX7 rad it just fits nice
between the chasy rails and is designed to fit flat i could then run the coolant pipes through the old heater tube so no pipes would be seen well
thats the plan any way, i will now for sure when i get all the parts to do it
mackamanx
Doooooo wrong code
i'll have a look tomorrow and post some new pic's its getting late over here now so thanks for the info
cheers phil
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1303Steve
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| posted on October 17th, 2009 at 08:43 AM |
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Hi
Nice work. Is it possible to fit a cooler for the ATF on these transmissions? I think that would help it survive.
Steve
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mackaymanx
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| posted on October 17th, 2009 at 11:56 AM |
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No fitting an oil cooler is not possible without major mods. Have a kombi auto in a buggy built presently and we are planning to use the subi power
steering pump to circulate atf from the pan through a cooler.
You can use the kombi auto sections (1700/1800 not 2L)with the type 3 diff sections if you want, they are beefier.
Codes
Type 3 EA,EB,EJ
Type 4 EC,EE,EF,EH
Type 2 NA,NB,NC,ND
I don't have details for code with me presently
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scooby split
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| posted on October 17th, 2009 at 09:30 PM |
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Hi ive had another look and the numbers are
EA13033
EJ0257321
and the one thats in the bus at the moment is
EA0196553
the first two are my spairs but are untested, the one in the bus has been checked over and had a new cog set fitted before it went in
so i thought i would use one of the first two as their going to be stripped and have new parts fitted, or perhaps make one good one from the two
any way any info would be most welcome
cheers phil
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seagull
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| posted on October 18th, 2009 at 12:02 AM |
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Phil , just a little tip. replace the converter seal before you fit the motor. You can fit two seals in there back to back.
you can also light band grind the clutch pack disks & fit another clutch pack in there, besure he drills extra oiling holes in the planetarys so
they dont bind up.
also phil , are you sure this is not a 2.2 ltr / 2.5 ltr ? look just behind the alternator there is motor size is stamped there
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scooby split
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| posted on October 18th, 2009 at 02:27 AM |
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Hi seagull
yes i will fit 2 seals would it be worth packing between the seals with grease as the outer seal would be running dry and wear out ?
light band grind? i did say to him it would be possible to fit 2 clutches in if the spacer between them was machined down but he said we dont do it
like that we fit bigger clutches is that really possible to do?
i will also have him drill the extra oil holes for the planetrays to stop them binding
the guy seems too know what he is talking about i hope do you think the mods he's going to do are ok to handle the extra power ok?
and yes its an EJ20 2ltr series 2 with 80.000 miles on
cheers phil
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