| [ Total Views: 1812 | Total Replies: 16 | Thread Id: 94972 ] |
|
|
 vwbugsrule
Slammed & Awesome Dubber
Posts: 84
Threads: 26
Registered: February 10th, 2011
Member Is Offline
Location: Kellyville NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on January 24th, 2012 at 10:21 AM |
|
|
1200 head gaskets, Need Help !!
Are these the correct gaskets (copper rings) and is this where they are meant to go? If not please let me know what type of gaskets i need and where
they should go.
| Error |
| Sorry, you must be a registered user in order to download attachments. |
|
| Error |
| Sorry, you must be a registered user in order to download attachments. |
|
|
|
|
68AutoBug
A.k.a.: Lee Noonan
Aircooled Master
Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138% - YIKES --
Posts: 11654
Threads: 449
Registered: August 31st, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: SCONE in UPPER HUNTER VALLEY NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Yellow
Mood: Really Mentally Ill - all of the time -
|
 posted on January 24th, 2012 at 11:22 AM |
|
|
Hi
Yes
that is where they go..
between the head and barrel /cylinders..
Lee
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
|
|
|
vwbugsrule
Slammed & Awesome Dubber
Posts: 84
Threads: 26
Registered: February 10th, 2011
Member Is Offline
Location: Kellyville NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on January 24th, 2012 at 11:51 AM |
|
|
cheers mate, thankyou very much
|
|
|
 matberry
Super Moderator
Go hard or go home
Posts: 8114
Threads: 134
Registered: March 7th, 2006
Member Is Offline
Location: Cooroy Qld
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue
Mood: enjoying waving at all my Kombi buddies from my T3
|
| posted on January 24th, 2012 at 12:12 PM |
|
|
I beg to differ Lee. They are not head gaskets, they are copper seals used on early 40 and 36 hp engines as a secondary seal to the head to
'prevent' combustion gasses entering the heater system on the old non-fresh air style. The copper ring fits around the cylinder down near the cast
fins and into a receiving groove in the head. This is on early small bore engines, not the one pictured. On this engine, no gaskets are used, it
rely's on the machined surface being clean and flat, some people recommend lapping the barrels into the head to improve the seal, but be carefull to
not remove too much material on the head. It is also extremely important to have all the threads of the head nuts and studs retapped, cleaned and
lubed to ensure the correct tension is applied to the head when torqued.
Using those gasket, the copper will fail and leak and burn the head/barrel if left for any time. The compression ratio will also be seriously
effected.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
 |
|
|
vwbugsrule
Slammed & Awesome Dubber
Posts: 84
Threads: 26
Registered: February 10th, 2011
Member Is Offline
Location: Kellyville NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on January 24th, 2012 at 02:35 PM |
|
|
this is a 40hp 1200cc. And i had already put the engine back together this way and it all seemed fine, no problems at all. But i will keep that in
mind.
|
|
|
 vw54
Super Administrator
Always Waiting 4 Friday
Posts: 16723
Threads: 378
Registered: August 26th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Sunny Sydney
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Oval resto ongoing
|
| posted on January 24th, 2012 at 04:04 PM |
|
|
NO they go on the outer rim of the barrel as per Matt above
Dont put them in the cyclinder head as it will reduce the compression ratio and u will have less power
and now days there NOT used as the barrel is lapped into the cyclinder head to act as a seal
|
|
|
grumble
Son of Jim - Creator of Good
Posts: 2668
Threads: 53
Registered: June 10th, 2008
Member Is Offline
Location: Taree
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: happy all the time
|
| posted on January 24th, 2012 at 06:02 PM |
|
|
Matt and Dave are dead right they are not head gaskets as Matt says they fit on the top of the cylinder on the 36 & 40 hp and seat in the head
recess not in the head
|
|
|
vwbugsrule
Slammed & Awesome Dubber
Posts: 84
Threads: 26
Registered: February 10th, 2011
Member Is Offline
Location: Kellyville NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 01:20 PM |
|
|
so this is how it goes. I had the engine without the ring in the cylinder heads and the engine would always have small backfires and little popping
sounds, nothing serious though. I tried the engine with the rings in the cylinder heads and it ran perfectly, but then i removed them like you guys
said and the engine is running crap again. So what should i do?
|
|
|
matberry
Super Moderator
Go hard or go home
Posts: 8114
Threads: 134
Registered: March 7th, 2006
Member Is Offline
Location: Cooroy Qld
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue
Mood: enjoying waving at all my Kombi buddies from my T3
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 01:37 PM |
|
|
The problem sounds like the heads have had too much material removed as they may have been reconditioned numerous times. Now the heads are too close
together so the inlet manifold is not sealing properly.
Firstly you should be checking the compression ratio, that will tell you if it is high or not. If the CR is high (caused by excessive machining to the
head) you need to lower it by installing spacers under the barrels, the size of the spacer depends on how much you need to change it by. Once this is
all done, your heads should be in the right place for the manifold to fit properly. If you have a wierd combo of parts and for some reason the
manifold doesn't fit, you could modify it accordingly ( ).
You did the right thing as those copper rings don't last long used there. There are copper head gaskets available for 1600 upwards but they won't
suit your engine, the best way is to space the barrels from the underside, if they fit, the copper rings would work ok there as they are away from the
combustion process.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
|
|
|
vwbugsrule
Slammed & Awesome Dubber
Posts: 84
Threads: 26
Registered: February 10th, 2011
Member Is Offline
Location: Kellyville NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 01:41 PM |
|
|
ok thankyou for your information, i will try and work it all out. 
|
|
|
68AutoBug
A.k.a.: Lee Noonan
Aircooled Master
Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138% - YIKES --
Posts: 11654
Threads: 449
Registered: August 31st, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: SCONE in UPPER HUNTER VALLEY NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Yellow
Mood: Really Mentally Ill - all of the time -
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 02:19 PM |
|
|
| Quote: | Originally
posted by vwbugsrule
so this is how it goes. I had the engine without the ring in the cylinder heads and the engine would always have small backfires and little popping
sounds, nothing serious though. I tried the engine with the rings in the cylinder heads and it ran perfectly, but then i removed them like you guys
said and the engine is running crap again. So what should i do?
|
Put them back... it must be leaking compression there...
You can also get steel shims that fit there..
[they aren't really head gaskets]
cheers
LEE
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
|
|
|
matberry
Super Moderator
Go hard or go home
Posts: 8114
Threads: 134
Registered: March 7th, 2006
Member Is Offline
Location: Cooroy Qld
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue
Mood: enjoying waving at all my Kombi buddies from my T3
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 02:33 PM |
|
|
'the engine would always have small backfires and little popping sounds'
The description sounds like an inlet manifold leak and maybe an exhaust leak too, on the other hand a compression leak will hiss on cranking and be a
loud Blap when the engine is under load, starting at first only when cold, then all the time as the condition worsens. Very different IMO
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
|
|
|
68AutoBug
A.k.a.: Lee Noonan
Aircooled Master
Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138% - YIKES --
Posts: 11654
Threads: 449
Registered: August 31st, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: SCONE in UPPER HUNTER VALLEY NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Yellow
Mood: Really Mentally Ill - all of the time -
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 06:03 PM |
|
|
You know more than Me Mat
Lee
- [size=4]Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY--- [/size]
|
|
|
vwbugsrule
Slammed & Awesome Dubber
Posts: 84
Threads: 26
Registered: February 10th, 2011
Member Is Offline
Location: Kellyville NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 06:19 PM |
|
|
https://www.classicveedub.com.au/cvd_new/part_detail.aspx?parts_id=16405
So is this what i would be looking for? and if so, would these sit between the cylinder (where the fins are) and the cylinder head?
|
|
|
OZ Towdster
A.k.a.: Andrew Westwood
Custom Title Time!
Keen to finish some projects
Posts: 1921
Threads: 132
Registered: December 7th, 2003
Member Is Offline
Location: Alexandra Hills Brisbane QLD
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Yellow
Mood: Having fun in our great land
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 06:37 PM |
|
|
They are for 1600 size piston and barrel sets and as such will not fit your 1200 as the page states they are for between the head and barrel.
Don't let body work get in the way of real suspension travel
|
|
|
vw54
Super Administrator
Always Waiting 4 Friday
Posts: 16723
Threads: 378
Registered: August 26th, 2002
Member Is Offline
Location: Sunny Sydney
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
Mood: Oval resto ongoing
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 06:58 PM |
|
|
NO u dont need that CRAP just lap the barrels to the heads
As per Matt above you have a inlet leak in the mainfold system some where did u replace the head inlet mainifold gasket did the old ones out
|
|
|
vwbugsrule
Slammed & Awesome Dubber
Posts: 84
Threads: 26
Registered: February 10th, 2011
Member Is Offline
Location: Kellyville NSW
Theme: UltimaBB Pro Blue ( Default )
|
| posted on January 25th, 2012 at 06:59 PM |
|
|
Yes i realised, it was just an example but i will get the correct size. Thanks mate
|
|
|
