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Stanley I guess the reward is in the doing of it

4,523 posts · joined Mar 2003 ·

#274870
Just a quick reminder on risque images, etc



Just re-iterating the current standing rule on nudity and risque images.

The truly rooted censorship laws in Australia "prohibit" the transmission of content deemed "unsuitable" or "objectionable" to minors (ie people under 18). Who defines "objectionable" and "unsuitable"? Not us.

If we have these type of images, we have to get rid of all the under 18's on this forum by installing an adult verification system (ie, you enter a valid credit number and it's checked).

Basically, I don't want to do that as have several very active under 18's here and their contribution is much more valuable than the perceived benefits of having swaying breasts, penises under kilts, etc no matter how funny or well published on the front pages of English papers. This is why the regime is so rooted - 3 million Uk papers are printed with the images, but we can't have them displayed in Australia without risking the forum.

If you have a problem with this, the current federal communications minister is Helen Coonan. It seems she has less grasp of the Internet than her predecessors Alston and Williams. However, she is the minister responsible, and you need to speak to her, not me.

Expect risque images and avatars to have a short life span and moved with or without notice. (I have given notice to the one avatar I have replaced).

Andrew

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Andrew,
I know this will open a can of worms here but are we talking commonwealth censorship here or an individuals iinterpretation of the censorship laws. If we're going to censor cartoon images with big breasts, thats getting a bit sad. I agree in principal on censorship however having four kids the youngest 6, I ask would I want any of my kids to see these images.
If the answers no I wont post them.

As the poster of the kilt photo anyone coud see the context to which it was posted. Should it have been posted on a VW forum well thats another question. I thought this was a forum for discussion but you locked your above post which means it will slide off pretty quick. But maybe it was meant that way so know one had the right of reply.

I don't want see anything on here that could jeopadise this site by being to risque but I don't think I have yet.

Other than that keep up the good work moderators.

Now I'll just sit back and wait for the earbashing

Andy42 Insano Dub Head

709 posts · joined Mar 2003 ·

#274872
Well I do not get it. You see way worse on the movies on TV which only have a M or an MA rating so what makes the internet any different. As for editing swaying breasts you have got to be kidding I am sure being the computer geeks some of you are you would have seen the Video games which are out now with exactly that. And they do not have an R rating. Sure no FULL frontal nudity but i am sure the avatars you deleated did not fall into that section.
.

StenGuns Veteran Volks Folk

2,147 posts · joined Mar 2004 ·

#274878
risque images



The benefit to the majority in using this forum is outweighed by the titillation of the few.. That is a gimme..

However I don't believe we should accept self regulatory censorship on the guise that it is Government enforced when it is not..

Never has the word or phrase "risque images" been referred to in any Internet censorship regulation or defination. Neither is a picture of a woman's breasts deemed prohibitive content. The display of it doesn't warrant "adult" restrictive access.. Well before this type of enforcement, a "take down" notice would be issued to the content hosts..

Not meaning to make waves but we should be informed of what our rights are and not just assume that it is the Gov't taking them away.. In this case, (tell me if I'm wrong) it is the forum administrator that is deciding what is prohibited and what is not.. AND probably for good reason as it is hard to police every image in real time. The easier way is to make it a condition of membership (check out the membership rules)..

As I have said.. I don't object to self imposed regulation (at this level anycase) as long as we call it what it is..

Definition of Prohibited Content
'Prohibited content' is material that has been classified and given one of the following classifications:


R18 (information deemed likely to be disturbing or harmful to persons under 18 years).
Content classified R18 is 'prohibited content' when it is Australian-hosted and access to it is not restricted by an ABA approved adult verification system. The law does not cover R18 content that is hosted on overseas sites.
X18 (non violent sexually explicit material involving consenting adults).
RC (Refused Classification).

vanderaj Administrator a suffusion of yellow

3,130 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#274882
I'm a member of the EFA, so I fight against the state and federal censorship regime as I can. I wrote to my members, I spoke at length with the Labor opposition spokesperson on IT, Kate Lundy and helped organised a panel at SAGE-AU a few years ago with Kate, the EFA, and a representative from the Government. I have done more to fight against these stupid laws *before* and *after* their enactment than anyone on here, so I find the juvenile attitudes by some (and you should see my U2U inbox) appalling. Fighting against me is illogical and a waste of time. I'm not the one the antagonists these people need to fight against.

Once these things become law, there is no choice, we have to comply even if it's a stupid law.

There are two alternatives:
  • we get rid of the under 18's and we have titties (and most likely lose about 50% of our active membership due to the onerous adult verification system)
  • or we don't have the titties
If we start using an AVS, it's only a short matter of time before Aussieveedubbers gets on to the censorware lists. Once that happens, it is basically impossible to read Aussieveedubbers from work places which use these awful nanny state systems. We'll lose more members from this than any other constriction.

Members under 18 in recent times include those who have been the most active, and I feel that having them around are worth a great deal more to the life blood of this place than bouncy avatars.

Lastly, if we have risque images, we'll lose some of our readers who simply don't like them, particularly if they start turning up more regularly.

What we need everyone to do is to ring their state and federal politicians and talk to them about censorship. You need to write to Helen Coonan and ask for the legislation to be dumped as it doesn't work. We need these stupid laws to be revoked as they are unenforceable, and do not compare like with like. There is no R rating on the Australian Internet, which is clearly not the case in real life. It only affects places like here.

This discussion raged more than 12 months ago, and we're not reversing the decision. But please feel free to vent as I know it helps.

Andrew

koolkarmakombi enkarmarising

2,078 posts · joined Jun 2003 ·

#274886
so naked vee dubs are ok then :party

vanderaj Administrator a suffusion of yellow

3,130 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#274889
I called it risque images. The term is "content", which is anything.

The process for us under the federal act is reactive - we don't have to do anything until a complaint is made to the ABA and we receive a take down notice. This has never happened. However, as we are hosted outside Australia, the ABA will refer take down notices to censorware software vendors, so if someone does complain, we'll end up being blocked. Which is worse even if the material is found not to be objectionable or we comply with the takedown notice. As once on, we cannot ever get off the censorware lists. We'd have to change domain names and ISPs.

The legislation under various state laws prevents us uploading any such images. The wording is different in most states, but the intent is the same - no "offensive" material.

http://parlinfoweb.aph.gov.au/piweb/Repository/Legis/Bills/Linked/04080400.pdf
The matters to be taken into account in deciding for the purposes of 14
this Part whether reasonable persons would regard particular 15
material, or a particular use of a carriage service, as being, in all 16
the circumstances, offensive, include: 17
(a) the standards of morality, decency and propriety generally 18
accepted by reasonable adults; and 19
(b) the literary, artistic or educational merit (if any) of the 20
material; and 21
(c) the general character of the material (including whether it is 22
of a medical, legal or scientific character).
Who are these reasonable adults? Not us. That is the key. It could be the Australian Family Association (who are in my opinion not reasonable, but that's another discussion entirely), it could be a forum member, it could be a school.

One of the complementary state based legislations (Victoria) has this to say about objectionable material:
"objectionable material" means-

(a) an objectionable publication; or

(b) an objectionable film; or

(c) a computer game that-

(i) depicts, expresses or otherwise deals with matters of sex, drug misuse
or addiction, crime, cruelty, violence or revolting or abhorrent
phenomena in such a way that it offends against the standards of
morality, decency and propriety generally accepted by reasonable
adults to the extent that it should not be classified; or

(ii) describes or depicts a person who is, or looks like, a minor under 16
engaging in sexual activity or depicted in an indecent sexual manner
or context; or

(iii) promotes, incites or instructs in matters of crime or violence; or

(iv) is unsuitable for a minor to see or play; or

(v) is classified RC or would, if classified, be classified RC;
Minors are anyone under 18. Again, the reasonable adult clause unfortunately includes our friends at the Australian Family Association.

Andrew

jenz58 Postal Menace

9,121 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#274891
Andrew did you have complaints about the Avatars?

I only found the movement of them distracting when trying to read the posts....well breasts don't do it for me....I think most kids would laugh n think d guys who had them up were old peeps...and I'm sure any healthy boy is peeping himself in real life...we nearly all do it

Well the pic of the Queens Guard was purely a laugh...I know it was showing his pink bits but not in a very rude way...only very cheeky naughty

Pics of womens breast even if not nude can offend some people....and a VW Avatar is more appropriate...but I'm sure the offending Avatars would not have stayed up there that long before the members got sick of them themselves...the joke would get boring after a while

Most things of this nature are done in fun...hopefully no one takes it to the extent of being classed pornagraphic....n believe me after raising 3 kids...they are not so innocent by the time they reach 18 yrs

Yes we do need to set a boundary which is not to be passed but I don't think anyone here would want to pass it...there are plenty more sites out there for that sort of content...Yes a membership agreement/rule is a good idea

At the moment I've only seen it as only harmless fun
"All you need is trust and a little bit of pixie dust!"

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=22473
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=56558#pid535643

...so I don't loose the links to my rides again hehehe

StenGuns Veteran Volks Folk

2,147 posts · joined Mar 2004 ·

#274921
It is fine to apply self governance and censorship. After all this is a motoring forum.. Just call it for what it is.. Don't hide behind dodgy legislation or blame the fed's.. That is bullshit.. We don't need the gov't to legislate.. Surely we are big enough to state the rules (they are stated), enforce them and live by them.. I'm happy with that as I guess are the majority who access the forum for VW related info, not closet sexual gratification..

VDUBXTC Tea Bag

3,587 posts · joined Feb 2003 ·

#274954
let see
My Avater that was deleted is still active on 2 other forums in Australia.
After 5 months on one and 3 weeks on another.

I have sent the moderators of those sites a letter asking if they find it breaching any laws they have to obide by or if it was offensive to them.
the answers where both no that it was fine.

now both of these forums don't have a adult censorship or what ever you call it.


Anyways its as Jenz58 says people get bored with them quickly and i was over mine already so i don't mind mine being taken down
Jasmine the 75 L Bug
56 oval, 2000 New Beetle

ClassicVW(pacific) Custom Title Time!

1,627 posts · joined Jul 2004 ·

#274972
I'snt this just another case of TWO many rules in modern society in general. While I dont keep a BREAST of happenings, I think I saw the 'offensive' material and I couldnt take my eyes off them, I mean from a technical point of view of course.
I can see the other stand POINTS of where do you draw the line, there must be some FIRM rules, but generally things are taken too seriously where has the innocence gone
Didnt want to BOUNCE this to the top again.
By the way the 'office' avator is great, seen the set of DVD's including the xmas party over and over again.

[Edited on 5-12-2004 by ClassicVW(pacific)]

jenz58 Postal Menace

9,121 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#275210
What on earth could be wrong with 'The Office' avatar??:jesus

Do we have to have seen the episode n have been offended by the content not shown in the Avatar footage...? It's a Saturday Night dance take off :duh
"All you need is trust and a little bit of pixie dust!"

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=22473
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=56558#pid535643

...so I don't loose the links to my rides again hehehe

VDUBXTC Tea Bag

3,587 posts · joined Feb 2003 ·

#275218
Nothing wrong with the one i have now Jen
But i had the one with the little china girl waving her best friends side to side😀
Jasmine the 75 L Bug
56 oval, 2000 New Beetle

VDUBXTC Tea Bag

3,587 posts · joined Feb 2003 ·

#275223
everyone has a deep dark secret fantasy jen

Maybe your mind is telling you something:P

[Edited on 5-12-2004 by vw0064]
Jasmine the 75 L Bug
56 oval, 2000 New Beetle

squizy Thinking about another dub...maybe

4,082 posts · joined Dec 2002 ·

#275380
vanderaj wrote:If we start using an AVS, it's only a short matter of time before Aussieveedubbers gets on to the censorware lists. Once that happens, it is basically impossible to read Aussieveedubbers from work places which use these awful nanny state systems. We'll lose more members from this than any other constriction.
Good point Andrew. I, as a number of other people access this site at work. If the site ever makes it onto a black list and therefore banned at the proxy server level then no doubt we will see a drop off in membership.

Personally I don't have a problem, but I suppose the restrictions are in place for the longterm good of the site, and not to stop people having fun.

Squiz....