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 Craig S
A.k.a.: Craig
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 posted on January 31st, 2011 at 08:59 PM |
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TAFE course for Vehicle Restoration
As per my member's ride thread, I gave myself a goal this year of learning how to weld and do some basic metal fabrication. Nothing fancy, just so I
can do some of my own rust repairs, fix simple things and so on.
It's fair to suggest that my level of knowledge and experience is nil, and that it's lucky I know which end of a screwdriver to pick up.
So I went scooting around the TAFE web site and found the following course:
http://www.nsi.tafensw.edu.au/Courses/CourseDetail.aspx?num=23424&sem=S1/...
Does anyone know of anyone that has done this?
Does anyone have any other recommendations??
I'm keen to learn, but $1,400 is a lot of money (although is obviously cheap for 72 hours of lessons).
All thoughts and ideas greatfully received.
Cheers
Craig
1969 Beetle - June
1974 L Bug - Gwendolyn
2002 Bora V6 4Motion - Anita
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65standard
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| posted on January 31st, 2011 at 09:17 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by Craig S
As per my member's ride thread, I gave myself a goal this year of learning how to weld and do some basic metal fabrication. Nothing fancy, just so I
can do some of my own rust repairs, fix simple things and so on.
It's fair to suggest that my level of knowledge and experience is nil, and that it's lucky I know which end of a screwdriver to pick up.
So I went scooting around the TAFE web site and found the following course:
http://www.nsi.tafensw.edu.au/Courses/CourseDetail.aspx?num=23424&sem=S1/...
Does anyone know of anyone that has done this?
Does anyone have any other recommendations??
I'm keen to learn, but $1,400 is a lot of money (although is obviously cheap for 72 hours of lessons).
All thoughts and ideas greatfully received.
Cheers
Craig
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Not having done this, but I would think that the $1,400 spent on the course could go toward your restoration (in the edumacation side of things) and
could very well end up costing a lot less than having someone else to do it for you and you have gained extra knowledge and possibly some extra
skills.
Just a thought though.
[size=4]If it ain't broke, fix it till it is![/size]
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waveman1500
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| posted on January 31st, 2011 at 09:28 PM |
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If you don't have the required tools then I'd spend your $1400 on those first. Once you have a decent welder, grinder and some hammers then you can
always practice, but if you blow all your money on a course instead then it won't get your car fixed!
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vlad01
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| posted on January 31st, 2011 at 09:49 PM |
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yes buy tools first learn after. But don't be put off if its hard and your shit, just keep practicing.
I bought my self a tig welder and 70% of the gear needed to start welding and i have a real good idea of how to weld already even though I haven't
used a tig yet.
Find good youtube channels and website to learn from, books are good to.
i will start you off.
go to http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/
superscribe to his youtube channel. Dam his videos are good. 
there is a good channel on youtube on a car body restoration too. I think it was a 66 Galaxy being restro
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE |
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STIDUB
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| posted on January 31st, 2011 at 10:19 PM |
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can you claim it on tax at all?
or want a career change?
adult apprenticship in motor vehicle body building would be the go - but most of it is truck/trailer & bus work-boring as bat poo, guaranteed to
get you welding knowledge thats for sure 
Volkswagen Drivers Club of Queensland - member 
STIDUB - yep its still a work in progress
Vwdcq club car racing/ and crashing while my bug isn't finished.
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bugzla
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| posted on January 31st, 2011 at 11:15 PM |
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mate if this is anything like the bankstown tafe course people would give their mother to be in there you get full use of benders rollers first in
line for paint booths my friends old man has been doing it for years cause he does up old chevys and his work is awesome
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oldtub356
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 04:44 AM |
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It is a wonderful course Craig - I did it when it was free(so it was even better then). As the guys have suggested above, there are several ways that
you can look at whether it is the way to go for you. If you have several restorations in you before being "called above" - definitely do it. If you
are thinking only about your one off, current project, then maybe not.
Take note of what >waveman< said above, plus from a dollar perspective - any expensive tools that you buy should be considered short term
purchases where you can expect to retrieve, say 50% of their value on eBay, after the project is finished.
To get the knowledge that you need, here are two excellent books, that are still available new, but often come up on eBay:
Donald Waites' - Panel Beating and Car restoration
aaand;
Al Proberts' - Spray Painting Motor Vehicles
Both very experienced Tradesmen,Tech Teachers and Heads of there Departments at Sydney Tech in their days - mainly old school techniques and products
used. Both books are often mentioned in restoration forum all over the world - particularly in the USA and the UK. Maybe newer additions would be
better as they have the 'old' methods and additional newer techniques and products added. Donald Waites' first edition was printed in 1955 and the
ninth edition in 1988. You should also find them in all local libraries in OZ.
Tools:
Get an el cheapo Chinese Tig on eBay ($400 if you play your cards right) - buy a brand name hand piece and consumables to go with it. Also, don't
muck around with the small (2 Litre??) gas bottles - lease bottles from the engineering supplier - this also gives you extra motivation to get the job
finished before the next annual gas lease invoice. You can butt weld panels using Tig to a file finish, without the typical line of scallop welds.
Tin Snips: Don't buy cheap ones, buy a left and a right hand (red and green handle), about $25 each.
Cheap dollies are OK, you may need to dress them up with a file and emery clothe - soften the sharp edges and polish the working surfaces.
Buy one quality (secondhand) planishing hammer - you will need several hammers, but the standard one needs to be a nice one.
Good luck with your project. We all have them.
Lance.
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donn
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 05:05 AM |
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Not sure if this comment is relevant. I have an uncle who is from the old school, repair panels not replace, weld replacement sections not glue,
shrink / stretch damaged areas to a good line not knock it in and fill with bog.
He taught at taaf for a while (handyman night course) but soon realised that the fellas doing the course were going to be on their own once the course
finished and they no longer had access to the high tech gear in the taaf workshop so he sat them down, explained his thoughts and offered to teach
them the old way using hand tools, to a man they agreed and were soon learning the "old" tricks, when the course had finished they could confidently
attack their projects at home with the tools they had. So after that bit of useless info I wonder if you could track down a retired panel beater and
pay him to teach you what you need to know, a lot of old retired tradesmen would be happy to get their hands dirty and teach a newbie a few of the
tricks of the trade, maybe worth a shot.
I dream of a day when a chicken can cross a road without being asked for it's motive!
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Craig S
A.k.a.: Craig
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 07:06 AM |
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Thanks Guys,
Lots of good ideas and comments that I'll now have to think about. The good thing is that there is very little welding and work to be done on this
car, because generally it is in good nick, but after that I want to buy a KG, and we all know what they can be like.
It's also true that on top of the course cost I would then need to buy tools to be able to do things at home which would rather stretch things for
me.
Thanks
Craig
1969 Beetle - June
1974 L Bug - Gwendolyn
2002 Bora V6 4Motion - Anita
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rob53
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 09:36 AM |
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It's crazy how much Tafe has increased the course price. 3 years ago it was $150!
The demand was huge and would fill up quickly.
Tafe were reluctant to add more classes, and a few times, the course was 'accidentally' not included on the website, or it was reported to not be
run at certain tafes (despite otherwise).
The head teachers were excellent, but were in the dark with administration. When I told them about what was happening, they were not surprised.
I'd understand rising course fee's, but it seems that someone is trying to kill the courses off.
It's a real shame because the courses are excellent, the teachers know their stuff, and they have all the equipment you need.
As lance said, the Donald Waites book is highly recommended. Pretty much what they teach in the spray painting course is in the book. (Well the old
stuff at least, no 2 pak paints and etc)
If your still determined, the proper panel beating courses are cheaper, but they are longer and follow a complete course structure with prerequisites,
and other units.
Thats not rust, it's ah ... orange primer ... yep that's what it is ...
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chickenfillet
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 10:22 AM |
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Hi Craig,
I did the smaller version of this course at the St George campus a few years ago and it was invaluable. I'm pretty sure they still do it and was a
very reasonable $190. The best part is you take your can take your car in and work on it there so you get the best of both worlds, learning a new
skill and your car repaired.
This is the 'classroom'...
Cheers,
Kevin
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Aussie Dubbin
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 02:04 PM |
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Great thread guys 
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vlad01
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 05:29 PM |
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| Quote: | Originally
posted by rob53
It's crazy how much Tafe has increased the course price. 3 years ago it was $150!
The demand was huge and would fill up quickly.
Tafe were reluctant to add more classes, and a few times, the course was 'accidentally' not included on the website, or it was reported to not be
run at certain tafes (despite otherwise).
The head teachers were excellent, but were in the dark with administration. When I told them about what was happening, they were not surprised.
I'd understand rising course fee's, but it seems that someone is trying to kill the courses off.
It's a real shame because the courses are excellent, the teachers know their stuff, and they have all the equipment you need.
As lance said, the Donald Waites book is highly recommended. Pretty much what they teach in the spray painting course is in the book. (Well the old
stuff at least, no 2 pak paints and etc)
If your still determined, the proper panel beating courses are cheaper, but they are longer and follow a complete course structure with prerequisites,
and other units.
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Tafe canned my electronics diploma halfway without notice. we protested and to it right up to the member of the state and won our case. We finished it
and then they demolished the electronic department after we left.
assholes! Oh well at least i have a great job now thanks to that course I did.
It doesn't surprise me tafe are trying to kill off another course. 
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE |
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Craig S
A.k.a.: Craig
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 07:55 PM |
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Thanks All,
I've been digging around and found the following:
http://www.nwcollege.net/index.php?action=course&course_action=detail&...
Whilst this term is full , hopefully they'd run it again during the year. It's cheap and it's close (in fact it's my old High School)
It doesn't include panel beating, but it is a start.
I also found this one:
http://www.courses.com.au/motor_vehicle_body_repairs-62834.html
which I think might be almost what Kevin was referring to, but it doesn't seem to be running at the moment, so I'll have to give them a call
tomorrow. Not at all local to me, but still may be preferable.
They also have welding at Jannali, but again, a long way from my humble home in the sunny western suburbs.
http://www.sgscc.nsw.edu.au/cgi-bin/WebObjects/sgscc.woa/wa/module.shtml?ID=1...
Reflecting on my chances of getting to North Sydney by 5:30pm every Thursday for 18 weeks and finding parking would seem to suggest I almost have
buckleys and none.
But I'll keep digging, and keep the ideas flowing.
Thanks
Craig
1969 Beetle - June
1974 L Bug - Gwendolyn
2002 Bora V6 4Motion - Anita
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Joel
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 07:59 PM |
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It's a catch 22 situation.
$1400 for a course that gives you all the skills, then you got no tools to use them with.
Spend that $1400 on tools then have no skills to use them.
I know which I'd choose.
Like Vlad said theres a plethora of brilliant instructional vids on youtube and they say practice makes perfect.
I don't know how much room you have for extra cars but it's easy to pick up some beat up 90s jap scrap for next to nothing on ebay with rust and/or
damage and have a go at some body work, if you ruin it no loss.
I gave away my 92 corolla which would have been perfect.
I practiced welding up some trim holes on some beat up old door before I tried it on the body.
That's how I learned bodywork and painting except 10 years ago it was easy to get cheap or free beetles instead of jap scrap.
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Craig S
A.k.a.: Craig
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 08:13 PM |
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Thanks Joel,
That's what I'm thinking, that if I find some scrap panels and doors and work on them as practice. I do remember hearing an interview with Chip
Foose where his Dad taught him to repair a Beetle bonnet, and then when he brought it to him he would put a hammer on the bonnet and he would do it
all over again. You'd get arrested for that these days wouldn't you???
Whilst looking around the St George site I found these as well:
Engine rebuilding
http://www.sgscc.nsw.edu.au/cgi-bin/WebObjects/sgscc.woa/wa/module.shtml?ID=1...
Motor Vehicle Body repairs
http://www.sgscc.nsw.edu.au/cgi-bin/WebObjects/sgscc.woa/wa/module.shtml?ID=1...
a 7pm start time for 8 weeks would be a lot more manageable for me. I suspect I'm going to get to know the way to Janalli
I'll keep looking.
1969 Beetle - June
1974 L Bug - Gwendolyn
2002 Bora V6 4Motion - Anita
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Birdman
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| posted on February 1st, 2011 at 10:45 PM |
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Give St George a try mate. I did welding last year and will be doing panel beating and welding again this year. $170 the teacher is a champ and its
very casual. If you want to know more PM me because the teacher is a close mate and he's into vw's.
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Craig S
A.k.a.: Craig
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| posted on February 3rd, 2011 at 07:23 PM |
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Well I'm now booked in for 8 weeks of welding at St George starting next week for the princely sum of $164.
Even though that amount is MUCH less than TAFE it still nearly didn't make it past my tight fisted self because prior to enrolment I saw the combined
bill for school / sport / dance / soccer shoes of over $700!!!!! 
Anyway, should be an adventure. If that all goes well I'll move onto the body repair course next.
Thanks again for everyone's helpful advice and thoughts.
Cheers
Craig
1969 Beetle - June
1974 L Bug - Gwendolyn
2002 Bora V6 4Motion - Anita
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